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[Dresden]

I don't think the bath scene was in the book, nor was the scene with her putting the eggs in the brazier and her handmaiden getting burned. I'm pretty sure those were both added for the show. In the book she just likes to hold the eggs at night because she feels heat emanating from them and can sense something inside the stone or some shit. I don't think she puts any eggs in a brazier until the ending

Also, from ADWD:



edit - just checked, the bath scene was in the book. I don't think it's really anything special though. She just likes to take really hot baths

Oh, so they're show-only events. Fun.

 

[blainethemono]

Daenerys:

They filled her bath with hot water brought up from the kitchen and scented it with fragrant oils. The girl pulled the rough cotton tunic over Dany’s head and helped her into the tub. The water was scalding hot, but Daenerys did not flinch or cry out. She liked the heat. It made her feel clean. Besides, her brother had often told her that it was never too hot for a Targaryen. “Ours is the house of the dragon,” he would say. “The fire is in our blood.”

Catelyn:

That was the way they found them, when Robb and Maester Luwin and Ser Rodrik burst in with half the guards in Winterfell. When the laughter finally died in her throat, they wrapped her in warm blankets and led her back to the Great Keep, to her own chambers. Old Nan undressed her and helped her into a scalding hot bath and washed the blood off her with a soft cloth.

Catelyn is a secret targ confirmed

 

[Eidan]

Fair enough on the bath. I couldn't remember if the eggs scene was or was not included in the book.

 

[Basileus777]

The first book repeatedly drills in the idea that Dany isn't harmed by fire.

It's mentioned in the beginning with her baths being hotter than most can tolerate. She is capable of touching the eggs as they have sat on burning coals. When Viserys is killed it is said that fire cannot harm the dragon, alluding to the idea that Dany is the true "Dragon", and Viserys is not. This all before the funeral pyre, and before ADWD.

It doesn't matter how you choose to interpret that when we have the word of god saying Dany isn't immune to fire. Maybe he changed his mind when writing ADWD, but her tolerance to hot water doesn't hold the significance you are attaching to it.

 

[John Dunbar]

Also, if Daenerys was actually immune to fire, why would she duck Drogon's flames? Seems kinda pointless. I would also have expected her to test her magical powers with a candle at some point just to be sure.

 

[Yonafunu]

Regardless, Jon would be half Targaryen. Seeing as his hair is not silver/gold, and he doesn't have violet eyes, I'd say the Targaryen blood in him isn't very strong. Even if Targaryens are immune to fire, that doesn't mean Jon should be as well.

 

[blainethemono]

Fair enough on the bath. I couldn't remember if the eggs scene was or was not included in the book.

I think I found the passage you're talking about. I half remembered it too but I didn't think the other girl got burned or anything

Was it madness that seized her then, born of fear? Or some strange wisdom buried in her blood? Dany could not have said. She heard her own voice saying, “Ser Jorah, light the brazier.”
“Khaleesi?” The knight looked at her strangely. “It is so hot. Are you certain?”
She had never been so certain. “Yes. I … I have a chill. Light the brazier.”
He bowed. “As you command.”
When the coals were afire, Dany sent Ser Jorah from her. She had to be alone to do what she must do. This is madness, she told herself as she lifted the black-and-scarlet egg from the velvet. It will only crack and burn, and it’s so beautiful, Ser Jorah will call me a fool if I ruin it, and yet, and yet …
Cradling the egg with both hands, she carried it to the fire and pushed it down amongst the burning coals. The black scales seemed to glow as they drank the heat. Flames licked against the stone with small red tongues. Dany placed the other two eggs beside the black one in the fire. As she stepped back from the brazier, the breath trembled in her throat.
She watched until the coals had turned to ashes. Drifting sparks floated up and out of the smokehole. Heat shimmered in waves around the dragon’s eggs. And that was all.
Your brother Rhaegar was the last dragon, Ser Jorah had said. Dany gazed at her eggs sadly. What had she expected? A thousand thousand years ago they had been alive, but now they were only pretty rocks. They could not make a dragon. A dragon was air and fire. Living flesh, not dead stone.
The brazier was cold again by the time Khal Drogo returned. Cohollo was leading a packhorse behind him, with the carcass of a great white lion slung across its back. Above, the stars were coming out. The khal laughed as he swung down off his stallion and showed her the scars on his leg where the hrakkar had raked him through his leggings. “I shall make you a cloak of its skin, moon of my life,” he swore.

 

[Eidan]

It doesn't matter how you choose to interpret that when we have the word of god saying Dany isn't immune to fire. Maybe he changed his mind when writing ADWD, but her tolerance to hot water doesn't hold the significance you are attaching to it.

I'll let it go. It's probably because of how it was portrayed on the show (I watched the first season before reading the first book), that the idea became so ingrained in my head.

EDIT: A scene like this.

 

[Crisco]

As I've said before, I don't think Targaryen blood is all that special. They burn, bleed, and die just like anyone else. Of the Targs we know of, the most "special" one was Bloodraven, and he was half Blackwood.

 

[Basileus777]

I'll let it go. It's probably because of how it was portrayed on the show (I watched the first season before reading the first book), that the idea became so ingrained in my head.

EDIT: A scene like this.

Yeah, the show certainly implies that Dany is always resistant to heat/fire.

 

[Trojita]

As I've said before, I don't think Targaryen blood is all that special. They burn, bleed, and die just like anyone else. Of the Targs we know of, the most "special" one was Bloodraven, and he was half Blackwood.

Some Targaryens and Blackfires have had premonitory dreams.

 

[PhoenixDark]

The pyre thing was a magic event and thus a one shot. I don't believe Dany can be killed by her own dragons' fire either, which would explain the dragon pit/arena.

Does that mean Dany couldn't be killed by a pot of molten gold? I don't know, I kind of think she'd die. I can buy Targs having a generally higher threshold for heat compared to other people, although the same could apply to other Valyria families too. Didn't the Faceless Men slave descendants mine in super hot caves without dying of the heat?

 

[lingiii]

The pyre thing was a magic event and thus a one shot. I don't believe Dany can be killed by her own dragons' fire either, which would explain the dragon pit/arena.

Does that mean Dany couldn't be killed by a pot of molten gold? I don't know, I kind of think she'd die. I can buy Targs having a generally higher threshold for heat compared to other people, although the same could apply to other Valyria families too. Didn't the Faceless Men slave ancestors mine in super hot caves without dying of the heat?

fixed that for ya.

I think all Dany's flame tolerance applies strictly to her, not to Targaryens widely. Cuz she's the Prince that was Promised. Or: she just hasn't been around enough fire to actually kill her? Shit I don't know I wasn't there I never saw how big that funeral pyre was.

Also she wears Plot Armor.

 

[Wh0 N0se]

Also she wears Plot Armor.

But for how long?
Does anyone still think she'll end up on the Iron Throne? Especially after what GRRM said recently about people being surprised who ends up on it.

 

[Doublesith]

Martin's website finally got redesigned:

http://www.georgerrmartin.com/

I'm going to miss the old one.

Wow. So many memories...

 

[CorvoSol]

But if the pyre was a once in a life-time deal, then how come Dany touched the eggs and her hand was fine?

Also: Dragonfire is supposed to be different from regular old fire, isn't it? It's supposed to be hot enough that it melted the stones of Harrenhal. I imagine her getting burned by dragon fire would be somewhat different from her getting burned by regular fire.

 

[Basileus777]

But if the pyre was a once in a life-time deal, then how come Dany touched the eggs and her hand was fine?

We just discussed this. It only happened that way in the TV series.

 

[CrunchyB]

As I've said before, I don't think Targaryen blood is all that special. They burn, bleed, and die just like anyone else. Of the Targs we know of, the most "special" one was Bloodraven, and he was half Blackwood.

Targaryens may not be inherently magical creatures, but it's been implied that they have some qualities not normally found in other men. Same with the Starks and several other old houses, such as the ancient Blackwoods.

Aside from (most likely) Jon, Bloodraven is the only other child from a true blood First Men/Targaryen union.

To put it in another way;

If Jon is going to sing The Song of Ice and Fire, Bloodraven first whistled the tune.

 

[electroshockwave]

Regardless, Jon would be half Targaryen. Seeing as his hair is not silver/gold, and he doesn't have violet eyes, I'd say the Targaryen blood in him isn't very strong. Even if Targaryens are immune to fire, that doesn't mean Jon should be as well.

The Valyrian/Targ traits might be recessive for the lack of a better term. Wasn't the first Baratheon storm lord Aegon the conqueror's bastard brother? And that whole line is noted for their coal black hair.

 

[CorvoSol]

We just discussed this. It only happened that way in the TV series.

Ah, well, there's that, then.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Regardless, Jon would be half Targaryen. Seeing as his hair is not silver/gold, and he doesn't have violet eyes, I'd say the Targaryen blood in him isn't very strong. Even if Targaryens are immune to fire, that doesn't mean Jon should be as well.

I don't think that Targaryen appearances (e: or other inherited characteristics for that matter) necessarily trump everything else anyways. Robert Baratheon's "legitimate" claim to the Iron Throne (and Stannis's by extension) exists because he and his brothers were 1/4 Targaryen (e: since their grandmother was a legitimate Targaryen), but in AGOT its a huge plot point how dominant the Baratheon look is over anything else, apparently including the Targaryen look. It's perfectly possible Jon could be 1/2 Targaryen and look nothing like a Targaryen.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

The Valyrian/Targ traits might be recessive for the lack of a better term. Wasn't the first Baratheon storm lord Aegon the conqueror's bastard brother? And that whole line is noted for their coal black hair.

And there were many mainline Targaryen's with dark hair. At least one of Egg's brothers had dark hair, and his uncle (who was supposed to be king).

 

[CrunchyB]

The Valyrian/Targ traits might be recessive for the lack of a better term. Wasn't the first Baratheon storm lord Aegon the conqueror's bastard brother? And that whole line is noted for their coal black hair.

Yes, and he married the Storm Lord's daughter. Another family of badasses, Robert, Renly and Stannis were/are all remarkable people.

It's a recurring theme in the book, old families all have some innate qualities that helped them survive through the ages. Sometimes a generation may produce a dud, but the pattern is clear.

 

[Basileus777]

I don't think that Targaryen appearances necessarily trump everything else anyways. Robert Baratheon's "legitimate" claim to the Iron Throne (and Stannis's by extension) exists because he and his brothers were 1/4 Targaryen, but in AGOT its a huge plot point how dominant the Baratheon look is over anything else, apparently including the Targaryen look. It's perfectly possible Jon could be 1/2 Targaryen and look nothing like a Targaryen.

You don't even need to speculate, there are legitimate Targaryens that look like Martells in the Hedge Knight. Without inbreeding, Targ traits don't seem to show.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

I think GRRM's statement about a "once in a lifetime" thing was ambiguous, might have been about the dragon's hatching as much as the fire immunity.

Dany is at very least heat resistant-- the bath doesn't affect her at all, nor does she even notice how hot it is.

 

[Angry Grimace]

I think GRRM's statement about a "once in a lifetime" thing was ambiguous, might have been about the dragon's hatching as much as the fire immunity.

Dany is at very least heat resistant-- the bath doesn't affect her at all, nor does she even notice how hot it is.

Yes she did; she just likes hot baths.

 

[tmdorsey]

But for how long?
Does anyone still think she'll end up on the Iron Throne? Especially after what GRRM said recently about people being surprised who ends up on it.

Sansa sits the Iron Throne confirmed.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

Sansa sits the Iron Throne confirmed.

I would be fine with this.

 

[CorvoSol]

Sansa sits the Iron Throne confirmed.

Arya or bust.

 

[Forsaken82]

Also, if Daenerys was actually immune to fire, why would she duck Drogon's flames? Seems kinda pointless. I would also have expected her to test her magical powers with a candle at some point just to be sure.

Perhaps Dragon Fire works differently than natural fires?

 

[chiQ]

If GRRM wouldn't misuse the word 'scald' none of this would be a problem. If the water was actually scalding hot it would do damage.

 

[Wh0 N0se]

Let's be honest, he's either changed his mind or he forgot what he said. I doubt it's that big a plot point really, the dragons didn't attack Brown Ben Plumm so assuming Jon and whomever the other 'head' is have a drop or two of Targ blood then the Dragons won't burn them anyway.

I can't see Dany being attacked by them again either.

 

[John Dunbar]

Let's be honest, he's either changed his mind or he forgot what he said. I doubt it's that big a plot point really, the dragons didn't attack Brown Ben Plumm so assuming Jon and whomever the other 'head' is have a drop or two of Targ blood then the Dragons won't burn them anyway.

I can't see Dany being attacked by them again either.

Still doesn't explain why her hands were burned at the end of A Dance With Dragons.

Also, she also seems to think Targaryens can't get sick, but she didn't seem too fucking well at the end there. Conclusion: she's another batshit crazy Targ and Barristan needs to kill her before the end.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

Still doesn't explain why her hands were burned at the end of A Dance With Dragons.

Also, she also seems to think Targaryens can't get sick, but she didn't seem too fucking well at the end there. Conclusion: she's another batshit crazy Targ and Barristan needs to kill her before the end.

I would be fine with this.

 

[Yonafunu]

I don't think that Targaryen appearances (e: or other inherited characteristics for that matter) necessarily trump everything else anyways. Robert Baratheon's "legitimate" claim to the Iron Throne (and Stannis's by extension) exists because he and his brothers were 1/4 Targaryen (e: since their grandmother was a legitimate Targaryen), but in AGOT its a huge plot point how dominant the Baratheon look is over anything else, apparently including the Targaryen look. It's perfectly possible Jon could be 1/2 Targaryen and look nothing like a Targaryen.

You don't even need to speculate, there are legitimate Targaryens that look like Martells in the Hedge Knight. Without inbreeding, Targ traits don't seem to show.

The Valyrian/Targ traits might be recessive for the lack of a better term. Wasn't the first Baratheon storm lord Aegon the conqueror's bastard brother? And that whole line is noted for their coal black hair.

But this could also mean that whatever 'special traits' the Targaryens would possibly have, Jon wouldn't possess, because he's a halfblood.
So Jon not being immune to fire shouldn't be a reason to disregard the R+L=J theory, which is what Corvosol originally asked, and I responded to.

 

[Crisco]

Still doesn't explain why her hands were burned at the end of A Dance With Dragons.

Also, she also seems to think Targaryens can't get sick, but she didn't seem too fucking well at the end there. Conclusion: she's another batshit crazy Targ and Barristan needs to kill her before the end.

She was pregnant. Not sick.

 

[Tenrius]

What are the chances of Tyrion taking the Iron throne? It would certainly be surprising and fitting, I think.

 

[Angry Grimace]

What are the chances of Tyrion taking the Iron throne? It would certainly be surprising and fitting, I think.

0?

 

[Forsaken82]

What are the chances of Tyrion taking the Iron throne? It would certainly be surprising and fitting, I think.

Surprising would be neither Lannister, Targaryan or Stark take the throne in my opinion.

Theon Greyjoy for the Iron throne. Now THAT is surprising

 

[timetokill]

You guys are wrong. It's Rickon on the Throne. A new age of terror begins.

 

[daripad]

Surprising would be neither Lannister, Targaryan or Stark take the throne in my opinion.

Theon Greyjoy for the Iron throne. Now THAT is surprising

Theon would be the best king ever

Spoiler

No

 

[Angry Grimace]

Where does the throne would go by rights if Stannis, Dany and Aegon all die?

 

[Tenrius]

Where does the throne would go by rights if Stannis, Dany and Aegon all die?

Copyright limbo, I guess.

 

[daripad]

Where does the throne would go by rights if Stannis, Dany and Aegon all die?

Shireen?

Spoiler

And Patchface as her husband

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

Where does the throne would go by rights if Stannis, Dany and Aegon all die?

Shireen.

After that, it gets tricky. If you consider the Stannis line, the next would probably be one of the Estermonts, since they're his cousins from his maternal side, and I suppose Arianne and Trystane would have a claim through being Aegon's cousins, but we're getting into people who are pretty far removed from actual royal lines at this point.

 

[Summary Man]

Where does the throne would go by rights if Stannis, Dany and Aegon all die?

Stays with Tommen.

 

[blainethemono]

Strangely I think i'd be okay with Shireen on the throne. Patchface as fool and Hand

 

[Forsaken82]

Shireen.

After that, it gets tricky. If you consider the Stannis line, the next would probably be one of the Estermonts, since they're his cousins from his maternal side, and I suppose Arianne and Trystane would have a claim through being Aegon's cousins, but we're getting into people who are pretty far removed from actual royal lines at this point.

What about Edric Storm? Robert's bastard that Davos hid from melisandre? Not to mention, I am sure Gendry has a role to play in this somewhere down the road... they have made it to big of an issue to simply not address any of the surviving baratheon bastards.

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

What about Edric Storm? Robert's bastard that Davos hid from melisandre? Not to mention, I am sure Gendry has a role to play in this somewhere down the road... they have made it to big of an issue to simply not address any of the surviving baratheon bastards.

They could only inherit if they were legitimized, and a bastard can only be legitimized by royal decree. Stannis could choose to legitimize Edric Storm if he wanted to, but if he died without doing that, Edric could never inherit.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Where does the throne would go by rights if Stannis, Dany and Aegon all die?

Whoever takes it and has the biggest army to hold it.