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[Ryoku]

If youre counting resolution and framerate, Next generation would be 120hz and/or uHD/4K.

Lol.

Spoiler

You're not serious, right?

 

[BlankaBR]

Lol.

Spoiler

You're not serious, right?

Your avatar pic is hilarious!

 

[LCGeek]

IMO Halo 4 is more impressive than any Wii U launch game.

Should be considering the money and teams involved.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Then why have I read documents that says it does?
"Figure 38-1 An Image Rendered with Global Illumination Accelerated by the GPU"


Textures?

Oh come on, really?

I don't think this title gives us any information about the power of the Wii U. Zombi U maybe, some effects are interesting, but not NintendoLand.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

PGR3 was 30fps, but it is smooth. It is like Forza Horizon, it is not a real "problem".

PGR3 played just great at 30fps. It had a fantastic blur effect and the controls were a very responsive. A true next gen game.

Modeling/processing over framerate/IQ. To each their own, but I'll always choose the latter in a racer if given the option. 600p/30fps just didn't scream "next gen" in 2005 imo, especially with a 10x power increase such sacrifices should've been unnecessary. I guess it's more a matter of developer priorities and architecture familiarity, much like with every hardware launch.

1. You totally miss his point, he is talking about a leap compared to previous titles (from the end of a generation, not from the beginning).

2. Ridge Racer 7: 1920x1080x60 = 124.416.000 pixels/sec. Proof that PS3 > Wii U? See how pointless this is?

My point was PGR3 had to make serious concessions to reach it's level of visual output in other areas (geometry, lighting, post processing). RR6 (720p/60fps) is a good counter example to it, a game with true "next gen" resolution and acceptable genre framerate but generally got bagged on for simpler visuals. We never got the "whole package" at launch really it seemed.

As far as from-the-end-of-last-gen racers though:

Rallisport Challenge 2: 640p / 60 fps (24,595,200 pixels/sec)

 

[XtremeXpider]

Halo 4 pics are looking stunning, ZombiU should be looking as good as that, at least

I hope, but anything I have seen from Zombi U looks as good as Halo 4 (IMO).

Should be considering the money and teams involved.

There are people saying NintendoLand is better than any Ps3 and Xbox 360 game (graphically).

 

[Kai Dracon]

Should be considering the money and teams involved.

But hardware alone makes graphics. It has nothing to do with time, budget, staff, outlined goals, and quality of assets.

But more seriously,

For all the talk about how Wii U is exactly the same as PS360 since quick and dirty launch ports don't run at 60fps/1080p with new textures, I was under the impression that NintendoLand and The Wonderful 101 were already showing off things that were visibly nicer than what you get on PS360. As in, better textures, better lighting, cleaner high res shadows. And wasn't Wonderful 101 supposed to run at 60fps?

 

[frankie_baby]

Halo 4 pics are looking stunning, ZombiU should be looking as good as that, at least

If zombi u had even half the budget halo 4 did it would probably look far better than it

 

[Van Owen]

I hope, but anything I have seen from Zombi U looks as good as Halo 4 (IMO).

lol

 

[JordanN]

Oh come on, really?



I don't think this title gives us any information about the power of the Wii U. Zombi U maybe, some effects are interesting, but not NintendoLand.

Where did you get that screenshot? That looks alot worse compared to what I played. There's even some effects missing (the environment reflections on the helmet).

 

[XtremeXpider]

If zombi u had even half the budget halo 4 did it would probably look far better than it

There are games with low budget and great graphics.

 

[LCGeek]

I hope, but anything I have seen from Zombi U looks as good as Halo 4 (IMO).

Much smaller team of a different tier of quality, look up what the teams have done or been attached too. The game is a core title but calling it a system pusher like halo is just dumb.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

Lol.

Spoiler

You're not serious, right?

What I'm saying is that the amount of pixels is not an order of magnitude greater, and hence has nothing to do with the generation. We've had 720p 30/60fps games since Xbox/PS2 and we will next generation as well. I don't know what the fillrate count he posted is supposed to prove.

 

[BlankaBR]

I hope, but anything I have seen from Zombi U looks as good as Halo 4 (IMO).



There are people saying NintendoLand is better than any Ps3 and Xbox 360 game (graphically).

Yeah im quite impressed by Halo 4 pics snd I never played any Halo game...
Lets hope Metroid for the U look similar or even better

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

But hardware alone makes graphics. It has nothing to do with time, budget, staff, outlined goals, and quality of assets.

But more seriously,

For all the talk about how Wii U is exactly the same as PS360 since quick and dirty launch ports don't run at 60fps/1080p with new textures, I was under the impression that NintendoLand and The Wonderful 101 were already showing off things that were visibly nicer than what you get on PS360. As in, better textures, better lighting, cleaner high res shadows. And wasn't Wonderful 101 supposed to run at 60fps?

Nintendo Land and Wonderful 101 both run at 60fps afaik. NL may drop to 30fps in some of the splitscreen minigames though.

 

[frankie_baby]

There are games with low budget and great graphics.

That I don't deny but they are the exception not the rule

 

[RedSwirl]

But hardware alone makes graphics. It has nothing to do with time, budget, staff, outlined goals, and quality of assets.

But more seriously,

For all the talk about how Wii U is exactly the same as PS360 since quick and dirty launch ports don't run at 60fps/1080p with new textures, I was under the impression that NintendoLand and The Wonderful 101 were already showing off things that were visibly nicer than what you get on PS360. As in, better textures, better lighting, cleaner high res shadows. And wasn't Wonderful 101 supposed to run at 60fps?

101 and NintendoLand run at 60, and I'll agree that NL does show off some lighting beyond most of what I've seen on PS360.

 

[XtremeXpider]

Much smaller team of a different tier of quality, look up what the teams have done or been attached too. The game is a core title but calling it a system pusher like halo is just dumb.

The Witcher 2 is not a "big budget" game and it looks stuning:

Lets hope Metroid for the U look similar or even better

I'm sure Retro will do.

 

[Pineconn]

Once developers have had time with the Wii U hardware, we will see games that look better than Halo 4. What we should be comparing are 360 launch games versus Wii U launch games.

 

[Net_Wrecker]

Can't you guys at least wait for real Wii U developed showpiece titles to be shown before making these comparisons? Didn't Zombi U start as PS360 game? Pikmin 3 a Wii game? All the ports....are ports? Nintendo Land is a minigame collection? None of these games and/or devs will show the leap you're looking for, not early on at least. Comparing them to Halo 4, and Uncharted 3 is crazy.

 

[AzaK]

You need to play Halo 4:

IMO Halo 4 is more impressive than any Wii U launch game.

Of course it is. The budget for that thing is WAY more impressive than any Wii U game.

Halo 4 pics are looking stunning, ZombiU should be looking as good as that, at least

Not on a budget thats probably 20-40 times less than Halo 4.

 

[BlankaBR]

Much smaller team of a different tier of quality, look up what the teams have done or been attached too. The game is a core title but calling it a system pusher like halo is just dumb.

What do you mean? Do you think Ubisoft isnt capable of delivering that? Look at Watch dogs...

 

[BlankaBR]

Of course it is. The budget for that thing is WAY more impressive than any Wii U game.


Not on a budget thats probably 20-40 times less than Halo 4.

Do you have a source of how much money were spent on both games?

 

[LCGeek]

But hardware alone makes graphics. It has nothing to do with time, budget, staff, outlined goals, and quality of assets.

To a certain point.

Doesn't matter if it's software rendering or hardware rendering if you don't use the goods it's meaningless to some despite if you have the power.

Time doesn't mean much on a nintendo console. Factor 5 demonstrated that with various n64 and gc titles done in under a year to 18 months and had great results pushing a system. Staff certainly does dictate the quality of the graphics to argue otherwise is as foolish as saying it's not about the hardware. Quality of assets or effects is exactly what we use to judge these things it matters.

What do you mean? Do you think Ubisoft isnt capable of delivering that? Look at Watch dogs...

Ubisoft has multiple teams and the one doing this has isn't responsible for that, ac, or the splinter cell games which easily fall under their best looking.

 

[lednerg]

What do you mean? Do you think Ubisoft isnt capable of delivering that? Look at Watch dogs...

There's more than one Ubisoft studio.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

What I'm saying is that the amount of pixels is not an order of magnitude greater, and hence has nothing to do with the generation. We've had 720p 30/60fps games since Xbox/PS2 and we will next generation as well. I don't know what the fillrate count he posted is supposed to prove.

It was more a reflection of priorities than anything. PGR3 has to make major sacrifices in an obvious area, that's all.

Though I also think you're going a bit far saying pixel fillrate isn't a measure of next gen-ness (or whatever). That seems to be the major argument against Wii U (ports aren't 1080p/60fps universally) while used to prop up 360 launch ports from PS2/Xbox that got bumped to 720p (but not 60fps).

 

[Smiles and Cries]

Considering the HUGE overall improvement i revealed in a WUST that some studios managed to reach from winter 2011/2012 builds to post-E3 ones, it's not surprising that Ancel went from "meh" to "wow" in this judgment of the system capabilities. We're talking of a 2X scale of increase, thanks to tons of parameters (new dev kit, a lot of new SDK, enhancements in middleware, engines, learning curve of developers, more and more familiar with the console specificities). Now, this improvement is surely not consistent across the board for every projects, but it's here, it's automatic, at least from the release of new dev kits and new sdk.

Really, the Wii U is a solid system, not a current gen one, if this precision was still needed.

Did you recently drop some dashboard rumor I see on a banned site that you are being blamed for a Wii U dashboard rumor that claims Wii/3DS look and feature set for Wii U dashboard.

- don't expect a complete revolution on the dashboard side
- natural evolution of the Wii "channel" organization
- will include improvements, some stemming from 3DS design
- possibility Miiverse won't be ready for third parties on day one
- staging process for content as to not overwhelm consumers

the comments say this is from you?

 

[Proelite]

Of course it is. The budget for that thing is WAY more impressive than any Wii U game.

Not on a budget thats probably 20-40 times less than Halo 4.

The next Metroid better blow Halo 4 away or there will be some explaining to do on Nintendo's part and some epic damage control to do on Nintendo fan's part.

Same for the next Zelda.

 

[ozfunghi]

Do you have a source of how much money were spent on both games?

One would think the "probably" gave it away.

 

[Alexios]

The next Metroid better blow Halo 4 away or there will be some explaining to do on Nintendo's part and some epic damage control to do on Nintendo fan's part.

Same for the next Zelda.

Why? When did anyone claim those games will look better than Halo 4? That's quite a leap of logic going from people merely saying ZombiU and the like aren't necessarily representative of everything the system is capable of. Nintendo isn't even known for its big budget cinematic productions. Other M is probably the closest they've come to that style of game, and that didn't exactly go down well regardless of the system's power (though graphically it's often quite good). I mean, what if next Zelda is Wind Waker 2...

Lol @ Blanka pretending to not know the difference between publisher and developer, or that different games have different goals, budgets and the like, which obviously affect their whole, graphics included, just to make a point.

Also, the Witcher 2 was a huge production for the studio and suffers in many presentation areas, though they don't necessarily show in screenshots. Also, part of the lower (but not exactly low budget) cost is the area it was developed in. Plus, talent and dedication, man. Not everyone has it, or devotes it on any project. The Witcher 1 certainly didn't come close either.

 

[lednerg]

The next Metroid better blow Halo 4 away or there will be some explaining to do on Nintendo's part and some epic damage control to do on Nintendo fan's part.

Same for the next Zelda.

I would replace the word "Metroid" with "Retro Studios game". While they could be one and the same, whatever it is they're working on is what most Nintendo fans have their hopes up about in terms of flashy graphics for a Western audience.

That said, whatever they do come out with, no matter how good, will not be met with universal praise from Halo fans. Fanboyism goes both ways, I'm afraid.

 

[XtremeXpider]

Why? When did anyone claim those games will look better than Halo 4? That's quite a leap of logic going from people merely saying ZombiU and the like aren't necessarily representative of everything the system is capable of. Nintendo isn't even known for its big budget cinematic productions. Other M is probably the closest they've come to that style of game, and that didn't exactly go down well regardless of the system's power (though graphically it's quite good). Or do you already know they'll have the same budget and graphical intentions as Halo4?

Great visuals not mean great budget. It only needs people with knowledges and some time. First Gears of War was a "low budget" game.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

It was more a reflection of priorities than anything. PGR3 has to make major sacrifices in an obvious area, that's all.

Though I also think you're going a bit far saying pixel fillrate isn't a measure of next gen-ness (or whatever). That seems to be the major argument against Wii U (ports aren't 1080p/60fps universally) while used to prop up 360 launch ports from PS2/Xbox that got bumped to 720p (but not 60fps).

Consoles have technically been able to produce 720p/60 visuals since Dreamcast. We don't have any hard numbers for the Wii U yet, and it definitely depends on scene complexity. Compare the same games from the same developers to get an idea, not just Racer x from this gen and Racer y from another.

 

[Nilaul]

The Witcher 2 is not a "big budget" game and it looks stuning:





I'm sure Retro will do.

Its big budget product comparing to Polish minimum wage standard, working patterns and living costs. The same product in America would cost a lot more.

 

[LCGeek]

The Witcher 2 is not a "big budget" game and it looks stuning:

So where does this override my other point which is that a good staff helps a lot

Id software
Factor 5
Epic

All small teams that make great looking games why because they have skills. Staff matters never argued otherwise, that's another user.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Why? When did anyone claim those games will look better than Halo 4? That's quite a leap of logic going from people merely saying ZombiU and the like aren't necessarily representative of everything the system is capable of. Nintendo isn't even known for its big budget cinematic productions. Other M is probably the closest they've come to that style of game, and that didn't exactly go down well regardless of the system's power (though graphically it's often quite good). I mean, what if next Zelda is Wind Waker 2...

Lol @ Blanka pretending to not know the difference between publisher and developer, or that different games have different goals, budgets and the like, which obviously affect their whole, graphics included, just to make a point.

So what would be the point of Wii U having more powerful hardware, when nobody seems to use it? Neither third party devs for ports, nor Nintendo for their exclusives?

 

[XtremeXpider]

Its big budget product comparing to Polish minimum wage standard, working patterns and living costs. The same product in America would cost a lot more.

Then Zombi U is a "big budget" for polish devs.

 

[BlankaBR]

Great visuals not mean great budget. It only needs people with knowledges and some time. First Gears of War was a "low budget" game.

Resident Evil 6 had Capcoms biggest team working on the game and turn out to be a mediocre game

 

[Alexios]

Great visuals not mean great budget. It only needs people with knowledges and some time. First Gears of War was a "low budget" game.

No, it doesn't necessarily mean that. But more often than not, it does. Especially when speaking of the mainstream market, not a pair of indies who slaved away for years because they love what they're doing or something. Denying that is silly. Of course there are always exceptions, nobody said it's the law. Ubisoft has plenty PS360 games that don't look like AC3, how do you explain that? The systems became underpowered for a period? Like what do the huge budgets of said huge budget games go to if the games could be equally good without them? Those must be some retarded publishers and developers giving all that money for nothing.

So what would be the point of Wii U having more powerful hardware, when nobody seems to use it? Neither third party devs for ports, nor Nintendo for their exclusives?

I have no idea how you got that from my post.

 

[XtremeXpider]

No, it doesn't necessarily mean that. But more often than not, it does. Especially when speaking of the mainstream market, not a pair of indies who slaved away for years because they love what they're doing or something. Denying that is silly. Of course there are always exceptions, nobody said it's the law. Ubisoft has plenty PS360 games that don't look like AC3, how do you explain that? The systems became underpowered for a period? Like what do the huge budgets of said huge budget games go to if the games could be equally good without them? Those must be some retarded publishers and developers giving all that money for nothing.

And, as BlankaBR said, some "big budget" games don't have the "greatest" visuals. Like I said before, it is a mix of budget and devs experiences, with an experienced team you don't need a big budget, there are a lot of samples.

 

[cyberheater]

How many times will you ignore the fact that people need to actually put some sort of effort in to use the power of the system.

It's a nice response to say that the reason we're not seeing next gen like graphics is because every dev on WiiU isn't putting any effort in.

 

[Alexios]

It's a nice response to say that the reason we're not seeing next gen like graphics is because every dev on WiiU isn't putting any effort in.

I don't think he said that, though. Maybe I missed it. But I don't think it's that far fetched to think a system can maybe do better than launch titles, most of which clearly weren't very ambitious (even outside the quality of the graphics few if any even try to have the cinematic oomph of your average AAA game). Whether that better is next gen enough for you is a different issue. Some people don't even think PCs are that far ahead because they get the same AAA games, just spiced up, ignoring the reasons for it. Whatever works for whoever. Having less than the best graphics doesn't mean there was no effort involved either, there are different areas to development. For a historical example, Wii didn't exactly boast many titles that looked as good as Super Mario Galaxy and Monster Hunter Tri. Going by most games you wouldn't guess it's any better than the PS2, but such clearly prove it is. If they didn't exist, that wouldn't be proof they are impossible. It still didn't get any big budget exclusive of the Metal Gear or Resident Evil or Halo type, things that tend to wow people these days were absent (I guess COD was the closest it got, but being a port intended for other systems it didn't look nearly as good as PS2 exclusives, even if technically it probably couldn't be ported to it in that way). Again, that doesn't mean such weren't possible. Nobody is claiming to know how well WiiU will do and if it will get that sort of AAA production tailored to it or if it will be relegated to PS360 ports and later when the PS4 and Nextbox are out low budget spin offs, niche games, etc, like the Wii was, never showing its potential in certain categories. Just that pretending to know for a fact nothing can improve on what's already seen, essentially just "because nothing has already", is quite silly to see.

 

[Steph_E.]

Might be different in the states but i don't know anyone who has a blu-ray player which isn't a PS3.

It might be different where you live, but here in Manchester I only know one person who has a PS3, but I know plenty of people who have blu-ray players.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Consoles have technically been able to produce 720p/60 visuals since Dreamcast. We don't have any hard numbers for the Wii U yet, and it definitely depends on scene complexity. Compare the same games from the same developers to get an idea, not just Racer x from this gen and Racer y from another.

Are RSC2 and PGR3 really incomparable though? Both are 1st party headliners, same genre, respected devs, about a dev cycle apart. They're not entirely unrelated really. I guess we could also look back to PGR2, which was also dissapointingly 30fps and favored processing over framerate.

Still, I just don't think propping up PGR3 is really the best example of 360 "next gen" visuals given it was subHD and sported a contentious genre framerate. Most of the 360 launch stuff was unimpressive, and even the better examples were problematic in some respects (as PGR3 definitely was). That's what tends to happen at next gen launches though.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Then Zombi U is a "big budget" for polish devs.

Too bad then it's being developed in France and not Poland.

If we stick to the "same devs, same genre" notion AS put forward, the team's last fps was King Kong 360.

 

[test_account]

Nintendo also said 3ds cards could only go up to 2gb but we've got 4gb games already

That was only at launch, wasnt it?


On dual layer discs, you need hardware that can read it. Nintendo needs have this ready in every console from day 1.

 

[frankie_baby]

That was only at launch, wasnt it?


On dual layer discs, you need hardware that can read it. Nintendo needs have this ready in every console from day 1.

I'm pretty sure (could be mistaken ) all they said was 2gb cards

 

[Durante]

Is that screenshot further up representative of the current IQ of NintendoLand? I'm just wondering if they are really going with 720p and no AA.

 

[Stulaw]

I'm pretty sure (could be mistaken ) all they said was 2gb cards

Nope, 2GB at launch and up to 8GB in the future. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_Game_Card

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Nope, 2GB at launch and up to 8GB in the future. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_Game_Card

The "8GB in the future" bit never came from Nintendo, that was a leak from the card manufacturer iirc. All Nintendo said was 2GB max at launch.