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Monitoring the situation in Iran

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The difference in thinking between the west and some of the countries destroyed by centuries of radical Islamic dogma is probably one that some of the posters here would have to see with their own two eyes, repeatedly and for an extended duration, in order to believe.

It's why whenever people who are actually familiar with it try explaining, it's far easier to come to the conclusion that their opinions are racist or corrupted in some other way.

And you know what? Had I not spent most of my life in the middle east, I would probably think the same.

Islamic dogmatic thinking does not concern itself with cause and effect, nor with accountability. It's magical thinking through and through. And it's so deeply ingrained in certain parts of Middle Eastern culture that people like that Kuwaiti pilot will tell you they don't need to aim their missiles, because Allah will guide them. And that if an American fighter was downed it was the will of Allah and is therefore just.

Gp1 Gp1
 
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violence said:
I watched a video that talked about how the Spanish Civil War was a preview of World War II and was trying to draw some parallels that were unnerving. If things go real bad this could be a preview of WW triple.
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I can certainly see a line of dominoes leading to WW3, particularly if Venezuela + Iran disruption of Chinese oil supply + US carrier occupation in ME gives China the opportunity to move on Taiwan, global chip manufacture gets hammered, and then everyone starts fighting for oil/natgas while they retain the electronic capacity to do so.

Ironically, in this scenario, the US could step back and let eurasia pound itself into pieces as no one really has the capability to reach us other than ballistic missiles. We make enough food, pump enough oil, have lots of water, just gotta hold off on iphone20s and samsung s27s whilst learning how to refurbish transformers and computer circuit boards.

Israel is probably the one with the most on the line. Without Iran I think suddenly lots of other neighboring countries get much more diplomatic with them, or they all gang up if they think there is a chance at "river to the sea"
 
DeepEnigma said:
You do the same shit, very selectively as well. So congrats, I guess.
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Utter nonsense.

edit: Oh I see what you are saying lol Yeah I am fucking annoyed at how you guys turn the forum political for everything movies or games related. What I do not do is go into threads where the major topic is what politicians are doing and tell them not to talk about politics. Nor do I go stir up political shit in threads about games or movies.

That's called being consistent.
 
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jason10mm said:
I can certainly see a line of dominoes leading to WW3, particularly if Venezuela + Iran disruption of Chinese oil supply + US carrier occupation in ME gives China the opportunity to move on Taiwan, global chip manufacture gets hammered, and then everyone starts fighting for oil/natgas while they retain the electronic capacity to do so.

Ironically, in this scenario, the US could step back and let eurasia pound itself into pieces as no one really has the capability to reach us other than ballistic missiles. We make enough food, pump enough oil, have lots of water, just gotta hold off on iphone20s and samsung s27s whilst learning how to refurbish transformers and computer circuit boards.

Israel is probably the one with the most on the line. Without Iran I think suddenly lots of other neighboring countries get much more diplomatic with them, or they all gang up if they think there is a chance at "river to the sea"
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So... The US starts the fire, and then retreats as the rest of the world fucks itself up? That's the get out? The grand plan?
 
jason10mm said:
I can certainly see a line of dominoes leading to WW3, particularly if Venezuela + Iran disruption of Chinese oil supply + US carrier occupation in ME gives China the opportunity to move on Taiwan, global chip manufacture gets hammered, and then everyone starts fighting for oil/natgas while they retain the electronic capacity to do so.
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Add to that the potential conflict within EU with Ukraine vs Hungary. Plus imagine a bigger confrontation between Greece and Turkey. I doubt China will move on Taiwan, but Japan certainly should abandon the article 6 or something that prevents them from getting a proper army.

jason10mm said:
Israel is probably the one with the most on the line. Without Iran I think suddenly lots of other neighboring countries get much more diplomatic with them, or they all gang up if they think there is a chance at "river to the sea"
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I highly doubt any Gulf countries will try attacking Israel. The train is long gone - there won't be support for that. Everybody will gang on Iran and if Iran changes it will lead to a bigger coalition against potential conflict with Turkey later due to Israeli reputation post this war.

StabbyStabStabStabStab said:
So... The US starts the fire, and then retreats as the rest of the world fucks itself up? That's the get out? The grand plan?
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That's the problem of the world, not the american one. USA is resolving their own problem that other countries are not willing to address (Aside sending strongly worded letters).
 
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DeepEnigma said:
I thought it was Israel that started it all?
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I was just responding to the scenario presented.

jason10mm said:
That's a possible scenario, sure. Doubt that's what we WOULD do if China hopped over and snatched Taiwan, India hits Pakistan while they are focused on Iran, Europe starves of oil, etc, but we COULD.
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Well you could, just rather unsavoury if you though ofc..

(Sorry if a little short/curt, just eating dinner).
 
ChuckeRearmed said:
Accountable for what? People die in war unless you believe that they were deliberately was targetting school. Like: "This is school - let's bomb it".
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We do not know.

There's a huge difference between people dying in war, in general, and specific actions that may violate the Geneva Conventions, other treaties or the UCMJ.

"Someone died but it's a war so nothing matters"...that's not how these things are supposed to work. Hell, even WWI-era Europe didn't think that was right.

For instance, if someone used some kind of AI to select a list of targets and the school was included among them without verification, then that person should answer for it. The responsibility of their chain of command should also be evaluated. If it was truly accidental, then that should be investigated, of course, plus fully and properly demonstrated. Hard to believe this was a completely random fluke when it seems like the first wave of attacks was quite precise in its targets. The school was close to other facilities, yes, but not right next to them and there were at least two strikes against it.

www.middleeasteye.net

Exclusive: Iranian girls killed by ‘double-tap’ strikes on Minab school

Eyewitnesses describe second blast which killed survivors as they sheltered in prayer hall
www.middleeasteye.net www.middleeasteye.net

I know some folks are likely in the "U.S./Israel can do no wrong in war" bandwagon, but that's bullshit. Even Israeli military courts don't argue that nonsense. In this particular case...considering this is the one outstanding atrocity that's likely angered more of the overall Iranian population than anything else, doing something about it should be relevant to the success of the mission, directly or indirectly.

I have little faith because even when the My Lai massacre, for example, went to courts...only one person was punished and that guy also got off lightly. During Trump's first term, he also pardoned people who had been found guilty of atrocities in Iraq and Afghanistan. This after Hegseth, of all people, was lobbying for it. Which isn't a good precedent.

time.com

Pete Hegseth's Role in Trump’s Controversial Pardons of Men Accused of War Crimes

Pete Hegseth advocated for Trump to intervene on behalf of service members in three cases involving war crime accusations in 2019.
time.com time.com
 
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LQX said:
It's fucking insanity. Now more European countries want their own nukes and the US is like; hey guys why would you want to do that? Lol, fucking hell.
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It's true. We have set the world down a very bad path. Maybe people take the world they were born into for granted? Is that how we allowed this to happen?

Maybe the notion of one "inherently good" large power maintaining stability for a free world was inevitable to be a pipe dream and only last a little while. Something was always gonna give and ruin it by course of human nature.
 
BlackTron said:
I had plenty of time to bitch about the "other side of the coin" while they were doing dumb shit to help destabilize America.

Now, I'm looking at you because you're killing the country in real time. Not in ideological opinions over transgender shit, but actively working to destroy America's power, in ways that can't be reversed in 4 years. And we're already in deep with irreversible damage. I live here, so I kinda care.

You tweaked my comment to take on the meaning that if someone calls something a Nazi, that means it is. It hardly ever is, but you should know history so that when it DOES apply, you don't become a useful idiot parroting propaganda. Also I was raised to hate Nazi shit and I didn't suddenly change because Fox News hosts have good hair and wear American flags. Like how you guys will flip based on dear leaders' remarks...like the 2nd amendment is God until a tweet.

People really do treat it like gaming, ignoring and minimizing anything bad about their brand while reframing anything good as the best, most important thing ever.

You mentioned he tariffed the way everyone else does. The way he did was not like everyone else, destroying trust and economic stability by using it as a bullying stick. Going as far as to use it to sanction countries, who did not want us to invade Greenland. Where, by the way, we already have a base and could negotiate whatever we want. The assertion that we have to invade it for national security is a story to support a dictator and from the standard playbook. Needing security from a buffer state was one of Putin's excuses to invade Ukraine. And Ukraine was already deeply resentful and distrustful of Russia. We just threatened it against our own ally, where we already have a base. Imagine if Russia tariffed every country that did not want them to invade Ukraine to "show em who's boss". And then, those countries turned to others for economic security, and balked when Russia asked for military help. Just for pro-Russian bloggers to start joking about those countries. Hard to imagine this or even living it, I know! (Cough, cough)

This was the right time for Iran to act up. Trump is not happy with power if he doesn't get to use it, so the top brass have been trying to keep him occupied on campaigns (better ones than sending the military to American cities, or Greenland). I'd rather discharge this need on a shit regime that mows down people with machine guns in the street. We accomplish two goals, pave the way to a better Iran and take the heat off a world now distrustful of what Trump will do tomorrow; at least, they know the military is busy in Iran, and won't send it to your country (or American city) because you said something wrong and his pp feels small. At least, this month.
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I'm not reading all that. Lol.

You got emotionally triggered, and that's enough for me to find joy.

Enjoy knowing your novel went unread. Good use of time!
 
I would like to formally welcome all the new (to this thread) accounts on recent pages, and users with under 200 post in 5+ years chiming in here with multiple post.

Also all of the mega hubris historians and former generals with more knowledge than the government.

It's a blessing to have you all.
 


I guess the threat near Israel is low enough to have this ship anymore.

Madonis said:
specific actions that may violate the Geneva Conventions, other treaties or the UCMJ.
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"Geneva Conventions", "international law" etc. are just useful tool to tie your hands behind your back. None of ME conflicts followed the "Geneva conventions". It did not stop anybody in Ukraine, it did not stop anybody in Syria and so on.
 
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0neAnd0nly said:
Aight J. K. Rowling, have at it.

Your audience is waiting on pins and needles for your next book.
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Our relationship is inversely proportional because every time you reply to me you look bad.

But I don't get as much joy from that as you do, so don't worry, you can rest easy knowing no one's day is brightened as much as yours by feeling you made random people waste time. I can't compete on it!
 
BlackTron said:
Our relationship is inversely proportional because every time you reply to me you look bad.

But I don't get as much joy from that as you do, so don't worry, you can rest easy knowing no one's day is brightened as much as yours by feeling you made random people waste time. I can't compete on it!
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You have dethroned the champ, and have moved up the TRIGGERMAXX boards to take the top spot!

Sport GIF by Special Olympics Belgium


Your lame-mogging is elite!
 
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BlackTron said:
It's true. We have set the world down a very bad path.
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We are supposed to be the shining city on the hill that others look up to as a role model for peace, justice, and the rule of law. When all that goes out the window and our most prominent actions basically amount to "might makes right", that does not bode well for the world at large when everyone else attempts to follow that lead.
 
Rentahamster said:
We are supposed to be the shining city on the hill that others look up to as a role model for peace, justice, and the rule of law. When all that goes out the window and our most prominent actions basically amount to "might makes right", that does not bode well for the world at large when everyone else attempts to follow that lead.
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As the shining city on the hill, do you respond when a country massacres thousands of peaceful protestors or do you not?
 
ChuckeRearmed said:
"Geneva Conventions", "international law" etc. are just useful tool to tie your hands behind your back. None of ME conflicts followed the "Geneva conventions". It did not stop anybody in Ukraine, it did not stop anybody in Syria and so on.
Click to expand...

I didn't realize that the military being extra careful to not unnecessarily bomb an elementary school full of students counted as "tying their hands behind their backs". Come on....we live in the era of precision ordnance and this shouldn't be so hard. Look, if Khameini was hiding at the school or something and you had a tough time targeting him, you could make an argument for military necessity. A rather morally bankrupt argument, perhaps, but it'd make some sense out of strict operational need. Otherwise...it's just plain gross when carrying out a war crime was not objectively required and is simply handwaved.

What I find the most disturbing about this lawless approach is that for all the (justified) criticisms of islamic brutality, it's essentially enabling western barbarism as a response. Is western civilization, so to speak, really worth defending if you're erasing any and all moral inhibitions and going with "FUCK YEAH, WAR!" vibes?

I've made it clear that I'm not against U.S. intervention in Iran or wherever, but mistakes of judgment can be made, both large and small.
 
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0neAnd0nly said:
You have dethroned the champ, and have moved up the TRIGGERMAXX boards to take the top spot!

Sport GIF by Special Olympics Belgium


Your lame-mogging is elite!
Click to expand...

So does this mean I actually did affect you emotionally if it was enough for a medal? Or was I supposed to be sad that I couldn't do that?

I think people should be able to discuss varying opinions, but these kinds of posts aren't doing that, just drive by shit posting.
 
It's very sad that those children have to deal with pure evil of building ICBM bases and launchers right underneath and in the back of their schoolyards.

They must really hate their children, especially females.

Pray for them 🙏
 
efyu_lemonardo said:
As the shining city on the hill, do you respond when a country massacres thousands of peaceful protestors or do you not?
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Yes. You responded in a way befitting of that moral beacon to the world. Us killing a bunch of their citizens because we got mad at them for killing a bunch of their own citizens is not exactly what I would call a logical response.
 
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Warspite said:
Strikes on the houthi rebels in Yemen maybe?
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The problem is that the strikes won't change much for Houthis. There should be a ground invasion - by Saudis for example - to dismantle the regime of Houthis. Like with Lebanon or Gaza.

Madonis said:
I didn't realize that the military being extra careful to not unnecessarily bomb an elementary school full of students counted as "tying their hands behind their backs"
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You see USA and Israeli straight killing leaders, launchers, underground faciliteis with surgical precision and in the same thing you believe that somehow they misfired a missile into a school?

Madonis said:
What I find the most disturbing about this lawless approach is that for all the (justified) criticisms of islamic brutality, it's essentially enabling western barbarism as a response. Is western civilization, so to speak, really worth defending if you're erasing any and all moral inhibitions and going with "FUCK YEAH, WAR!" vibes?
Click to expand...
You literally are dealing with a regime hosting press conferences at schools and building hubs, hosting military equipment in kindergardens. What do you expect them to do - say to "pls give up" and they agreeing and smiling in response or what? IRGC literally killed 30k+ protesters some time ago. Who was complaining about the geneva convention or anything? Strongly worded letters from EU? etc etc. You literally have western governments cozying up to China who has no problem selling and buying stuff from Iran, while also having their own camps while also having the same western governments screeching about deportations and rights of the terrorists.
 
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BlackTron said:
So does this mean I actually did affect you emotionally if it was enough for a medal? Or was I supposed to be sad that I couldn't do that?

I think people should be able to discuss varying opinions, but these kinds of posts aren't doing that, just drive by shit posting.
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Ahhh, the old narc on my opponent and try to get him banned tactic.

Real man stuff. I like that.

I think it's OK to have some levity on threads like this, I have been serious on discussion and debate even with people who disagree with me plenty here and elsewhere on GAF.

You aren't a serious person. You have an obnoxiously high amount of confidence, you make horribly inaccurate assumptions, and you toss around terms like NAZI lazily and dangerously.

I have no real reason to have dialogue with that, but alas, I don't want you banned because I respect the HECK out of what EL has built here and the fact so many people have different view points.

Don't take stuff so serious man. My post that triggered you are all just light hearted and somewhat prodding post.

I know right now you are trying to have some "I know you are but what am I" type post and you want to look tough, but dude it isn't that serious - and even if I don't think your takes are good at all, I wish you the best and want nothing bad for you.

Have a good day. I mean that, too.
 
Madonis said:
I didn't realize that the military being extra careful to not unnecessarily bomb an elementary school full of students counted as "tying their hands behind their backs". Come on....we live in the era of precision ordnance and this shouldn't be so hard. Look, if Khameini was hiding at the school or something and you had a tough time targeting him, you could make an argument for military necessity. A rather morally bankrupt argument, perhaps, but it'd make some sense out of strict operational need. Otherwise...it's just plain gross when carrying out a war crime was not objectively required and is simply handwaved.

What I find the most disturbing about this lawless approach is that for all the (justified) criticisms of islamic brutality, it's essentially enabling western barbarism as a response. Is western civilization, so to speak, really worth defending if you're erasing any and all moral inhibitions and going with "FUCK YEAH, WAR!" vibes?
Click to expand...
Do you understand how western your thinking is? You carry with you an innate bias that your morality is superior because it is capable of greater self reflection and self criticism.

Radical Islamic thinking carries with it a different bias: that its morality is superior because it is ordained from above and therefore requires no questioning. To prove this, try finding examples of events in which cultures dominated by Islamic influence were ever critical of themselves. Can you find any?
 
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