Dota 2 |OT2| Ellen Pudge starring in Beyond Two Throws

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Technosteve said:
I hate bounty hunter, one of the hardest heroes to play well, also a very situational pick. He needs to snowball, he needs to gank, he has to dominate early to mid game because he falls off late game.
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BH is one of the best comeback heroes in the game only surpassed by someone like NP. I can't tell you how many times Navi has come back from a large deficit thanks to getting some clutch Track kills.

You draft BH for the offlane, for early ganking, to counter some invisible heroes and to gain a gold advantage. He's a great hero to pick if you feel like you are against a well matched opposition. He doesn't "need" to snowball, he definitely needs to gank but that's all he needs to do along with scouting. He doesn't need to farm creeps because he farms heroes.
 
Mordeccai said:
Yeah, I am realizing now that BF on Jugg isn't a good idea most of the time. I played a game earlier where I got fantastic farm, and was the hard carry on the team. But the rest of my team sucked and fed top lane. As a result, we had a super leveled and farmed PA that starting roaming and ganking at about 15 minutes.

Instead of grabbing the early scepter, I picked up a BF to try to increase my farm so I could outfarm the PA. Trouble is that doesn't really help much in two hero engagements with a PA and a Shadow Shaman, while a NP can just tele in and sprout you.

Think I'm just going to ignore BF on him from here on out and pick up stuff like MKB and scepter instead. It just costs so much damn gold.

Does anybody build shadow blade on jugg? I feel like it could be useful against gank heavy teams for the escape.
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SB is decent, but you really need a drum first (or a naked point booster into sb into agha) else you'll never have the mana for using it in combination with your other items. You also can actually shadowblade spin and shadow blade ulti now lol.
 
Does anybody build shadow blade on jugg? I feel like it could be useful against gank heavy teams for the escape.
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I do occasionally in pub games. The item is very good on Jugg for getting those ulti kills or getting close for the Battle Fury. You just go in their jungle while invisible, back stab them then use ulti and get out before anyone knows what happened.

I think the main reason people get BF on Jugg is because of the mana regen. IMO if you are able to solve his mana issues early on then he has no reason to go for a BF. He has a good last hit animation, crits to help kill creeps fast and he has Blade Fury which clears camps and waves fast. In terms of life regen he already has his healing ward to keep him at good health, it's really only his mana that he has problems with early to mid game.
 
I remember before the bottle crow nerf when magnus was a top tier mid Alliance said that empower was his secret best skill. You level it not too long after a carry would have managed to get a battlefury anyway, and suddenly you can let them keep up in farm with any carry without having to spend so much gold. They get fighting items quicker and essentially make your teams effective fighting potential in the midgame super strong but you will still have amazing late game. This holds particularly true for carries like PA who really benefit from bfury but need to get other items instead.
 
My two attempts to play Bounty Hunter have been miserable. I've never been able to even transition into the ganking phase because I don't ever feel powerful or capable of killing anyone.
 
LiQuid! said:
My two attempts to play Bounty Hunter have been miserable. I've never been able to even transition into the ganking phase because I don't ever feel powerful or capable of killing anyone.
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You don't really go for solo kills with Bounty until the late game anyway. Once you hit six you basically want to be ping-ponging between lanes using the Shadow Walk damage, a single Jinada strike and all of the damage from your allies to secure a track kill.
 
LiQuid! said:
My two attempts to play Bounty Hunter have been miserable. I've never been able to even transition into the ganking phase because I don't ever feel powerful or capable of killing anyone.
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You only ever start getting really powerful once you get items like Desolator. You're relying on your allies for most of the game otherwise.
 
LiQuid! said:
My two attempts to play Bounty Hunter have been miserable. I've never been able to even transition into the ganking phase because I don't ever feel powerful or capable of killing anyone.
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Don't think of BH as a hero that solos heroes in the jungle, think of him as a hero that has constant invis, a passive that slows by 25% and does a bunch of damage, a ministun that stops TPs, and an ult that lets your teammates chase faster.

Just get 6 by any means necessary, then go gank the other two lanes.
 
Emerson said:
What heroes do you guys buy a battlefury on?

Played with a BF Veno today (lol)
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Juggernaut, PA, sometimes Tusk, AM, somtimes Alch are the ones it would most often be used on


Hylian7 said:
Doing some streaming!

http://www.twitch.tv/hylian7

Wtf, I can't queue for some reason.
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GAME IS HARD
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Aselith said:
Juggernaut, PA, sometimes Tusk, AM, somtimes Alch are the ones it would most often be used on




GAME IS HARD
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That's a funny way to spell "ded"
 
Guys I have a question.

When you are a carry, how do you know when to build Vladimir's Offering and when to build Helm of Dominator?

I have seen Phantom Assasins and Juggernauts using them, sometimes Vladimir, sometimes Helm, but what is the criteria to choose?
 
Vlads will allow you to pick up anther orb effect, and gives the entire team an aura. Helm of the Dominator will give more early game damage though, and allows you to dominate a creep so you can stack creep camps.

If you want to know the math, you need 134 base damage for Vlads to give more damage then a Helm of the Dominator, which usually doesn't happen until pretty late.

Also, range supports grabbing Vlads is totally legit, the +5 Armor Aura really does a lot.
 
Thanks for the tips guys.

I think I will push for solo off-lane next time I play BH. I'm pretty sure both games I've dual laned, which slowed me getting to 6.
 
cuevas said:
First game against broodmother...wow
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Bullshit sometimes, isn't it?

Here's a question for you all though:

Hero(es) you love, but are terrible at? Preferably >10 games played, lower than 45% winrate or so.

For me, Templar Assassin is definitely one, but the games where you ball out of control make it worth it. Juggernaut is another one, batting .333 on him - things just never seem to work out, though I don't enjoy him nearly as much as TA. My CM is tied with my Juggernaut, though most of those were a long time ago before she was in vogue and certainly before 6.79. Look forward to playing her some more soon with all the buffs she/supports have gotten since.
 
Eternal Gamer said:
Guys I have a question.

When you are a carry, how do you know when to build Vladimir's Offering and when to build Helm of Dominator?

I have seen Phantom Assasins and Juggernauts using them, sometimes Vladimir, sometimes Helm, but what is the criteria to choose?
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Basically Dominator gives you the option to upgrade to a Satanic at some point but has weaker stats (and obviously is the only option for ranged heroes) while Vlad's provides you and your team with stronger utility.
With that in mind you'll generally go for Dominator if your hero synergizes well with Satanic, you're getting a steady income and the current situation doesn't call for more than the bit of sustain the Dominator alone gives you. You get Vlad's on the other hand when you know you'll want to/have to teamfight soon and won't be able to farm anything big until then, so it can be a desperation item or one that tips the scales in your favor and lets you take an important tower or something.

Also don't forget that Vlad's can be a much more valuable mid-game pickup on a support who already has his core items since it saves the carry cash and the slot for more potent items.
 
Never forget that Helm and Vlad's should be built 1% of the time and Mask of Madness should be built 99% of the time.

ViviOggi said:
You get Vlad's on the other hand when you know you'll want to/have to teamfight soon and won't be able to farm anything big until then, so it can be a desperation item or one that tips the scales in your favor and lets you take an important tower or something.
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The strangest thing is those carries that rush Vlad's even though they absolutely need farm and items and go off to fight.
 
Drkirby said:
Vlads will allow you to pick up anther orb effect, and gives the entire team an aura. Helm of the Dominator will give more early game damage though, and allows you to dominate a creep so you can stack creep camps.

If you want to know the math, you need 134 base damage for Vlads to give more damage then a Helm of the Dominator, which usually doesn't happen until pretty late.

Also, range supports grabbing Vlads is totally legit, the +5 Armor Aura really does a lot.
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ViviOggi said:
Basically Dominator gives you the option to upgrade to a Satanic at some point but has weaker stats (and obviously is the only option for ranged heroes) while Vlad's provides you and your team with stronger utility.
With that in mind you'll generally go for Dominator if your hero synergizes well with Satanic, you're getting a steady income and the current situation doesn't call for more than the bit of sustain the Dominator alone gives you. You get Vlad's on the other hand when you know you'll want to/have to teamfight soon and won't be able to farm anything big until then, so it can be a desperation item or one that tips the scales in your favor and lets you take an important tower or something.

Also don't forget that Vlad's can be a much more valuable mid-game pickup on a support who already has his core items since it saves the carry cash and the slot for more potent items.
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Thanks a lot for the answers! now I have a clear picture.


Sigismundo said:
Never forget that Helm and Vlad's should be built 1% of the time and Mask of Madness should be built 99% of the time.
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I am not accustomed to build Mask of Madness :( I will try to get it.
 
Shagbark HUD v2, what do you think?

http://www.cyborgmatt.com/2013/10/dota-2-introducing-familiar-woods/#familiar-woods-v2-updates

Dota2_ShagbarkHUDSpacerUpdate.jpg


Dota2_ShagbarkHUDDayNight.jpg


Dota2_ShagbarkHUDTopUpdate.jpg
 
Buy MoM on every hero. It's the greatest item of all time.
 
Cyborgmatt said:
Shagbark HUD v2, what do you think?

http://www.cyborgmatt.com/2013/10/dota-2-introducing-familiar-woods/#familiar-woods-v2-updates
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I feel like the new left spacer doesn't blend in that well with the rest of the HUD, the leaves on the tree are rounder and lit differently compared to the other leaves on the bottom bar. I liked Shagbark's shack more although he himself was irritating because he resembled the hero portrait so closely. New top bar is much better.

Halloween update when?
 
LiQuid! said:
My two attempts to play Bounty Hunter have been miserable. I've never been able to even transition into the ganking phase because I don't ever feel powerful or capable of killing anyone.
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BH can't really kill people solo without big items or if they are at low health or if you have a rune. You need to be doing coordinated ganks on targets with the help of your teammates. Your burst damage as BH is really good, all 3 of your primary skills give you big Burst damage and your chasing is really good if you have Phase Boots plus Orb of Venom. When you are ganking someone, ping the targets so your allies know what's up, hit him while under Shadow Walk to let the Jinada proc, tag them with Track and then just chase them down... use your Shuriken if they try to TP away or if they are just out of range for a melee attack. The Shuriken does a lot of damage but depletes a lot of mana as well so you need to manage it accordingly.

If say you arrive at a gank late and then have engaged on the opponent, then instead of trying to go in with the Shadow Walk -> Jinada hit just tag them with Track from a distance so that you have contributed to the gank. Otherwise your teammate is missing out on a lot of gold. No one hates on BH if he doesn't get some kills but everyone hates a BH who is conservative with his Tracks.
Guys I have a question.

When you are a carry, how do you know when to build Vladimir's Offering and when to build Helm of Dominator?

I have seen Phantom Assasins and Juggernauts using them, sometimes Vladimir, sometimes Helm, but what is the criteria to choose?
Click to expand...
If you plan on making a different orb effect than life steal then you must use Vlad's Offering. Like say I want to go Desolator on Troll... I have to build Vlad's because that hero definitely needs the life steal. Same for PA and Juggernaut. You also build Vlad's when there are more than a couple melee heroes on the team especially if they scale late game. Generally speaking you want to have one Vlad's on the team anyway. Vlad's also has a small mana regen component so you get it on heroes who are likely to use some spells frequently. Vlad's is a core item on Ursa because it's the only way he can get life steal as one of his passives is an orb effect. Heroes who have melee summon units like say Lone Druid or Lycan also build this item.

If you want to go a slightly tankier build you go for HotD. HotD allows you to dominate a creep and it's useful for stacking creeps which is ideal for someone like Luna or Gyro who can hit multiple creeps at once (also great on Medusa). Remember that HotD is effective on both ranged and melee carry heroes where as Vlad's only gives the life steal benefit to melee heroes. HotD also upgrades to Satanic which is a great late game item as it gives you a ton of survivability. Shadow Fiend and Drow make HotD as well because their damage is so high that they get a lot of life back from regular hits thanks to life steal. HotD/Satanic is also excellent on Huskar you just need to toggle his orb effects on and off if you want to use life steal.

Mask of Madness is a PURE glass cannon damage item as it gives you some offensive bonuses for more damage taken. You want to use this item in situations where you know you will not be getting hit or in some extreme cases where you want to actually get hit (like carry Abaddon, don't try this strat at home folks). Yeah it gives life steal but it's mostly picked up for the attack speed and movement speed boost (attack speed more than movement speed). It's picked on Void as a core item because he is not getting attacked during Chronospheres and the faster he attacks the more bashes he procs (which do more damage and keeps them stunned for a longer duration). Sven likes to build it because he can stun someone, turn on all of his buffs and kill them before they have a chance to do anything. Magnus can make it because he can Empower, RP then use MoM to do a ton of damage really fast. Snipers in pubs like to build this along with Shadowblade where they will pop out of hiding, turn on MoM and do enough damage into an Ulti before the other person has a chance to react. Drow players make this for the same reason only they add in Silencer as well to make sure their options are even more limited. MoM is paired with Crits/Daedalus because the getting life steal with crits usually results in a lot of life sustain. Spirit Breaker makes this item too as he wants faster attack speed to get more bash procs. If Slardar's Sprint didn't already make him weaker he would pick up MoM too.
 
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