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American Soccer |OT| Life, liberty and the pursuit of the beautiful game

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G

gutshot

Member
It seems Garber is fiercely protective of MLS to the point of publicly critizing important figures of US Soccer such as Klinnsman and Bruce Arena. Not a good look for him or the league.
 
N

Nesotenso

Member
gutshot said:
It seems Garber is fiercely protective of MLS to the point of publicly critizing important figures of US Soccer such as Klinnsman and Bruce Arena. Not a good look for him or the league.
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I hope Klinsmann fires back at him telling he needs to know his place and mind his own business.
 
S

smokeandmirrors

Banned
Osorio said:
Mls 3.0
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Sign me up for MLS 4.0 then.

Nesotenso said:
because Garber is an idiot.
Seriously who the fuck is he to say what Klinsmann should or shouldn't say? Is telling the truth about the league hard for him to bear?
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Apparently so.

"There's nothing I can do about it. I made it clear with Clint's move back and Michael's move back that it's going to be very difficult to keep the same level that they experienced at the places where they were. It's just reality. It's just being honest."
"He has to prove that he hasn't lost a bit. Obviously we'll keep working and pushing but it's down to him and his environment to see what level he's capable to play."
"This league is getting better and stronger every year which we are all very proud about, and I want everyone to grow in this environment."
"But the reality also is that for both players, making that step means that you are not competitive environment that you were in before."

""I want Jozy to get through the difficult time at Sunderland and maybe make a big step one day to a Champions League team in Europe because that's where the top players in the world play."
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I don't see how wanting your players to play at the height of their game is a bad thing. But everyone freak the fuck out because Klinsmann said something you don't agree with or didn't even bother to actually read!!!!!
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Notrollious said:
Sign me up for MLS 4.0 then.



Apparently so.



I don't see how wanting your players to play at the height of their game is a bad thing. But everyone freak the fuck out because Klinsmann said something you don't agree with or didn't even bother to actually read!!!!!
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There's nothing wrong with wanting your starters to play at the highest levels, but it does come off as a bit of a snub towards MLS. Dempsey was great in the World Cup and he's been in MLS for a few years, Bradley was fine after the move and Donovan spent most of his career in MLS. Also look at guys like Beckerman, who is another MLS lifer and was one of the most important players to our World Cup campaign.

Playing at the highest levels is something to shoot for, but it's not the only way to become a great player.
 
S

smokeandmirrors

Banned
I mean I pretty much agree with everything you said but a lot of it feels like people are equating "I wish these players could play against champions league talent instead of being big fish in a little but growing pond" to "MLS IS SUCKS" when it's not that at all.

I mean if he were truly saying that then why would he be calling all these great MLS players to begin with? I'm sure there are plenty of dual nationals available to play.

B-Dubs said:
There's nothing wrong with wanting your starters to play at the highest levels, but it does come off as a bit of a snub towards MLS. .
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I figured it was more due to Germans being a lot more blunt and straightforward than necessarily a snub towards the league.
 
H

Hasphat'sAnts

Member
B-Dubs said:
There's nothing wrong with wanting your starters to play at the highest levels, but it does come off as a bit of a snub towards MLS. Dempsey was great in the World Cup and he's been in MLS for a few years, Bradley was fine after the move and Donovan spent most of his career in MLS. Also look at guys like Beckerman, who is another MLS lifer and was one of the most important players to our World Cup campaign.

Playing at the highest levels is something to shoot for, but it's not the only way to become a great player.
Click to expand...

Yet our two best players in the World Cup were playing top flight football in England and Germany.

(I know Jermaine was playing in Turkey, but bear with me here)

The writing was on the wall for Bradley and Dempsey. It's good for their own careers that they came back. Not necessarily for US Soccer as a whole.

What Klinsi already is and the rest of us fans should be wary of is for players like Green and Yedlin to think it's okay to fail in Europe because there will always be a payday waiting here in the States.
 
O

Osorio

Member
The people who fail in Europe don't get callups though

Clint and Bradley didn't fail. They just got offers they couldn't turn down
 
E

Esch

Banned
I agree with Klinsmann. There's no point in pretending that guys are getting the best experience here. I like the current model; send them off to get their straps in europe and then bring them back later.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Hasphat'sAnts said:
Yet our two best players in the World Cup were playing top flight football in England and Germany.

(I know Jermaine was playing in Turkey, but bear with me here)

The writing was on the wall for Bradley and Dempsey. It's good for their own careers that they came back. Not necessarily for US Soccer as a whole.

What Klinsi already is and the rest of us fans should be wary of is for players like Green and Yedlin to think it's okay to fail in Europe because there will always be a payday waiting here in the States.
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In the long run having better players in MLS is good for the growth of not only the league but future talent. I agree with your last point though.

Clint and Bradley didn't fail though, they were both doing well and wound up getting offers that no one could turn down.
 
S

smokeandmirrors

Banned
You can also have your top 23 players playing in the highest league(s) and still have a good domestic league. How many countries have better national teams than we do and yet don't have the world's top leagues? I mean the Belgium team that we lost to? like 3 or 4 of the players were playing in the Belgian Pro League.

Both aren't exclusive to one another. The biggest problem MLS is facing is lack of depth and lower team budgets (salary cap included) overall. Once the league can get more money in we can start to bring in some of the better talent on a consistent basis and then it might not be perceived as detrimental to bring your talents to the back to the US if you're apart of the USMNT. And even then the growth has to come from the bottom in the academies and youth programs.
 
H

Hasphat'sAnts

Member
Not blaming Dempsey for biting at the chance to come home. He's proved himself at Fulham and Tottenham. It literally makes zero sense for him to stay in England and try to stick at a place like Southampton or Stoke or wherever.

Less enthusiastic about the Bradley choice because he was in the prime of his career, and definitely had the quality to start for a squad in Italy or elsewhere with European ambitions. Let's not forget that the only reason he got lost in the shuffle is because he was competing in the best midfield in Italy apart from Juventus. It'd be the equivalen of Shinji Kagawa leaving Man U to play for Gamba Osaka because he "failed" in Manchester.

But you know, TFC brought a brinks truck full of money and that was that.
 
A

Askani

Member
At the CONCACAF Qualifier. Like, maybe 300 people are here since the Royals game is on. Afraid of how many are going to show up for the US women.
 
A

Arials

Member
Pretty much everything Garber said was wrong/stupid/delusional. I doubt he'd argue that club football at a lower level isn't detrimental to a players performance levels if Michael Bradley had left Roma for somewhere like Barnsley or Hajduk Split rather than Toronto.

Notrollious said:
I mean if he were truly saying that then why would he be calling all these great MLS players to begin with? I'm sure there are plenty of dual nationals available to play.
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There aren't. For the World Cup Klinsmann called up every available player based in one of Europe's top 5 leagues and that only amounted to 9 players. If he had a deeper talent pool of players based in those leagues then I think many of those who chose to play at a lower level (or just plain aren't good enough to play at that level in the first place) would get dropped pretty quickly.
 
S

smokeandmirrors

Banned
Arials said:
There aren't. For the World Cup Klinsmann called up every available player based in one of Europe's top 5 leagues and that only amounted to 9 players. If he had a deeper talent pool of players based in those leagues then I think many of those who chose to play at a lower level (or just plain aren't good enough to play at that level in the first place) would get dropped pretty quickly.
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It was moreso tongue-in-cheek and not even counting the just the top 5 leagues. it was more a joke about how if he hated MLS so much he could've found other means. They would've sucked but still.
 
C

Cornballer

Member
- Jeff Carlisle: MLS, U.S. Soccer don't always have to see eye-to-eye on everything
But that's not necessarily Klinsmann's job, and he wasn't saying anything that the public didn't already know. Are there times when the needs of the national team are synchronous with those of MLS? Without question. But there are moments -- and the league's general refusal to observe international fixture dates is one -- when the two sides are at odds, and Klinsmann has never hesitated to speak his mind when such a conflict has arisen.

Whether Klinsmann should do so publicly is another question, and it is on this issue where Garber found himself on firmer ground, especially as it relates to Klinsmann's treatment of Dempsey and Bradley. As ESPNFC.com colleague Graham Parker eloquently stated, Klinsmann's motivational ploy of taking Dempsey and Bradley to task about their decision to return to MLS, as well as their current form, seems dubious at this point. These are not 18-year-olds, but seasoned professionals, and it seems likely there will come a point where harping on their career choices does more harm than good.

But one has to question whether Garber's comments signal a broader backlash within the U.S. soccer community at Klinsmann and the power he's accumulated from being both technical director and national team manager. It's worth pointing out that while on one side there are issues like the international fixture dates, on the other there is the release of players for a lengthy pre-World Cup training camp. It seems likely that MLS feels aggrieved at having made concessions such as its players missing club fixtures to be with the national team only to later be publicly lambasted by Klinsmann.

Is it possible that the two sides will make nice? Definitely. It's in the collective interests of both parties to work together. The question of whether there is the will on either side to be collaborative will remain.
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O

Osorio

Member
Notrollious said:
solidarity sister

gonna laugh so hard when Curtin is announced as the full time manager despite a "world wide search" as according to Sakiewicz and i can't wait till we sign another keeper after MacMath leaves.
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I'm not sure if you know this but nick sack used to be a metro gm
 
S

smokeandmirrors

Banned
Osorio said:
I'm not sure if you know this but nick sack used to be a metro gm
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oh im aware but he won executive of the year!111 lolz

ugh. I really hate the feeling of the team and FO not giving a fuck about winning as long as they make money and that seems a lot more prevalent MLS side than most other sports here, but that may just be because some of the teams are owned by people who truly don't care. and it's disheartening.

*insert funny joke about ny sloppy seconds*
 
O

Osorio

Member
Notrollious said:
oh im aware but he won executive of the year!111 lolz

ugh. I really hate the feeling of the team and FO not giving a fuck about winning as long as they make money and that seems a lot more prevalent MLS side than most other sports here, but that may just be because some of the teams are owned by people who truly don't care. and it's disheartening.

*insert funny joke about ny sloppy seconds*
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He was truly awful

Only thing he did which was any good was getting the ball rolling on a stadium in Harrison
 
T

The Culture Vulture

Member
I think the Garber vs. Klinsmann thing is a bit of a work. What did Jurgen say that was really that bad to get Garber's panties in a bunch. I like Garner and follow MLS as my #1 league but I also don't disagree with any of the Klinsmann quotes I saw.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
The Culture Vulture said:
I think the Garber vs. Klinsmann thing is a bit of a work. What did Jurgen say that was really that bad to get Garber's panties in a bunch. I like Garner and follow MLS as my #1 league but I also don't disagree with any of the Klinsmann quotes I saw.
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Garber is trying to turn MLS into a world class league, I suppose the comments, no matter how true they are, rubbed him the wrong way. Especially coming from the head coach of the national team. He's been trying to build up some respect for MLS, though Klinsmann is right and it's not the Premier League, he probably took it as a slight.
 
X

xbhaskarx

Member
Bill Archer: Garber Takes Klinsy to the Woodshed

It will be interesting to see how the arrogant, ego-besotted Klinsmann, who considers himself the bride at every wedding and the corpse at every funeral, responds to this kind of public spanking.
The guess here is that he'll take Garber's advice and come out shuffling and jiving about how he was "misunderstood" or some such rubbish.

He probably won't admit that yes, in fact, it was his personal dislike of Landon Donovan that put Chris Wondolowski in front of the goal at the key moment of the World Cup, but that's OK. Everybody already knows it.

...

He may secretly believe that he can scrape up enough Volksdeutsch offspring of random US Servicemen to form a team he can communicate with in his native tongue - Mussolini - but he surely must recognize that without MLS the USMNT might as well be Jamaica in terms of international competitiveness.

Klinsmann can think what he wants. He and his classless, churlish son can sit around behind closed doors and say whatever they like about Major League Soccer and the men who elect to play here. Nobody cares.

But as the head coach of the US National Team, he has to understand that talking down MLS to a domestic and world press that laps it up like mother's milk only helps retard the progress of an entity he needs very badly if he wants to succeed
Click to expand...
 
X

xbhaskarx

Member
Former LA Galaxy Academy F Haji Wright has 28 goals and 8 assists in 31 appearances for the #USMNT U17's.

Bz7noDJIEAA--UQ.png:large


Wright, Pulisic, and Gallardo (who broke his leg in August) dominating this U-17 cycle... NYC already has a better prospect than certain established MLS teams... Dallas just signed Zendejas a few days ago.


(for comparison, Donovan had 32 goals in 35 matches going into the U-17 World Cup, where he had three more to finish with 35 in 41)
 
M

Meier

Member
Let's be honest. Garber's comments were embarrassing for him, but something he felt like he needed to do to protect his brand so I can't blame him. Jurgen is of course right about a player like Bradley moving from Roma to Toronto being a massive, massive step backwards -- that's not really open for debate. Whether or not Bradley would have played enough this season with them bringing in Nainggolan is another question though.. you can see why he wanted to leave before he was marginalized, but it's likely he could have found a home elsewhere in a league that would continue to test him. The issue at hand is he probably could not have made $7m a year while doing that unless he moved to a mid-tier or better Premier League team.

I think the most embarrassing part of it for Garber was when he "demand[ed]" something of Klinsmann. You have to wince at that -- it really makes him come off as a very small man if he thinks he can have any level of control over JK or what he says.
 
O

Osorio

Member
Petke might be looking at using Oyongo as a RB

Oomph

---------BWP---------
Henry---Peguy----Sam
------Dax-----Alexander
Miller Seka Olave Oyongo

That is sexy
 
C

Cornballer

Member
- MLS Soccer: MLS on Campus: USL PRO fills the 18-22 gap, and here are the Homegrowns who will benefit
It's called, colloquially, "the 18-22 gap," and conventional wisdom says that's where promising youth in the US and Canada have traditionally stalled in comparison to their peers elsewhere. While the most promising of those peers are usually taking their first steps into the pro arena at that age, in North America all but the exceptional few have taken at least a pit stop in college.

That may be about to change. With the announcement of two more MLS teams running USL PRO reserve teams next season, there are suddenly more pro contracts, a clearer path to the first team and – hopefully – a more comprehensive development plan for legitimate prospects.

Will it be enough to close the 18-22 gap? Definitely not right away, and maybe not all the way. But it's a move in the right direction.

Those in the best position to benefit immediately are those who've already spent time in MLS academies and are currently in college. Nine such players were signed to Homegrown Player contracts last offseason, and on Tuesday Sigi Schmid name-dropped two of them who would have benefitted greatly if S2 existed this year.

With that in mind, here’s a list of 10, compiled by our college expert Nate Sulat, who should sign Homegrown Player deals this year, and who might be among the first to help both the US and Canada mind the gap
Click to expand...
 
X

xbhaskarx

Member
Cornballer said:
- SI: MLS, Garber threatened by Klinsmann challenging America's status quo
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gutshot said:
Another good one.

Deadspin: MLS Commissioner Has Some Dumb Shit To Say About Jürgen Klinsmann
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Note the common thread between these two dudes is that they both support promotion and relegation, which Klinsmann said he's a "deep believer" in just a few days ago...

Hasphat'sAnts said:
and this lol:

Ives Galarcep Verified account
‏@SoccerByIves
Klinsmann makes valid point that it’s tough to take for granted #NASL is a lower division than #MLS without promotion/relegation. #USMNT
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Klinsmann has been making public statements that are critical of both MLS players (Donovan, Dempsey, Bradley, etc.) and the overall level of MLS vs Europe for years, I think the real change that prompted the owners to finally send Garber out there to take some swings on their behalf is the recent pro/rel comments (along with the related token call up of Ibarra to play a couple minutes)...

Garber said he felt the need to go public with his concerns about Klinsmann after he spent the past 24 hours discussing the issue with members of the MLS ownership board. He sent a “very strong” letter to US Soccer president and longtime friend Sunil Gulati about the situation and a number of MLS board members also sent Gulati letters on Tuesday. Garber said he spoke briefly with Gulati before the conference call on Wednesday afternoon.
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Of course that Deadspin dbag is most famous for this:
Getting Ready For MLS? Allow Us To Convince You Otherwise
Shocking that someone who calls MLS "shitty American soccer" and writes columns discouraging people from watching it would side against the MLS commissioner!
 
X

xbhaskarx

Member
MLS on Campus: USL PRO fills the 18-22 gap, and here are the Homegrowns who will benefit

Brandon Allen, junior forward, Georgetown/New York Red Bulls
Jay Chapman, junior midfielder, Michigan State/Toronto FC
Sean Davis, senior midfielder, Duke/New York Red Bulls
Darwin Jones, senior forward, Washington/Seattle Sounders
Charlie Lyon, redshirt senior goalkeeper, Marquette/Chicago Fire
Darius Madison, junior winger, Virginia/Philadelphia Union
Dan Metzger, senior midfielder, Maryland/New York Red Bulls
Jordan Morris, sophomore forward, Stanford/Seattle Sounders
Boyd Okwuonu, senior defender, North Carolina/FC Dallas
James Rogers, senior winger, New Mexico/Colorado Rapids
 
O

Osorio

Member
B-Dubs said:
Oh man, that's the good stuff.
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I'm getting cautiously optimistic. We still have a terrible record on the road but that lineup is balanced and dangerous. Our defense on the wings looks exploitable but with a defensive square of Seka, Olave, Dax, and Alexander I think we're composed in the back.

Then we have Timmy on the bench lol
 
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