BankaiZaraki
Banned
I hope I'm never in a serious accident that will require an ambulance and thousands of dollars worth of hospital bills.
I just got threatened to be sent to collections because I can't pay for an ambulance
- Thread starter KevinCow
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nVidiot_Whore
Banned
A rather large percentage of bills go unpaid (upwards of 25%).. it's hardly "microscopic." And as healthcare costs have risen.. so have the amount of unpaid bills (not shocking especially considering the economy going in the opposite direction.)
I fully support single-payer nationalized health care by the way..
But in the current system, unpaid bills are a problem.. and one that feeds into itself growing said problem.
Being insured and not figuring out how to properly get your insurance to pay your bills is just sort of silly.
He does have health care, it is just that you have to pay for some of it which may mean selling a Wii U.
Medical bills suck as I said, I had to pay over $3000 out of pocket for when I rode an ambulance, 4 day hospital stay, plus surgery and I have phenomenal health insurance. I had to make sacrifices to pay my bills and it sucked but I am sure glad I had health insurance because if not, THEN I would have been in debt forever.
GillianSeed79
Member
Just hope you never get a helicopter ride. Might as well declare bankruptcy if you survive.
Also, just a side-note. For all those complaining that if we had universal healthcare there would be long lines to see a doctor, I tried to make an appointment with gastrologist (sic) the other day. I was told the first available appointment was Jan. 21. There's only one other gastro in town. Yay. Envy of the world. Yadda, yadda.
Unless you are on National Park land. A guy was helicoptered out of a remote hike-in beach location 3 hours away from Seattle for free, and do you know why? Because when you pay for your site access pass to the park, that shit is covered under it.
You missed the part where he was strapped down and put in the ambulance.
BankaiZaraki
Banned
Haha yeah. That would suck.
nVidiot_Whore
Banned
If he "almost died".. his insurance should cover at least the majority of the ambulance ride.
I don't see where he indicated he contacted his insurance.
Not every medical bill is processed through insurance automatically.. if you get ANY medical bill in the mail, immediately contact your insurance and ask them about it.
I don't see where he indicated he contacted his insurance.
Not every medical bill is processed through insurance automatically.. if you get ANY medical bill in the mail, immediately contact your insurance and ask them about it.
So you're saying since you got fucked by the system, KevinCow deserves to get fucked just as bad?
Well, good. I hope things work out for you.
That isn't what I am saying at all. In no way did I get fucked by the system, sure it was expensive as shit, but I can walk again. With the health system we have in the US you know you have to pay at least part of your way if you can, we do not have the health care system that other countries do and until then we have to pay for it. It sucks, but the alternative (no care) is even worse.
You have to pay for an ambulance in Canada. I think it's like $60 or something. I've only ever seen two ambulance bills in my life and they were a few years ago so I don't remember exactly what they were. They were definately under $100 however.
At the practice level, maybe it does come down to income more often than not. But I'm talking about hospital level where unpaid emergency room visits and ambulance transports are paid off often by government funding.
I should have said federal funding instead of tax discount, but a lot of these already established agreements are direct from funds created by tax, or the way the exchange is made is via a tax discount or a tax refund where direct funding might be complicated or improper. The end result is money staying where it is instead of being given back, which is just as effective. This isn't a result of income assessment, but more services and responsibilities, and ultimately liabilities.
I'd say the system probably had a much better time of it than you did. Bottom line is we have a problem with the status quo. You apparently do not. Does the exchange need to go beyond that point? Not necessarily.
Clay Davis
Member
what's the point of insurance if you still end up having to pay out of your pocket?
that sounds like a pretty amazing and disgusting racket. you pay insurance but you also pay for some of your hospital costs. what does the insurance cover then?
Like 80% of the cost. The full bill was likely WAYYYY over $3000.
That should be a political comic. End panel, the paramedics chasing after you with a stretcher, into oncoming traffic, Keystone Cops style.
That's a bit of a self-answering question, isn't it? The insurance pays for as little as possible since the insurance companies will do everything in their power to make you pay instead. 'MERICA!
Correct. Adding up all the medical bills, from the ambulance ride, hospital stay, surgery, to the follow-up doctors appointments and physical therapy, it came out to around $45,000 total.
Zoe
Member
That's how ALL insurance works. If you have some kind of insurance with zero deductible, then you're typically swimming in premium costs.
Clay Davis
Member
do they make this clear when you take out insurance? that they will only cover 80% or less of the costs?
pretty disgusting if you ask me. you pay insurance, they should cover the totality of the costs.
I've claimed on insurance before (home related) and they paid the full amount. there was no arguing or back and forth with them over how little they would pay and such.
then again, I am in the uk.
Of course. There are also ways to get them to cover the whole costs, but this usually involves you paying a deductible.
well than maybe the the doctors should do something about it instead of charging humongous bills to people that cant afford it.
The system is what it is right now. Bitching about the way things are is not going to change his current situation. He has obligations to pay for the services that were rendered to him. He needed emergency medical treatment and he received it. Now the people who provided him his care need to be compensated. He has a responsibility to pay for the care he received. He may not like it, but that is the way it is right now.
cloudwalking
300chf ain't shit to me
Typically how much you pay a month for insurance also affects your yearly deductible (at least here in Switzerland).
You can choose to pay more per month and have a smaller deductible, maybe as low as a few hundred bucks. You can also pay less per month and have a higher deductible. Most people here just adjust it to whatever they can afford combined with how often they typically need medical attention. Someone who gets sick a lot or has a pre-existing condition will probably want to pay a little more a month and therefore have a lower yearly deductible because they'll need to go to the doctor a lot.
I personally have a high deductible because I rarely get sick, so I save money by paying less per month than most people. If something should happen where I'd need to pay the deductible, the insurance pays 90% of the cost of all procedures up until a certain cutoff, then they cover 100% of the costs.
ClassyPenguin
Banned
Your tag is apt.
Duane Cunningham
Member
Usually it's something like 80/20, meaning you pay the 20%. However everything in the US is super inflated, so it still usually winds up being a pretty huge chunk.
Basically, in the US:
-You pay premiums... say $110 per month or something depending on where you work. This is a typical price to insure yourself. Add a spouse and a child or God forbid both and it can easily go up to close to $700 (which is what I pay). Also, this is done through your employer, who also gives them some money. Change jobs and you have to set it up again with someone else.
-You pay for the deductible. Meaning the first $2,000 (or more depending on your plan) is ALL on you. This number resets every year. A lot of plans are a little less than that, but plenty have a higher deductible. Plenty are $3,000, and the average climbs every year.
-You pay for your co-pay. Like I said, this is usually 20-40%. (Only after the deductible is met, mind you. Prior to that, you pay 100%.)
And as others have said, the prices for stuff is off the charts. Things like CT scans or MRIs usually cost a few thousand, compared to a few hundred in European countries. So if you need one, and it's $3k and you're on an 80/20 copay and have met your deductible, you have to pay $600 out of your pocket. These amounts are pretty typical.
Some things to keep in mind, however:
Even though the CT scan costs you $600 after insurance, you'll owe another $120 for the room you stayed in for an hour, $400 for the CT operators, $300 for you regular doctor, $X for this, $X for that, anything like an anesthesiologist or an ambulance ride or any little thing is going to cost you another couple hundred after insurance.
AND, if you don't submit EVERYTHING, they won't count it toward the deductible. And trust me, the insurance company won't be easy to get a hold of or submit claims to. When they deduct the premiums from your paycheck, they don't make a mistake. It comes out like clockwork, and you don't have to do anything. But when it's their turn to pay out, you have extremely vague instructions, automated phone lines that are engineered to keep you out, and if they "accidentally" make a mistake covering one of your items, you better catch it, because they sure as hell wont. In fact, good luck bringing it to their attention.
Once you have wheeled and dealed with them long enough that you're SURE your pile of bills (nothing gets consolidated, you literally have a separate bill for the ambulance, the MRI people, etc) really is what you owe, it's going to add up to a few thousand. So what you then have to do is get on a payment plan with each of them and pay out $50 a month to each one until they're all gone.
IF you can't pay, or you can't understand the system or whatever, they WILL bankrupt you and ruin your credit.
This is how the health care system works in the USA. If you feel like you need to go to the doctor for something, you have to think long and hard whether you actually want to go, because if you do you're going to owe some serious money. And that's if you DO have insurance. For those who don't... well, basically don't plan on ever buying a house or a car.
Please. He has a deductible and owes his deductible. He is responsible for that. If he can't pay for that, go on assistance. Though I doubt he will get much help since he is still a covered dependent on his mother's plan and she, presumably, has some type of group health insurance.
Zoe
Member
Of course it's spelled out clear as day when you sign up for the plan. The problem with the OP is he's not the one who signed up for the plan.
We have deductibles for home insurance as well in the US.
Amory
Member
Asshole paramedics trying to save lives and whatnot, trying to play god. Should've told them to go fuck themselves.
This is complete and utter BS. The health insurance industry is heavily regulated by the federal government. Are you at all familar with the concept of Prompt Pay?
D
Deleted member 81567
Unconfirmed Member
This is so sad.
My little brother actually got sent to collections over a 10K hospital bill because his primary insurance tried to pawn responsibility off. He got stabbed in the neck at a party, was carted off by ambulance, spent a night in the hospital. The game of "Not it" insurance companies play is insane. It was suggested that either the stabber should be held responsible for the bills (the guy had no money and was carted off to jail for stabbing), or the homeowner's insurance of the place the party was at should contribute. It did ultimately get worked out somehow, a year later and after convincing the hospital to try billing insurance again, but it's amazing how effective insurance is at finding excuses to try to gt out of paying.
Duane Cunningham
Member
What do you mean it's BS? No, it's not. I'm speaking though personal experience. Dealing with these people is a load of thick jargon and bullshit. Humana was that way, my current provider is that way, they all are. If you have a question, you have to press 1 for this and 4 for that, then sit on hold for 15 minutes then get transferred to somebody else, then accidentally hung up on.
Why in the fuck would you bold that and claim that it's bs?
nVidiot_Whore
Banned
Interesting.. thanks.
My point still stands however: It's still in their best interest to collect a full prompt payment, rather than having to go through some agency to get funding.
It seemed like you were suggesting they incur no loss of potential profit when you don't pay.. and that's certainly untrue. They'd all rather you pay because that's cheaper for them to operate that way, and they aren't missing funds until reimbursement occurs.
And my main point wasn't to suggest people not paying is the "root cause" of high health care costs.. but it is part of the justification for them.. the entire system of them being reimbursed exists because of people not paying.
The whole situation is just ridiculous to me either way. We should have nationalized healthcare.. 1 plan.. 1 payer... removes so much of the crap that inflates everything.
empty vessel
Member
Or not paying his health care bills, a practice I don't oppose. Of course, it's an individual decision. The broader point is that accessing health care should not depend upon economic circumstances of an individual. And that it naturally follows that one ought not need to choose between health care and a Wii U if one can generally otherwise afford a Wii U.
If you're A&O x 4 you can AMA. If they continue to strap you down. Get a lawyer and you have a case of kidnapping and get rich.
And there's the reason why that ambulance ride was $1000.
Duane Cunningham
Member
Yeah, must be it. You can't even look at the headlines without seeing a frivolous ambulance kidnapping lawsuit. It's pretty much a daily thing.
It's about $80 and you get charged the fee even if you don't get in. So if someone else unecessarily calls one you still get pegged. Better than the US by far but kinda dumb.
Wickerbasket
Member
Shameful system that shits all over the poor and the middle class. The fact that one of the top reasons for bankruptcy in the US is medical costs says a lot about the priorities of the country.
It's disgraceful that one streak of bad health can ruin someone's entire life and drive them out of house and home.
I can't imagine what it's like having to consider the cost of visiting the doctors. You shouldn't have to weigh the pros and cons of having good health vs having money for the month.
It's disgraceful that one streak of bad health can ruin someone's entire life and drive them out of house and home.
I can't imagine what it's like having to consider the cost of visiting the doctors. You shouldn't have to weigh the pros and cons of having good health vs having money for the month.
Are frivolous ambulance kidnapping lawsuit the only frivolous medical malpractice lawsuits?
Do you even know how much a hospitals and doctors have to pay for malpractice insurance?
Pretty much because you have companies "kidnapping" patients and billing their insurance. You have people who have fractures breaking skin going AMA, granted kidney stones are about as painful as it can get for a guy. But it cost quite a bit to operate an ambulance.
My brother got a collection notice for one. Someone spiked his drink and he had a violent reaction to it. I guess our mom was ignoring the bill. He was 17 at the time so I was confused about how he could even be getting collection agency letters in the mail as a minor. Not sure what happened with that.
faceless007
Member
Are those numbers typical for private insurers in the U.S.? I'm sure some are that bad but do we have aggregated stats for most insurers? Because mine is nowhere near that expensive.
TedBundysNips
Member
Had some issues with american hospitals myself over the past few months , Took a trip to Vegas in may ( I'm from the UK ) went for a walk one morning for breakfast, on the way back my girlfriend collapsed due to the heat I helped her round gave her water and a sugar snack (she's also diabetic). Then all of a sudden an ambulance screech's up to us and 2 guys jump out asking me to step away from her and do I know who she is!?! I never called an ambulance so a passer by must of called , anyway guy asks her and my details and he says ain't you a little old for her!?! The fuck I'm 28 you moron she's 26!! Into the ambulance she goes with a drip inserted to her , she seems fine now no problems , we arrive at spring valley hospital where she's put on a bed and into a corridor where we were for at least 5 hours till some dick ex marine doctor said we need to do some tests, I was like erm for what?? To which he replied to see if she has any other problems , After he went away for an hour the admin lady said can my girlfriend sign an insurance form I said yeh sure were insured no problem so I filled in our details gave her back the insurance form which she quickly looked at and said my insurance details were false and my bank didn't exist ( its a well known bank in England I've used since I was at least 6 ) I said wtf type in it Google to which she replied Google is not reliable!! Upon hearing this she said I must pay $2500 now. I was angry as shit at this point and told her no way am I paying that , so she says I'll take whatever money you have in your wallet and purse to which I cal my replied fuck you. Then the doctor came back I told him I don't want any further tests done which are not needed and were going , so I signed the discharge form and left the hospital. At the hotel I rang my insurance company and they said don't worry your covered it should be sorted no problem. Since then I have had collection letters from Switzerland and Jamaica demanding the money ($3400) which is for the ambulance and use of the hospital bed and drip!?! My insurance company have gotten every letter these cranks have sent me but they even had the nerve to find my girlfriends work number and contact her!!! Its hopefully all sorted now but was a bit of a worry at first. Great time in Vegas though OK back next year lol.
Duane Cunningham
Member
I've heard of better and worse. My gut says those numbers are pretty average, but I could be off. I know there are High Deductable low premium plans and vice versa.
thetechkid
Member
This isn't really related but it reminds me of a time a cop showed up at my door saying someone called 911 from our house and since no one did he left, we ended up getting a bill in the mail later for like $35.
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