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[mujun]

I don't think ME 2 is an RPG at all. It's just a shooter.

Is that because shooters have RPG elements in them now (Modern Warfare) or are you just crazy?

 

[ArjanN]

What?

I don't completely agree, but I see where he's coming from. Your decisions in ME2 actually make very little difference on the game overall. Quite often there is only the illusion of choice.

They also toned down inventory management and the character stats and such.

 

[Alex]

What?

Look at all of these buttons for me to push! Wow, so many variables, so many things to tweak.... Oh god, they're just stickers.

People still like to try to convince themselves that the window dressing in the original Mass Effect was functional and in any way well designed. It wasn't, it was a game with an identity crisis and a lot of mechanics suffered from it.

Mass Effect 2 is a consolization done right, Mass Effect was a consolization that was somewhat deluded about being one and put up posters to hide it.

Alpha Protocol, from these remarks and quips doesn't even sound like it belongs on a console for the most part. More akin to that late 90's PC vibe where it's more about self-discovery and choice, which will equal flares of non-linearity and mechanics folks have to learn on their own, which will THEN lead to frustration and RPG AUTO 7 review types.

Which makes it sound far more appealing to me, so I hope for the best.

 

[Axiom]

Enjoying Alpha Protocol on PS3. Gameplay is a bit clumsy and last-gen, but the dialogue system & effect thereof is next-NEXT gen. Bioware really should take note, ME2 is my game of the year, ME is my favourite game this gen but this is taking the 'real decision making' ball and running away with it.
Honestly if ME3 doesn't at least have the time limit on certain dialogue choices that this does, I'm going to be let-down.

The stealth is pretty okay, I generally dislike stealth but I'm not being frustrated by this too much, but again to draw a Mass Effect comparison, it's very much in the first ones vein of 'RPG developer trying their damndest with gameplay they have no experience with, but pulling off everything else to a degree that you forgive a lot of the flaws.
The shooting in the first Mass Effect was better than this though, maybe it's my weapons or the fact I'm not heavily investing in weapon skills but the main reason I'm playing stealthy is because it's so frustrating to get into firefights. Perhaps it's supposed to be, but that doesn't make it fun.

Seriously, damn the camera and cover system sometimes, and the game just crashed on me reminding me that this is indeed an Obsidian game.
I was just about to embark on what I assume was the last mission in the first Asian area, I turn the in-game TV as I head out and there my game goes. I love you guys, I like your game, so stop hitting me Obsidian.

 

[cjtiger300]

Enjoying Alpha Protocol on PS3. Gameplay is a bit clumsy and last-gen, but the dialogue system & effect thereof is next-NEXT gen. Bioware really should take note, ME2 is my game of the year, ME is my favourite game this gen but this is taking the 'real decision making' ball and running away with it.
Honestly if ME3 doesn't at least have the time limit on certain dialogue choices that this does, I'm going to be let-down.

The stealth is pretty okay, I generally dislike stealth but I'm not being frustrated by this too much, but again to draw a Mass Effect comparison, it's very much in the first ones vein of 'RPG developer trying their damndest with gameplay they have no experience with, but pulling off everything else to a degree that you forgive a lot of the flaws.
The shooting in the first Mass Effect was better than this though, maybe it's my weapons or the fact I'm not heavily investing in weapon skills but the main reason I'm playing stealthy is because it's so frustrating to get into firefights. Perhaps it's supposed to be, but that doesn't make it fun.

Seriously, damn the camera and cover system sometimes, and the game just crashed on me reminding me that this is indeed an Obsidian game.
I was just about to embark on what I assume was the last mission in the first Asian area, I turn the in-game TV as I head out and there my game goes. I love you guys, I like your game, so stop hitting me Obsidian.

So, how does the game run on PS3? How is the frame rate and tearing?

I am thinking about picking this up next week for PS3.

 

[Axiom]

Tearing doesn't seem as bad as I saw on a live stream, I think that was of the 360 version, if it's happening on PS3 it's not been too distracting. But granted, that was a video stream and I'm much better on picking up on that stuff watching someone else play.
Framerate is consistent most of the time, but it can be all over the place at seemingly complete random, there's also the occasional long time between texture loading that always pops up in Unreal Engine games, but it's not bad. It's not an amazing looking game, but it's faults are more a lack of bells and whistles than technical issues.

It's technically just fine so far, aside from the aforementioned issues and the game crashing on me. This certainly isn't another PS3 Bayonetta or anything where it actively hinders enjoyment of the game. The game is the only thing actively trying to hinder my enjoyment of the game.

 

[Lafiel]

Look at all of these buttons for me to push! Wow, so many variables, so many things to tweak.... Oh god, they're just stickers.

People still like to try to convince themselves that the window dressing in the original Mass Effect was functional and in any way well designed. It wasn't, it was a game with an identity crisis and a lot of mechanics suffered from it.

Mass Effect 2 is a consolization done right, Mass Effect was a consolization that was somewhat deluded about being one and put up posters to hide it.

Alpha Protocol, from these remarks and quips doesn't even sound like it belongs on a console for the most part. More akin to that late 90's PC vibe where it's more about self-discovery and choice, which will equal flares of non-linearity and mechanics folks have to learn on their own, which will THEN lead to frustration and RPG AUTO 7 review types.

Which makes it sound far more appealing to me, so I hope for the best.

Nailed it.

 

[EDarkness]

What?

Pretty obvious what I meant. I never said anything about it being a good game or not, so don't get defensive, but it's not an RPG, but a shooter.

Look at all of these buttons for me to push! Wow, so many variables, so many things to tweak.... Oh god, they're just stickers.

People still like to try to convince themselves that the window dressing in the original Mass Effect was functional and in any way well designed. It wasn't, it was a game with an identity crisis and a lot of mechanics suffered from it.

Mass Effect 2 is a consolization done right, Mass Effect was a consolization that was somewhat deluded about being one and put up posters to hide it.

Alpha Protocol, from these remarks and quips doesn't even sound like it belongs on a console for the most part. More akin to that late 90's PC vibe where it's more about self-discovery and choice, which will equal flares of non-linearity and mechanics folks have to learn on their own, which will THEN lead to frustration and RPG AUTO 7 review types.

Which makes it sound far more appealing to me, so I hope for the best.

I disagree. I'll admit that the original Mass Effect could have used some tweeking, but it was consolidated down to a basic shooter. I used the same gun from the beginning all the way to end and never had to really upgrade anything (outside of doing things to keep the team alive at the very end). The game had shops that didn't sell anything worthwhile and they could have removed all that stuff and it wouldn't have mattered at all.

Anyway, my roommate picked this up because this sounded like something he wanted Mass Effect 2 to be, so I'll get a chance to try it out in a few days. Sounds interesting, but I've never really liked Obsidian's games. Heh, I'm always willing to give them a shot for some reason, though. Heh, heh.

 

[-tetsuo-]

Pretty obvious what I meant. I never said anything about it being a good game or not, so don't get defensive, but it's not an RPG, but a shooter.




I disagree. I'll admit that the original Mass Effect could have used some tweeking, but it was consolidated down to a basic shooter. I used the same gun from the beginning all the way to end and never had to really upgrade anything (outside of doing things to keep the team alive at the very end). The game had shops that didn't sell anything worthwhile and they could have removed all that stuff and it wouldn't have mattered at all.

Well I used a lot of different guns, and I went to all the shops and explored every area I could so I could unlock new parts and upgrades for me to spend my money and resources on. I also leveled up and distributed ability points on top of the game keeping same dialogue system. I was also still playing the role of Commander Shepard.

So what you are telling me is that ME 2 needed different equipment for it to be an RPG? Not even different equipment, because that is still in the game. An inventory system? Shops that sell weapons and armor? Is that what made the first an RPG?

 

[Ceebs]

Reading these impressions sounds like exactly what I was expecting from it. Needless to say I cannot wait until I get my hands on this game.

Is there a list or screenshot of the tech tree/stat point stuff out there yet?

 

[Gestahl]

Yeah I loved buying things in Mass Effect 1. All those medigel and grenade upgrades, and all those items I could never afford until they were completely worthless and made obsolete by Spectre weaponry or just the general shit I found in a generic warehouse because I went up a level and every weapon and piece of armor became a VII. Truly, ME2 was a hollow shell because of its absence.

 

[MannahContana]

First Online Reivew: http://www.bit-tech.net/gaming/xbox-360/2010/05/27/alpha-protocol-review/1

As expected has some good stuff, but seriously seriously flawed. Will buy when cheap.

 

[NEOPARADIGM]

Look at all of these buttons for me to push! Wow, so many variables, so many things to tweak.... Oh god, they're just stickers.

People still like to try to convince themselves that the window dressing in the original Mass Effect was functional and in any way well designed. It wasn't, it was a game with an identity crisis and a lot of mechanics suffered from it.

Mass Effect 2 is a consolization done right, Mass Effect was a consolization that was somewhat deluded about being one and put up posters to hide it.

Alpha Protocol, from these remarks and quips doesn't even sound like it belongs on a console for the most part. More akin to that late 90's PC vibe where it's more about self-discovery and choice, which will equal flares of non-linearity and mechanics folks have to learn on their own, which will THEN lead to frustration and RPG AUTO 7 review types.

Which makes it sound far more appealing to me, so I hope for the best.

"PC gamers are smarter than console gamers" post?

 

[whatevermort]

First Online Reivew: http://www.bit-tech.net/gaming/xbox-360/2010/05/27/alpha-protocol-review/1

As expected has some good stuff, but seriously seriously flawed. Will buy when cheap.

Here's a quote from the end of the review:

Sitting down to play Alpha Protocol we wanted to feel like spies, but we ended up feeling like somewhat awkward soldiers simply because the RPG and stealth systems aren’t robust enough to support player choice. Alpha Protocol may be a RPG/shooter hybrid on paper, but in practice it just feels like a dodgy third person action game and the brevity of most levels means that you can easily spend more time getting ready for assignments than actually enjoying them.

To be fair, there are still a few things that Alpha Protocol does really well and there are definitely some truly brilliant ideas presented within it, like the notion of collecting dossiers on allies by asking the right questions or following bonus objectives. The perks system too is worthy of praise, as it works alongside the dossier feature in the way it encourages you to interact with characters and consider your actions.

Sadly though, those few ideas which do work well are buried by a multitude of issues which systematically tear down and destroy the huge potential that could have been afforded by Obsidian’s choice of setting and approach. The poor balancing, the rambling speeches, the linearity and the simple fact that the combat doesn’t feel pleasant? These are just the highlights

Alpha Protocol still works in the strictest sense and there’s still doses of fun to be metered out from individual kills, accomplishments and a few standout moments – but on the whole it doesn’t have the focus or quality you’d expect of a modern day RPG. We’re willing to overlook specific weaknesses based on the merits of the experience as a whole – to cite it again, we still love Deus Ex despite the terrible graphics and stiff combat, but Alpha Protocol frankly doesn’t have enough strengths to qualify.

RUH ROH

 

[Maccas]

It has been about six months since my last Torment playthrough.

Maybe I'll do that instead of picking up Alpha Protocol.

 

[EDarkness]

Well I used a lot of different guns, and I went to all the shops and explored every area I could so I could unlock new parts and upgrades for me to spend my money and resources on. I also leveled up and distributed ability points on top of the game keeping same dialogue system. I was also still playing the role of Commander Shepard.

So what you are telling me is that ME 2 needed different equipment for it to be an RPG? Not even different equipment, because that is still in the game. An inventory system? Shops that sell weapons and armor? Is that what made the first an RPG?

I didn't want to get into all the reasons, since this isn't the Mass Effect thread. I could name a bunch, but I went for simple. Buying things and upgrading equipment is just one of the things that makes an RPG an RPG, surely you don't think that was the ONLY reason why I said what I said. Heh, heh. Anyway, I got the first pistol and pretty much used it all the way to the end. I never needed to change it. And even if I did, there was nothing to upgrade to.

 

[Sloane]

Sitting down to play Alpha Protocol we wanted to feel like spies, but we ended up feeling like somewhat awkward soldiers simply because the RPG and stealth systems aren’t robust enough to support player choice.

Just read completely different impressions from a guy whose opinion I really trust. He likes the AI, seems to consider the RPG stuff to be anything but "not robust enough", says there are a lot of choices even in the missions... Well, tomorrow I'll find out myself. Finally.

 

[whatevermort]

Just read completely different impressions from a guy whose opinion I really trust. He likes the AI, seems to consider the RPG stuff to be anything but "not robust enough", says there are a lot of choices even in the missions... Well, tomorrow I'll find out myself. Finally.

Can you link to those, please?

 

[Zenith]

Ostensibly an RPG at heart, Alpha Protocol also suffers a bit from the way it attempts to fuse this structure onto a shooter frame. It wants to be a new Deus Ex, but poor balancing and over-simplified mechanics mean it feels more like Invisible War at best.

ouch.

 

[Sloane]

Can you link to those, please?

Sure. Can you read German? :lol

I'll sum it up:

- well written dialogue
- mostly good AI, enemies working together to get you
- many different ways to solve any mission (shoot everyone / put gas into the ventilation system to knock everbody out at once, etc.)
- choices have huge consequences
- RPG elements much more noticeable than in Mass Effect
- how you choose the order of missions influences how the following missions are set-up
- you can buy a lot of stuff before a mission begins, even info that leads to new ways to solve a mission

He basically likes everything except for the shooting and the production values. The guy's a relatively well-known journalist, by the way, some German posters might have heard him.

 

[panda21]

Sure. Can you read German? :lol

Yes

The Laberei occupies about 15%. I'm normally a dialogue and CutsceneWegklicker. Here I have given to me but almost all dialogs voluntary.

It plays more like a shooter with RPG elements. But not as bad as Mass Effect, 2nd In AP you realize the RPG content properly.

You can almost always choose which application you tackle next. That's why it's so cool that affect your actions. Can happen that one level XY experienced very different because you have already previously played levels and not level XX YY. Within the missions, you have too many freedoms. Example: All the buildings do personally prefer flat or anesthetic gas through the ventilation system? Kind of stuff.

You can assemble his equipment before the mission. There are quasi-line stores where you can buy with the new stuff earned dough. As can also acquire information, the alternative solutions ready etc.

My conclusion: The places in the game that are particularly baller-heavy liked me the least. On the hottest is the game if the RPG elements are increasingly used. The fact that the hero seems so completely devoid of character, I find it very good. Finally, it shapes its character even by their own deeds. It notes that overall, not so much money flowed in AP, as in the blockbuster EA or Ubisoft. The fact that it still likes to play, speaks to the quality of the title imo. Is with me was a bit ago. Possibly it has now changed so pretty.

Spoiler

sorry i like google translate nonsense too much. its baller-heavy!

 

[Plasma]

My copy just arrived in the post and I'm installing it now, will put up some impressions later.

 

[Lafiel]

Sure. Can you read German? :lol

I'll sum it up:

- well written dialogue
- mostly good AI, enemies working together to get you
- many different ways to solve any mission (shoot everyone / put gas into the ventilation system to knock everbody out at once, etc.)
- choices have huge consequences
- RPG elements much more noticeable than in Mass Effect
- how you choose the order of missions influences how the following missions are set-up
- you can buy a lot of stuff before a mission begins, even info that leads to new ways to solve a mission

He basically likes everything except for the shooting and the production values. The guy's a relatively well-known journalist, by the way, some German posters might have heard him.

I've been kinda getting worried about the quality of the game. But these elements have sold me, as long as gets this right, i can forgive the potentially shitty shooting elements. And graphics and production values. (like these things even matter!).

 

[twisteddeeds]

i tink there is an embargo on reviews... read into that how you see fit, im picking mine up tomorrow

 

[Draft]

Can you kill little kids and toss their bodies into toilets and/or the New York harbor, or is this just another poser PC game?

 

[Shaka]

I guess I won't buy this game yet. I'll get it when I build a new PC. Play it the way it's meant to be played

 

[Hari Seldon]

Pre-ordering this puppy on Amazon for PC. $10 video game credit. And I get $20 off already for buying Red Dead lol.

 

[Nemesis_]

i tink there is an embargo on reviews... read into that how you see fit, im picking mine up tomorrow

The game's been available to the public for almost three days now. =/ Doubt there is an embargo

 

[subversus]

I've been kinda getting worried about the quality of the game. But these elements have sold me, as long as gets this right, i can forgive the potentially shitty shooting elements. And graphics and production values. (like these things even matter!).

They matter for people who can't play old games. Playing this after Deus Ex will be a nice change of pace for me. Can't wait for tommorow.

 

[subversus]

The game's been available to the public for almost three days now. =/ Doubt there is an embargo

I bet it's embargoed until US release.

 

[twisteddeeds]

The game's been available to the public for almost three days now. =/ Doubt there is an embargo

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/new-pal-releases-roundup-28th-may-2010

bottom paragraph on that page... that states they have an embargo.. makes sense as hardly anywhere has a review up...

 

[Sir Garbageman]

First Online Reivew: http://www.bit-tech.net/gaming/xbox-360/2010/05/27/alpha-protocol-review/1

As expected has some good stuff, but seriously seriously flawed. Will buy when cheap.

This review isn't pretty. Some red flags for me:

Ostensibly an RPG at heart, Alpha Protocol also suffers a bit from the way it attempts to fuse this structure onto a shooter frame. It wants to be a new Deus Ex, but poor balancing and over-simplified mechanics mean it feels more like Invisible War at best.

The RPG-side of the game isn’t all that well presented or interesting either – basically a case of dropping a point into weapon skills to get an accuracy boost or recoil adjustment. All out action characters will unlock a range of bullet-time abilities, while those who want to be a bit sneaky are lumbered with endless minigames and terrible pistols.

Balancing is a problem too and to say that the difficulty curve is all over the place is a huge understatement. Silenced pistols do pitiful damage unless you score a critical hit, which is done by holding the crosshair still for four or five seconds before firing – even if you’re at point blank range. Your fists on the other hand are capable of beating nearly enemies with just a bit of button mashing and, while Thorton has issues with pistols he’s bafflingly adept with rocket launchers by default.

 

[garath]

The game's been available to the public for almost three days now. =/ Doubt there is an embargo

Someone said earlier in the thread that the embargo is until 6/1 10am.

 

[Meier]

I can't believe this thing is actually coming out. I actually really loved KOTOR 2 even if it was a bit buggy and marred by slowdown. I'm confident they can put out a solid game. Graphics look so dated though, so I'm afraid it's destined for failure. I'll definitely rent it at least.

 

[BudokaiMR2]

I gotta admit from what I am hearing I do feel bad for the console people.

Even if the main game is complete shit, I have a feeling that the systems and mechanics are so deep that there will be some goddamn awesome PC mods in the future which really take advantage of the systems

 

[practice02]

Enjoying Alpha Protocol on PS3. Gameplay is a bit clumsy and last-gen, but the dialogue system & effect thereof is next-NEXT gen. Bioware really should take note, ME2 is my game of the year, ME is my favourite game this gen but this is taking the 'real decision making' ball and running away with it.
Honestly if ME3 doesn't at least have the time limit on certain dialogue choices that this does, I'm going to be let-down.

The stealth is pretty okay, I generally dislike stealth but I'm not being frustrated by this too much, but again to draw a Mass Effect comparison, it's very much in the first ones vein of 'RPG developer trying their damndest with gameplay they have no experience with, but pulling off everything else to a degree that you forgive a lot of the flaws.
The shooting in the first Mass Effect was better than this though, maybe it's my weapons or the fact I'm not heavily investing in weapon skills but the main reason I'm playing stealthy is because it's so frustrating to get into firefights. Perhaps it's supposed to be, but that doesn't make it fun.

Seriously, damn the camera and cover system sometimes, and the game just crashed on me reminding me that this is indeed an Obsidian game.
I was just about to embark on what I assume was the last mission in the first Asian area, I turn the in-game TV as I head out and there my game goes. I love you guys, I like your game, so stop hitting me Obsidian.

So would you say the game is like a Mass Effect 1.5?

 

[Joseph Merrick]

Can you kill little kids and toss their bodies into toilets and/or the New York harbor, or is this just another poser PC game?

there aren't open hub areas. only the safe houses, and they take you directly into mission areas. at least that's all I've seen so far in the game

stealth/cqc is working out quite well. but there are some encounters and chokepoint areas where I haven't figured out how to get through undetected at all. also I kill everyone I come across hehe

only bugs I've encountered so far were menu interface glitches. heh

 

[Baloonatic]

My PC pre-order arrived today, installing now.

Is the 360 version on 2 discs as well?

 

[Joseph Merrick]

This review isn't pretty. Some red flags for me:

well this part while those who want to be a bit sneaky are lumbered with endless minigames and terrible pistols. isn't really true at all, only in the beginning. there are nice stealth abilities aswell

 

[subversus]

well this part while those who want to be a bit sneaky are lumbered with endless minigames and terrible pistols. isn't really true at all, only in the beginning.

I guess he didn't get past the beginning.

 

[Joseph Merrick]

before you put much of any points into stealth at all, I mean

 

[Gorgon]

Buying things and upgrading equipment is just one of the things that makes an RPG an RPG,...

I thought it was the roleplaying?

 

[Flea]

Don't really post much and I never really get a chance to post impressions (usually get games here last in Australia) but I have been having a fucking ball with this game. Me and my buddy have played it for about 8 hours straight on the ps3. I'm not very good at summarising my impressions but what I have played sounds quite similar to that German article. This game is pretty much the definition of a flawed gem, it gets a whole lot right (dialogue, weapon customisation, perks <-- these are awesome, skills, hacking etc) but unfortunatley falls down in a few areas like the gunplay and general polish.

Those concerned about lack of choice in both story and gameplay can chill out, I saw 1st hand how different the game can be between 2 characters. My friend and I played for about 4 hours each, he was a melee heavy stealth badass that came across as an angry Jack
Bauer. I opted for a more conservative approach, taking more professional choices in my dialogue options and packing a mean ass assault rifle with some heavy armour engaging most targets in mid to long range. The outcomes of both were pretty distinct, different player characters liked/hated us (my friend got the trophy for 3 different people hating him at once about 2 hours in haha), dialogue and story events played out differently with varying rewards for choices that seemed balanced between the two. Gameplay was also very different, with each of us finding difficulties in certain encounters and from what I saw both playstyles seemed about even in effectiveness. The stages are also pretty well designed with multiple paths consistent with what you would expect from a spy game.

Apologies for the stream of consciousness but yeah I'm really enjoying this game. My half finished RDR sitting in its case because of Alpha Protocol is testament to this.

 

[butsomuch]

GamesMaster - 84%

GamesMaster's verdict on Alpha Protocol is in and it's a favourable one at that.

The mag's awarded Sega's espionage RPG a very respectable 84% thanks to its, "dynamic shooting, insane levels of customisation and a thumping near-future dose of espionage and sinister conspiracy."

Although Alpha Protocol lacks something visually and may not be the slickest shooter to hit our screens, it's apparently "gratifying and multifaceted" with GamesMaster ultimately finding the whole experience, "gripping, innovative and deserving of both success and a sequel".

 

[Lakitu]

Will definitely look to get this sometime this year.

 

[graywolf323]

Pre-ordering this puppy on Amazon for PC. $10 video game credit. And I get $20 off already for buying Red Dead lol.

this is exactly why I wish it had Steamworks >_<

I'd buy it for $30 but $50 just seems too much (I have credit on Amazon as well)

 

[Joseph Merrick]

this is exactly why I wish it had Steamworks >_< I'd buy it for $30 but $50 just seems too much (I have credit on Amazon as well)

I don't understand this, what difference would steamworks make? except me not buying the game. huahua

 

[Real4Life]

I will definitely be getting this game. Didn't play an RPG since The Witcher so I am hyped. I really don't care much for the early reviews. Watched some gameplay footage and I'm sold. Graphics arent the best around, but hey...from what I've seen from Dragon Age it wasnt all that great either. (from a gfx point of view, didnt play the game though)

 

[graywolf323]

I don't understand this, what difference would steamworks make? except me not buying the game. huahua

because I want the game on Steam :-/ where I do almost all my PC gaming (pretty much I get everything either on Steam or GOG.com)

 

[Baloonatic]

No option for AA or AF in-game just so that people know. Menus feel built for consoles as well.

Edit: Bollocks, and don't alt-tab out either :lol