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[ClosingADoor]

It wasn't. Most of the episode was Rick and Negan interacting

We went through three horrible things in a row with Abe, Glenn and then the arm cutting thing (well, that didn't went through, but still). Most episodes at least have some upbeat things to balance the brutality with. This was just one long display of Rick and the group getting totally fucked over in the most horrible way. It has more impact because of that I think. In other episodes the brutality and gory stuff is over pretty soon, here they really kept it hanging.

 

[Audioboxer]

I'm talking about where they are in the show. Morgan presented Rick with the idea of talking to Negan first. That's sure looking like a fine option now, considering they had that talk anyway, but it ended up being after Rick and co. murdered scores of Negan's men and Negan proceeded to kill two of their best people.



Fall in line.. at first. Long enough to formulate a plan after getting basic intel on Negan and his army.

But you don't get an army as big as Negan without him being a master reader of a person. I mean look how he broke Rick with the comment about how he was looking at him. I think you're under estimating Negan. Can you imagine the amount of people who would just say anything to him to get him to back off and leave them alone?

 

[Savitar]

Finally watched.

They nailed it.

Pun intended.

Loooooooooooooved it.

 

[Anth0ny]

Fuck me what an episode. JDM and Andrew Lincoln absolutely killed it. That may have been Lincoln's finest performance in the history of the show. When he was just losing it before having to chop off Carl's arm... amazing. The tension leading up to THE moment was incredible, some of the best I've ever seen in a TV show, and this is coming from someone who read the comic.

When Negan took out Abraham... they got me. I thought that was it and the writers bitched out of the comic book version. Abraham's dead wasn't even that violent or disturbing. There's certainly been more fucked up, gory shots on TWD than that.

AND THEN THEY GOT ME GOOD

WHAM

The shot straight out of the comic. One of THE money shots of the entire story brought to life. It had to be done to present Negan properly, and they nailed it. Fucking awesome.

Are people really complaining about that? Maybe I'm just a sick freak, but I didn't think it was THAT bad. A crazy visual, but certainly not offensive enough to complain about. Believe it or not, the comic goes even further with Glen's death. Maybe if they brought some of those other panels to life I'd understand the complaining

As great as JDM is, I do fuckin miss Negan fucking swearing after every fucking word. It adds a layer of crazy to his character that is lacking here, ESPECIALLY since some of those lines from the TV show are straight out of the comic, just with no swear words, or far less offensive versions of the word "fuck". Nothing they can really do about that, though, until they inevitably retell The Walking Dead in 20 years with an NC-17 rating

Nonetheless, this is the most excited I've been for a season of TWD since... season 2? Negan is great, and if they follow the comic close enough, there should be some good stuff coming up.

 

[Fenderputty]

I'm talking about where they are in the show. Morgan presented Rick with the idea of talking to Negan first. That's sure looking like a fine option now, considering they had that talk anyway, but it ended up being after Rick and co. murdered scores of Negan's men and Negan proceeded to kill two of their best people.



Fall in line.. at first. Long enough to formulate a plan after getting basic intel on Megan and his army.

The only time Morgan says anything that could have made a difference is back in episode 12 of season 6 when he suggests letting the saviors know Alexandria is willing to attack might be enough to get what they want in helping hilltop. I think it's pretty clear this wouldnt have worked as Negan lays claim to literally everything. At some point in time this clash was going to go down.

 

[jroc74]

Don't understand why people are quitting now.

It's supposed to make you uncomfortable. It was recurring last season. Heck I felt like Rick and the group were assholes when they got to Alexandria and started saying they would take it if people didn't listen to them.

Sure, they were doing it in the name of protecting the somewhat ignorant settlers from what they did not know of the outside world, but they still came across like assholes. And I felt that way too when they assaulted Negans base and killed people in their beds while they slept, when they had done nothing to Alexandria at that point.

That's the point though I think. We as the audience are following Rick and company, but by no means are they "good people". They're just the group we're attached to. People are bad in this world. Negan might be a psycho with his psychological torture of Rick but Rick murdered people in their sleep, and executed the prisoner they had in season 6 with zero trial or anything.

People quitting have entirely missed the point or have not been paying attention.

Exactly. They/he got very over confident. (more like he did vs them) I'm not saying they deserved this to happen but sometimes you need to be humbled.

Whoever makes it thru this, this will definitely be a teaching lesson.

 

[jerry113]

Fuck me what an episode. JDM and Andrew Lincoln absolutely killed it. That may have been Lincoln's finest performance in the history of the show. When he was just losing it before having to chop off Carl's arm... amazing. The tension leading up to THE moment was incredible, some of the best I've ever seen in a TV show, and this is coming from someone who read the comic.

When Negan took out Abraham... they got me. I thought that was it and the writers bitched out of the comic book version. Abraham's dead wasn't even that violent or disturbing. There's certainly been more fucked up, gory shots on TWD than that.

AND THEN THEY GOT ME GOOD

WHAM

The shot straight out of the comic. One of THE money shots of the entire story brought to life. It had to be done to present Negan properly, and they nailed it. Fucking awesome.

Are people really complaining about that? Maybe I'm just a sick freak, but I didn't think it was THAT bad. A crazy visual, but certainly not offensive enough to complain about. Believe it or not, the comic goes even further with Glen's death. Maybe if they brought some of those other panels to life I'd understand the complaining

As great as JDM is, I do fuckin miss Negan fucking swearing after every fucking word. It adds a layer of crazy to his character that is lacking here, ESPECIALLY since some of those lines from the TV show are straight out of the comic, just with no swear words, or far less offensive versions of the word "fuck". Nothing they can really do about that, though, until they inevitably retell The Walking Dead in 20 years with an NC-17 rating

Nonetheless, this is the most excited I've been for a season of TWD since... season 2? Negan is great, and if they follow the comic close enough, there should be some good stuff coming up.

It's ludicrious that we can have an eye hanging out but we can't have a character say "fuck" or show a female nipple. How fucked up is our society that gore & violence is completely acceptable on a basic cable network, but that language and sexuality isn't?

 

[disappeared]

It's ludicrious that we can have an eye hanging out but we can't have a character say "fuck" or show a female nipple. How fucked up is our society that gore & violence is completely acceptable on a basic cable network, but that language and sexuality isn't?

That's been western television in a nutshell for decades.

 

[Pankratous]

Going into the episode I legit thought Maggie was going to be the one to go, because I don't think they can be arsed having another baby on screen.

So I guess they'll find another way to ruin that birth.

 

[Represent.]

Andrew Lincoln KILLED this premiere. His acting took it to another level. Like legit up there with the best of television acting i've seen. Hope he gets some recognition or some type of nomination at least.

 

[Lothar]

Going into the episode I legit thought Maggie was going to be the one to go, because I don't think they can be arsed having another baby on screen.

So I guess they'll find another way to ruin that birth.

They have to repopulate the earth if they want the show to still be running in 20-30 years.

I don't know if I'm joking.

 

[glow]

This was definitely me last night-

Someone I watched with couldn't take it. When Neegan bashed Glenn she was like "Oh no not Glenn!!" and was on the verge of tears then was squirming and feeling sick. My other friend totally silent, shocked.

A great way to kick off the season. I hope they keep the show at this amped up level. JDM will win an Emmy at this rate.

 

[LQX]

Still cant get over that episode. It was like a Scared Straight episode.

And, I kept waiting for Maggie to say something harsh to Rick. Matter off fact I expected the whole group to look differently on Rick to the point he had to hang his head in shame in front of them also.

Also people put off by the violence because a beloved character died sort of shows whats wrong with society in that we often don't give shit about something until it hits close to home.

 

[bitoriginal]

Damn what a brutal episode. I enjoyed that it stayed true to the comics (to an extent) - that scene was supposed to be shocking.

It was too much for my girlfriend though, who had really been looking forward to watching it. I'm glad it was intense, it needed to be after the wait, but I can imagine it was too much for some viewers.

 

[Goodstyle]

This was definitely me last night-

Someone I watched with couldn't take it. When Neegan bashed Glenn she was like "Oh no not Glenn!!" and was on the verge of tears then was squirming and feeling sick. My other friend totally silent, shocked.

A great way to kick off the season. I hope they keep the show at this amped up level. JDM will win an Emmy at this rate.

Ya, I don't know about most people, but I got a lot of joy at seeing Negan put the heroes through all of that. Their crying, anguished faces were delicious. Great work from the actors. Critics derided this episode as "torture porn"... I can't argue with that, but I sure as hell enjoyed it.

 

[Savitar]

The only real surprise to me after watching it was that Maggie didn't pass out due to the whole baby thing. She's a trooper.

 

[dustyherb]

Andrew Lincoln KILLED this premiere. His acting took it to another level. Like legit up there with the best of television acting i've seen. Hope he gets some recognition or some type of nomination at least.

Yep I completely agree. Both him and JDM were beyond fantastic in my opinion.

 

[Miracle]

Andrew Lincoln KILLED this premiere. His acting took it to another level. Like legit up there with the best of television acting i've seen. Hope he gets some recognition or some type of nomination at least.

His acting is at his best when he acts terrified.

 

[ronaldthump]

god, that glen switcheroo; just when you though they were like being TWD with their character switcheroos. The double kill was very effective. They did a great job on the episode. RIP glen. and RIP abraham. Both characters I really like.

The only quibble I had was that I didn't think the actors did a great job selling the fear. Only lincoln with his snotty bits (despite the somewhat OTT overacting) was convincing. For everyone else, I was like hmm.. maybe they were all in shock. I mean, your eyes and nose will be red from crying. Eugene probably did it best. He looked terrified.

would have been a very hard scene to act. It was so protracted and they had to be fearful for an entire hour +++

 

[Anth0ny]

It's ludicrious that we can have an eye hanging out but we can't have a character say "fuck" or show a female nipple. How fucked up is our society that gore & violence is completely acceptable on a basic cable network, but that language and sexuality isn't?

for real. it's ridiculous.

Ya, I don't know about most people, but I got a lot of joy at seeing Negan put the heroes through all of that. Their crying, anguished faces were delicious. Great work from the actors. Critics called derided this episode as "torture porn"... I can't argue with that, but I sure as hell enjoyed it.

critics should read the issue of the comic where michonne does things to governor

they'd love it

 

[stupei]

Considering the reactions of my family last night, it sure has hell wasn't to please people that get off on that stuff

Do you think it would have been more effective to not show that stuff? How would you have done it?

But I do think seeing Negan swing over and over absolutely is part of establishing his character.

I think it would be impossible to argue that Abraham's death was anywhere near as hard to watch as Glenn's. That's not just because of their level of importance in the overall arc of the show. It's because of how they chose to frame it. Abe got to be strong and brave, the center of that moment. He got to be defiant.

Glenn was an innocent bystander, taken out by someone else's stupidity. He didn't get to be brave or defiant in death. He got to slowly fall apart, unable to even speak, as it was drawn out at length.

The part in silhouette where we watch Negan swing over and over makes sense. Brutal as Hell, but it makes sense and serves a purpose. Cutting to the close shot of his hand twitching was totally unnecessary and honestly kind of weirdly dehumanizing. You didn't need to see that to understand that Negan is brutal. It just felt like it was there to prove they could get away with showing it.

And yes, in the context of a network that thinks swearing isn't okay, it's bizarre and kind of unsettling that they have no problem with that image.

This is different than a horror movie, even though people keep making those comparisons to justify it. It's a character you've been asked to care about for seven years being stripped of all dignity in a brutal death. It felt like it crossed over from, "This is necessary for character and plot reasons," into, "Look how daring we are for doing this." It felt very self-congratulatory for being the network and the show that would dare to show you human brains that belonged to people you care about.

If they were actually brave, they would have killed Daryl. They're not, so they went for the gore porn instead to disguise the fact that this was the easiest and most obvious choice they could have made.

Still cant get over that episode. It was like a Scared Straight episode.

http://cdn.ebaumsworld.com/2012/03/82410384/scared.jpg


And, I kept waiting for Maggie to say something harsh to Rick. Matter off fact I expected the whole group to look differently on Rick to the point he had to hang his head in shame in front of them also.

Also people put off by the violence because a beloved character died sort of shows whats wrong with society in that we often don't give shit about something until it hits close to home.

People getting upset watching someone they've been explicitly made to empathize with suffer is what's wrong with society? Really?

 

[SlipperyFishes]

I knew it was coming. I was spoiled beforehand but it was tense and I felt nauseous seeing Glenn with a partially caved in skull and eye hanging out.

The savagery was just too intense for me.

 

[Regginator]

Can't say I'm a TWD fan, I liked the first two seasons but then it went downhill fast for me, but occasionally I still watch it with my younger sister. She loves this show (no comics knowledge), and she's been looking forward to this since that cliffhanger last season. She was "okay" with it when it was just Abraham, but then when Negan killed Glenn, she was shocked, lol.

For a minute there I thought they'd chicken out of killing Glenn.

 

[saelz8]

This shit was more brutal than the RED WEDDING

I SAID GODDAMN

 

[jelly]

Brutal, I presumed Abraham because of the take it like a champ line. Didn't see Glenn coming. I do agree with some that one or two shots were't necessary.

I don't think there is a brutal enough death for Negan after that.

 

[NeonBlack]

I will never look at John Winchester the same again.

 

[Zeus The Dino]

Did the fucking critics or viewers not watch season 6 episode 1? The cannibals bashing peoples heads in and slitting there throats all show on screen?

 

[GeekyDad]

Holy fuck.

My wife made me turn the episode off after Glenn got hit. Thankfully she looked away before she could see his eye bulging out of his skull.

Fucking brutal.

Unfortunately, it looks as though she's done watching the show. I'll try and convince her otherwise, but that was some insane television.

Legit shook.

Funny 'cause I said the same thing to my wife this morning -- not sure I can continue on. It's not even just the loss of Glenn (though I told my daughter and wife both a year ago that if they kill off Glenn, they're gonna lose a shit-ton of viewers), but the story is just getting so fucking heavy, and that's saying a lot considering it's always been very heavy. Just so bleak and...well, obscene. And I mean obscene in the sense of how horrifying the events are. The writing is still excellent. Just might be too much for me at this point.

 

[Vyse]

I will never look at John Winchester the same again.

LOL. I was thinking the same thing.

 

[MiamiWesker]

I think it would be impossible to argue that Abraham's death was anywhere near as hard to watch as Glenn's. That's not just because of their level of importance in the overall arc of the show. It's because of how they chose to frame it. Abe got to be strong and brave, the center of that moment. He got to be defiant.

Glenn was an innocent bystander, taken out by someone else's stupidity. He didn't get to be brave or defiant in death. He got to slowly fall apart, unable to even speak, as it was drawn out at length.

The part in silhouette where we watch Negan swing over and over makes sense. Brutal as Hell, but it makes sense and serves a purpose. Cutting to the close shot of his hand twitching was totally unnecessary and honestly kind of weirdly dehumanizing. You didn't need to see that to understand that Negan is brutal. It just felt like it was there to prove they could get away with showing it.

And yes, in the context of a network that thinks swearing isn't okay, it's bizarre and kind of unsettling that they have no problem with that image.

This is different than a horror movie, even though people keep making those comparisons to justify it. It's a character you've been asked to care about for seven years being stripped of all dignity in a brutal death. It felt like it crossed over from, "This is necessary for character and plot reasons," into, "Look how daring we are for doing this." It felt very self-congratulatory for being the network and the show that would dare to show you human brains that belonged to people you care about.

If they were actually brave, they would have killed Daryl. They're not, so they went for the gore porn instead to disguise the fact that this was the easiest and most obvious choice they could have made.



People getting upset watching someone they've been explicitly made to empathize with suffer is what's wrong with society? Really?

It's supposed to be brutal. They saw it so you the audience HAS to see it. You don't get to be excused from the horror, we were there with the group, that's the point.

It makes zero sense that this is thing that makes people freak out. We have seen stuff gorier than this for no reason. Now when there is a great reason people freak out. It hurts it's supposed to hurt. It's disgusting, it's supposed to be disgusting.

Seeing the reaction shows that they did exactly what they had to do. They nailed it.

 

[Seductivpancakes]

I mainly watched the show for Glenn, so i think I'm done with the show. We had good times Glenn.

 

[HardRojo]

This was definitely me last night-

Someone I watched with couldn't take it. When Neegan bashed Glenn she was like "Oh no not Glenn!!" and was on the verge of tears then was squirming and feeling sick. My other friend totally silent, shocked.

Same here lol, we were 2 guys and 5 girls. We both were like Yoooooo daaaaamn! when Negan went ham on Glenn, the girls went silent and cried a little.

 

[hamchan]

I do think they should have used up their one swear per season by having Abraham tell Negan "Go fuck yourself" or something to that effect.

 

[Mario]

I haven't read the comics, but I know a few things from it.

I thought for sure with the hatchet being such a prominent part of the episode that (comic spoilers)

Spoiler

Rick was going to lose his hand, especially given the bit with Carl at the end and Rick pleading "It can be me". I know it isn't how it happened in the comics, but I was convinced they were going to "catch up" on that.

 

[CrazyShady]

WOW what an episode. Tension to the maximum.

Beyond being immensely entertaining and making me feel insanely sad for the characters, the episode also served another purpose for me.

I'll never go back to IGN again. Went to look up their review. Good lord Matt Fowler is just one salty, bitter man. Scored it a

Spoiler

6/10

.

Cannotttt wait for next week

 

[hamchan]

Did the fucking critics or viewers not watch season 6 episode 1? The cannibals bashing peoples heads in and slitting there throats all show on screen?

It feels like a lot of critics are giving negative reviews as revenge for AMC doing the cliffhanger season finale.

 

[Chopper]

It's supposed to be brutal. They saw it so you the audience HAS to see it. You don't get to be excused from the horror, we were there with the group, that's the point.

It makes zero sense that this is thing that makes people freak out. We have seen stuff gorier than this for no reason. Now when there is a great reason people freak out. It hurts it's supposed to hurt. It's disgusting, it's supposed to be disgusting.

Seeing the reaction shows that they did exactly what they had to do. They nailed it.

"Zero sense" is a bit strong. As my wife said, we've seen unbelievably horrific things happen in this show in the past, but to zombies. The undead. To the human brain, this makes a huge difference in the way the violence is perceived. This is the first time we've seen such brutality dished out to living human protagonists. Humans that we root for and love watching.

I'm no prude, and I thought the episode was incredible, for all sorts of reasons. But I absolutely understand whatever backlash it might receive.

 

[TimeEffect]

Have they ever had an instance of a woman getting bashed on screen? I feel the controversy would be even worse if Negan skulled Maggie or Rosita. That's one line theyll probably never cross. There's some kind of macho nonsense with Abe taking it "like a man"

 

[Seductivpancakes]

Have they ever had an instance of a woman getting bashed on screen? I feel the controversy would be even worse if Negan skulled Maggie or Rosita. That's one line theyll probably never cross. There's some kind of macho nonsense with Abe taking it "like a man"

His character was partially macho nonsense to me which is why I suspected he was gonna get it at the end of last season.

"Took it like a champ" and I immediately thought Abe.

 

[MiamiWesker]

"Zero sense" is a bit strong. As my wife said, we've seen unbelievably horrific things happen in this show in the past, but to zombies. The undead. To the human brain, this makes a huge difference in the way the violence is perceived. This is the first time we've seen such brutality dished out to living human protagonists. Humans that we root for and love watching.

I'm no prude, and I thought the episode was incredible, for all sorts of reasons. But I absolutely understand whatever backlash it might receive.

That's the point. It's supposed to be the most horrifying thing you can think of. It's supposed to leave you totally broken.

 

[hamchan]

Poor Hershel, no one remembers the brutality of his head getting chopped off with multiple swings.

 

[LowParry]

Have they ever had an instance of a woman getting bashed on screen? I feel the controversy would be even worse if Negan skulled Maggie or Rosita. That's one line theyll probably never cross. There's some kind of macho nonsense with Abe taking it "like a man"

If say the comic had either Rosita or Maggie getting the bat, I bet you'd see it happen.

 

[More_Badass]

Poor Hershel, no one remembers the brutality of his head getting chopped off with multiple swings.

Or the baseball bat/throat slit combo at Terminus. That was so fucked up too, seeing people being executed so dispassionately. This was fucked up on the other end of the spectrum, with the killer doing it with joy and relish. Governor killing Hershel is in the middle, just psychotic anger

 

[DeadlyParasite]

Any word on the ratings from last night? I feel like it should have broken records or something for the show.

 

[Ricky Ricardo]

Or the baseball bat/throat slit combo at Terminus. That was so fucked up too, seeing people being executed so dispassionately. This was fucked up on the otherend of the spectrum, with the killer doing it with joy and relish. Governor killing Hershel is the middle, just psychotic anger

The Terminus scene is how the girl I dated last was first introduced to the show.

She hasn't forgiven me, to this day.

 

[Alligatorjandro]

The group getting revenge is going to be one of the best moments ever

 

[MiamiWesker]

Or the baseball bat/throat slit combo at Terminus. That was so fucked up too, seeing people being executed so dispassionately. This was fucked up on the other end of the spectrum, with the killer doing it with joy and relish. Governor killing Hershel is the middle, just psychotic anger

Exactly. People are confusing their anger with one of their favorites dying and trying to act like it's because of the gore. It's bullshit, this show has been this gory since forever, we have seen worse. The reason people are freaking out is because it hurt them emotionally, which is exactly what that episode is supposed to do.

 

[TheChewyWaffles]

This thread is bizarro-world.

 

[HawksWinStanley]

He was also in The Losers, and was Papa Winchester on Supernatural.

He's a pretty underrated actor and I think his abilities have only gotten better with time.

I like that he's underrated because he's willing to take roles like these and just kill it...so to speak.

 

[RS4-]

Just fucking laughing at the whole bit.