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2011 Fall Anime Thread - Bad Shows & Self Hating Nerds

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Jex

Jex

Member
doomed1 said:
Eh, I meant that in the negative. It's hard to best him in his awfulness. But you're right, Claus was alot better than the standard protagonist, though that's not exactly an accomplishment...
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Y'know, that's not how quoting works.
 
M

Master Milk

Member
Ezalc said:
Shorter is not a plus unless you're short yourself.
Better legs I admit but blonde+blue eyes are both the hottest colors of hair and eyes respectively.
Not really, for every blonde character you have at least five brunettes. Under brunette is brown and black. And since purple and blue hair is actually black they count under brunette as well. So you're still a peasant.
Purple eyes aren't hot and neither are red eyes. Blue and green eyes are the best.
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You're arbitrarily calling blue and purple, brunette? What? Are you color blind? The Ice Witch is not a brunette. And purple and red eyes are the best eye colors, with green under them, and blue at the very bottom under all the other eye colors.
 
E

Ezalc

Member
Master Milk said:
You're arbitrarily calling blue and purple, brunette? What? Are you color blind? The Ice Witch is not a brunette. And purple and red eyes are the best eye colors, with green under them, and blue at the very bottom under all the other eye colors.
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No I'm not. Go look at a bunch of anime purple and blue are actually black hair. The drawings made by Chihaya's brother all have her with black hair. I remember some anime where some chick with purple hair said somebody was jealous of her raven hair. Raven= black. I don't know why they're colored purple and blue but they're really black. I never said the witch was brunette. And no blue and green eyes are the best with all the others after that. Red eyes in particular are terrible because it just makes them look like they're always mad.
 
Jex

Jex

Member
RurouniZel said:
Well, Ben-to hasn't exactly been afraid of a little T&A, this episode just made the final battle for bentto at the end funnier and more awesome by shaking up the formula while throwing in some fanservice.

I will admit though, it's funny how some shows fanservice bothers me, while other shows like Ben-To I just take it in stride. Like this episode, for example. There's a scene where the main character Sato, whom the show has established as a connoisseur of the female physique, is looking at Yarizui in her swimsuit. So it's not exactly out of character for him, but then again most anime MCs like to look so it's nothing new. Now, normally the complete fanservice of her stretch in said swimsuit would put me off in many other shows, but here it doesn't because it's in her character to stretch before physical activity. This is also helped by her choice of swimsuit, which looks more akin to someone who takes sports and physical activities seriously rather than an out-of-character pandering style bikini.

That's not to say it isn't gratuitous. It is. But it bothered me a bit less due to how it was handled overall, the above being an example.
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Well I think it's probably to do with how the show presents itself and the lens you look at the show through. When a shows tone marries up with it's story and presents itself one way and you're happy to experience the show in that manner (which is what the creators intended) then the fanservice might not bother you. If there's a clash between tone, story and presentation then you'll probably be offended. Let me explain by way of demonstration.

Infinite Ryvius is an extremely serious drama about characters placed in a variety of life-threatening situations. That's how the show was written and directed. Yet, in one particular scene there's a completely overt pantyshot that practically covers the screen - it comes from nowhere and leads to nothing. It's superfluous, distracting and immature - all these things break your immersion in the world and clash with the way the show had presented itself up till now. This is bad. Imagine watching Schindler's List when suddenly a woman runs across the screen in slow motion with her breasts moving up and down - it's a bit awkward. You might expect such adolescent titillation in Transformers but not from that movie.

However, Ben-To presents itself as stupid, childish, disposable entertainment. Junk food for the soul. Seeing the camera slowly track the contours a women's body seems perfectly natural after you've just watched five guys engage in a battle royale over discount food. Both scenes seem like equally silly pieces of fluff for teenage boys.
 
H

hellclerk

Everything is tsundere to me
Jexhius said:
Y'know, that's not how quoting works.
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Que?

Last Exile: Fam, the Silver Wing 4
Catching up. All I gotta say is that Fam better be lesbo for Millia, because otherwise I cannot think of a single "justifiable" reason for her to be such a Goddamned doormat for her. Honestly, I saw some of that ferocity that got me so excited in the first episode. It's not even a "If we believe it! We can try!" sort of anime protagonist ferocity, it's more raw than that, like it's being driven by something more base, more primal.

Some of the awkward Last Exile S1 framing and pacing showed up in this episode. They really have to make their editing and shot progression smoother. Right now it feels choppy and brings down the cool factor to the aerial acrobatics.
 
H

hosannainexcelsis

Member
Master Keaton 33

When the detectives came out of that side alley, I was sure Keaton would have disappeared, as is usually the case in these chase scenarios, but instead he was leaning against a wall, casually examining their wallets which he had just pickpocketed.
Well played, Keaton.

And then he couldn't find his own wallet. This guy...
 
N

NewFresh

Member
Finally some free time, which of course means...

Catching up with PenguinDrum, Ben-to, Bakuman, Un Go, Guilty Crown...

PGSM!

Ep. 09
Looks like the show is having fun with editing. Also, this episode has one of my favorite moments so far.

aV8iW.gif


Ep.10
The more Zoisite that an episode has is clearly proportionate to its quality. I still don't understand how
"kill every princess in the world"
is the best possible strategy.
 
H

hellclerk

Everything is tsundere to me
Last Exile: Fam, the Silver Wing 5

Editing was smoother, short the montage, but then, montages don't really have much place in a show paced like this. The loli leader of the Sky Nazis was hilariously fascist in her speech too. Put it in German you might mistake it for the work of a certain man. The humor's showing off it's quirky nature too, and just watching the head chef just stare at Millia
in a meido outfit
unblinkingly with just a slightly bemused look on his face as she tried to annex his kitchen for her government-in-exile was pure class.

Also, Olaf is now being played by Brian Blessed. You cannot unsee this.
2BM7ml.png

twUVY.jpg
 
H

hellclerk

Everything is tsundere to me
Last Exile: Fam, the Silver Wing 6
Well, that sure was intense. Much better than two episodes ago with that sad excuse for dogfighting. The mini-recap montage was unnecessary, or rather would have benefited from fast flashes rather than the second or two each lingered, it would have upped the intensity, but it was still another episode where Fam's ferocity came through, and for that I'm glad. The
purge
was rather interesting... Sky Nazis indeed...

And now I can finally address...

Ezalc said:
Last Exile Fam isn't Claus 6

No matter what I just can't like Fam as a character. They're trying to make her as good as Claus without it actually working. This is a girl who never raced in her life, going up against not only a veteran racer, but one of the best with a 120 win streak, while in a tiny ass ship that probably has half of the power of a normal Vanship. You expect me to believe she'd be able to win? Bullshit. I was expecting her to lose only for Claus to show up and completely annihilate everybody in the Grand Race and win back Milia and the ship. Sadly that doesn't seem like it'll happen which leaves me rather disappointed. That baroness was hot but the race in itself was very boring and completely unbelievable. The fact that I'm supposed to believe that a go-kart could beat an F1 car in a race is beyond me. I want my Claus and Tatiana Vanship Superstar Ace Pilots Duo back with Dio on the side with his whimsy. If Fam wins that Grand Race thing I'm dropping this show, it'll be the biggest bullshit ever.
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You're talking about the same two people that can enter the narrow opening on a ship and then navigate its tight, not-meant-for-vanships corridors, and still maintain speed. Fam might not have much professional racing experience, but fuck me if that sort of thing doesn't take top class skill. The other thing is power-to-weight ratio. Fam isn't flying the vanship equivalent of a go-kart, she's flying the equivalent of a Ducati superbike. That thing has an engine that takes up about half of the size of the craft, and is already much smaller in drag profile to something like what that other pilot was racing. While it won't necessarily win out in the straightaways, it will accelerate to top speed much faster than a heavier craft with a larger engine.
In an underground race which mostly consists of tight turns, a smaller craft has the advantage in that it can take turns at higher speed and recover from the deceleration faster. This is also what made their slingshot maneuver much more likely. Due to the actual low weight of the craft, the tensile strength of the cable and their ability to actually accelerate through the turn, there were able to slingshot themselves to ahead of the pack leader as he was probably decelerating for the checkered flag. He would not have had the time to react by the time they were already ahead, she had already won. If it was a closer race, that "Invincible Falcon" would probably have just kept top speed through the finish and done better than Fam could possibly have managed. What won Fam the cup was she was underestimated, not that she couldn't have been totally beat.
 
E

Ezalc

Member
doomed1 said:
You're talking about the same two people that can enter the narrow opening on a ship and then navigate its tight, not-meant-for-vanships corridors, and still maintain speed. Fam might not have much professional racing experience, but fuck me if that sort of thing doesn't take top class skill. The other thing is power-to-weight ratio. Fam isn't flying the vanship equivalent of a go-kart, she's flying the equivalent of a Ducati superbike. That thing has an engine that takes up about half of the size of the craft, and is already much smaller in drag profile to something like what that other pilot was racing. While it won't necessarily win out in the straightaways, it will accelerate to top speed much faster than a heavier craft with a larger engine.
In an underground race which mostly consists of tight turns, a smaller craft has the advantage in that it can take turns at higher speed and recover from the deceleration faster. This is also what made their slingshot maneuver much more likely. Due to the actual low weight of the craft, the tensile strength of the cable and their ability to actually accelerate through the turn, there were able to slingshot themselves to ahead of the pack leader as he was probably decelerating for the checkered flag. He would not have had the time to react by the time they were already ahead, she had already won. If it was a closer race, that "Invincible Falcon" would probably have just kept top speed through the finish and done better than Fam could possibly have managed. What won Fam the cup was she was underestimated, not that she couldn't have been totally beat.
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Yes I realized all of that, but given the man's record, machine and just overall experience in an area she's wholly unfamiliar with and the course itself, she should not have won. You're telling me that slingshot maneuver was to boost them in a straightaway, something that the larger machine would easily outclass their Vespa. There would be no reason for him to decelerate, that would just be a bullshit excuse from the creators to allow Fam to win. I also don't remember them ever getting specific about the course, we don't know if it had so many tight turns to give the smaller craft such an advantage, and even if it did his familiarity with the course should easily account for a smaller ship handling tight turns better. Underestimation excuse has been used in every anime as a generic way to get the good guys to win over overwhelming odds. Of course I'm not saying it's impossible, it's just incredibly unlikely given that the guy was ahead of all the competitors the entire race. You're telling me he'd make a mistake like decelerate at the last minute because he thinks it's a sure win? Yeah no. From his record and past experience he's a veteran racer that should know better than to make such a simple mistake like that. This was classic bullshit friendship is magic protagonist win.
 
H

hellclerk

Everything is tsundere to me
Ezalc said:
Yes I realized all of that, but given the man's record, machine and just overall experience in an area she's wholly unfamiliar with and the course itself, she should not have won. You're telling me that slingshot maneuver was to boost them in a straightaway, something that the larger machine would easily outclass their Vespa. There would be no reason for him to decelerate, that would just be a bullshit excuse from the creators to allow Fam to win. I also don't remember them ever getting specific about the course, we don't know if it had so many tight turns to give the smaller craft such an advantage, and even if it did his familiarity with the course should easily account for a smaller ship handling tight turns better. Underestimation excuse has been used in every anime as a generic way to get the good guys to win over overwhelming odds. Of course I'm not saying it's impossible, it's just incredibly unlikely given that the guy was ahead of all the competitors the entire race. You're telling me he'd make a mistake like decelerate at the last minute because he thinks it's a sure win? Yeah no. From his record and past experience he's a veteran racer that should know better than to make such a simple mistake like that. This was classic bullshit friendship is magic protagonist win.
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Oh please, there were quite a few mentions of
how tight the turns were ("This is where Nerves of Steel come in") and there were several shots of racers hitting the cave walls as well. Falcon was at the head of the pack by a wide margin for the entire race so it's pretty clear that he was racing on muscle memory. 120 wins on the same course will do that. Aside from their clear research of the track before the race, their tactics were last ditch and would have failed in any other situation.
In short, it was a Batman Gambit. The fact that it was last ditch and by the seat of their pants made it exciting, and everyone wants to see the hero win. Deal with it. I mean, it's not like we know anything about that racer in the first place other than he's very good and a solo pilot., so your observations aren't any more valid than mine.
 
E

Ezalc

Member
doomed1 said:
Oh please, there were quite a few mentions of
how tight the turns were ("This is where Nerves of Steel come in") and there were several shots of racers hitting the cave walls as well. Falcon was at the head of the pack by a wide margin for the entire race so it's pretty clear that he was racing on muscle memory. 120 wins on the same course will do that. Aside from their clear research of the track before the race, their tactics were last ditch and would have failed in any other situation.
In short, it was a Batman Gambit. The fact that it was last ditch and by the seat of their pants made it exciting, and everyone wants to see the hero win. Deal with it. I mean, it's not like we know anything about that racer in the first place other than he's very good and a solo pilot., so your observations aren't any more valid than mine.
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The course could have had one turn that was the key point of the race and they would have still said that, oh wait that was what happened. Of course and you think this little bullshit gamble from a girl who's never raced before would have gotten her the win against a seasoned veteran? They can research all they want they wouldn't have gotten the same amount of experience and knowledge about the track unless they raced on it as much as the other guy. It should have failed regardless, it was a classic this is the protagonist and she should win because she's the MC and friendship power is how she'll do it. No not everybody does. Character building is best done when the hero admits they aren't perfect and that they can't just automatically win everything on their first try. They have to fail before they can make the comeback. Of course we don't know anything about the other guy, he's not supposed to be anything more than a very minor character. It would have just been way more interesting if Fam had lost to him and they had to get somebody with more skill and experience in such matters to win. The whole episode was terrible, why did she want that particular ship badly enough to bet Milia on it. She could have taken any other ship without such a bet. In the end of the day, no matter what you say this is just another case of the friendship power trope.
 
H

hellclerk

Everything is tsundere to me
Ezalc said:
blahblahblah friendship sucks blahblahblah
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Do you even know what the fuck "Friendship is Magic" means? Friendship is Magic is Ash getting saved from being a living statue through pokemon tears. It's Simon fighting an ancient race of super beings with the motherfucking universe. It's someone getting through with absolutely no reason given other than "Friendship Magic". This isn't friendship magic, this is a last resort plan to win that very well could have failed. There is no magic about it. Some deus ex machina? Possibly a bit, but you're acting like this
falcon character is undefeatable. He's not. He had his expectations about the course from the get-go. Fam's maneuver was not part of those expectations. Fam got her ass kicked by the Sylvana, if you remember, and was basically given a deal to go and steal a fleet of warships for her freedom, which she accepted because she's a hot-headed sky pirate. In the end, Fam beat a random pilot who had all of two lines in the entire episode. The only thing that separated him from the rest of the mooks is he has a name, bitch'n mutton chops, and an apparent foot fetish. He was set up as nothing more than an obstacle and will definitely show up at a later episode as a stronger opponent. Fam can be beat, she has been beat, but being beaten by a couple of minor characters, one who has literally no ambition is about the most narratively useless thing that could happen, especially considering Sky Nazis and their current purge.

So please, consider how you invoke tropes in this regard. Friendship is Magic is a very specific instance where the literal magic of friendship (or the heart of the cards, or what you will most, or whateverthefuck) happens to get you what you need at the right time. This was something different, something that made sense, and I think it says more about your perceptions of the characters more than it actually says about the writing of the show. Not enough T&A in that garter belt fanservice?

Anyway, speaking of Deus Ex Machinas...

Mirai Nikki 5

Yeah, catching up with this one too, and damn if it isn't fantastic. Their control of perception and framing is masterful in giving different twists to characters as things progress. Who would have thought that
12th ultimately redeems himself as a psychotic character or at the least shows he was right all along. Sure, the juxtaposing of ritualized gang rape with goofy Sentai parody is terrifically unsettling, but that's the brilliance of it.
This show's command of the uncanny leaks all sorts of doubt while leading by the nose on what could be true and making the audience want it. Case and point:
Yuno's humanity. Despite her obsessive tendencies, she's all over the map in terms of being portrayed as the love interest, the crazed yandere, the earnest moe girl, and psychotic killer.
Yukiteru's constant as the scared teenage boy with a mix of terror and self-preservation with a moral backbone that make him want to do better not only allows for growth of character, but also realistically subverts and critiques the issues with the standard anime protagonist. While actually relating to him might be difficult, they still manage to draw you into his perspective. Seriously brilliant stuff.
 
E

Ezalc

Member
doomed1 said:
Do you even know what the fuck "Friendship is Magic" means? Friendship is Magic is Ash getting saved from being a living statue through pokemon tears. It's Simon fighting an ancient race of super beings with the motherfucking universe. It's someone getting through with absolutely no reason given other than "Friendship Magic". This isn't friendship magic, this is a last resort plan to win that very well could have failed. There is no magic about it. Some deus ex machina? Possibly a bit, but you're acting like this
falcon character is undefeatable. He's not. He had his expectations about the course from the get-go. Fam's maneuver was not part of those expectations. Fam got her ass kicked by the Sylvana, if you remember, and was basically given a deal to go and steal a fleet of warships for her freedom, which she accepted because she's a hot-headed sky pirate. In the end, Fam beat a random pilot who had all of two lines in the entire episode. The only thing that separated him from the rest of the mooks is he has a name, bitch'n mutton chops, and an apparent foot fetish. He was set up as nothing more than an obstacle and will definitely show up at a later episode as a stronger opponent. Fam can be beat, she has been beat, but being beaten by a couple of minor characters, one who has literally no ambition is about the most narratively useless thing that could happen, especially considering Sky Nazis and their current purge.

So please, consider how you invoke tropes in this regard. Friendship is Magic is a very specific instance where the literal magic of friendship (or the heart of the cards, or what you will most, or whateverthefuck) happens to get you what you need at the right time. This was something different, something that made sense, and I think it says more about your perceptions of the characters more than it actually says about the writing of the show. Not enough T&A in that garter belt fanservice?
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I don't give a fuck about what the actual name of the damn trope is. I call it friendship is magic because her bullshit duo with her navigator they can overcome all obstacles! Of course he's not unbeatable but Fam still shouldn't have won. When any anime does the classic ass pull of this plan is risky and odds of it working are totally against you, that shit will end up working every goddamn time no matter how high the odds are stacked against the protagonist. Fam lost to the Silvius, Sylvana was last season's ship, because it's the fucking Silvius and I'm glad it showed that hot headed little bitch she isn't the hot shit she thinks she is. I remember about the deal, but it doesn't make sense for her to risk her friend over a ship and it's not even a special ship either she just wants that one and so since she's "hot headed and fiery" I'm supposed to accept that it's ok? Fuck that. It was a stupid decision, if the ship had any particular meaning or worth I'd understand but it didn't it was jut another ship of the 15 she had to get. Nothing more. Fam being beaten now would have been perfect. It would show that she shouldn't be so gung-ho about every fucking thing risking things like her friend for an unimportant ship. That's why I wanted her to lose, and why she should have lost. No I won't be considerate about what the technical name of the trope is because I don't give a fuck, I never did. I just used it to get a point across and even if it is wrong you still understood what I meant. Also no it didn't make sense because it was just another generic anime protagonist wins because they're the main character bullshit. To finish, the first Last Exile wasn't good because it had fanservice dick, it was good because it was well written. Fam suddenly beating a veteran racer, on a course he's well experienced in, her first fucking time racing because of a "risky" move is bullshit writing.
 
Z

zeroshiki

Member
Steroyd said:
Bokura Ga Ita 01 - 12

No idea where to place this on the shoujo scale, tons and tons and tons of monologuing
which created the most weirdest non-sex scene EVER
, everyone is missing an eye or two when someone else speaks a sentence coupled with lots of close single eye shots whether they've been drawn in or not, and the show seems to really be pushing the love is blind angle which makes for laughable angst/drama, or whatever the hell this is.
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I loved this series upto the point they get together.

"break my fingers" was pretty sweet. The stuff after was arrrgghhhh rage inducing.
 
R

RurouniZel

Asks questions so Ezalc doesn't have to
Jexhius said:
Well I think it's probably to do with how the show presents itself and the lens you look at the show through. When a shows tone marries up with it's story and presents itself one way and you're happy to experience the show in that manner (which is what the creators intended) then the fanservice might not bother you. If there's a clash between tone, story and presentation then you'll probably be offended. Let me explain by way of demonstration.

Infinite Ryvius is an extremely serious drama about characters placed in a variety of life-threatening situations. That's how the show was written and directed. Yet, in one particular scene there's a completely overt pantyshot that practically covers the screen - it comes from nowhere and leads to nothing. It's superfluous, distracting and immature - all these things break your immersion in the world and clash with the way the show had presented itself up till now. This is bad. Imagine watching Schindler's List when suddenly a woman runs across the screen in slow motion with her breasts moving up and down - it's a bit awkward. You might expect such adolescent titillation in Transformers but not from that movie.

However, Ben-To presents itself as stupid, childish, disposable entertainment. Junk food for the soul. Seeing the camera slowly track the contours a women's body seems perfectly natural after you've just watched five guys engage in a battle royale over discount food. Both scenes seem like equally silly pieces of fluff for teenage boys.
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I guess it's all about setting the proper expectation. And I'll agree that Ben-To is junk food, but it's oh SO tasty junk food!! I look forward to my fix each week. ^_^
 
H

hosannainexcelsis

Member
Hanasaku Iroha 16

As I started this episode, I remembered why I lost motivation to keep watching this show when it was airing. Then Grandma showed up and my motivation was restored! Even when she's barely on screen, she's still a great character.

Anyway, this is a pretty decent episode. The film crew wasn't as annoying as I expected. Enishi is one of the better developed side characters, and he even got to have a sweet nostalgic moment with Takako. There was some pretty art on display too, such as when Enishi was looking out at the pool.

The very end was
a lame attempt at a cliffhanger. A phone is ringing! Oh no, what horrible news could be waiting on the other end! Discord with girls' innocent laughter! Also wet shirts! Bah. The phone ringing cliffhanger only works if we have some idea of what there is to fear.
 
H

hellclerk

Everything is tsundere to me
Ezalc said:
I don't give a fuck about what the actual name of the damn trope is. I call it friendship is magic because her bullshit duo with her navigator they can overcome all obstacles! Of course he's not unbeatable but Fam still shouldn't have won. When any anime does the classic ass pull of this plan is risky and odds of it working are totally against you, that shit will end up working every goddamn time no matter how high the odds are stacked against the protagonist. Fam lost to the Silvius, Sylvana was last season's ship, because it's the fucking Silvius and I'm glad it showed that hot headed little bitch she isn't the hot shit she thinks she is. I remember about the deal, but it doesn't make sense for her to risk her friend over a ship and it's not even a special ship either she just wants that one and so since she's "hot headed and fiery" I'm supposed to accept that it's ok? Fuck that. It was a stupid decision, if the ship had any particular meaning or worth I'd understand but it didn't it was jut another ship of the 15 she had to get. Nothing more. Fam being beaten now would have been perfect. It would show that she shouldn't be so gung-ho about every fucking thing risking things like her friend for an unimportant ship. That's why I wanted her to lose, and why she should have lost. No I won't be considerate about what the technical name of the trope is because I don't give a fuck, I never did. I just used it to get a point across and even if it is wrong you still understood what I meant. Also no it didn't make sense because it was just another generic anime protagonist wins because they're the main character bullshit. To finish, the first Last Exile wasn't good because it had fanservice dick, it was good because it was well written. Fam suddenly beating a veteran racer, on a course he's well experienced in, her first fucking time racing because of a "risky" move is bullshit writing.
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You mean the same season that Clause pulled roughly the same move to beat Dio, who was by all means a much better pilot? If you invoke the trope, you gotta own up to it man, otherwise, I don't know where you're coming from. If you didn't mean "friendship is magic", then you could mean something totally different. But you really have to understand, this is the mildest instance of them doing this sort of thing. Keep in mind that they have
flown INTO the hulls of enemy ships of which they have never in their lives seen and yet can navigate through them as though they've flown through them all their lives. This is a sort of skill we already assume they have, why would this race be any different?

And I'll tell you way that ship is important
It's a top class battleship, the flagship of that aristocrat's fleet. Why settle for a sloop when you can get the big guns for much lower risk? Fam is hotheaded, that's what drove the plot, but you don't think that they would have gotten out of the bet since Millia's not actually a boy? They would have stolen the ship anyway the old-fashioned way, so it's not like this was particularly that important. It saves screen time and prevents the whole plot from getting bogged down in setbacks.
Shit happens man. Sometimes it's to the protagonists, sometimes it's not. But shit can't happen all the time. There's got to be some victories in that.

Anyway, back to the good shit...

Mirai Nikki 6
I really, really do not get this Yukiteru kid. Yeah, I'd probably feel uncomfortable with a crazed, murderous stalker chick who
breaks into my house to get on my mother's good side, but shit, he has got to know when not to run away from his problems. He kept saying that his day was the worst, but hey, Yuno got along with his mother, didn't do anything more crazy than breaking into his house to prepare. He now basically has an infinite excuse to go places with Yuno without having to say anything about it.
I mean, Jeeze, at least act like you want to know a bit more about Yuno. You expressed that much last episode...

Good set up episode though. That kid is devious.
 
U

Uchip

Banned
Hitokage said:
Hair dye exists.
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that's funny because while i was in Japan i saw maybe one or two with died hair and those were some weird cosplayers in Akihabara (may have even been a wig)

I guess its supposed to be an alternate reality where everyone dyes their hair and wears matching contacts for their eyes

its suspension of disbelief at its worst, man!
 
E

Ezalc

Member
doomed1 said:
You mean the same season that Clause pulled roughly the same move to beat Dio, who was by all means a much better pilot? If you invoke the trope, you gotta own up to it man, otherwise, I don't know where you're coming from. If you didn't mean "friendship is magic", then you could mean something totally different. But you really have to understand, this is the mildest instance of them doing this sort of thing. Keep in mind that they have
flown INTO the hulls of enemy ships of which they have never in their lives seen and yet can navigate through them as though they've flown through them all their lives. This is a sort of skill we already assume they have, why would this race be any different?

And I'll tell you way that ship is important
It's a top class battleship, the flagship of that aristocrat's fleet. Why settle for a sloop when you can get the big guns for much lower risk? Fam is hotheaded, that's what drove the plot, but you don't think that they would have gotten out of the bet since Millia's not actually a boy? They would have stolen the ship anyway the old-fashioned way, so it's not like this was particularly that important. It saves screen time and prevents the whole plot from getting bogged down in setbacks.
Shit happens man. Sometimes it's to the protagonists, sometimes it's not. But shit can't happen all the time. There's got to be some victories in that.
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Here's the thing though, Claus has competed in races before. The fact that he knows how to race in a Vanship already at least gives some credibility to his victory. I'm not even going to answer to your incessant need for me to get the name of the trope right, I just don't fucking care because it doesn't matter. Here's the thing with her flying into ships. She's a pirate, so she steals ships. The way she does is can involve going into them. The only reason I accept that skill is because of the fact that she has done that shit before so she knows what to do. She has never competed in a race, at least as far as we know so far she hasn't.

As for your second point it's still bullshit. Alright, it's a flagship so? What makes that flagship special, it's from an aristocrat? Oh boy guess that makes her special never mind the 30 other aristocrats Luscinia murdered. They never said the ship had to be a flagship or belong to some aristocrat they just said 15 ships. She's the one trying to show off and did so by risking her friend. That hotheadedness is exactly why she deserved to lose, to learn her lesson not to do dumbshit like that to try and show off. The only reason that wasn't a big risk is because this is the magical anime world where protagonists always win somehow in cases like this, if they actually stop to think about it then there should be no way for her to win that race. Millia not being a boy doesn't even matter, if Fam had lost what could have happened is either now Millia is a servant of the baroness or she's let go because she's not a boy. If the former had happened that would have been interesting, if the latter happens then nothing changes and this episode would have been useless altogether. It'd be even more useless if you say they could have just stolen the ship. Then why not fucking do that. Why waste time with Fam winning a race that she clearly shouldn't be able to win. Better waste screen time with something that makes sense rather than pull a bullshit win out of their ass. It's not sometimes shit happens, it's not sometimes the protagonists it's always. Unless the opponent is meaningful to the overarching plot every protagonist will win otherwise. Of course it can't but that doesn't mean it shouldn't, it can help make the character grow a chance that was wasted here. There should only be victories if it at least makes sense how the character won and if it wasn't by a last minute ass pull of a deus ex machina. They can win by dumb luck just like how Spike won against Pierrot Le Fou, it's just that his dumb luck made sense within the context of what was happening.
 
C

CornBurrito

Member
Uchip said:
that's funny because while i was in Japan i saw maybe one or two with died hair and those were some weird cosplayers in Akihabara (may have even been a wig)

I guess its supposed to be an alternate reality where everyone dyes their hair and wears matching contacts for their eyes

its suspension of disbelief at its worst, man!
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You mean you DONT do this?
 
H

hellclerk

Everything is tsundere to me
Ezalc said:
Here's the thing though, Claus has competed in races before. The fact that he knows how to race in a Vanship already at least gives some credibility to his victory. I'm not even going to answer to your incessant need for me to get the name of the trope right, I just don't fucking care because it doesn't matter. Here's the thing with her flying into ships. She's a pirate, so she steals ships. The way she does is can involve going into them. The only reason I accept that skill is because of the fact that she has done that shit before so she knows what to do. She has never competed in a race, at least as far as we know so far she hasn't.
Click to expand...

Here's the keyword: as far as we know. You have no idea about whether or not Fam has ever raced before. It isn't particularly made a point that this race is their first or anything else of the sort, but rather very little was actually said about it. There's alot of things, however, to suggest that Fam is very interested in racing. If this is the core of your argument, then I can't see how we know enough to make any judgement. I mean, isn't that what people like to see? Heroes surmounting the odds to win the day? What statistically should happen is different than what actually does happen. I don't see how that changes anything. What, you WANT to see Fam go all sulky and calm down or do you just have a problem with aggressive female characters? Fam's hotheadedness is her best character trait. Constantly punishing that, aside from frustrating the audience, gets old after not too long. Fam and company are
still in the custody of the Sylvius with a very difficult mission and it's not like they'd be able to get away alive as it were. This is a small victory to show their cleverness and tenacity, not to appeal to your more sadistic urges.
 
E

Ezalc

Member
LegatoB said:
I liked this post better when it said "Fuckkkkkkkkkk youuuuuuuuuuuuu" and the actual content of your post was contained in your edit reason.
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.


doomed1 said:
Here's the keyword: as far as we know. You have no idea about whether or not Fam has ever raced before. It isn't particularly made a point that this race is their first or anything else of the sort, but rather very little was actually said about it. There's alot of things, however, to suggest that Fam is very interested in racing. If this is the core of your argument, then I can't see how we know enough to make any judgement. I mean, isn't that what people like to see? Heroes surmounting the odds to win the day? What statistically should happen is different than what actually does happen. I don't see how that changes anything. What, you WANT to see Fam go all sulky and calm down or do you just have a problem with aggressive female characters? Fam's hotheadedness is her best character trait. Constantly punishing that, aside from frustrating the audience, gets old after not too long. Fam and company are
still in the custody of the Sylvius with a very difficult mission and it's not like they'd be able to get away alive as it were. This is a small victory to show their cleverness and tenacity, not to appeal to your more sadistic urges.
Click to expand...

I'm tired of this argument, so I'll give a quick rundown:

1) Alright you got me there, but she's not an experienced racer.
2) No it's not, plenty of people enjoy seeing heroes fail. Especially annoying heroes like Fam.
3) This is known as the classic anime ass pull. See Bleach for further information.
4) Yes I want to see Fam crushed and show that she isn't hot shit and that she can't rush into things expecting everything to turn out hunky dory.
5) No I don't have a problem with aggressive female characters, I have a problem with bad aggressive female characters like Fam.
6) No it's not, it's fairly annoying.
7) The audience hasn't been punished once, and even then they need to toughen up not everybody should be born a genius and at one point this shit needs to be acknowledged.
8) It's not really a difficult mission considering they already stole 8 ships.
9) I doubt the Silvius would kill them for trying to run away, maybe shoot them down but they wouldn't die.
10) She could have had a small victory, the thing that remains is that she shouldn't have had this victory. Nothing wrong with her winning she just has to have a believable chance of winning
 
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