Mental Health |OT| Depression & Co.

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Song rec of the day: Diane Young by Vampire Weekend

I always think of my pal, Bagels, when I hear this. And then if we're on Mumble I sing my favorite part to him. I'm sure he's sick of it. BABY BABY BABY BAby

If Diane Young won't change your mind,
Baby, baby, baby, baby right on time
 
Sometimes simple papers can be hard to write because you tend to over think things. (My sister's going through the same thing in the next room, actually.) It's a frustrating feeling, I know. If it'd make you feel better to have someone besides your dad help out, let me know. :)
Thanks, maybe you can help me on the next one. After banging my head on a figurative wall I started making progress, that's usually how it goes. (Which doesn't always cut it in college, unfortunately.)
I know that feeling. Fucked up my last two quarters of college.

Sometimes writing it on paper actually helps.
I'm rather slow when it comes to writing by hand.
 
Didn't realize there were so many Dutch in this topic! Suddenly my 'Dutch speakwords' feel less special. So where do all us Dutch headcases live at, then? I'm in Zwolle.
WOW! I'm in Zwolle too... I like the Dutch speakwords ;) Funny to see them translated.

I really appreciate the quote as one of my first impulses when I woke up was a desire to delete the post and try to hide everything away. I realized I forgot to ask someone to quote it so I was very thankful to see someone did so anyway. As for trying to deal with the fear/anxiety with avoidance, it was an important part of the process in my original therapy, but that was tempered by an understanding that I still needed to develop active coping/defensive mechanisms. I had to rewire my default chain of thinking so that I could be exposed to triggers without getting sucked into the vortex of despair. Otherwise I would be too dependent on external conditions I couldn't control and a regular life means that I will get exposed to triggers, so I wanted to be strong enough to acknowledge and reject them.



I see enough of myself in your description that I'll share a bit about my therapy in case it helps in some way. One of the hardest things I had to accept was that I had a guilt-complex and that it helped to fuel some of my self-destructive tendencies. For example, I lost a lot of weight during my depression because I had no appetite and eating felt pointless. I would try to force it down, but that would often lead me to vomit (anxiety attacks also caused me to vomit). But I also got a bizarre kind of pleasure out of it, because I felt like my suffering somehow compensated a bit for my privileged first world existence. When people remarked how worried they were about my weight loss, it would make me feel better, not worse. It felt like proof I was truly suffering, and I had to suffer because of how good my life was compared to the third world.

I did not want to admit it for a long time, but I was being masochistic and guilt was the tool; I would even intentionally make anxiety attacks I was coping with worse so that I would vomit. It's hard to recall and explain the motivations precisely. I was suffering, but it was self serving suffering motivated by my own desires, I wasn't actually suffering for the third world. Why would anyone there know or care that I didn't eat that day or that I threw up my last meal? It didn't change or affect anything or anyone except for my life (and others in it). "Real" guilt corresponds with corrective action, not self-flagellation.

The problem is there's no one to apologize to nor is there any true absolution for inequality; there's nothing I can correct, it's just the way things are. Knowing I couldn't impact the dynamics of global inequality, I had to decide how I wanted to react, do I not deserve to live at all or do I accept reality and move on? If I truly felt first world existence was immoral or unjustifiable, then I should kill myself or move to the third world, but self-harm and masochistic guilt was not an honest response. That was my attempt to have both slices of the pie, to live in the first world because I 'bought' in through suffering.

That also tied into a lot of my high concept philosophical thinking that was just self-harmful and truly pointless. What was the point of getting into those weeds if it was only going to hurt me? I felt some duty to 'honesty', that ignoring these "truths" was wrong and I had to confront them, no matter the pain and suffering it caused me and those I had relationships with. Giving up 'big' philosophy was one of the most important things I had to do to survive and I still struggle with it. But for me, continuing down that road was a dead end, I wanted to live, not to live like I was dying. I have not cracked open a philosophy book in many years and I am the better for it. I don't want to imply that I got better simply through self-realizations or appraisals though. They were necessary steps in my recovery but not sufficient by any stretch. True recovery meant extensive training to rewire my thinking and behavior from default negative to default positive, simple and cliched it may be.

Finally, I would say that although I am not a Buddhist, I identify with a lot of Buddhist teaching which I find to be a realistic and practical appraisal of human experience. I went to Jesuit schools but had a Buddhist relative, though I would not claim to have more than a passing knowledge. Although the Jesuits helped strengthen and affirm my thirst for justice, Buddhism helped me realize that kind of thirst (tanhā) is itself a source of suffering. A desire for answers, for purpose, for identity, for justice, all these kinds of cravings are a well of suffering; they are a black hole of need that you will never be able to truly satisfy, because it is the continued existence of the need itself that is the problem, not a perceived lack of solutions or answers which can only ever offer temporary relief. An unyielding desire to be happy can be just as harmful as an unyielding desire to not be sad. It's a very different way of thinking compared to Western tradition, and I have found it helpful in getting away from the existential angst that Western philosophy tends to create.

Great post, thanks for sharing. I completely understand the problem, I have the same thing with animal rights, deciding on being vegetarian/vegan. Now I just avoid every movie, story and picture about it, I'm vegetarian and try my best. If I try to do more, I freak out.
 
WOW! I'm in Zwolle too... I like the Dutch speakwords ;) Funny to see them translated.

Wow. Talk about a small world. Maybe I've seen you before. Matter of fact, I'm at the train station right now. Looking over my shoulder. I feel like I'm being watched. Haha.
 
I really appreciate the quote as one of my first impulses when I woke up was a desire to delete the post and try to hide everything away. I realized I forgot to ask someone to quote it so I was very thankful to see someone did so anyway. As for trying to deal with the fear/anxiety with avoidance, it was an important part of the process in my original therapy, but that was tempered by an understanding that I still needed to develop active coping/defensive mechanisms. I had to rewire my default chain of thinking so that I could be exposed to triggers without getting sucked into the vortex of despair. Otherwise I would be too dependent on external conditions I couldn't control and a regular life means that I will get exposed to triggers, so I wanted to be strong enough to acknowledge and reject them.



I see enough of myself in your description that I'll share a bit about my therapy in case it helps in some way. One of the hardest things I had to accept was that I had a guilt-complex and that it helped to fuel some of my self-destructive tendencies. For example, I lost a lot of weight during my depression because I had no appetite and eating felt pointless. I would try to force it down, but that would often lead me to vomit (anxiety attacks also caused me to vomit). But I also got a bizarre kind of pleasure out of it, because I felt like my suffering somehow compensated a bit for my privileged first world existence. When people remarked how worried they were about my weight loss, it would make me feel better, not worse. It felt like proof I was truly suffering, and I had to suffer because of how good my life was compared to the third world.

I did not want to admit it for a long time, but I was being masochistic and guilt was the tool; I would even intentionally make anxiety attacks I was coping with worse so that I would vomit. It's hard to recall and explain the motivations precisely. I was suffering, but it was self serving suffering motivated by my own desires, I wasn't actually suffering for the third world. Why would anyone there know or care that I didn't eat that day or that I threw up my last meal? It didn't change or affect anything or anyone except for my life (and others in it). "Real" guilt corresponds with corrective action, not self-flagellation.

The problem is there's no one to apologize to nor is there any true absolution for inequality; there's nothing I can correct, it's just the way things are. Knowing I couldn't impact the dynamics of global inequality, I had to decide how I wanted to react, do I not deserve to live at all or do I accept reality and move on? If I truly felt first world existence was immoral or unjustifiable, then I should kill myself or move to the third world, but self-harm and masochistic guilt was not an honest response. That was my attempt to have both slices of the pie, to live in the first world because I 'bought' in through suffering.

That also tied into a lot of my high concept philosophical thinking that was just self-harmful and truly pointless. What was the point of getting into those weeds if it was only going to hurt me? I felt some duty to 'honesty', that ignoring these "truths" was wrong and I had to confront them, no matter the pain and suffering it caused me and those I had relationships with. Giving up 'big' philosophy was one of the most important things I had to do to survive and I still struggle with it. But for me, continuing down that road was a dead end, I wanted to live, not to live like I was dying. I have not cracked open a philosophy book in many years and I am the better for it. I don't want to imply that I got better simply through self-realizations or appraisals though. They were necessary steps in my recovery but not sufficient by any stretch. True recovery meant extensive training to rewire my thinking and behavior from default negative to default positive, simple and cliched it may be.

Finally, I would say that although I am not a Buddhist, I identify with a lot of Buddhist teaching which I find to be a realistic and practical appraisal of human experience. I went to Jesuit schools but had a Buddhist relative, though I would not claim to have more than a passing knowledge. Although the Jesuits helped strengthen and affirm my thirst for justice, Buddhism helped me realize that kind of thirst (tanhā) is itself a source of suffering. A desire for answers, for purpose, for identity, for justice, all these kinds of cravings are a well of suffering; they are a black hole of need that you will never be able to truly satisfy, because it is the continued existence of the need itself that is the problem, not a perceived lack of solutions or answers which can only ever offer temporary relief. An unyielding desire to be happy can be just as harmful as an unyielding desire to not be sad. It's a very different way of thinking compared to Western tradition, and I have found it helpful in getting away from the existential angst that Western philosophy tends to create.

wow, thank you for this. i think i'll be returning to it a number of times in the future. it really does help.
 
I sympathize with you quite a bit Brawndo.

In the sense that I also feel guilt and seem to derive some kind of pleasure from punishing myself. It was initially my psychologist that brought this to my attention as I had never used the word masochism to describe my actions and opinions towards myself and what I should be doing. Thinking about the various negative events and injustices across the world is something that I think about very often, as well as my own regret for refusing to take opportunities that would have resulted in a positive benefit to my life and perhaps the life of my parents. I seem to have bolted myself to the belief that I can somehow change reality after I die. The belief that I cannot effect the great change I desire in life but would somehow gain that ability in death. I have no logical or rational basis for believing this. Absolutely no supporting evidence besides mere speculation but my mind continues to hold onto this belief. In a way this provides some kind of reassurance as no matter how things turn out in life I will still "win" in the end and will have the world of peace for all that I desire.

Naturally I realize that this is all likely a coping mechanism I've created in order to deal with my depression. However I don't see it as an issue as long as it provides some kind of positive effect to my mental state. Unfortunately it doesn't affect the issue of my self punishment, that I am unworthy. That my parents would have been better off if they had bore a child who would be significantly superior to myself in every fashion. One of my fantasies is of sacrificing myself to give my parents a child who would be capable of achieving things that would make them proud. I realize this is impossible though and that it's not productive at all to think this way.

However when you are deep in the trenches these are the kinds of things that tend to circulate throughout your mind.

My biggest hurdle right now would be eliminating my need for self punishment, and allowing myself to pursue opportunities that I have forgone as part of that punishment. I honestly believe if I can do that then I can only move upwards from there.

Let me end off with thanking you Brawndo. Your giant walls of text inspired me to dust off my brain and actually type something longer than 5 lines.
 
Having a swell day so far, essay still isn't finished and I got soaked on the way to my first class.
The world just wants you to be as fresh as possible for the day. :D
I like getting caught in the rain, but only if I don't have a bag of stuff, which presumably you did. :(
 
Rode my bike to my ex one time. Got caught in a god damn cloudburst. Ten-minute ride, and I was completely soaked. She made me put on dry clothes when I got there. Her dry clothes. Haha.
 
Didn't get the job, apparently im not an "office fit" for them, which I can only assume means they don't think I would fit in with the rest of the people in the office.

Feels great.
 
It could be definitely returning to your baseline, which if depressed is kinda low. It could also be depression and stress symptoms as well. There doesn't seem to be long-term withdrawal issues with anti-depressants other than going back to a depressive state.

Try exercising, eating better and staying away from alcohol and drugs and get to a psychiatrist when you can.

Yeah, you're probably right about the return to baseline. Perhaps the contrast from meds to no meds is what's making me feel a little more on edge. I guess I'm a little concerned that since I took the SSRIs for so long that my neurochemical homeostasis has shifted and now that I'm off of the meds, it's that much worse. If this is the case, I think it will get better over time. I just feel so exhausted.

The body aches aren't necessarily painful, they're more just like body energy sinks and are all over. I don't know if that makes sense. It's comparable to how you feel after a tough work out.

Anyways, thanks for yall's support. It's really helpful knowing I'm not alone.

Having a swell day so far, essay still isn't finished and I got soaked on the way to my first class.

What is your paper on? When I have to write papers, it helps me to find one or two aspects of the material that I find interesting (that relates to the prompt) and expand on that. Write about what you know, not what you think the professor is looking for.
 
The world just wants you to be as fresh as possible for the day. :D
I like getting caught in the rain, but only if I don't have a bag of stuff, which presumably you did. :(
I had an umbrella, only the rain was coming down hard and sideways.
What is your paper on? When I have to write papers, it helps me to find one or two aspects of the material that I find interesting (that relates to the prompt) and expand on that. Write about what you know, not what you think the professor is looking for.
It's on the original English colonies in North America for my United States history course.
 
I'm trying to fight my anxiety symptoms mentally but I'm losing the battle. I feel much better when I take my anxiety medication but I haven't been taking it because I feel it makes me a weaker human being. Should I feel bad because I'm losing "the battle" or is it normal to have a hard time dealing with anxiety without the need for meds?
 
I'm trying to fight my anxiety symptoms mentally but I'm losing the battle. I feel much better when I take my anxiety medication but I haven't been taking it because I feel it makes me a weaker human being. Should I feel bad because I'm losing "the battle" or is it normal to have a hard time dealing with anxiety without the need for meds?
It doesn't make you a weaker human being. That's like saying I'm weak for having to take hormone supplements because I had thyroid cancer. Take your meds dude.
 
I'm down to two diphenhydramine sleeping pills. Took a few Atenolol last night and four of the sleeping pills and I still couldn't sleep good. Ended up crashing mid day. Insomnia is so bad with me and it's getting worse and worse and now I'm having to wake up early. I try to go to bed at a decent hour but all I do is toss and turn. My neighbor has Ambien and one time she offered me one and I refused but I've taken it a couple times before and I know it works. Half tempted to go over and ask her if she can spare me one but I'm not going to do that. I'm so agitated I feel like banging my head into the wall at this point. I already have enough high anxiety that causes me facial ticks and teeth grinding so I don't particularly need all this insomnia.
 
I'm trying to fight my anxiety symptoms mentally but I'm losing the battle. I feel much better when I take my anxiety medication but I haven't been taking it because I feel it makes me a weaker human being. Should I feel bad because I'm losing "the battle" or is it normal to have a hard time dealing with anxiety without the need for meds?

What Pau said. You'd think nothing of taking insulin if you had diabetes, right? Or pain pills after major surgery? There's nothing "weak" about taking medications for mental health issues. You've already said it helps you so why suffer needlessly?
 
Has anyone here suffered of a vertigo attack? I had one last Saturday that lasted for several hours. It was scary since I didn't knew what it was.
 
Haven't posted here in a while since things have been going well except for the past couple of days. There's been mounting pressure of feeling the need to grow up and settle down after seeing my friends get married and settling down. I worry about not being able to provide a good life for myself and future family. Nearly broke down this morning at work just thinking about the future. Thinking about it right now is really depressing me, while the pay for my job is good, I can't see myself doing it for life. Just seeing how miserable some of the people are scares me.
 
It doesn't make you a weaker human being. That's like saying I'm weak for having to take hormone supplements because I had thyroid cancer. Take your meds dude.

QFT - there's nothing weak about being unwell and treating the problem. 'Sensible' is the word I'd be inclined to apply.
 
Does anyone ever worry that being so jaded and fed up with the world may lead to them becoming a psychopath, or is this just me?
 
Does anyone ever worry that being so jaded and fed up with the world may lead to them becoming a psychopath, or is this just me?

Tbh, no. As I understand it, it is something someone is born with. Person has an inability to feel emotions that are essential to understanding/ participating in meaningful social interactions and empathy.

Sorry to hear about the lost opportunity. :(

I will get into gear with your resume once I'm done an online course for work that I'm behind on. It's something that I have to put first right now unfortunately.

Want to come to IRC and chat? :3
 
Haven't posted here in a while since things have been going well except for the past couple of days. There's been mounting pressure of feeling the need to grow up and settle down after seeing my friends get married and settling down. I worry about not being able to provide a good life for myself and future family. Nearly broke down this morning at work just thinking about the future. Thinking about it right now is really depressing me, while the pay for my job is good, I can't see myself doing it for life. Just seeing how miserable some of the people are scares me.

Start subtly looking for something better. And seriously, don't worry about the pressure to start a family and get married. If you want to, that's awesome, but don't let what other people are doing dictate your own self worth. Do what makes you happy, not what you think you are supposed to be doing.
 
My birthday is a little less than two weeks (September 29th) and I'll be hitting a "significant" age. I hope all goes well....
 
I'm trying to fight my anxiety symptoms mentally but I'm losing the battle. I feel much better when I take my anxiety medication but I haven't been taking it because I feel it makes me a weaker human being. Should I feel bad because I'm losing "the battle" or is it normal to have a hard time dealing with anxiety without the need for meds?

Thats just a lie your mind tells you. There is no logic to it. Try to take your meds.
 
I'm trying to fight my anxiety symptoms mentally but I'm losing the battle. I feel much better when I take my anxiety medication but I haven't been taking it because I feel it makes me a weaker human being. Should I feel bad because I'm losing "the battle" or is it normal to have a hard time dealing with anxiety without the need for meds?

I know it has been said before but take the meds anyway. See them as the weapons you take up to stomp the anxiety in the ground where it belongs, eating dirt, while you work on rebuilding the glorious nation of you mind. Yes you can fight the good fight with just your bare hands. But the AK-47 that is modern medicine is just a tad more effective at mowing down those treasonous enemies.

Hitting 21 in December. Feels kinda meaningless. In the south drinking is legal at any age if you are with family who are of age.

Kinda agree. After a certain age birthdays become sort of meaningless.

I often (almost daily) wish that i never existed, wiped from history, that no one ever knew me.

I kind of want to get to know you. That cool with you?
 
Hi guys, I know I kind of drive by posted a while ago and didn't come back (sorry about that I got a bit embarrassed) but thanks for your support. I finally went to see a doctor and got referred to a psychologist, not only for my problems dealing with suicide but for some ongoing anxiety stuff too. He even gave me some medication to stop me shaking. I'm feeling really good, like I'm finally going somewhere. Fingers crossed it goes well.
 
Hi guys, I know I kind of drive by posted a while ago and didn't come back (sorry about that I got a bit embarrassed) but thanks for your support. I finally went to see a doctor and got referred to a psychologist, not only for my problems dealing with suicide but for some ongoing anxiety stuff too. He even gave me some medication to stop me shaking. I'm feeling really good, like I'm finally going somewhere. Fingers crossed it goes well.

Crossing finger now. Good to hear that it is going better!
 
Hi guys, I know I kind of drive by posted a while ago and didn't come back (sorry about that I got a bit embarrassed) but thanks for your support. I finally went to see a doctor and got referred to a psychologist, not only for my problems dealing with suicide but for some ongoing anxiety stuff too. He even gave me some medication to stop me shaking. I'm feeling really good, like I'm finally going somewhere. Fingers crossed it goes well.

Hey, shanshan. Glad you're doing okay, here's hoping for the best. :)
 
Wow. Talk about a small world. Maybe I've seen you before. Matter of fact, I'm at the train station right now. Looking over my shoulder. I feel like I'm being watched. Haha.

I think I was walking behind you, there was this guy that kept looking over his shoulder. You're midtwenties right?
I was not at the station... :P

I have some good news today. My cat got lost two weeks ago and I had desperately tried to find her with no luck. Today my neighbour came to my door and told me that she saw it in her shed. It had been there for two weeks! Now she is home, hungry, stinky, but alive!
 
I think I was walking behind you, there was this guy that kept looking over his shoulder. You're midtwenties right?
I was not at the station... :P

I have some good news today. My cat got lost two weeks ago and I had desperately tried to find her with no luck. Today my neighbour came to my door and told me that she saw it in her shed. It had been there for two weeks! Now she is home, hungry, stinky, but alive!

Hooray! But poor cat... what with the terrible weather we've had the last week(s).
 
Hooray! But poor cat... what with the terrible weather we've had the last week(s).

Yeah, but she was inside the whole time, I had imagined her soaking wet as well. Instead she was thirsty :| She seems alright, but I think her tail is broken or something from the fall. I don't even have money for food, let alone the vet :( Guess I'll ask my parents for help..
 
I think I was walking behind you, there was this guy that kept looking over his shoulder. You're midtwenties right?
I was not at the station... :P

I have some good news today. My cat got lost two weeks ago and I had desperately tried to find her with no luck. Today my neighbour came to my door and told me that she saw it in her shed. It had been there for two weeks! Now she is home, hungry, stinky, but alive!

Congrats on the cat thing! So where in Zwolle are you? I'm in Assendorp.
 
Two members of my family very close to me have the same birthday. That means you are all awesome.
I have a friend who was born on the same year and day as me. She'll be the exact same age as I will come September 29th.

So far, my only plans are to go out with a friend of mine and blind buy Star Trek: Into Darkness, assuming I get b-day monies.
 
I did something truly horrible to my girlfriend and I don't know if it's repairable. I will never drink again and it's been a huge wake up call to be compliant treating bipolar. What can I do other than remind her everyday how I feel about her and give her the time she needs?
 
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