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[Basileus777]

The world building in ASOIAF isn't really realistic, GRRM basically dialed everything up to make everything bigger and more fantastical in scale. A lot of thing are done for writer's convenience (ie lack of cities). And one of the more important elements of the series, the weather cycle, is mostly hand-waived away when it comes to how the world is constructed, even though in reality those seasons would have created lifeforms and civilizations completely alien to our medieval world.

 

[apana]

The world building in ASOIAF isn't really realistic, GRRM basically dialed everything up to make everything bigger and more fantastical in scale. A lot of thing are done for writer's convenience (ie lack of cities). And one of the more important elements of the series, the weather cycle, is mostly hand-waived away when it comes to how the world is constructed, even though in reality those seasons would have created lifeforms and civilizations completely alien to our medieval world.

Perhaps, it depends on when it started, how far it reaches, and how evolution works on that planet. Humans and other animals could have already evolved before the seasons started shifting like this. As for the scale, yes George is not always accurate about time and distances. Simply put, more time should have elapsed in the storyline. Though what is most unbelievable is that Bran a crippled boy along with his large companion and two other kids is able to make it all the way across a cold and dangerous North to get all the way to the Wall. It was also kind of silly when George was describing North of the Wall. He said that some of the mountain ranges were like the Himalayas, which made me shake my head. I haven't seen anything like that indicated on maps. You would probably be able to see such mountains from the wall itself and it would radically affect the climate of Westeros. Though I do think, Iceland, while alien and beautiful does not look like beyond the wall. Or at least it doesn't look like the area where Jon was in the book.

 

[A More Normal Bird]

Stuff like this is why I think the size descriptors of Westeros and it's land masses are completely screwed up. The continent is supposedly pretty massive, but you wouldn't guess by the amount of time it takes people to travel it. Characters seem to have no trouble traversing literally thousands of miles on horseback.

In my mind I imagine Westeros being about the size of California. Mabe that's way too small, but it makes much more sense in the context of the story. Like you said, Skagos is about the size of Ireland. I think that's pretty ridiculous, to tell the truth.

The world building in ASOIAF isn't really realistic, GRRM basically dialed everything up to make everything bigger and more fantastical in scale. A lot of thing are done for writer's convenience (ie lack of cities). And one of the more important elements of the series, the weather cycle, is mostly hand-waived away when it comes to how the world is constructed, even though in reality those seasons would have created lifeforms and civilizations completely alien to our medieval world.

Yep. The continents are also basically rectangles, the mountains tend to be in clumps rather than ranges, everyone speaks the same language and a lot of the environments/climates don't make much sense given their topography. It's pretty impressive how much the writing overcomes these things in terms of making the world believable. That said, I think the crazy seasons do serve as a bit of an explanation for the low population density and lack of cities. The world's still too big though. I think California size is a little too small (esp. considering the difference in climate between north and south) but it could do to scale down a fair bit.

 

[endlessflood]

The world building in ASOIAF isn't really realistic, GRRM basically dialed everything up to make everything bigger and more fantastical in scale. A lot of thing are done for writer's convenience (ie lack of cities). And one of the more important elements of the series, the weather cycle, is mostly hand-waived away when it comes to how the world is constructed, even though in reality those seasons would have created lifeforms and civilizations completely alien to our medieval world.

Yeah, there's magic and dragons and people rising from the dead. The clumping of mountains or progression of seasons are the last things people should be getting hooked up on

 

[PhoenixDark]

Pretty interesting article listing some of the most anticipated TWOW storylines

The Winds of Winter: 12 Major Plot Points to Anticipate
http://the-artifice.com/the-winds-of-winter-12-major-plot-points-to-anticipate/

It mirrors my #1 most anticipated arc

 

[Joni]

The seasons seem strange, but the world of Westeros is actually having miniature ice ages. Considering Westeros is based on medieval Europe, it wouldn't be strange for Martin to mimic the Little Ice Age that occured in that period. It was marked by three very long, cold winters with warming in between. Winter in Westeros is actually a cold period in that miniature ice age and not a season.

 

[Steelyuhas]

Pretty interesting article listing some of the most anticipated TWOW storylines

The Winds of Winter: 12 Major Plot Points to Anticipate
http://the-artifice.com/the-winds-of-winter-12-major-plot-points-to-anticipate/

It mirrors my #1 most anticipated arc

Agreed on #1.

Davos at #11 would be much higher for me, and the only reason I'm interested in the battle of Meereen is so that part of the story can be finished with one way or another.

Good list though. Book should come out now, thanks George!

 

[curlyfriski]

Pretty interesting article listing some of the most anticipated TWOW storylines

The Winds of Winter: 12 Major Plot Points to Anticipate
http://the-artifice.com/the-winds-of-winter-12-major-plot-points-to-anticipate/

It mirrors my #1 most anticipated arc

So what percentage of these will never happen? I'm going to be generous and say 33%.

The world building in ASOIAF isn't really realistic, GRRM basically dialed everything up to make everything bigger and more fantastical in scale. A lot of thing are done for writer's convenience (ie lack of cities). And one of the more important elements of the series, the weather cycle, is mostly hand-waived away when it comes to how the world is constructed, even though in reality those seasons would have created lifeforms and civilizations completely alien to our medieval world.

The weather cycle should be important if we ever see the extra-long winter that's been hinted at since the beginning and everybody starves to death because they haven't had a harvest in a decade. Although I wonder if it'll happen at this point. When I first started reading I assumed the books would eventually reach a second Long Night, but with five books done and winter barely started I don't know how that would work at this point.

 

[iirate]

Pretty interesting article listing some of the most anticipated TWOW storylines

The Winds of Winter: 12 Major Plot Points to Anticipate
http://the-artifice.com/the-winds-of-winter-12-major-plot-points-to-anticipate/

It mirrors my #1 most anticipated arc

Pretty good list, but it's missing the Cleagne brothers reunion, which stands pretty damn high on my list.

 

[Blue Ninja]

Pretty interesting article listing some of the most anticipated TWOW storylines

The Winds of Winter: 12 Major Plot Points to Anticipate
http://the-artifice.com/the-winds-of-winter-12-major-plot-points-to-anticipate/

It mirrors my #1 most anticipated arc

Man, I want book 6 to get here already.

 

[A More Normal Bird]

Yeah, there's magic and dragons and people rising from the dead. The clumping of mountains or progression of seasons are the last things people should be getting hooked up on

Sorry, but this sort of thing is pretty annoying. The presence of supernatural elements in a story doesn't magically (lol) justify everything that stretches willing suspension of disbelief. It's not a cartoon, it's perfectly fine to point out that the characters travel at the speed of plot or that the world seems too big. This is a series where each of the books have about forty pages of names and titles at the end: people are going to get hooked up on things, and it's not like it was a particularly heated or critical discussion anyway. Also, the seasons also play a pretty big part in the story, so I'm not sure why you think people shouldn't pay attention to them - don't worry, there'll be plenty of time to discuss every aspect of the series. I'm sure by 2016 most of the discussion will be about screencaps of the show and what the handwriting on the letter sent to Jon implies for the still unreleased TWoW.

The seasons seem strange, but the world of Westeros is actually having miniature ice ages. Considering Westeros is based on medieval Europe, it wouldn't be strange for Martin to mimic the Little Ice Age that occured in that period. It was marked by three very long, cold winters with warming in between. Winter in Westeros is actually a cold period in that miniature ice age and not a season.

I'm pretty sure Martin has said there's magic involved. Do we know if the years long summers and winters contain their own fluctuations that more closely mimic regular seasons?

 

[endlessflood]

Sorry, but this sort of thing is pretty annoying. The presence of supernatural elements in a story doesn't magically (lol) justify everything that stretches willing suspension of disbelief. It's not a cartoon, it's perfectly fine to point out that the characters travel at the speed of plot or that the world seems too big. This is a series where each of the books have about forty pages of names and titles at the end: people are going to get hooked up on things, and it's not like it was a particularly heated or critical discussion anyway. Also, the seasons also play a pretty big part in the story, so I'm not sure why you think people shouldn't pay attention to them - don't worry, there'll be plenty of time to discuss every aspect of the series. I'm sure by 2016 most of the discussion will be about screencaps of the show and what the handwriting on the letter sent to Jon implies for the still unreleased TWoW.

I wasn't saying that people shouldn't discuss that stuff or it wasn't important, just pointing out that they're probably setting themselves up for disappointment given the nature of the stories

 

[zon]

Man, I want book 6 to get here already.

You and me both.

 

[A More Normal Bird]

I wasn't saying that people shouldn't discuss that stuff or it wasn't important, just pointing out that they're probably setting themselves up for disappointment given the nature of the stories

Well, I definitely agree that anyone expecting the author to drastically revise the figures given for population and area in a series that's been going for close to two decades would be setting themselves up for disappointment! I don't agree that it's due to the nature of the story though, because one of its defining features is the juxtaposition between the 'gritty/realistic' historical elements and political machinations and the more fantastical elements. It's not LoTR, where we accept that the bad guy lives in an area surrounded by a square of mountains just because. I think a lot of those things, like the common language and currency and lack of cities are due to convenience, like Basileus said, and others are probably due to Martin taking a 'near enough is good enough' approach. He may have also wanted to make his series seem a little grander, but I don't think the Wall would have been any less fantastical if it was only one hundred miles long as opposed to three. As I mentioned above though, these are really only niggles. They'd probably get less notice if there wasn't so much time between books.

 

[Dysun]

No TV show for a year, No new books for X amount of years
Sigh I need a fix, might have to get around to reading the last Dunk and Egg

 

[CrashBandicoot]

No TV show for a year, No new books for X amount of years
Sigh I need a fix, might have to get around to reading the last Dunk and Egg

Am I right in thinking there's a joint book coming out soon with all the ones so far in it? I really can't be bothered with all the anthologies.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Seasons being tied to "magic" doesn't make it a cop out from Martin. It seems pretty clear that the seasons/weather have something to do with dragons, the Doom, and perhaps the Wall; we can't really critique this until the series is finished.

It definitely seems like the seasons have something to do with the stagnation of technology in the series. Long ass winters that kill off the old and young seems like the perfect way to restrict the advancement if societies.

 

[Basileus777]

It definitely seems like the seasons have something to do with the stagnation of technology in the series. Long ass winters that kill off the old and young seems like the perfect way to restrict the advancement if societies.

The seasons sure are a convenient world building device. You can justify things like this with them, but ignore all the larger consequences they would have on the world and a society.

 

[PhoenixDark]

The seasons sure are a convenient world building device. You can justify things like this with them, but ignore all the larger consequences they would have on the world and a society.

Convienent sure, and also one of the more logical ways to deal with the "endless medieval period" fantasy trope. I'd rather have that than another "they just haven't discovered gun powder yet" explanation/excuse.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

The relative stasis of tech advancement over thousands of years is my only issue. They casually refer to things that happened that long ago, and even have some books and writings from then, but basically not much has changed in all that time.

I'd find hundreds of years more believable than thousands.

 

[CrashBandicoot]

The relative stasis of tech advancement over thousands of years is my only issue. They casually refer to things that happened that long ago, and even have some books and writings from then, but basically not much has changed in all that time.

I'd find hundreds of years more believable than thousands.

I suppose that issue could tie in with the seasons. If almost all their progress was totally halted by the weather while everyone was busy struggling to survive the years long winters maybe it'd slow development down.

 

[LegendofJoe]

I think the show, if filmed out entirely, would last 9 seasons. That gives GRRM a little less than 6 years to finish the last two books. If he's truly going to get in done in 7 books and beat the show to the punch Winds will release no later than the beginning of 2015, with Dreams coming 4 years later at the beginning of 2019.

 

[Basileus777]

I'm not even sure they'll get 9 seasons. 7 or 8 sounds like the more reasonable maximum. And they'll be done with TWOW material in 3 or 4 more seasons. GRRM has no chance. He'll have to work just to get TWOW out in time.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

I suppose that issue could tie in with the seasons. If almost all their progress was totally halted by the weather while everyone was busy struggling to survive the years long winters maybe it'd slow development down.

The Summer Isles ought to have spacecraft by now.


Hell, maybe they do, and they laugh at all the dopes up in the North!

 

[CrashBandicoot]

The Summer Isles ought to have spacecraft by now.


Hell, maybe they do, and they laugh at all the dopes up in the North!

Maybe that's what the comet in the first two books was

 

[Jack Scofield]

Pretty interesting article listing some of the most anticipated TWOW storylines

The Winds of Winter: 12 Major Plot Points to Anticipate
http://the-artifice.com/the-winds-of-winter-12-major-plot-points-to-anticipate/

It mirrors my #1 most anticipated arc

I feel embarrassing for asking this, since it's only been a few months since I've finished ADWD, but can someone explain this bit?

Ramsay also demanded that Jon swore fealty to House Bolton if he wished to preserve his beloved Night’s Watch, but carelessly highlighted that he was bluffing – although this was unbeknownst to Jon – through commanding Jon to return ‘his Reek’ to him

How does asking for Reek show that Ramsay was bluffing? Ramsay knows that Theon is gone, and he assumes Jon has him. I know I'm missing something obvious, but what?

Like I said, it's embarrassing how quickly I've forgotten some plot points in this series.

 

[Joni]

I feel embarrassing for asking this, since it's only been a few months since I've finished ADWD, but can someone explain this bit?



How does asking for Reek show that Ramsay was bluffing? Ramsay knows that Theon is gone, and he assumes Jon has him. I know I'm missing something obvious, but what?

Like I said, it's embarrassing how quickly I've forgotten some plot points in this series.

Winds of Winter I think:

Spoiler

Theon is with Stannis. If Stannis is defeated, why doesn't he have Reek?

 

[DrForester]

That last Asha chapter kind of ruined the tension there. They could have left it out and Ramsay's letter would do nothing but tell you that Theon and Jeyne did manage to escape after the jumped. Ramsay would have gotten enough from Mance to know what to write.

 

[phazedplasma]

Man that article got me so hyped...to wait two more years

 

[Wh0 N0se]

Man that article got me so hyped...to wait two more years

Yeah, can't wait though.

I seriously did not even consider the possibility that Jaime and Brienne may have fight each other. With Brienne's character arc I could totally see her betraying the oath and refusing to fight him and then they fight Lady Stoneheart instead.

 

[Thai]

I think the show, if filmed out entirely, would last 9 seasons. That gives GRRM a little less than 6 years to finish the last two books. If he's truly going to get in done in 7 books and beat the show to the punch Winds will release no later than the beginning of 2015, with Dreams coming 4 years later at the beginning of 2019.

This is what I think...they are probably going to combine books 4+ 5 into 3 seasons. Cut tons of the fat off, and I'm going to "generously" assume that the last 2 books get 2 seasons each. this will give us something like this:

4 - 2013 - FILMING 2/2 SOS
5 - 2014 - filming 1/3 FFC + DWD
6 - 2015 - filming 2/3 FFC + DWD
7 - 2016 - filming 3/3 FFC + DWD
8 - 2017 - filming 1/2 WoW
9 - 2018 - filming 2/2 Wow
10 - 2019 - filming 1/2 DoS
11 - 2020 - filming 2/2 DoS


That means that by 2016 at the latest, WoW has to be out so that they can start adapting it to film in 2017.

And DoS has to be out by 2018 for the show to start adapting that for TV.

So 5 more years for 2 more books...at the most optimistic. He's not going to make it.

 

[Trasher]

I feel embarrassing for asking this, since it's only been a few months since I've finished ADWD, but can someone explain this bit?



How does asking for Reek show that Ramsay was bluffing? Ramsay knows that Theon is gone, and he assumes Jon has him. I know I'm missing something obvious, but what?

Like I said, it's embarrassing how quickly I've forgotten some plot points in this series.

Pretty sure it's because Ramsay didn't write the letter.

I think Mance did personally. Hence why the letter uses the term "crows" when referring to the Watch. I forget who, but someone in this thread pointed that out a while ago. It had never occurred to me when I read it though.

This is what I think...they are probably going to combine books 4+ 5 into 3 seasons. Cut tons of the fat off, and I'm going to "generously" assume that the last 2 books get 2 seasons each. this will give us something like this:

2013 - FILMING 2/2 SOS
2014 - filming 1/3 FFC + DWD
2015 - filming 2/3 FFC + DWD
2016 - filming 3/3 FFC + DWD
2017 - filming 1/2 WoW
2018 - filming 2/2 Wow
2019 - filming 1/2 DoS
2020 - filming 2/2 DoS


That means that by 2016 at the latest, WoW has to be out so that they can start adapting it to film in 2017.

And DoS has to be out by 2018 for the show to start adapting that for TV.

So 5 more years for 2 more books...at the most optimistic. He's not going to make it.

Sorry to break it to you, but that timeline is very unlikely I think. If anything, they will be combining books 4 and 5 into one season. They have even already been doing Theon's stuff from those books in this last season. There is just not enough meat in those books that adapts well to the show. I feel like a lot of those storylines will be condensed (Brienne for example).

 

[Thai]

Sorry to break it to you, but that timeline is very unlikely I think. If anything, they will be combining books 4 and 5 into one season. They have even already been doing Theon's stuff from those books in this last season. There is just not enough meat in those books that adapts well to the show. I feel like a lot of those storylines will be condensed (Brienne for example).

That's why I said "at the most optimistic. He's not going to make it."

Pay attention.

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

Pretty interesting article listing some of the most anticipated TWOW storylines

The Winds of Winter: 12 Major Plot Points to Anticipate
http://the-artifice.com/the-winds-of-winter-12-major-plot-points-to-anticipate/

It mirrors my #1 most anticipated arc

My most anticipated arc isn't even on the list. I'm really looking forward to the Oldtown storyline above everything else. But just about everything listed is also very exciting. The Winds of Winter is certainly looking to be a very packed book.

The relative stasis of tech advancement over thousands of years is my only issue. They casually refer to things that happened that long ago, and even have some books and writings from then, but basically not much has changed in all that time.

I'd find hundreds of years more believable than thousands.

There are strong hints in A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons that most of that established history is embellished, and that it hasn't actually been nearly that long. I think this is definitely going to be touched on even more in The Winds of Winter.

 

[Jayof9s]

This is what I think...they are probably going to combine books 4+ 5 into 3 seasons. Cut tons of the fat off, and I'm going to "generously" assume that the last 2 books get 2 seasons each. this will give us something like this:

2013 - FILMING 2/2 SOS
2014 - filming 1/3 FFC + DWD
2015 - filming 2/3 FFC + DWD
2016 - filming 3/3 FFC + DWD
2017 - filming 1/2 WoW
2018 - filming 2/2 Wow
2019 - filming 1/2 DoS
2020 - filming 2/2 DoS


That means that by 2016 at the latest, WoW has to be out so that they can start adapting it to film in 2017.

And DoS has to be out by 2018 for the show to start adapting that for TV.

So 5 more years for 2 more books...at the most optimistic. He's not going to make it.

Didn't one of the main writers/directors already say something along the lines of "we're pretty much half way done now"? I'm honestly expecting:
Season 4 - SOS/FFC/DWD (we've already seen some FFC/DWD stuff in S3 and they've covered more than half of SOS from what I recall)
Season 5 - FFC/DWD w/ some WOW
Season 6 - WOW
Season 7 - DoS
*Minimal

Maybe an 8th season with seasons 6/7/8 split between WOW/DOS but I don't see them doing 9 and especially not 10+.

Without published books they're going to have a lot more freedom on how they get from point A to B and I expect they'll cut a lot of fat and end the series concisely. And I'll be shocked if Martin gets even one book out before they've finished airing the series and I think anyone that thinks he'll release both before they finish airing is deluding themselves. But crazier things have happened I suppose.

 

[Trasher]

That's why I said "at the most optimistic. He's not going to make it."

Pay attention.

Well I was directly replying to this statement mainly.

This is what I think...they are probably going to combine books 4+ 5 into 3 seasons.

So I was paying attention...

Didn't one of the main writers/directors already say something along the lines of "we're pretty much half way done now"? I'm honestly expecting:
Season 4 - SOS/FFC/DWD (we've already seen some FFC/DWD stuff in S3 and they've covered more than half of SOS from what I recall)
Season 5 - FFC/DWD w/ some WOW
Season 6 - WOW
Season 7 - DoS
*Minimal

This is the most likely scenario. I'm really hoping they change it from seven to eight season though like you were saying. WoW sounds like it will be quite massive, so if we could get two season out of that I would be happy. Then they can wrap up the last book in the final season hopefully.

 

[Steelyuhas]

Didn't one of the main writers/directors already say something along the lines of "we're pretty much half way done now"? I'm honestly expecting:
Season 4 - SOS/FFC/DWD (we've already seen some FFC/DWD stuff in S3 and they've covered more than half of SOS from what I recall)
Season 5 - FFC/DWD w/ some WOW
Season 6 - WOW
Season 7 - DoS
*Minimal

Maybe an 8th season with seasons 6/7/8 split between WOW/DOS but I don't see them doing 9 and especially not 10+.

Without published books they're going to have a lot more freedom on how they get from point A to B and I expect they'll cut a lot of fat and end the series concisely. And I'll be shocked if Martin gets even one book out before they've finished airing the series and I think anyone that thinks he'll release both before they finish airing is deluding themselves. But crazier things have happened I suppose.

Yeah this seems like a pretty accurate season layout.

 

[Jack Scofield]

Isn't it possible that the show and book could end differently? It's not exactly unheard of. Maybe some major story beats will be the same, but I could see the show taking an entirely different direction in the absence of books 6 and 7.

I would honestly prefer that. It would lead to a lot of interesting discussions, at least.

 

[Trasher]

Isn't it possible that the show and book could end differently? It's not exactly unheard of. Maybe some major story beats will be the same, but I could see the show taking an entirely different direction in the absence of books 6 and 7.

I would honestly prefer that. It would lead to a lot of interesting discussions, at least.

At this point I think it's a very real possibility.

 

[CassSept]

Isn't it possible that the show and book could end differently? It's not exactly unheard of. Maybe some major story beats will be the same, but I could see the show taking an entirely different direction in the absence of books 6 and 7.

I would honestly prefer that. It would lead to a lot of interesting discussions, at least.

That's what I'm thinking will happen. Several arcs will be cut to reduce confusion and character volume, everything will be more simplified as the story goes and the end will be different, though similar, with general outcome and the grand finale being the same as in the books (and also serve as a tease of what's to come for us book readers).

I'm ok with this as long as it doesn't go full retard like Fullmetal Alchemist and it turns out Westeros is parallel India and Daenerys was Mahatma Gandhi or whatever.

 

[A More Normal Bird]

Didn't one of the main writers/directors already say something along the lines of "we're pretty much half way done now"? I'm honestly expecting:
Season 4 - SOS/FFC/DWD (we've already seen some FFC/DWD stuff in S3 and they've covered more than half of SOS from what I recall)
Season 5 - FFC/DWD w/ some WOW
Season 6 - WOW
Season 7 - DoS
*Minimal

Maybe an 8th season with seasons 6/7/8 split between WOW/DOS but I don't see them doing 9 and especially not 10+.

Without published books they're going to have a lot more freedom on how they get from point A to B and I expect they'll cut a lot of fat and end the series concisely. And I'll be shocked if Martin gets even one book out before they've finished airing the series and I think anyone that thinks he'll release both before they finish airing is deluding themselves. But crazier things have happened I suppose.

There's a chance that it takes them a little longer to get through the Feast/Dance stuff, in which case TWoW might not wrap up until S7 (probably with some DoS woven in). This is assuming that TWoW is the door-stopper most are expecting; it does happen to have two massive battles at its beginning, one of which could be brought forward to amp up a season of more sedate material from ADwD. It's a little hard to predict how Feast/Dance will be handled though, because we've already seen that some fairly major changes are being made with things like Asha's rescue mission.

 

[apana]

I think Winds of Winter will likely be two seasons, didn't George say it was going to be like 1500 pages or something?

Anyways kind of random but I was just watching the Game of Thrones panel with James Cosmo (Jeor Mormont) and Natalie Dormer (Margaery Tyrell). I noticed Natalie is a very intense lady. Like I would actually be kind of scared to make a joke around her. Of course the odds of me ever getting to talk to her are below zero, just saying.

 

[PhoenixDark]

I feel embarrassing for asking this, since it's only been a few months since I've finished ADWD, but can someone explain this bit?



How does asking for Reek show that Ramsay was bluffing? Ramsay knows that Theon is gone, and he assumes Jon has him. I know I'm missing something obvious, but what?

Like I said, it's embarrassing how quickly I've forgotten some plot points in this series.

Minor TWOW spoiler:

Spoiler

Many early TWOW chapters were meant for ADWD, including Theon's. In that chapter, Stannis takes control a tower alongside a Dreadfort maester and his ravens; the ravens can only go to Winterfell. It's generally believed that Stannis must have won the upcoming battle on the frozen lake, then sent a letter to Winterfell claiming that he was defeated/killed. The ruse would allow Stannis and Manderly's men to be admitted into Winterfell, at which point they sack it.

I don't think Ramsay is "bluffing" per se about Theon. He might genuinely think that Theon escaped, or perhaps Stannis' letter to Winterfell mentioned that Theon was not found.

 

[Steelyuhas]

There's a chance that it takes them a little longer to get through the Feast/Dance stuff, in which case TWoW might not wrap up until S7 (probably with some DoS woven in). This is assuming that TWoW is the door-stopper most are expecting; it does happen to have two massive battles at its beginning, one of which could be brought forward to amp up a season of more sedate material from ADwD. It's a little hard to predict how Feast/Dance will be handled though, because we've already seen that some fairly major changes are being made with things like Asha's rescue mission.

I think looking at the overall arc of the series (some of this is just my speculation) Feast and Dance will be seen as the transition novels of sorts. After the rolling climaxes of ASOS that wrapped up many of the arcs in the first three novels, Feast and Dance put our characters in place for the final series of climaxes in books six and seven.

I think for a significant number of arcs in this series, it won't be beneficial to drag out the Feast and Dance arcs. The more I think about it and the closer the show gets, the more I'd like to see the show completed with most if not all Feast and Dance arcs by the end of season 5.

As for the seasons it will take for the final two books, of course who knows until we read them, but keep in mind as the characters and plotlines come together again, the pace can quicken. Less separate arcs going on is especially beneficial to the TV show.

 

[Basileus777]

They will be done with most if not all of ADWD by the end of season 5. Some characters are simply too far along in their stories already. Look at Bran, Arya, Asha, Theon, and even Stannis, their plotlines are far along. It's going to be interesting to see how they handle the northern storyline. I wonder if Stannis and Asha meet even before Stannis goes to the wall.

 

[Joni]

They will be done with most if not all of ADWD by the end of season 5. Some characters are simply too far along in their stories already. Look at Bran, Arya, Asha, Theon, and even Stannis, their plotlines are far along. It's going to be interesting to see how they handle the northern storyline. I wonder if Stannis and Asha meet even before Stannis goes to the wall.

They aren't that far in the Stannis storyline. Just like in the book he sulks, he locks up Davos, tries to sacrifice one of the bastards and then is surprised when Davos learns how to read. The show has shown us his decision to go north, but in the book I think he just disappears until the end. We'll see how they handle the battle at Castle Black, but at the moment Stannis is on the right point. Asha only meets Stannis in A Dance with Dragons so I don't know why that would be in the next season
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[Basileus777]

They aren't that far in the Stannis storyline. Just like in the book he sulks, he locks up Davos, tries to sacrifice one of the bastards and then is surprised when Davos learns how to read. The show has shown us his decision to go north, but in the book I think he just disappears until the end. We'll see how they handle the battle at Castle Black, but at the moment Stannis is on the right point. Asha only meets Stannis in A Dance with Dragons so I don't know why that would be in the next season
.

If we go by the books. Stannis has two scenes left at the end of the season, obviously that's not going to happen that way in the show. The reason he would meet Asha is obvious, Asha is sailing in the same direction, when she met him in the books is irrelevant because Asha isn't following the same path. There is no Deepwood Motte and probably no Kingsmoot. Asha and Thein are going to have a plotline next season and Stannis could interact with that before he goes to the Wall. Or maybe Stannis goes to Wall earlier and us there before the big Wildling attack.

 

[Joni]

If we go by the books. Stannis has two scenes left at the end of the season, obviously that's not going to happen that way in the show. The reason he would meet Asha is obvious, Asha is sailing in the same direction, when she met him in the books is irrelevant because Asha isn't following the same path. There is no Deepwood Motte and probably no Kingsmoot. Asha and Thein are going to have a plotline next season and Stannis could interact with that before he goes to the Wall. Or maybe Stannis goes to Wall earlier and us there before the big Wildling attack.

Why wouldn't they have the Kingsmoot and Deepwood Motte? They can have Asha set sail for the Dreadfort, conquering Deepwood Motte on the way and returning to the Iron Isles when she hears the news of her fathers dead.

 

[Basileus777]

Why wouldn't they have the Kingsmoot and Deepwood Motte? They can have Asha set sail for the Dreadfort, conquering Deepwood Motte on the way and returning to the Iron Isles when she hears the news of her fathers dead.

Deepwood Motte being in the show is not going to happen, they aren't going to make another set for a throwaway unimportant location. The Kingsmoot could still potentially take place, but it doesn't make sense to move Asha to the Dreadfort if they were planning on having her go back to the Iron Islands so soon. Their plans for Asha suggest they are restructuring the Ironborn plotline, which is not surprising at all. They can have Asha and Theon have their own plotlines with Stannis and the Boltons, and whatever happens on the Iron Islands can still go on without them. The question is how much of the Euron/Aeron/Victarion stuff they keep in the show. Aeron is probably gone at least.

 

[Reyne]

Why wouldn't they have the Kingsmoot and Deepwood Motte? They can have Asha set sail for the Dreadfort, conquering Deepwood Motte on the way and returning to the Iron Isles when she hears the news of her fathers dead.

If she 'set sail for the Dreadfort' she can scarcely conquer Deepwood Motte on the way because Deepwood is on the west coast while the Dreadfort is some 400 miles away on the other side. The Ironborn thrive near the sea, and for them to realistically launch an assault on the Dreadfort, they'd need to keep their fleet on the east coast.

Well, regardless, I don't think Asha is gonna end up there at any rate...