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[AdventureRacing]

No seriously, is this cool off period just for people coming out of education, or all under 30s folk trying to get new start? Is it different to aus study?

Because I'm seriously trying to find balance for those living in rural, low economic areas looking to improve their life by pursuing education they most likely cannot find in their area. This will require they travel and/or move, which is where stuff like aus study and new start are supposed to come in. Usually before so people can get situation and begin their study.

If it's universal then these people are basically fucked for life, unless they're content working the shittiest job they can in their home town, living insanely thrifty, just to save up enough to pursue said education elsewhere.

As far as i can tell it's just a universal thing for all people under 30. Your last paragraph is basically spot on and with entry level jobs becoming more and more difficult to get and university fees likely to rise significantly it's only going to get harder.

Acc. to the budget documents, ALL. Doesn't matter if you're applying for the first time, just got fired and need to go on, whatever - ALL.

Unless you're already on it then you get till 2015 i think.

 

[Garrus Vakarian]

So much I don't like about this mess, it's probably best I didn't get started.

Time to put that dual citizenship to use, how is England looking at the moment? Dare I ask?

 

[Candescence]

So. What're the chances of a double dissolution? The government's popularity is tanking, will probably tank more, and Labor, the Greens and Palmer would be mad not to take advantage while the iron is still hot. The first two have enough time to work out a better policy. Everyone assumes that they won't do it, but the Whitlam dismissal was only a few decades ago, killed his political career despite polling well in the aftermath, and the USA recently had a government shutdown over much more petty reasons. Even ol' Clive has talked about it.

 

[A More Normal Bird]

No seriously, is this cool off period just for people coming out of education, or all under 30s folk trying to get new start? Is it different to aus study?

Because I'm seriously trying to find balance for those living in rural, low economic areas looking to improve their life by pursuing education they most likely cannot find in their area. This will require they travel and/or move, which is where stuff like aus study and new start are supposed to come in. Usually before so people can get situation and begin their study.

If it's universal then these people are basically fucked for life, unless they're content working the shittiest job they can in their home town, living insanely thrifty, just to save up enough to pursue said education elsewhere.

It's seems to be a budget that ignores the realities of rural Australia (thanks Nationals!). Fuel excise is gonna hit people with ~100km daily commutes hard. Framing the GP co-payment as "$7 to see the doctor" ignores the fact that people in rural areas aren't exactly spoiled for choice in terms of low cost clinics or bulk billing: often it's $60 or make the day trip to the nearest A&E.

 

[EatChildren]

Acc. to the budget documents, ALL. Doesn't matter if you're applying for the first time, just got fired and need to go on, whatever - ALL.

As far as i can tell it's just a universal thing for all people under 30. Your last paragraph is basically spot on and with entry level jobs becoming more and more difficult to get and university fees likely to rise significantly it's only going to get harder.

Insanity. The immorality of this government is unfathomable. They hate the people. This isn't debatable.

It's seems to be a budget that ignores the realities of rural Australia (thanks Nationals!). Fuel excise is gonna hit people with ~100km daily commutes hard. Framing the GP co-payment as "$7 to see the doctor" ignores the fact that people in rural areas aren't exactly spoiled for choice in terms of low cost clinics or bulk billing: often it's $60 or make the day trip to the nearest A&E.

Right, this is exactly what I mean, which is baffling for a society like Australia which compared to the rest of the world is uniquely rural. Rural in cultural identity, rural in business, rural in population dispersion, etc.

 

[bomma_man]

So much I don't like about this mess, it's probably best I didn't get started.

Time to put that dual citizenship to use, how is England looking at the moment? Dare I ask?

Out of the fry pan into the fire

 

[CrazedProfessional]

Eat the young to feed the old.

 

[The Librarian]

Eat the young to feed the old.

Then why isn't EC happy with this?????

 

[jim-jam bongs]

So. What're the chances of a double dissolution? The government's popularity is tanking, will probably tank more, and Labor, the Greens and Palmer would be mad not to take advantage while the iron is still hot. The first two have enough time to work out a better policy. Everyone assumes that they won't do it, but the Whitlam dismissal was only a few decades ago, and the USA recently had a government shutdown over much more petty reasons. Even ol' Clive has talked about it.

It would require that a piece of legislation introduced after the budget be rejected by both houses, then be reintroduced after a cooling off period and be rejected again. I'm pretty sure that the crossbench holds the balance of power in the senate, not sure about the house of reps.

 

[Jintor]

It's up to Palmer. Jesus.

His interview was okay, but he's such an erratic politician it's hard to get a good read

 

[toastyToast]

The change to newstart is beyond fucked

Absolutely beyond despicable

 

[wonzo]

The original tweet was deleted but this says it all really:

 

[Candescence]

It would require that a piece of legislation introduced after the budget be rejected by both houses, then be reintroduced after a cooling off period and be rejected again. I'm pretty sure that the crossbench holds the balance of power in the senate, not sure about the house of reps.

Mind you, all it took was the Senate blocking supply to cause Whitlam's dismissal, and Abbot has threatened DD in the past if the senate blocks any of his pet policies. Considering Abbot's personality, I wouldn't be surprised if he were to throw a shit-fit over blocking supply.

 

[Omni]

Who the fuck voted these muppets in?

Gah.

 

[Candescence]

Who the fuck voted these muppets in?

Gah.

People voted Labor out. It didn't take long for the majority to realize that they had made a mistake.

 

[Garrus Vakarian]

The original tweet was deleted but this says it all really:

At first glance I thought Abbot's drink was mushrooming out of his cup, then I realized it was just some dude's arm behind him. Damn surreal moment there lol.

 

[Westlo]

Congrats future prime minister Bill Shorten or is this country dumb enough to keep Abbot in.

 

[bomma_man]

Congrats future prime minister Bill Shorten or is this country dumb enough to keep Abbot in.

Costello's first budget was even worse, don't count on it.

 

[A More Normal Bird]

Insanity. The immorality of this government is unfathomable. They hate the people. This isn't debatable.

Right, this is exactly what I mean, which is baffling for a society like Australia which compared to the rest of the world is uniquely rural. Rural in cultural identity, rural in business, rural in population dispersion, etc.

Are you saying that this mob are bloody un-Australian? Too right cobber.

The original tweet was deleted but this says it all really:

No cigars? #sharingtheburden

 

[Tim the Wiz]

So wait austudy is getting cut too?

.

 

[TheHeretic]

No seriously, is this cool off period just for people coming out of education, or all under 30s folk trying to get new start? Is it different to aus study?

Because I'm seriously trying to find balance for those living in rural, low economic areas looking to improve their life by pursuing education they most likely cannot find in their area. This will require they travel and/or move, which is where stuff like aus study and new start are supposed to come in. Usually before so people can get situation and begin their study.

If it's universal then these people are basically fucked for life, unless they're content working the shittiest job they can in their home town, living insanely thrifty, just to save up enough to pursue said education elsewhere.

Well we can at least get the basic facts down:

Those under 25 now apply for Youth Allowance, not Newstart.

Those between 25-30 who have not previously held a job will have a 6 month period of no payment whilst they go through the Governments employment services.

Those between 25-30 who have held a job previously will be eligible immediately, based on how long they have worked in the past.

Exceptions to the waiting period include: parenthood, disability, apprentices and I believe people under a certain age.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Mind you, all it took was the Senate blocking supply to cause Whitlam's dismissal, and Abbot has threatened DD in the past if the senate blocks any of his pet policies. Considering Abbot's personality, I wouldn't be surprised if he were to throw a shit-fit over blocking supply.

It's a big if, though. A DD is an interesting constitutional quirk, but I don't think many governments are cocky or stupid enough to push for one. The coalition are going to poll really badly after this budget, even News.com.au is giving them a relative thrashing for it; under those circumstances, if they're the evil pack of Tory ideologues I think they are, they'll tread carefully so that they can do as much damage as possible before the next election comes around and we get another round of the Australian electorates favourite reality show: Who Can Be More Cruel To Asylum Seekers.

Then again, Abbott really is thick as pigshit so who knows?

 

[mjontrix]

So wait austudy is getting cut too?

If you're under 25 then no more austudy.

First six months unemployed no unemployment benefits you'll have to survive on youth allowance.

Austudy is not getting cut per se - the threshold to getting it just got harder - a lot harder.

 

[Candescence]

It's a big if, though. A DD is an interesting constitutional quirk, but I don't think many governments are cocky or stupid enough to push for one. The coalition are going to poll really badly after this budget, even News.com.au is giving them a relative thrashing for it; under those circumstances, if they're the evil pack of Tory ideologues I think they are, they'll tread carefully so that they can do as much damage as possible before the next election comes around and we get another round of the Australian electorates favourite reality show: Who Can Be More Cruel To Asylum Seekers.

Then again, Abbott really is thick as pigshit so who knows?

He's utterly convinced that the public will thank him in the long run, so who knows. Even many of his own party have considerable doubts, and if the senate blocks supply, there could be an internal revolt.

 

[HowZatOZ]

Awesome, so Liberal give no shits about the future of uni students, yet want us to "learn or earn" while struggling with higher uni fees and reduced benefit payments.

I'm all for clamping on rampant abuse of the system, but this is just bullshit. You can't sustain an economy when the future work force can't pay for their education, we'll just become America with their crippling uni fees and impossible education opportunities.

All this feels like is a straight "fuck you, I got my degree already" from Liberal. I hope anyone who voted for these clowns is hanging their head in shame.

 

[tri_willy]

as a public servant, i can see myself getting fucked hard for this. 2100 jobs in my department to be cut by this coming october ffs

fucking hockey you cunt, if you wanna make savings, i suggest you start off first by cutting off the fat off your face you fucking squealing pig!!!

 

[Garrus Vakarian]

This just makes me so sad.

 

[cheezcake]

"No cuts to education, no cuts to health, no change to pensions, no change to the GST and no cuts to the ABC or SBS." - Tony Abbott 6th Sept 2013

Ugh.

 

[Dryk]

Ugh.

The public was stupid for believing that since it's essentially "If elected the Liberals promise to not Liberal"

 

[cheezcake]

The public was stupid for believing that since it's essentially "If elected the Liberals promise to not Liberal"

Murdoch. Though anyone who bothered to put 2 of their own brain cells to work thinking about the election should have realised it..

Its more just how fucking blatantly politicians can lie to the public and face no repercussions, angers me.

 

[jambo]

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/cartoon/2014/may/13/first-dog-budget#_

"Sydney University Liberals for Other People's Austerity Society" is my new favourite thing today.

 

[jim-jam bongs]

Murdoch. Though anyone who bothered to put 2 of their own brain cells to work thinking about the election should have realised it..

Its more just how fucking blatantly politicians can lie to the public and face no repercussions, angers me.

It's not their fault that Labour were so irresponsible that they left the country in a debt crisis that only austerity could resolve. Please believe us, this is all Labour's fault.

 

[Phoenician_Viking]

Also imagine how much more power this gives bosses. Who's going to risk getting fired if you're up for six months with no guaranteed safety net right off the bat?

Also, do they imagine this is going to encourage people to leave home? Who's going to fucking support them if they lose their jobs?

How can any government build a modern society without providing education to its citicenz? Too stupid of a decision.

 

[viciouskillersquirrel]

Just read the thread and the synopsis of the budget. We're through the looking glass here people.

Also, people threatening to move to the UK or Canada be aware that the UK has its own austerity-addled politicians and that Canada is very much influenced by its right-wing neighbour to the south. New Zealand is pretty much your only option within the Anglosphere. Good luck.

 

[Arksy]

Everyone here knows that I'm a non-gun totting small government loving right winged free maketeering fruitcake but even I'm taken a bit aback by it all. It's incredibly extreme for a new government and it would be more extreme than I would've implemented had I gotten control of the budget.

Which is fucking saying something.

 

[The Librarian]

As someone from the US looking in, are most of these cuts and taxes done in the name of deficit concerns?

 

[Arksy]

As someone from the US looking in, are most of these cuts and taxes done in the name of deficit concerns?

All entirely in the name of reducing deficit. Which is hilarious because we have incredibly low levels of debt, low levels of spending as a percentage of our GDP and 21 years of uninterrupted growth. I would be confident in saying our fiscal position is one of the best, if not the best in the western world.

 

[The Librarian]

All entirely in the name of reducing deficit. Which is hilarious because our fiscal position is the best in the Western World, bar none.

Doesn't the Australian government own and operate its own currency? If so, Australia doesn't necessarily need to get its budget under control to maintain its spending level. Unless, of course, Tony Abbott is reducing the deficit because inflation and/or interest rates are out of control. Otherwise it's entirely unnecessary to cut all this spending in the name of reducing the deficit.

 

[Arksy]

Doesn't the Australian government own and operate its own currency? If so, Australia doesn't necessarily need to get its budget under control to maintain its spending level. Unless, of course, Tony Abbott is reducing the deficit because inflation and/or interest rates are out of control. Otherwise it's entirely unnecessary to cut all this spending in the name of reducing the deficit.

Interest rates are lower than they have been in a while, which somehow hasn't managed to make a lasting dent in the value of our currency. Inflation isn't excessively high (I think it's 2% but don't quote me on that).

The answer to your question is yes, we are monetarily sovereign, our public finances are fine, and this is all basically a sham to try to justify their philosophical position on the role of government.

 

[yepyepyep]

Doesn't the Australian government own and operate its own currency? If so, Australia doesn't necessarily need to get its budget under control to maintain its spending level. Unless, of course, Tony Abbott is reducing the deficit because inflation and/or interest rates are out of control. Otherwise it's entirely unnecessary to cut all this spending in the name of reducing the deficit.

There is no real reason, it is just ideology.

 

[The Librarian]

Interest rates are lower than they have been in a while, which somehow hasn't managed to make a lasting dent in the value of our currency. Inflation isn't excessively high (I think it's 2% but don't quote me on that).

The answer to your question is yes, we are monetarily sovereign, our public finances are fine, and this is all basically a sham to try to justify their philosophical position on the role of government.

Well that's a damn shame.

 

[Arksy]

Basically.

I'm quite upset because I think the idea of a smaller government and more economic freedom is an something adults can have reasoned debates about and there is an entirely defensible position on both sides with plenty of instances where different ideas have worked. It's just annoying that they decided to try to pull the wool over our eyes with this whole concocted budget emergency.

 

[magenta]

I wonder if this government wants to be known for having the first recession in 21 years. If it does happen then I wonder how they will spin it and will the public buy it.

 

[Elaugaufein]

If that RTS funding cut is going to apply to people already doing a research degree, I'm screwed. I'm already at the FEE-HELP funding limit, so I can't put any fees onto that, and I'd be forced to pay for those up front. There's no way in hell I can afford to pay that.

Had a look through. This definitely doesn't apply until Jan 1 2016.
Theres also some stuff in the education summary about current students being grandfathered until 2020 but it's unclear if that's undergrads only.

 

[Elaugaufein]

I wonder if this government wants to be known for having the first recession in 21 years. If it doesn happen then I wonder how they will spin it and will the public buy it.

I believe the standard line is something about recessions we had to have. Probably with "Labor's reckless spending led us here" seasoning in this case.

 

[Arksy]

No one remembers Keating's "This is the recession we had to have."?

 

[Elaugaufein]

No one remembers Keating's "This is the recession we had to have."?

That's what I was referencing.

 

[Arksy]

That's what I was referencing.

Oh right, my bad. I need coffee.

 

[Elaugaufein]

Oh right, my bad. I need coffee.

I was deliberately vague hoping for humorous effect when it was realized, so its my bad too.

 

[Arksy]

Sort of cross-posted from the AusPol thread.....

I honestly think that there is a potential for blocked supply....Palmer is a bit of a loose cannon and I think the ALP would basically be betraying their base by allowing it through.