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2014 NBA |OT| Let's just wait it out. Be NKY/LAL fans and lose our games together.

F

Fjordson

Member
overcast said:
Curry is still having a phenomenal season, while being on the best team in the league. The latter is a big deal.
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Yep. He'll coast into the MVP if he keeps up his current level of play and the Warriors continue to contend for the best record in the league.

That being said, I have a troubling suspicion that the Warriors will dip in the second half of the season. Hope I'm wrong, but we'll see.
 
B

Bowser

Member
I think Curry is currently the frontrunner for MVP, but it should be Harden IMO. Replace Harden with an average SG and the Rockets suck, likely scuffling to make the playoffs as an 8 seed.
 
F

Fjordson

Member
I feel like penalizing Curry because his team is better is a bit unfair.

The Warriors are arguably the best offense in the league through the first half of the season. Best shooting percentage, most assists per game, #2 in offensive efficiency, most points per game, etc. Curry's supporting cast is damn good, but they'd fall pretty hard without him. I mean who's our second best player, Klay Thompson? I love him, but he averages 2 assists a game. Curry is what drives the offense and is why the Warriors have been so good on that end. And some of that doesn't even show up in stats. His immense gravity on offense creates gaps for others to score even when he's playing off the ball or when he gets hockey assists.

So while Houston without Harden would go from a solid offense to a bad one, the Warriors would go from arguably the best offense in the league to a middling one. Different parts of the spectrum to be sure, but similar falls in my opinion.

What they do on defense is a bit murkier and neither is great on that end. Curry does lead the league in steals as a member of the #1 defense, though steals can be misleading and he's no doubt buoyed by the great defenders around him on Golden State so maybe that doesn't mean much.

edit: to be clear, I'll have zero issue with Harden winning. And I expect the Warriors' excellence to slack a bit in the second half so Curry's MVP case could weaken as the season goes on. I just think he deserves to be up there right now with anyone else in the discussion.
 
S

Splatt

Member
I really don't want Harden to win MVP.

I hate his style of play.

Not saying he's underserving of the award, I just don't like him because #reasons
 
A

alr1ght

bish gets all the credit :)
0112_dhuon.gif


this works better
0112_vao3t.gif
 
G

Gully State

Member
Fjordson said:
I feel like penalizing Curry because his team is better is a bit unfair.

The Warriors are arguably the best offense in the league through the first half of the season. Best shooting percentage, most assists per game, #2 in offensive efficiency, most points per game, etc. Curry's supporting cast is damn good, but they'd fall pretty hard without him. I mean who's our second best player, Klay Thompson? I love him, but he averages 2 assists a game. Curry is what drives the offense and is why the Warriors have been so good on that end. And some of that doesn't even show up in stats. His immense gravity on offense creates gaps for others to score even when he's playing off the ball or when he gets hockey assists.

So while Houston without Harden would go from a solid offense to a bad one, the Warriors would go from arguably the best offense in the league to a middling one. Different parts of the spectrum to be sure, but similar falls in my opinion.

What they do on defense is a bit murkier and neither is great on that end. Curry does lead the league in steals as a member of the #1 defense, though steals can be misleading and he's no doubt buoyed by the great defenders around him on Golden State so maybe that doesn't mean much.

edit: to be clear, I'll have zero issue with Harden winning. And I expect the Warriors' excellence to slack a bit in the second half so Curry's MVP case could weaken as the season goes on. I just think he deserves to be up there right now with anyone else in the discussion.
Click to expand...

I can't find it but there's an advanced stat that says the offense is like +10 points per X possessions with Curry on the floor. By eye test, you can also see how Curry pretty much makes the offense. Teams are afraid of his pull up 3 so they have to pick him up a couple of steps before the 3 point line which allows him to easily blow by opponents/ creates spacing for interior scorers etc. Without Curry, that spacing just doesn't exist. As good as Klay is, he just doesn't command that kind of attention just quite yet.
 
F

Fjordson

Member
Gully State said:
I can't find it but there's an advanced stat that says the offense is like +10 points per X possessions with Curry on the floor. By eye test, you can also see how Curry pretty much makes the offense. Teams are afraid of his pull up 3 so they have to pick him up a couple of steps before the 3 point line which allows him to easily blow by opponents/ creates spacing for interior scorers etc. Without Curry, that spacing just doesn't exist. As good as Klay is, he just doesn't command that kind of attention just quite yet.
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Yeah, with Curry on the court the Warriors are +16 in offensive rating and shoot it over 7% better.

Just for offensive rating, they would go from second in the league down to about 18th or 19th without him.
 
P

Pimpwerx

Member
alr1ght said:
this works better
0112_vao3t.gif
Click to expand...
That's what Hassan will be having with Bron's corpse after he kills him tonight. Whiteside's hosting a block party in the 'Landfill tonight. Who's invited? Bitchass LeBron James. Let's go HEAT.

BTW, surprised no one is getting on Chuck for badmouthing analytics. Dude came off mad ignorant last night, and it should be no surprise that he hasn't been offered a GM position, like he wants. He just doesn't get the modern game. PEACE.
 
R

RBK

Banned
Pimpwerx said:
BTW, surprised no one is getting on Chuck for badmouthing analytics. Dude came off mad ignorant last night, and it should be no surprise that he hasn't been offered a GM position, like he wants. He just doesn't get the modern game. PEACE.
Click to expand...

Now that's it's finally been brought up, Barkley pretty much talks out of his ass all the time, whether it's sports or social issues. I don't see how anyone can truly value his opinion outside of entertainment purposes.
 
F

Fjordson

Member
Pimpwerx said:
BTW, surprised no one is getting on Chuck for badmouthing analytics. Dude came off mad ignorant last night, and it should be no surprise that he hasn't been offered a GM position, like he wants. He just doesn't get the modern game. PEACE.
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I heard about that on twitter. What he said was definitely silly, but I'm not totally surprised by it coming from Charles. I feel like he likes to lean into that whole button pushing thing on TNT just to get a rise out of people.
 
N

Ninja Scooter

Member
Barkley is an idiot but that's why people like him. His popularity on NBA on TNT isn't because of any sort of fantastic insight or analysis, it's because he's a loudmouth buffoon who says entertaining things. I"m not surprised he's badmouthing analytics. "Old school" type guys in baseball have been doing the same thing since Moneyball came out. Joe Morgan is an idiot too, but at least Chuck can be funny.
 
S

Soonri

Member
Chuck was hilarious last night. The petty name-calling and hate hard on analytics had me crying. He is right about talent always winning in the NBA though.
 
P

Pimpwerx

Member
I'm not even a huge proponent of analytics in basketball, because it's such a star driven league, but even I know they hold value given proper context. It's why the 3pt shot has become so popular, among other things. I just felt embarrassed for him last night, because he's talked about wanting to become a GM. There's just no way in hell a president or owner listens to that rant last night and hands the keys over to him.

Yeah, basketball is really down to the team with the best player winning a lot of times, but how do you know if a guy has talent? If you wait until he's a known quantity, then the ship has sailed already. To be a good GM these days, you have to be able to gauge hidden talent that only shows up in numbers. Some players are misused or underutilized, and someone like Chuck would never know. He badmouthed Morey, but Chuck would never have known dude had MVP caliber talent because of how he was used in OKC. Morey did, and when everyone thought he was overpaying a 6th man, he was secretly stealing one of the best players in the league from a title contender. I think Morey's work more than validates his approach. PEACE.
 
P

Pimpwerx

Member
BTW, I heard on the Lebatard Show tonight that Anthony Mason is fighting for his life with some sort of heart failure. Apparently his sons are by his hospital bed. I loved Mase when he played. He was one of my favorite players in the league. I'm really hoping he can make a recovery.

@PeterVecsey1
Sickened 2 report, ex-Knick Anthony Mason fighting 4 life. Congestive heart failure, heart attack, 4 surgeries, last one 9 hrs. Sons by side
Click to expand...
MetalFearSolid said:
Just saw this on Twitter



Yo.
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LOL. Jim Carrey throwing that shade. PEACE.
 
dream

dream

Member
Yeah. Hubie's been pretty jarring to listen to. It's at the point where I sort of expect him to pass away during a call.
 
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