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[QuicheFontaine]

Trump's doing a speech with the Palestinian president and made the comment that the people responsable for the attack are "losers in life" and that he wouldn't call them monsters because they would like that. Instead he will refer to them as "Losers".

I'm fine with that, and will probably do the same. I don't want to know their names.

 

[BossDarkseid]

The situation as known although I'm open to correction.

22 are dead including the murderer.
No group has claimed responsibility.
There is no released information on the ethnicity, religion or nationality of the bomber.

Despite this, there is discussion about mass deportations presumably to places where people are brown, about the need for denunciations, about the failure of brown people to integrate.

Yeah, this seems correct. Police say bomber died at the scene (I mean it was a suicide bomb but there were conflicting reports) and apparently they are still trying to identify things from CCTV.

 

[Captain Smirk]

Shout out to the emergency services throughout the night, taxi drivers taking people away and the hotels for sheltering missing children. Hope all the missing people get found ASAP.

 

[legend166]

Very few political ideologies can convince people to kill themselves to kill a bunch of teenagers at an Ariane Grande concert. You need religion for that.

And before the comparisons come in, this is not like kamikazes who used suicide attacks against enemy warships. Also the comparisons to the Tamil LTTE don't work as they did not call for or carried out attacks on random civilians in foreign countries.

I mean, pretty much every major war in the 20th century had absolutely nothing to do with religion and we saw violence and cruelty at unprecedented scale.

I'm certainly not going to argue there isn't a major issue with extremist Islam right now, but if there's one thing human history tells you is that pretty much any and every excuse has been used to commit violence.

 

[Stop It]

Well, people from Manchester have already been saying that their first instincts were to help people, and that all peoples were offering to help out...basically parents might be scared to let their kids go to concerts unsupervised for a while - despite this happening outside the purview of the organizers - but in terms of sowing discord and division....unless you were already that way inclined...not gonna happen.

That's because people from Manchester are fucking awesome. I say this as a southern shite who fell for one

Alas they're all too familiar with this sort of thing and the response is the same. Help anyone in need, and Fuck you to the terrorists.

It's still cute when people refer to the Manchester Arena as the MEN. My partner still does too despite the sponsorship expiring ages ago.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Yeah disappointed. Some seem awfully chipper considering what's happened. I know GAF is a US site, but I can't see myself cracking wise in a thread about dead children anywhere in the world, but I get that I'm a Lancashire lad and way too close to this to have meaningful discussion about the cause in this thread when all I can think about is folk waiting to find about their kids.

This is a terrible tragedy, and if there is broader organisation behind it I think that the full force of the law should be brought down upon the perpetrators.

This largely goes without saying. No one is chipper about it.

That doesn't mean one can't point out the ridiculousness some people are spouting. With limited factual basis. Where even if assumptions bear truth, the comments are ridiculous.

 

[amanset]

Do you know what you should do?

Go to the gig and have a fucking good time.

It is the British way. Don't let it affect you.

On the day of the Stockholm attack I went to the pub instead of going home from work, just like I had planned to.

 

[E-phonk]

What the fuck

Just got to work not knowing anything and the first thing I on the Guardian is this? Bloody hell!

and its during a Live Gig. As someone who goes to a lot of them, I am shocked to hear that even entertainment and social gethrings that involves music is not safe. Fuck these people whoever they are.

I am going to 3 festivals this summer. I am starting to get worried now!

The paris attacks were also at a concert and a soccer game. Big crowds, unprepared people, chaos. The brussels attacks on an airport and metro, people going on vacation or just going to work. It's always a situation where people don't expect it.

But don't give in to fear. When the brussels attacks happened I went to a concert the day after (gaslamp killer - ironically) - and he brought a message of unity for all that showed up, it felt like a relieve after the tension we all lived in for the hours after the attacks.

 

[MarkMclovin]

Terrible news to wake up to.

 

[fierrotlepou]

Woke up to this.

What a tragedy. Fuck the guy that did this, and the people responsible. Humans are fucking disgusting.

 

[Shadow Puppetry]

Trump's doing a speech with the Palestinian president and made the comment that the people responsable for the attack are "losers in life" and that he wouldn't call them monsters because they would like that. Instead he will refer to them as "Losers".

How ironic.

 

[Roufianos]

Fucking sucks. We all knew the UK would be attacked sooner or later. Even when I get on the tube lately it's been playing on my mind. Unbelievable that kids going to an Ariana concert have to face this shit.

Also, wtf were people thinking with this balloon talk.

 

[oipic]

It's important not to forget that these bastards are not just attacking the west, they are causing doom and despair in the middle east as well. Innocent people are being killed on a daily basis there.

They make no distinction between westerners and others, they are monsters.

Ah, of course - thanks, yes, that's a very good point. Even 'home' isn't spared from this, which just further muddies the matter, and probably renders the question of 'why' this is happening, and continuing to happen, a moot point - perhaps there is no point, and it is simply mindless after all? I just don't understand the higher power or motives at play at all.

 

[Patrick S.]

Is this real?

Look at the timestamps...

Saw it on qt3.

 

[Keasar]

Fuck... just woke up and started reading the news.

My condolences to anyone here personally affected and stay strong England.

Fucking children man...

 

[KHlover]

Trump's doing a speech with the Palestinian president and made the comment that the people responsable for the attack are "losers in life" and that he wouldn't call them monsters because they would like that. Instead he will refer to them as "Losers".

One of the very few times where he hit the nail on the head.

 

[velociraptor]

Oh my God.

What the fuck.

Horrible, horrible news. I'm so fucking mad right now - words cannot describe my anger.

When will this shit fucking stop?

 

[Jacknapes]

First thing i thought of when i read about this is what is the world coming to. This is sickening and a tragedy. Thoughts are with all those affected.

 

[LNBL]

Is this real?

Look at the timestamps...

Saw it on qt3.

I think this was already debunked early on last night

 

[liquidtmd]

Fucking sucks. We all knew the UK would be attacked sooner or later. Even when I get on the tube lately it's been playing on my mind. Unbelievable that kids going to an Ariana concert have to face this shit.

Also, wtf were people thinking with this balloon talk.

Thousands of people at the gig. Noisy. Lots of balloons. No visibility. A couple of hours of probably hearing booms and bangs. In context at the gig, I entirely see why initially some may have thought it

 

[Patrick S.]

I think this was already debunked early on last night

Thanks.

 

[BocoDragon]

What is the end goal for these terrorist groups? I'm not quite sure I really understand what they are fighting for? Is it for the west to leave their countries and stop meddling? Is it just a general hatred of western values? I'm not sure I particularly get what it is they are trying to achieve?

(Just trying to learn here, so excuse my ignorance)

Edit: I guess my phrasing is bad for this as it hasn't been confirmed who has committed this act yet. So apologies, not trying to offend.

You'll get a lot of different responses to this. Some would say it's all self-defence against western imperialism. I wish I believed that (I did in the years after 9/11), but unfortunately I now think that's a leftist academic's beer goggles view of the situation. "Everything was economic inequality", they say.

Personally, the answer I'd present at this point is: desperate and humiliated* Muslims turned to a back-to-basics vision of Islam... and it's important to remember how Islam was in its first centuries. It was a God-sanctioned form of government that was considered "destined" to rule over the old world (including and especially Europe, where it was presumed to "patch" the outdated corruption of God's word that was Christendom). Muslims were very surprised when they were halted in their conquering of Europe at the Battle of Tours, because their eventual dominance over that land was promised by God. And they've grown increasingly confused by Islam's more recent shrinking dominance in the world, considering it contradicts what God promised them.

*So while these radical Muslims might have been made destitute and susceptible to extremist thinking by the humiliation of western imperialism (that's a side question), their ideology is not to strike back at the West, per se, but to restore Islam to political dominance on the earth. The West is merely the main obstacle to this project. They have a black and white reading of their religion, and it claims to be political destiny for the earth. They're working to make it happen. And terrorist attacks are the limited means they have to push the world in this direction. It seems like a small and futile stone throw at a giant.... but who knows, they've already moved governments rightward and divided us, so who knows if it's a bad strategy for their goals....

 

[jelly]

Horrific. Don't think they've said who did it so let's wait and see.

Carry on like usual, don't change for nobody.

 

[Xando]

Thousands of people at the gig. Noisy. Lots of balloons. No visibility. A couple of hours of probably hearing booms and bangs. In context at the gig, I entirely see why initially some may have thought it

Balloon talk was always ridiculous if you saw the response of police.

You don't deploy armed police, bomb squads and close a train station for a stampede.

 

[Machina]

This is just speculation obviously but that death toll isn't done yet. some of those injured aren't making it.

The question around extremist terrorism really needs an answer, fast. There's only so much people are gonna take before things get very ugly for innocent people (read: muslims)

 

[Sevenfold]

No one is chipper about it.

That doesn't mean one can't point out the ridiculousness some people are spouting

I too advocate the deportation of all Canadians.

...was your only input. You didn't scold the person you quoted nor did you point anything out. If you thought the member's post had no place in a thread of this nature why not just delete it?

 

[TeddyBoy]

So one of the girls I used to date was at the concert last night, thankfully she's safe. This just made it seem so much more real

 

[ClosingADoor]

Fucking sucks. We all knew the UK would be attacked sooner or later. Even when I get on the tube lately it's been playing on my mind. Unbelievable that kids going to an Ariana concert have to face this shit.

Also, wtf were people thinking with this balloon talk.

We see the same almost every attack. When a truck went into a crowd, we hoped for it to be just an accident. When the attacks in Paris happened, we hoped it was just some gang violence.

It is holding out hope that it is just a small thing compared to an actual terrorist attack, so that casualties aren't too high. Plus it is easier to make sense of it that way. I can understand an accident, how horrific the result might be. I can't understand someone exploding a bomb in a crowd of teenagers.

 

[Preezy]

Grim news to wake up to this morning. This is now the new normal, I can't see a future without these kind of attacks happening.

 

[Par Score]

Manchester got bombed by the Nazis. Manchester got bombed by the IRA.

Manchester will not be cowed by a pathetic attack like this. We will mourn, and then we will come together, stronger than before.

Is this real?

Please stop posting random social media bullshit.

Have some respect for the 22 people who have died and the many others injured.

 

[MosquitoSmasher]

So not an accident and very likely a attack?

Absolutely terrible all these things going on in this world.

 

[blastprocessor]

So sad to wake up to this. I went in bed reading it was some balloon now wake up to learn it was an attack and in Manchester too

 

[KarneeKarnay]

It's days like this I get upset we even have to share our air with people who do this. It's also when I am reminded that we are British and we don't give in. It's right to feel as I did, but to be a free and democratic country we can't give into it.

There will be people who will try and manipulate this awful event to their own ends, the perpetrators and the political scum that seek to use this to further their own ends. But there will be more of the other. People who will come out and in the face of the worst of humanity, show the best of it.

I've seen the cab drivers flocking to the city to give free lifts all those impacted. People offering up their homes for those that can't get home. Doctors, Nurses, Officers and Fire Service men and women, offer to take extra shifts to help.

We can't give in. We won't give in and we will refuse to let ourselves be defined by the acts of cowards. I'm prouder to be British today.

 

[fanboi]

Grim news to wake up to this morning. This is now the new normal, I can't see a future without these kind of attacks happening.

It is not new normal, attacks have been happening for decades.

70- and 80is had extreme amount of attacks.

 

[Corleth the Fey]

My heart goes out to all those affected.

I live and work in Manchester. I have to travel through the city on the public transport to get to work. I normally pass through Victoria. Instead I got off the tram early and walked through town. It was eerily quiet around Victoria. No trams buses or vehicles. Stay safe all.

 

[weekev]

This is just speculation obviously but that death toll isn't done yet. some of those injured aren't making it.

The question around extremist terrorism really needs an answer, fast. There's only so much people are gonna take before things get very ugly for innocent people (read: muslims)

This kind of rhetoric is very dangerous. Extremist terrorism doesn't have an answer. Not a short and fast one anyway. Talking about people generalising and marginalising communities because they are associated with the Muslim religion is not the answer. These communities are just as shocked and appalled as everyone else and blaming them or expecting people to blame them will invariably make the situation worse.

We need to keep calm, respect those that have lost their lives and try to learn from every event when it happens. Is there more we could have done to prevent this attack? Was there chatter about it beforehand? What happened when the guy tried to access the venue? Was he reported as a suspicious character? Etc etc

 

[faridmon]

You'll get a lot of different responses to this. Some would say it's all self-defence against western imperialism. I wish I believed that (I did in the years after 9/11), but unfortunately I now think that's a leftist academic's beer goggles view of the situation. "Everything was economic inequality", they say.

Personally, the answer I'd present at this point is: desperate and humiliated* Muslims turned to a back-to-basics vision of Islam... and it's important to remember how Islam was in its first centuries. It was a God-sanctioned form of government that was considered "destined" to rule over the old world (including and especially Europe, where it was presumed to "patch" the outdated corruption of God's word that was Christendom). Muslims were very surprised when they were halted in their conquering of Europe at the Battle of Tours, because their eventual dominance over that land was promised by God. And they've grown increasingly confused by Islam's more recent shrinking dominance in the world, considering it contradicts what God promised them.

*So while these radical Muslims might have been made destitute and susceptible to extremist thinking by the humiliation of western imperialism (that's a side question), their ideology is not to strike back at the West, per se, but to restore Islam to political dominance on the earth. The West is merely the main obstacle to this project. They have a black and white reading of their religion, and it claims to be political destiny for the earth. They're working to make it happen. And terrorist attacks are the limited means they have to push the world in this direction.

I am sorry, I disagree with ''Back-to-basics Islam''. Today's Islam is no different than when the Islam was incepted. Extremist always existed after Prophets death. They are called ''Khawarij'' and they always caused fear, not only in western civilization at the time, but also amongst muslims.

 

[RedHill]

Thanks.

Also I want to point out that timestamps mean nothing when everyone is in a different time zone and the time zone the screenshot was taken in is unknown

 

[cyberheater]

So no organization taking responsibility yet? I find that odd.

 

[dakun]

Trump's doing a speech with the Palestinian president and made the comment that the people responsable for the attack are "losers in life" and that he wouldn't call them monsters because they would like that. Instead he will refer to them as "Losers".

i actually like that.

 

[BADMAN]

This is just speculation obviously but that death toll isn't done yet. some of those injured aren't making it.

The question around extremist terrorism really needs an answer, fast. There's only so much people are gonna take before things get very ugly for innocent people (read: muslims)

The fast answer involves taking away the rights of a broad group of people. The vast majority of them innocent (read: muslim travel ban)

 

[Subpar Scrub]

Also I want to point out that timestamps mean nothing when everyone is in a different time zone and the time zone the screenshot was taken in is unknown

This is an important thing that I agree with. People should take into consideration when screencapping social media posts.

 

[Mr_Moogle]

Trump's doing a speech with the Palestinian president and made the comment that the people responsable for the attack are "losers in life" and that he wouldn't call them monsters because they would like that. Instead he will refer to them as "Losers".

Probably the first time I've ever agreed with Trump on anything. If we sensationalise terrorism, we are playing right into their hands.

 

[Pankratous]

The more I read, and the more I see pictures of victims as they were before the attack, and people posting online about their now deceased friend, the more disgusted I feel.

 

[shinra-bansho]

...was your only input. You didn't scold the person you quoted nor did you point anything out. If you thought the member's post had no place in a thread of this nature why not just delete it?

I think it's pretty self-explanatory in pointing out the ridiculousness of "feeling safe" warranting deportation of brown Muslim British citizens on the unsubstantiated presumption this is a brown Muslim. And the lack of similar responses when heinous acts of terror are committed by other ethnic and religious groups, given nobody anywhere suddenly thought the Quebecois suspect as a group after that attack.

But perhaps your mileage may vary.

The members post does nothing that warrants deletion beyond simply being nonsensical.
What I do or don't delete isn't really your concern regardless.

 

[Marvel]

i actually like that.

Yeah, not bad.

 

[jelly]

i actually like that.

Pretty good from Trump.

 

[nekkid]

Trump's doing a speech with the Palestinian president and made the comment that the people responsable for the attack are "losers in life" and that he wouldn't call them monsters because they would like that. Instead he will refer to them as "Losers".

This is a good response. Humiliate them. Make them feel small, pathetic, alone.

 

[King_Moc]

Grim news to wake up to this morning. This is now the new normal, I can't see a future without these kind of attacks happening.

As the post below yours points out, attacks like these have happened long before this particular band of religious crazies started doing them. There's a lot of dickheads out there.

 

[Stop It]

Trump's doing a speech with the Palestinian president and made the comment that the people responsable for the attack are "losers in life" and that he wouldn't call them monsters because they would like that. Instead he will refer to them as "Losers".

He's right you know.

Part of the power of terrorism is the almost mythological power we give them. The fear they crave to shape our lives and to change our way of life because of them is exactly what they want.

They're not losers, they're scum. Cowards who can't win argument with the most powerful weapons, words so resort to the weakness of destruction. We need to stand up for what is right, by showing that we will never change because of them.