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[darkinstinct]

I am really sorry, but even Sony doesn't believe they are using RDNA2:

次世代コンソールゲーム機 「プレイステーション 5」に名称決定 2020年年末商戦期に発売

ソニー・インタラクティブエンタテインメント（SIE）は、次世代コンソールゲーム機の名称を「プレイステーション 5」（PS5）に決定し、2020年の年末商戦期に発売することをお知らせいたします。

www.sie.com

・CPU:　x86-64-AMD Ryzen™ “Zen2", 8 cores/16 threads
・GPU:　AMD Radeon™ RDNA (Radeon DNA) -based graphics engine

 

[ResilientBanana]

That conclusion just brought something to my attention. Do you remember when it was rumored that Sony was using their own solution for Ray Tracing and NOT AMD's solution? Not having support for RDNA 2 might be the reason they had to go with their own RT solution, or the reason for not going to RDNA 2 altogether Assuming we can trust all these rumors.

I can see the posts now, Sony saves money by not licensing RDNA 2 and instead goes with RDNA 1 and develops their own custom hardware raytracing solution. "Sony's solution is better and more efficient" lol.

RDNA2 is 7nm EUV If I’m not mistaken. This could provide up to 50% better performance per FLOP. So even if Sony is at 13TF RDNA 1, MS could out perform them at 12TF due to better efficiency.

 

[demigod]

as I said... I really need this quote on speed dial




also, EVERY GPU SUPPORTS RAYTRACING.

here is a raytraced image made on a freaking Amiga 500

Not sure why you keep repeating yourself with this. This is SOFTWARE RAYTRACING. Only RDNA 2 is hardware raytracing.

 

[MiyazakiHatesKojima]

So it's confirmed Sony is using RDNA 2.0?

 

[darkinstinct]

RDNA2 is 7nm EUV If I’m not mistaken. This could provide up to 50% better performance per FLOP. So even if Sony is at 13TF RDNA 1, MS could out perform them at 12TF due to better efficiency.

There was a rumor that it is 50 % more efficient, but I highly doubt that. It originated from Red Gaming Tech.

Hardware & Tech News - OC3D.net

OC3D is where you can find the latest PC Hardware and Gaming News & Reviews. Get updates on GPUs, Motherboards, CPUs, and more.

www.overclock3d.net

 

[Tripolygon]

I personally think PS5 uses RDNA 1 as base then adds stuff like VRS and RT with other Sony extensions. Would it make sense to start with RDNA 2? yes but i think RDNA 2 is just a refined RDNA 1 with lessons learned from designing console hardware all packaged neatly.

 

[Tripolygon]

I am really sorry, but even Sony doesn't believe they are using RDNA2:

次世代コンソールゲーム機 「プレイステーション 5」に名称決定 2020年年末商戦期に発売

ソニー・インタラクティブエンタテインメント（SIE）は、次世代コンソールゲーム機の名称を「プレイステーション 5」（PS5）に決定し、2020年の年末商戦期に発売することをお知らせいたします。

www.sie.com

・CPU:　x86-64-AMD Ryzen™ “Zen2", 8 cores/16 threads
・GPU:　AMD Radeon™ RDNA (Radeon DNA) -based graphics engine

Also seems they don't believe they are using RDNA1 either. That is rather curious.

 

[FranXico]

So it's confirmed Sony is using RDNA 2.0?

It's confirmed the PS5 GPU has accelerated RT capabilities ar least.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

I am really sorry, but even Sony doesn't believe they are using RDNA2:

次世代コンソールゲーム機 「プレイステーション 5」に名称決定 2020年年末商戦期に発売

ソニー・インタラクティブエンタテインメント（SIE）は、次世代コンソールゲーム機の名称を「プレイステーション 5」（PS5）に決定し、2020年の年末商戦期に発売することをお知らせいたします。

www.sie.com

・CPU:　x86-64-AMD Ryzen™ “Zen2", 8 cores/16 threads
・GPU:　AMD Radeon™ RDNA (Radeon DNA) -based graphics engine

Did Microsoft not believe they were using RDNA 2 when they revealed the XSX either?

 

[Batiman]

You literally made a topic saying both consoles are RDNA2 using that writer as a source, and now that writer is telling you that he doesn't know if it's RDNA1 or RDNA2. I see it's not worth talking anymore to you, I will just put you on ignore.

Seriously. I’m not sure what’s going on anymore......

 

[FranXico]

RDNA1 plus custom raytracing solution from somebody else. Could be Adshir. In fact I am certain that PS5 uses Adshir.

Adshir

www.adshir.com

Does that guy on the main page look like out of a Sony exclusive IP?

How nice of AMD to advertise the Adshir RT solution.

Or sneaky, because it sure sounded like they said it was running natively in their GPU. Poor Adshir.

 

[SenjutsuSage]

Okay, reacting to that actual audio of the quote now, yes the author clearly played with the quote (why? Kinda silly to do that), and yes he doesn't outright come out and say certain things, but there's also an obvious implication in what he did say by starting out his thoughts discussing RDNA2 and hardware ray tracing, and then immediately right after jumping to mentioning the new xbox and playstation being powered by radeon and supporting hardware ray tracing natively.

The implication from this sentence, though he does not say it directly, is that both Xbox and PS5 use RDNA2 and have hardware ray tracing built in. Regardless of my opinion, I have to be fair here and say that's the perceived implication from what I'm hearing.

It's no secret that I've always been skeptical about the PS5 and ray tracing only due to Sony's communication on it, and Cerny's clarifications never really convinced me before, and sony's ces certainly didn't help matters. I saw it more like attempting to clean up something they didn't really want to be more . This AMD statement, however, leads me to really believe that PS5 truly does have it and that it may also be powered by RDNA2 like Series X, although I'd also like confirmation directly from Sony about the RDNA 2 stuff, and of course there will come the games that will tell the story. So yea, it wasn't an entirely made up quote like I originally thought, but they weren't exactly honest about the proper context and details of what was said lol.

 

[BlackBuzzard]

Okay, reacting to that actual audio of the quote now, yes the author clearly played with the quote (why? Kinda silly to do that), and yes he doesn't outright come out and say certain things, but there's also an obvious implication in what he did say by starting out his thoughts discussing RDNA2 and hardware ray tracing, and then immediately right after jumping to mentioning the new xbox and playstation being powered by radeon and supporting hardware ray tracing natively.

The implication from this sentence, though he does not say it directly, is that both Xbox and PS5 use RDNA2 and have hardware ray tracing built in. Regardless of my opinion, I have to be fair here and say that's the perceived implication from what I'm hearing.

It's no secret that I've always been skeptical about the PS5 and ray tracing only due to Sony's communication on it, and Cerny's clarifications never really convinced me before, and sony's ces certainly didn't help matters. I saw it more like attempting to clean up something they didn't really want to be more . This AMD statement, however, leads me to really believe that PS5 truly does have it and that it may also be powered by RDNA2 like Series X, although I'd also like confirmation directly from Sony about the RDNA 2 stuff, and of course there will come the games that will tell the story. So yea, it wasn't an entirely made up quote like I originally thought, but they weren't exactly honest about the proper context and details of what was said lol.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I don’t think it really matters .. if Sony is using non RDNA 2 day tracing .. they might be using this https://www.adshir.com/demos ( has a demo wish Spider-Man)

Which goes along with the rumor of a simpler version that’s “elegant”.

Prob what that means is most of the time it looks as good but runs with less performance hit .. but may not be as functional or correct as Microsoft DXR version.

Either way it’s good for gamers.

This will contradict the rhetorical comment from one of their ex chip designers last week on Twitter.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Okay, reacting to that actual audio of the quote now, yes the author clearly played with the quote (why? Kinda silly to do that), and yes he doesn't outright come out and say certain things, but there's also an obvious implication in what he did say by starting out his thoughts discussing RDNA2 and hardware ray tracing, and then immediately right after jumping to mentioning the new xbox and playstation being powered by radeon and supporting hardware ray tracing natively.

The implication from this sentence, though he does not say it directly, is that both Xbox and PS5 use RDNA2 and have hardware ray tracing built in. Regardless of my opinion, I have to be fair here and say that's the perceived implication from what I'm hearing.

It's no secret that I've always been skeptical about the PS5 and ray tracing only due to Sony's communication on it, and Cerny's clarifications never really convinced me before, and sony's ces certainly didn't help matters. I saw it more like attempting to clean up something they didn't really want to be more . This AMD statement, however, leads me to really believe that PS5 truly does have it and that it may also be powered by RDNA2 like Series X, although I'd also like confirmation directly from Sony about the RDNA 2 stuff, and of course there will come the games that will tell the story. So yea, it wasn't an entirely made up quote like I originally thought, but they weren't exactly honest about the proper context and details of what was said lol.

They were always honest, you just had your mental gymnastics.

They literally said hardware based ray tracing.

 

[cookiemuffin]

We are still in the denial stage huh?

 

[Lort]

Let’s read into this now...



If Playstation had RDNA 2 he wouldn’t act so surprised ..

 

[DeepEnigma]

Let’s read into this now...



If Playstation had RDNA 2 he wouldn’t act so surprised ..

You read it as surprised, I read it as cheeky chip designer rhetorical questions. Kind of in a condescending tone.

Almost as if he knows what options and paths you can go in your customizations over the bare bones RT silicon.

 

[darkinstinct]

Let’s read into this now...



If Playstation had RDNA 2 he wouldn’t act so surprised ..

Wow, that's from the PS5 software architect? If they were using the same raytracing solution, shouldn't he know all those answers? It would be exactly the same for both of them, right?

 

[demigod]

Let’s read into this now...



If Playstation had RDNA 2 he wouldn’t act so surprised ..

Do you seriously think an engineer would openly go to a different company asking them the solutions over twitter?

 

[DeepEnigma]

Wow, that's from the PS5 software architect? If they were using the same raytracing solution, shouldn't he know all those answers? It would be exactly the same for both of them, right?

Add more “wows” and “yikes” in there and maybe I’ll believe your “genuine questions”.

Ex chip designer by the way. I’m sure he’s asking real genuine questions on Twitter instead of phrasing them in such a way by eluding to things because of breaking NDA’s and all that jazz!

In here.

 

[ethomaz]

RDNA2 is 7nm EUV If I’m not mistaken. This could provide up to 50% better performance per FLOP. So even if Sony is at 13TF RDNA 1, MS could out perform them at 12TF due to better efficiency.

That is not what efficiency means lol

It means RDNA 2 can delivery the same performance using less watts...

An example:

RDNA 12TFs uses 200W
RDNA2 12TFs uses 150W

Smaller node doesn’t give better performance per flop or whatever you are trying to create lol

 

[oldergamer]

Some will keep dreaming. MS and Sony aren't using identical hardware.

 

[thelastword]

Both of these consoles are using RDNA 2......Ideally they should use Zen 3 as well, which means a lower power footprint a smaller node and even more powerful CPU's than we currently have with RDNA1 and Zen 2...….

The custom work would be Sony's way of uniting Memory, GPU, CPU.....How they connect these to storage solutions like HBCC and of course their own custom engineering on Raytracing hardware and pipelines including audio which they said is of high priority for them.....I've also read somewhere that A.I is also very high up on Sony's Feature set for next gen. An A.I chip anyone?

 

[Tripolygon]

Let’s read into this now...



If Playstation had RDNA 2 he wouldn’t act so surprised ..

Ya'll read this as a surprise, i read it as a rhetorical question posed to address current limitation of RTX implementation. In a round about way of saying does RDNA2 RT solution perform better than what we have now and address current limitations.

 

[darkinstinct]

Ya'll read this as a surprise, i read it as a rhetorical question posed to address current limitation of RTX implementation. In a round about way of saying does RDNA2 RT solution perform better than what we have now and address current limitations.

But none of those are limitations of RTX?

 

[Tripolygon]

But none of those are limitations of RTX?

Yes they are. Multi bounce and transparent objects are a known limitation of RTX currently.

 

[demigod]

Yes they are. Multi bounce and transparent objects are a known limitation of RTX currently.

Sir, you can't beat him cuz he's a dev .

 

[darkinstinct]

Yes they are. Multi bounce and transparent objects are a known limitation of RTX currently.

They take a deeper performance hit, but they aren't limitations.

 

[ethomaz]

Ya'll read this as a surprise, i read it as a rhetorical question posed to address current limitation of RTX implementation. In a round about way of saying does RDNA2 RT solution perform better than what we have now and address current limitations.

He is pretty clear spotting the limitations of DXR and RDNA2 ray-trading implementation.

But none of those are limitations of RTX?

They are.

 

[DeepEnigma]

They take a deeper performance hit, but they aren't limitations.

Why do you think he mentioned 4K/60 as the initial qualifier?

It’s like we are taking crazy pills in here.

 

[Tripolygon]

They take a deeper performance hit, but they aren't limitations.

That is a limitation, it doesn't work well. You are saying the same thing i'm saying without using the word limitation.

 

[JTCx]

They take a deeper performance hit, but they aren't limitations.

Bruh you just agreed with him.

 

[mitchman]

AMD can't say PS5 is using RDNA2 until Sony themselves confirms it, that's the simplest explanation.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

They take a deeper performance hit, but they aren't limitations.

 

[darkinstinct]

That is a limitation, it doesn't work well. You are saying the same thing i'm saying without using the word limitation.

That's BS and you know it. Of course multi bounce raytracing comes with an additional cost. That's just the way it works, every additional bounce adds exponentially more rays. That's not a limitation of RTX, that's just the concept of the technology and hardware that isn't there yet and won't be for the next decade. Same thing for transparencies. And there are workarounds for both.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

That's BS and you know it. Of course multi bounce raytracing comes with an additional cost. That's just the way it works, every additional bounce adds exponentially more rays. That's not a limitation of RTX, that's just the concept of the technology and hardware that isn't there yet and won't be for the next decade. Same thing for transparencies. And there are workarounds for both.

How are you failing at such basic english? Raytracing is slow. That is a limitation. "Its just the way it is" doesn't change that.

If it wasn't a limitation, then there wouldn't be any need to overcome it. Which is wrong.

 

[ethomaz]

There is some others tweets.

 

[mitchman]

Did AMD say XSX would use RDNA2 before MS released the specs?

 

[Vroadstar]

Bruh you just agreed with him.

Don't be surprised, he's been grasping at straws. Next up, Sony RDNA 2.0 but MS is actually RDNA 2.0001

 

[ethomaz]

Did AMD say XSX would use RDNA2 before MS released the specs?

Nope.

 

[demigod]

Playstation: Zen 2, 7nm (not 7nm+, which would be RDNA2), Radeon Navi (which can mean RDNA or RDNA2)



"next gen Radeon technology"


Xbox:



"next generation Radeon RDNA gaming graphics architecure"

The two are not the same. It's RDNA for PS5 and RDNA2 for Xbox.

Yes they are you tool. Also she said "next gen Radeon architectures" so how about not changing the words. That's the same thing as saying "next gen Radeon RDNA".

 

[itsjustJEFF]

I love all the bickering going on in here. The mental gymnastics happening, on both sides, is on an Olympic level.

 

[Kdad]

You are wrong.

AMD has a percentual gain from each unit sold. Given how much more PlaySyation Brand is popular worldwide., If anything, they can even get morr money out of Sony as the market leader tban MS.

Sony investment on gaming division is huuuge. Champions league psrtnership alone for so many years is a ridiculous ammount of money.

Microsoft has deals with AMD well beyond Xbox (see Surface and Azure), thier overall importance to AMD would dwarf SONY.

 

[wolffy71]

Lord please let Sony just reveal already. This is just the same convo over and over. Everyone trying to disect every word, tweet, rumor, insult, and joke. Help!

 

[Chairman Tickles]

it actually did, in 1985 it was way above anything on PC and 86, 87...., hell even the Atari ST could emulate the MAC better than a MAC ;-)

I MEMBAH GUD

I refer to sales long term. It flopped despite being AT LEAST 2 generations beyond anything else. It was a 1992 machine released in 1985. That still wasn't enough.

 

[demigod]

Microsoft has deals with AMD well beyond Xbox (see Surface and Azure), thier overall importance to AMD would dwarf SONY.

No it does not, stop making shit up without having any source to back your claim up. First of all we don’t know how much the Azure servers cost and how many are sold. Secondly the amd surface has only existed since last year and you can’t really compare amd sales to intel for laptops.

For 2017 only 3mil surface sold that pales in comparison to 15+mil ps4.

Microsoft’s Surface Pro turns 5 amid rising competition and faltering sales

As Microsoft celebrates the five-year anniversary of the Surface Pro, data from IDC reveals that unit sales of Microsoft Surface detachable laptops and tablets have dropped nearly 19 percent in the last year.

www.pcworld.com

 

[Kdad]

No it does not, stop making shit up without having any source to back your claim up. First of all we don’t know how much the Azure servers cost and how many are sold. Secondly the amd surface has only existed since last year and you can’t really compare amd sales to intel for laptops.

For 2017 only 3mil surface sold that pales in comparison to 15+mil ps4.

Microsoft’s Surface Pro turns 5 amid rising competition and faltering sales

As Microsoft celebrates the five-year anniversary of the Surface Pro, data from IDC reveals that unit sales of Microsoft Surface detachable laptops and tablets have dropped nearly 19 percent in the last year.

www.pcworld.com

I never compared anything to Intel.

In the last 2 years MS has made deals with AMD in the server space and in consumer space as well as the existing VG relationship. The current and future potential of that relationship dwarfs the value of strictly VG. Do you think AZURE is a less profitable space for AMD to play in?

You don't need to be aggressive in your responses. So calm down. It's called an opinion.

If your running g AMD who is going to be more important...a multichannel behemoth or a company that uses one chip design every 7 years?

 

[demigod]

I never compared anything to Intel.

In the last 2 years MS has made deals with AMD in the server space and in consumer space as well as the existing VG relationship. The current and future potential of that relationship dwarfs the value of strictly VG. Do you think AZURE is a less profitable space for AMD to play in?

You don't need to be aggressive in your responses. So calm down. It's called an opinion.

If your running g AMD who is going to be more important...a multichannel behemoth or a company that uses one chip design every 7 years?

You are making assumptions. Until we have numbers on Azure, it does not dwarf Sony.

 

[Kdad]

You are making assumptions. Until we have numbers on Azure, it does not dwarf Sony.

My assumptions are as valid as yours. Cheers.