Support NeoGAF

[angelkimne]

I'm not sure if it's been posted before, but if anyone wants a nice shiny signed copy of the book a few weeks after release - $40 plus delivery.

On the one hand it really won't improve the reading experience at all, but on the other hand it's just cool, and they'll probably sell for a tidy profit eventually.

Edit: Also, it's a bit like a charity donation, because the guy who runs the site has cancer and no health insurance. Yeah.

 

[ItAintEasyBeinCheesy]

Will probably get one, trying to get at least one signed work by my fav authors, got some Peter V Brett and Robin Hobb stuff already and will keep trying for more.

 

[jon bones]

can someone summarize what goes on in A dance with dragons?

christ you are the worst

Arn't the giants already awake? they were attacking the wall with Mance Rayder.

yeah, those giants were never asleep either, they were always beyond the wall if you believe people like osha, and there's no reason to believe that the giants suddenly appeared. The wildlings seem to be very familiar with them.

true on all counts. i like the idea of the horn awakening pale spiders. those things are gonna be scary as fuck. the winter is going to be a straight horror novel.

 

[Pollux]

christ you are the worst




true on all counts. i like the idea of the horn awakening pale spiders. those things are gonna be scary as fuck. the winter is going to be a straight horror novel.

Ugh I hate spiders, but that shit would be awesome.

As for the signed copies mentioned above...is that guy legit?

 

[Kud Dukan]

Ugh I hate spiders, but that shit would be awesome.

As for the signed copies mentioned above...is that guy legit?

Yes, those signed copies from http://signedpage.com/ are legit. I've ordered several books from him in the past. Already have my copy of ADWD ordered, along with a copy of the 10th anniversary edition of American Gods.

 

[Emerson]

Because everyone who knew about it is either dead, locked up in the Twins or MIA. I am sure it will come to play somehow since its such an awesome plot point.

There's speculation it could not be Jon but all evidence points to Robb legitimizing Jon as a Stark and appointing him heir over Sansa.

I'm almost positive that this is not true. Robb sent out messengers to various places carrying his decree before the Red Wedding. That will be very relevant, I'm quite sure.

 

[BeeDog]

Alright, JUST finished A Feast For Crows. A good book, but slow-paced compared to ASOS and with an obvious lack of main characters. Also took much longer to read through ASOS despite it being shorter.

Anyway, I hope someone can help me sort out the ending. What are we supposed to glean from Sam's last chapter? Who are those new people all of a sudden?

 

[Rubashov]

I'm almost positive that this is not true. Robb sent out messengers to various places carrying his decree before the Red Wedding. That will be very relevant, I'm quite sure.

He only sent 2 messengers and they were to find the true hero of Westeros, the only other person besides Hodor who will survive the winds of winter: Howland Reed.

 

[Emerson]

I thought there were more messengers but looking back I see not. Still, Howland Reed is the only person badass enough to do anything about it anyway. I stand by my saying that it will be very relevant.

 

[Rubashov]

I thought there were more messengers but looking back I see not. Still, Howland Reed is the only person badass enough to do anything about it anyway. I stand by my saying that it will be very relevant.

Oh yes, whenever he finally shows up with an army of crannogmen and Robb's last bannermen, I will get goosebumps.

 

[ultron87]

I can going to find it hilarious when Howland Reed turns out to be some useless crippled old man or something.

 

[Sotha Sil]

I can going to find it hilarious when Howland Reed turns out to be some useless crippled old man or something.

Howland Reed destroyed Ser Arthur Dayne. The man can do anything!

 

[jon bones]

Oh shit I forgot about Howland Reed... dude knows about Jon Snow's parents, too most likely.

 

[Rei_Toei]

Howland Reed destroyed Ser Arthur Dayne. The man can do anything!

Well, Reed must've been something in his younger days, offing Dayne with Ned. I kinda expect him and his people to fulfill the role of suprising leftfield underdog fucking up enemies of the North moving either North or South. Pretty much any conventional army will get FUBAR'ed in the swamps.

Edit: what Sotha Sil said.

 

[bengraven]

So where is Varys?

First off, I think he was the character Rugen - the undergaoler who mysteriously disappeared the night Tywin died and Tyrion escaped. He rarely showed up down in the black cells that he was assigned to and when he did he was "portly, unshaven and gruff" - the same type of person Varys played when he visited Ned down in the black cells.

The last thing he left was an ancient coin belonging to Highgarden. Maybe Varys is leaving a clue to his whereabouts? Qyburn makes it seem as if HG was behind the death of Tywin, which we know is false, so he's playing that to his advantage somehow. But what's the truth of it? Why would Varys leave that behind to be found?

 

[yacobod]

I can going to find it hilarious when Howland Reed turns out to be some useless crippled old man or something.

it will be funny when its revealed that howland = jojen.

 

[Matt]

it will be funny when its revealed that howland = jojen.

I really don't see how that could be, considering Ned never mentioned that he was a small guy that looked like a kid.

 

[jon bones]

wasn't he made fun of at an old tourny though? maybe it was because he looked like a kid. and maybe he beat dayne with magic.

ah who knows.

 

[bengraven]

I'm pretty sure when Howland is revealed, he will be extremely short. I can promise you that.

However that plays out, he will be short.

 

[LegendofJoe]

I know one thing, with all the POVs centered around the North in ADWD I will be sorely disappointed if Howland isn't introduced. He's been alluded to throughout the series, it's time for him to make his grand entrance - bad ass, guerrilla mage style.

 

[Pollux]

I know one thing, with all the POVs centered around the North in ADWD I will be sorely disappointed if Howland isn't introduced. He's been alluded to throughout the series, it's time for him to make his entrance - bad ass, guerrilla mage style.

Don't expect him to be revealed until after ADWD.

As to the Varys/Highgarden scenario...I think Varys is somewhere in Dorne, considering Dorne is the main "kingdom" in Westeros which still supports the return of the Targaryan's, much like Varys. Doran betrothed his daughter to Viserys afterall, probably with the help of Varys.

 

[Emerson]

I would probably bet a hundred bucks that Howland Reed shows up with some sort of significant plot involvement. I wouldn't bet that it'll be in ADWD, nor would I necessarily say he'll be a military force to be reckoned with. I'd love both of those things, but I dunno about them. But he will be important.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

I want to see him too, but I'll bet Howland doesn't make his first appearance until the Winds of Winter. I'd be happy to be wrong though.

 

[Emerson]

Do you guys remember when the "proof video" was made of ADWD being done? They had to shoot a second one because in the first one she accidentally turned randomly to a significant "character reappearance." Any thoughts on who?

Benjen is certainly my main guess.

 

[Enduin]

I really don't see how that could be, considering Ned never mentioned that he was a small guy that looked like a kid.

Not only that but its not like the guy had never been seen before. I would be highly surprised that Maester Luwin nor Rodrik Cassel never saw him. He fought with Ned during the rebellion along with lots of other people, including Rodrick's own brother who died at the Tower of Joy. So I would think theyd have mentioned he looked eternally like a 13 year old boy and would have realized he was actually Jojen if that were actually true.

Also while Howlands no doubt an able fighter, since he was probably the mysterious Knight of the Laughing Tree, in dealing with Ser Arthur Dayne I would assume he just ganked him from behind as he was about to strike a fallen and defeated Ned Stark or something of the like. Making him some magical mystical super being is just too much and not consistent with the series. I think he would be much better as just a wise and crafty but practical and human character. Jojen already has the magical knowledge covered, Howland just needs to offer sage advice and reveal a few secrets like who Jon's mother was, what Lyanna's last wish was and some other shit to help answer some questions and guide a few people on the right path.

 

[LegendofJoe]

I don't understand why you guys (or girls) are so skeptical of the possibility. There are several POVs in ADWD that will be in the vicinity of the Neck. So why is it so unlikely that he'll show up at some point or another?

 

[Emerson]

I do agree, though if it were me I'd step up his craftiness even further. Make him a political force to be reckoned with on the level of Littlefinger and similar people.

Also I wouldn't be surprised, nor would I have a problem with the Reeds having some connection to the Children of the Forest. Even if Howland isn't Jojen, they could still all be immortal or whatever.

I don't understand why you guys (or girls) are so skeptical of the possibility. There are several POVs in ADWD that will be in the vicinity of the Neck. So why is it so unlikely that he'll show up at some point or another?

Here's why:

 

[Advance_Alarm]

Alright, JUST finished A Feast For Crows. A good book, but slow-paced compared to ASOS and with an obvious lack of main characters. Also took much longer to read through ASOS despite it being shorter.

Anyway, I hope someone can help me sort out the ending. What are we supposed to glean from Sam's last chapter? Who are those new people all of a sudden?

most of those characters aren't "new", Marwyn was in AGOT, Jaqen Hgar is that novice, Alleras is one of the Red Viper's daughters

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

most of those characters aren't "new", Marwyn was in AGOT, Jaqen Hgar is that novice, Alleras is one of the Red Viper's daughters

Well I wouldn't say Marwyn was in AGOT, rather he was given a quick mention.

 

[Rubashov]

Varys as Rugen is an interesting theory, but it would be an elaborate deception spanning decades with little benefit. I could see Varys doing it, but I figure Rugen is just a dead patsy.

My guess was that Varys was going to find Dany, but Dorne may be a better choice. There's almost too much convergence around Dany by the end of AFFC. Between Victarion, the Dornish envoy and Marwyn, Dany's story is going to get crowded.

 

[Pollux]

Varys as Rugen is an interesting theory, but it would be an elaborate deception spanning decades with little benefit. I could see Varys doing it, but I figure Rugen is just a dead patsy.

My guess was that Varys was going to find Dany, but Dorne may be a better choice. There's almost too much convergence around Dany by the end of AFFC. Between Victarion, the Dornish envoy and Marwyn, Dany's story is going to get crowded.

Which is why it makes the most sense that he is going to Dorne.

 

[Cornballer]

If you're looking for some reading material, there's a series of articles about The War of the Five Kings over on Tower of the Hand:It's a useful recap of where things stand after the first four books in the series.

- Part 1: Overview
- Part 2: The Starks
- Part 3: The Lannisters
- Part 4: The Baratheons
- Part 5: The Tyrells
- Part 6: The Tullys
- Part 7: The Arryns
- Part 8: The Greyjoys
- Part 9: The Martells
- Part 10: Daenerys

Part 11: The Dothraki

 

[Pollux]

Part 11: The Dothraki

Keep up the good updates Cornballer. Love these.

 

[BeeDog]

most of those characters aren't "new", Marwyn was in AGOT, Jaqen Hgar is that novice, Alleras is one of the Red Viper's daughters

Alright, but what are they playing at near the end of AFfC? From what I can recall, Jaqen (aka "The alchemist") kills Pate in the prologue for some reason, but I don't recall more than that. My question is, has anything been divulged in regards to Marwyn's, Alleras' and Pate's/Jaqen's roles in all of this? Or is it still an unresolved plotline?

 

[Pollux]

Alright, but what are they playing at near the end of AFfC? From what I can recall, Jaqen (aka "The alchemist") kills Pate in the prologue for some reason, but I don't recall more than that. My question is, has anything been divulged in regards to Marwyn's, Alleras' and Pate's/Jaqen's roles in all of this? Or is it still an unresolved plotline?

still all unresolved.

 

[BeeDog]

still all unresolved.

Thanks, then I was paying more attention than I thought.

 

[Pollux]

Thanks, then I was paying more attention than I thought.

But I would guess that something important is going to happen in that plotline...we wouldn't be following a Faceless Man around for no reason. Also this is the one who directed Arya to Braavos, so I could see him having a more overarching role in the story.

 

[Rubashov]

I'm hoping that Marwyn sheds some more light on the actual "Song of Ice & Fire." He's traveled to the east and should be familiar with the prophecies of Azor Ahai and how it relates to whatever Rhaegar read that made him think it was his destiny.

 

[elrechazado]

So where is Varys?

First off, I think he was the character Rugen - the undergaoler who mysteriously disappeared the night Tywin died and Tyrion escaped. He rarely showed up down in the black cells that he was assigned to and when he did he was "portly, unshaven and gruff" - the same type of person Varys played when he visited Ned down in the black cells.

The last thing he left was an ancient coin belonging to Highgarden. Maybe Varys is leaving a clue to his whereabouts? Qyburn makes it seem as if HG was behind the death of Tywin, which we know is false, so he's playing that to his advantage somehow. But what's the truth of it? Why would Varys leave that behind to be found?

Wait, how do we know that's false, when the queen of thorns poisoned joff?

 

[elrechazado]

Not only that but its not like the guy had never been seen before. I would be highly surprised that Maester Luwin nor Rodrik Cassel never saw him. He fought with Ned during the rebellion along with lots of other people, including Rodrick's own brother who died at the Tower of Joy. So I would think theyd have mentioned he looked eternally like a 13 year old boy and would have realized he was actually Jojen if that were actually true.

Also while Howlands no doubt an able fighter, since he was probably the mysterious Knight of the Laughing Tree, in dealing with Ser Arthur Dayne I would assume he just ganked him from behind as he was about to strike a fallen and defeated Ned Stark or something of the like. Making him some magical mystical super being is just too much and not consistent with the series. I think he would be much better as just a wise and crafty but practical and human character. Jojen already has the magical knowledge covered, Howland just needs to offer sage advice and reveal a few secrets like who Jon's mother was, what Lyanna's last wish was and some other shit to help answer some questions and guide a few people on the right path.

knight of the laughing tree was lyanna.

 

[Pollux]

Wait, how do we know that's false, when the queen of thorns poisoned joff?

Wait Queen of Thorns poisoned Joff? I forgot about that one.

 

[Enduin]

knight of the laughing tree was lyanna.

That wholly remains to be seen.

 

[Pollux]

That wholly remains to be seen.

Bah...we'll agree to disagree...but it was most likely Lyanna. Although if I'm wrong I'll eat crow.

 

[elrechazado]

Wait Queen of Thorns poisoned Joff? I forgot about that one.

When you read littlefinger's explanation to sansa, it's clear that this is what happened yeah.

Obviously the lyanna thing is a guess, but it's a pretty obvious one, and explains a lot about lyanna and rhaegar too.

 

[QueenOfThorns]

I can't wait for the Queen of Thorns to show up in the show. It will be so good.

 

[Enduin]

Bah...we'll agree to disagree...but it was most likely Lyanna. Although if I'm wrong I'll eat crow.

I mean it could be her just as easily, if not more so, but its my hope its not her because its so far fetched. I have a much easier time believing a short 20 something year old crannogman lord beat the best knights in the land and not a 15 year old girl with no combat training whatsoever, especially when said mystery knight spoke to each defeated opponent and told them to teach their squires honor. You would think theyd have realized it was a girl, even if she tried to disguise her voice.

With Reed we at least know that afterwards he had a very successful combat career since he obviously was able enough to fight along side Ned and his companions throughout the entire rebellion and was the only other survivor of the Tower of Joy and the only reason Ned didnt die at the hands of Ser Arthur Dayne, the greatest knight alive, so it wouldnt be so crazy to think he was a skilled enough fighter capable of besting many other knights in a tourney.

Having the Knight of the Laughing Tree be Lyanna just seems silly, its just so far fetched and simply cliche in a way plot wise. But seeing how Howlands alive and Lyannas dead I doubt he'll just announce he was the mystery knight and it will likely be Lyanna instead, despite my hopes its not her. Maybe Martin will outsmart us all and have it be both of them.

 

[elrechazado]

Well, I don't think they were the best knights in the land first of all - I'd have to read again, but also not from major houses. Second, lyanna wasn't untrained. Ned or benjen mentioned how likely she was to be on a horse and with a sword. I just think it's waaaay too obvious that it's howland.

 

[Enduin]

Who the Laughing Tree beat arent named but seeing as the other entrants were Brandon Stark, Barristan Selmy, Bronze Yohn Royce, Arthur Dayne and Prince Rhaegar I would assume they were good enough to think they had a chance against the best knights in the whole realm. This is the same tourney that Jaime Lannister was appointed to the Kingsguard though he was not allowed participate. A tourney at Harrenhal, the largest castle and one of the richest holdings in the 7 kingdoms, isnt gonna be a small affair.

As for Lyanna's training she was good on a horse that was stated for sure, but Ned only remarked that she would have carried a sword had their father allowed it, thats not much of a vouch for her being able to handle one. Plus jousting isnt exactly something you just pick up and are good at.

Having her as the Knight just seems horrendously cheesy to me.

 

[elrechazado]

Who the Laughing Tree beat arent named but seeing as the other entrants were Brandon Stark, Barristan Selmy, Bronze Yohn Royce, Arthur Dayne and Prince Rhaegar I would assume they were good enough to think they had a chance against the best knights in the whole realm. This is the same tourney that Jaime Lannister was appointed to the Kingsguard though he was not allowed participate. A tourney at Harrenhal, the largest castle and one of the richest holdings in the 7 kingdoms, isnt gonna be a small affair.

As for Lyanna's training she was good on a horse that was stated for sure, but Ned only remarked that she would have carried a sword had their father allowed it, thats not much of a vouch for her being able to handle one. Plus jousting isnt exactly something you just pick up and are good at.

Having her as the Knight just seems horrendously cheesy to me.

The hand's tourney had shitty knights too. The frey knights got their asses kicked there left and right. Ser Hugh died and was barely more than a squire. Anyone could enter the lists.

 

[Enduin]

The hand's tourney had shitty knights too. The frey knights got their asses kicked there left and right. Ser Hugh died and was barely more than a squire. Anyone could enter the lists.

True but most of those people dont make it past the first or second round and certainly no one without considerable talent makes it to the final 3 like the Laughing Tree did.