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2014 NBA Feb |OT| Stern retires after failed attempt to bring pro basketball to NY

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L

linsivvi

Member
TheSadRanger said:
I was joking from that last statement, I've watched nearly every Mavs game this season. Monta is incredibly efficient inside the paint and can draw fouls. Is he anywhere near as good as Dirk?? No, but he's the only effectively reliable scorer other than him. He pulls too many forced shots but he's pulled back on that lately.
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http://stats.nba.com/playerShotchart.html?PlayerID=101145

His % inside the paint is worse than Calderon, roughly the same as Vince and Marion.

You do know the TS% already took into account free throws, right? And his % is still below even Devin Harris, right?

Feel free to continue dismiss real numbers though.
 
E

Emwitus

Member
Black Mamba said:
Dirk is amazing and Monta is garbage. Mavs have been 10 points better with monta on the bench this year. Monta is not even one of the top 5 Mavs let alone Dirk's best #2.

Still not convinced Mavs make the playoffs with memphis on their heels. They might make it, but they're first round fodder.
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Now this is hyperbole. Perfect example of watching a stat sheet rather than a team play....sort of like jimbo buss
 
F

Future PhaZe

Member
Melo is great as a PF. His rebounding is better than most PF's and he's been just average defensively against them.

If he'd go to a team with good pieces and took a reasonable paycut he'd easily be a top 5player imo.

He really needs to take a "modest" paycut and make something in the 15-17 PER range and he'll find himself in a great situation.
 
F

Future PhaZe

Member
ph33nix said:
What

How does him going to a good team and taking less money to play with better players vault him into the top 5?
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The Knicks are the sort of mess that only a guy like LeBron could push into something that even comes close to approaching an ECF appearance. There's probably nobody else in the league that would do a damn thing with what Melo has had to work with.
 
P

ph33nix

MWO
Dark FaZe said:
The Knicks are the sort of mess that only a guy like LeBron could push into something that even comes close to approaching an ECF appearance. There's probably nobody else in the league that would do a damn thing with what Melo has had to work with.
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I agree but your statement made it sound like if he simply changed teams to have better people around him that he's suddenly top 5. He either is or he isn't!

And he is borderline IMO
 
X

xnipx

Member
ph33nix said:
I agree but your statement made it sound like if he simply changed teams to have better people around him that he's suddenly top 5. He either is or he isn't!

And he is borderline IMO
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I think with a better supporting cast he can showcase his true abilities as a top player. With the shit he is surrounded with he gets dragged down considerably b
 
F

Future PhaZe

Member
ph33nix said:
I agree but your statement made it sound like if he simply changed teams to have better people around him that he's suddenly top 5. He either is or he isn't!

And he is borderline IMO
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I think there's like two guys in the league that are good enough to simply be the best no matter whats around them, and that's KD and LeBron (and Anthony Davis within a year or two).

There's a tier of guys after that that are really good but their relevancy and ranking is dependent on team success. Like with Love is doing right now, guys might not call him top 5, but you think if he was playing in Thibs system winning 60 games he'd probably be a serious MVP candidate.

I don't think Melo had a chance to be much of anything with the way the league was a few years ago and as an SF. But the league has evolved and he would probably break basketball as a PF on the right team.
 
L

LiveFromKyoto

Member
Dark FaZe said:
Melo is great as a PF. His rebounding is better than most PF's and he's been just average defensively against them.

If he'd go to a team with good pieces and took a reasonable paycut he'd easily be a top 5player imo.

He really needs to take a "modest" paycut and make something in the 15-17 PER range and he'll find himself in a great situation.
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He's not taking any paycut. He's just going to force a sign & trade to a pro basketball team in the summer.

Anthony, Dunleavy, Joakim Noah - that is a formidable front court.
 
L

LegendofJoe

Member
Melo being surrounded by a poor supporting cast is his own damn fault, I feel no pity for him. If he does end up leaving the Knicks he damn well better work something out to get them something decent in return, he owes them at least that.
 
P

ph33nix

MWO
LiveFromKyoto said:
He's not taking any paycut. He's just going to force a sign & trade to a pro basketball team in the summer.

Anthony, Dunleavy, Joakim Noah - that is a formidable front court.
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lol?

LegendofJoe said:
Melo being surrounded by a poor supporting cast is his own damn fault, I feel no pity for him. If he does end up leaving the Knicks he damn well better work something out to get them something decent in return, he owes them at least that.
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This, but he's probably learned his lesson
 
F

Future PhaZe

Member
LegendofJoe said:
Melo being surrounded by a poor supporting cast is his own damn fault, I feel no pity for him. If he does end up leaving the Knicks he damn well better work something out to get them something decent in return, he owes them at least that.
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to be fair, if they don't use the amnesty on Chauncey to get Chandler they could have amnestied Amare by now and surrounded him with 30+ million worth of help

#knickstape
 
L

LuchaShaq

Banned
How about a Tyreke Evans for Josh smith swap.

Wait don't laugh.

1. It works financially almost same contract/both 4 years.


For the Pistons.
- Allows them to play monroe and drummond more/together which they should be doing.
- No more wasting 8 jumpers a game on Josh
- Gives them a competent ball handler besides jennings

For the Pelicans
- Removes the jrue/tyreke/Gordan who gets the ball jam, aka give it to fucking Brow more.
- Brow/Smith frontline is potentially crazy defensively, and then when Ryan Anderson comes back (next season?) he can backup Josh or start at the 3 offensively while Josh can guard the 3 on Defense. This would lead to nightmares in transition for opposing defenses with Josh filling the lane and Ryan spotting up while their men scramble to switch back.
-With Jrue/Gordan/Anderson/Morrow you have enough floor spacing where you can just ban Josh smith from taking jumpers with more than 3 sec on shot clock.


Neither team would suddenly become contenders, but I genuinely think this move would improve both teams significantly.
 
H

Hasphat'sAnts

Member
LuchaShaq said:
How about a Tyreke Evans for Josh smith swap.

Wait don't laugh.

1. It works financially almost same contract/both 4 years.


For the Pistons.
- Allows them to play monroe and drummond more/together which they should be doing.
- No more wasting 8 jumpers a game on Josh
- Gives them a competent ball handler besides jennings

For the Pelicans
- Removes the jrue/tyreke/Gordan who gets the ball jam, aka give it to fucking Brow more.
- Brow/Smith frontline is potentially crazy defensively, and then when Ryan Anderson comes back (next season?) he can backup Josh or start at the 3 offensively while Josh can guard the 3 on Defense. This would lead to nightmares in transition for opposing defenses with Josh filling the lane and Ryan spotting up while their men scramble to switch back.
-With Jrue/Gordan/Anderson/Morrow you have enough floor spacing where you can just ban Josh smith from taking jumpers with more than 3 sec on shot clock.


Neither team would suddenly become contenders, but I genuinely think this move would improve both teams significantly.
Click to expand...

Not sure how Jennings and Tyreke would co-exist in crunch time. They need more shooting on the floor, and KCP/Singler/Datome is not doing that for them. Plus, it's not like Jrue and Tyreke were setting the world on fire anyway.
 
F

Future PhaZe

Member
If Falk finds a team ready to give Monroe the max or something close to it, expect Detroit to match the offer sheet and worry about the money later. At worst, you'd have a 24-year-old, 6-foot-10 power forward under contract that you'd then be able to shop. The Pistons had to lose a lot to wind up with top-10 picks in three straight Drafts. Those assets mean more to them than they probably do to others.
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fucking fuck

welp, guess we're extending Gortat :(, Monroe was our only hope

hmm, Nene would look good in Houston..
 
T

Tom Penny

Member
Why are people still trying to figure out Melo? He will never win big being the number 1 player because he's not a great playmaker and doesn't play D so he doesn't make lesser player all that much better. On the other hand he would be a superstar 2 for his closing ability / offense.
 
C

captmcblack

Member
Tom Penny said:
Why are people still trying to figure out Melo? He will never win big being the number 1 player because he's not a great playmaker and doesn't play D so he doesn't make lesser player all that much better. On the other hand he would be a superstar 2 for his closing ability / offense.
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Melo can win the same way Paul Pierce or Dirk Nowitzki did. Melo can also win the same way Allen Iverson (almost) did.

If you want to build a team around Melo, that team either needs S-rank defenders and shotmakers around it, or it needs to have an S-rank playmaker (ideally a PG) so that Melo can simply finish plays rather than initiate them.

But really, that's the nature of the league anyway. Nobody won alone, and nobody won without at least 1 complimentary star player sharing the load (maybe the Pistons did - but that's because they ran 4 All-Stars with perfect offensive synergy to make up for imperfect offensive output and S-rank defense).
 
N

Ninja Scooter

Member
Hasphat'sAnts said:
Not sure how Jennings and Tyreke would co-exist in crunch time. They need more shooting on the floor, and KCP/Singler/Datome is not doing that for them. Plus, it's not like Jrue and Tyreke were setting the world on fire anyway.
Click to expand...

Tyreke has shown willingness in the past to let someone else be the shooter
 
F

fertygo

Member
Yeah not sure how to rank them, LMA and Blake might have better season.. but feel like Dirk can bring NBA title if he have their team, so...
 
L

LegendofJoe

Member
Dark FaZe said:
fucking fuck

welp, guess we're extending Gortat :(, Monroe was our only hope

hmm, Nene would look good in Houston..
Click to expand...

Damn, Dumars is dumb. No wonder a Otto Porter-Greg Monroe swap hasn't happened yet. I'm going to be laughing for a long time if Monroe and Smith's contracts prevent them from resigning Drummond.
 
S

SephCast

Brotherhood of Shipley's
So I went to my local gym here in NYC to get some shots up before work and Nick Cannon was there shooting around, getting filmed. Super random. Guess he's practicing for the Celeb All Star Game. Sorry for the terrible picture, he's the one shooting free throws. He wasn't that good.

oVGR5.jpg
 
H

Hasphat'sAnts

Member
LegendofJoe said:
Damn, Dumars is dumb. No wonder a Otto Porter-Greg Monroe swap hasn't happened yet. I'm going to be laughing for a long time if Monroe and Smith's contracts prevent them from resigning Drummond.
Click to expand...

You're operating under the assumption that Otto Porter's actually good. Which he is not, and may never be.

Ninja Scooter said:
Tyreke has shown willingness in the past to let someone else be the shooter
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That's fair, but I also think Isaiah Thomas is just a better player than Jennings, on offense at least.
 
D

DY_nasty

NeoGAF's official "was this shooting justified" consultant
Out of all the shitty rookies, which look like they can turn it around? (lol)

I can at least factually defend Zeller. He can't shoot that mid-range jumper at all and we did force him to take it. I can at least find peace of mind that we were playing him out of position for the first 3 months of the season. I haven't seen enough of Porter. I'm on the fence about Burke because even though he's helping Utah win by simply being a point guard, he should be able to do a lot more considering the tools he has. Oladipo should be fine. Bennett needs to put on a plane with Biebz and sent back to Canada.
 
F

Future PhaZe

Member
LegendofJoe said:
Damn, Dumars is dumb. No wonder a Otto Porter-Greg Monroe swap hasn't happened yet. I'm going to be laughing for a long time if Monroe and Smith's contracts prevent them from resigning Drummond.
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They think they can worry about the money later. Problem is his value is going to look terrible by the time Drummond is ready for a max because he simply isn't a PF.

I'm not sure I'd trade Otto for him either. One thing a lot of people haven't noticed is that the center position very quietly got really good over the last couple of seasons to the point where I'm struggling to even find someone who could use Gortat enough to trade for him.

It's going to be easier to find decent centers than it is to find good two way wings really soon, so I'd probably opt to nix that trade as a Wiz fan despite the fact that we have Ariza and Web right now.

DY_nasty said:
Out of all the shitty rookies, which look like they can turn it around? (lol)

I can at least factually defend Zeller. He can't shoot that mid-range jumper at all and we did force him to take it. I can at least find peace of mind that we were playing him out of position for the first 3 months of the season. I haven't seen enough of Porter. I'm on the fence about Burke because even though he's helping Utah win by simply being a point guard, he should be able to do a lot more considering the tools he has. Oladipo should be fine. Bennett needs to put on a plane with Biebz and sent back to Canada.
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with a lot of these guys its a question of how long its going to take to actually get the development they need

Like Zeller is a center, but with Biz as a backup C and Al Jeff being a beast he's not even getting any real development and it's hard to see how that changes anytime soon. With the playoff mandate its even tougher to see it happening.

Porter might as well have never played any minutes for us. It's just nearly impossible for him to find minutes on this roster right now, but I've seen enough of him to want to move Ariza ASAP so we can start him by the end of the season. Unfortunately that looks like it won't happen at this point.

Burkes...doing fine. He's actually exceeded my expectations thus far.

Len moves good. Always health with him.

Bennett is running out of excuses. His problem more than anything is defense and he's never shown an ability on any level to play it. He's in "If you're not running isos against whoever he's guarding something's wrong" status right now.

KCP is really bad. Doesn't do anything well right now.


I'd declare KCP and Bennett as the only disappointments right now in the top 15.
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
Anthony Davis has played 50% PF and 50% C this season according to BK-Ref.com.

The NOP are -1.2 with him ON the court per 100 Poss. Ouch. But his ON-OFF are decent at +2.2 per 100 Poss.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
I'm worried that Burke hasn't been able to score at the rim or get to the line and has gotten crushed defensively since those all relate to his physical tools (which I was worried about pre-draft), but he should be good once he gets savvier and becomes a good three point shooter. He's smart and can dribble and seems to have good intangibles. That he's competing for RotY with .018 WS/48 is a function of his draft class more than anything else though...

The NOP are +2.2.... with him OFF the court and -1.2 with him ON the court per 100 Poss. Ouch.
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No, they aren't. They're -3.4 with him off and -1.2 with him on. The +2.2 is the difference between the two numbers.

They're +2.7 with him playing and Eric Gordon not playing as well.
 
L

LegendofJoe

Member
There's an awesome article on Clifford's coaching philosophy on Bleacher Report of all places. I'll link it when I can hop on my laptop at home. We finally have a coach worth keeping, it feels good. And with the way he praises MKG it's lol worthy to think we're trading him anytime soon.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
Increasing the age limit to 20 is a priority for Adam Silver. It will be a topic of discussion once the union hires an executive director.
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This is pretty unethical, but it makes sense for the NBA.

Hopefully it just happens after next year (since we're going to still be bad next year and need Cliff Alexander).
 
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