sixteen-bit
Member
Adam Koralik?
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Analogue NT ($578 HDMI NES) |OT| Better than anything, and ready to ship years ago
- Thread starter Chittagong
- Start date
Adam Koralik?
NES S-video on the Retro Trio looks worse than its own actual composite output (which is honestly quite acceptable for NES). I agree that an actual clone with RGB or component would be fantastic, and I don't see why it hasn't been made yet.
Nope, RGB is quite better. Also, no svideo support for NES and no RGB for Genesis sucks. I don't see the point of the Retro Trio really unless you want to save on space.
It's clearly aimed at people that want to use their own carts but don't really care about video quality or accuracy.
Lol.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
But S-Video is the best you can do on your average American CRT TV, is it not? Didn't only a handful of special Sony CRTs have RGB inputs?
NoFaceNico
Member
You'll have to excuse me, I'm off to go play Duck Hunt on my SR3.
There are upscalers and stuff available. And you can use Production level monitors.
Check out this thread: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=630556
But what you're saying is true, run of the mill CRTs usually don't even bother with svideo.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
A lot of later CRTs had component inputs, which looks as good as RGB unless the console is fucking up YUV encoding or the TV is fucking up YUV decoding. You could do native component 240p from PS2 or Wii or get a cheap box to convert RGB to component.
baphomet
Member
That doesn't change the fact that it's an extremely poorly made clone. And Duck Hunt isn't some sort of test for accuracy.
Wait, when I say accuracy I'm not talking about it in the "aiming" sense.
NoFaceNico
Member
Poorly made?! It hasn't sliced up even one of my cartridges yet!
Great, neither am I! I'm dying to see how the NT plays Duck Hunt on an HD television. Let's see some recorded gameplay and I'll provide my own from the SR3 for comparison.
baphomet
Member
It'll play it just as well as your clone on an HD tv. It will also play it just fine on a CRT.
Battlesmurf
Member
That, and one would still need good RGB cables, a frame meister,and a four score, and a Famicom adapter ($30, $300, $10, $10- another $350- bringing that total to $580). I love my frame meister, but it's got some quirks (better than the XRGB 2/3/etc though). This cleans up the clutter if all I want to mess with is the NES.
That being said, I am not a fan of the NTs price, but it's not super bad all things considered. If the performance delivers, then we're set. I am really hoping that somehow that one unit that was delivered is an isolated cart scratching case :/
I think my order was 1700 w/ hdmi. Looks like I'm not seeing this until Aug/Sept. To be honest, I forgot about it until the last couple of months. I am not pre-ordering anything from them again, that's for sure. Hopeful that it'll be worth the wait.
How well does the SR3 play Duck Hunt on an HDTV? What's the point in posing such a question?
I apologize for sounding overly harsh but I really dislike clone hardware. Why not just use a regular NES?
Again, you're focusing o. The NT but it's not the only solution for high quality NES play. It's parts are derived from other sources. You can achieve the same thing using a modded NES.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
My order of preference goes:
Original hardware > clone hardware combos (if space is an issue) > Raspberry Pie emulation in original shell >>>>>>>>>>>> generic emulation boxes (Retron).
Since space is an issue I'm looking at the RetroTrio.
NoFaceNico
Member
Including Retron on there... for shame... nah, jk. At least it's at the end.
I didn't illustrate my point correctly, my point was that once you go HDMI, you forfeit the ability to play light gun games, which are a nice part of the NES library. You might say- then why not go with the NX composite/RGB/component model and a CRT? To that I'll throw the argument back at you- if you're not going to use HDMI, then why not just use a modded NES?
Your dislike of clone hardware is the same as my dislike of hardware that's disproportionally expensive. I'm no different that the people who didn't buy a PS3 when it was $600. And guess what- I did buy the PS3 the same day the price came down to $300.
I have plenty of reasons for choosing the SR3 over an NES, which I explained in the last page.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
Fuck Retron. I'd never buy one. I'd buy a RetroTrio though and may end up needing to.
NoFaceNico
Member
Hmmmmmm
Like I said earlier, I have a video I've been working on. It's a long term comparison between the two (I've had both since launch) and you might find the results very interesting...
It's taking a while to make because I'm kinda getting stuck at the end since I'd like to include some discussion about the Retron 5's Retroarch fuckery but the whole GPL licenses thing is hard to keep in order and I don't want to say something I'll have to retract later. I'll send you a PM when the video is done.
That's what I've been saying, though. An RGB modded NES offers the same performance. I'm not arguing in favor of the NT, just RGB capable hardware in general.
That said, those modded units are still expensive even if you do it yourself.
This isn't a mass market item any longer, though, so arguing over price in a topic like this seems odd.
I'd feel a bit different about the Retro Trio if the video output were actually acceptable. RetroBit's products all put out bad video quality. Just be careful with your recommendations for such a thing. That's all.
That's said, I do want to check out your video when it's finished!
Chittagong
Gold Member
Analogue NT is expensive, but to get a comparable price you need to add the following
- Base moddable NES/Famicom unit
- NESRGB kit HW
- NESRBG kit installation
- Kevtris NES HDMI kit HW
- Kevtris NES HDMI kit instsllation
- NES/Famicom adapter
- Four Score adapter
- Custom PWB
- Aluminum shell
I have no idea how to price most of those components. I am sure the total comes in way below $579, but I don't think most people here arguing for Retrons really understand what's goes into that Analogue NT price tag. Anyone wanna do the math?
- Base moddable NES/Famicom unit
- NESRGB kit HW
- NESRBG kit installation
- Kevtris NES HDMI kit HW
- Kevtris NES HDMI kit instsllation
- NES/Famicom adapter
- Four Score adapter
- Custom PWB
- Aluminum shell
I have no idea how to price most of those components. I am sure the total comes in way below $579, but I don't think most people here arguing for Retrons really understand what's goes into that Analogue NT price tag. Anyone wanna do the math?
baphomet
Member
From what I understand, its RGB or HDMI. Not both.
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
This makes me want to get an RGB modded OG Famicom when I can. It seems to be the cheaper route and I guess I just need to find a modder when I'm ready.
A base front-loader NES is about $50. NESRGB kit is around $67 plus shipping. Installation would be around $50-$100, plus you might have to factor in shipping. I think considering all that, if you were to buy an NES pre-done with all that work it would run you around $250-300?
RadarScope1
Member
LOL. It's the Console Civil Wars.
And you can use it with a FDS. That's where I'm headed, I just know it...
And you can use it with a FDS. That's where I'm headed, I just know it...
NoFaceNico
Member
The Clone Wars!
Join the proletariat with the Super Retro Trio! We'll eat the rich together!
... I never thought about that! If it works, and I don't see why it wouldn't, that would be really cool!!
The RetronTrio is a great clone, especially if you're playing on a consumer-grade CRT. Imperfect, of course, but compatibility is great on Genesis and SNES, decent on NES, and audio and video are pretty damn accurate on all. Its controllers are also fantastic, and it's pretty damn cheap. I don't see what's poor about it, especially since no clone console is better.
Chittagong
Gold Member
Did someone say FDS?
Analogue NT is actually sized to sit with the FDS:
Analogue NT is actually sized to sit with the FDS:
baphomet
Member
Just because no clone is better, doesn't mean this one is good. Personally I see 0 reason for owning one. I could pick up an NES, Genesis, and SNES for the same price or less than the trio and not have to worry about it dying.
RadarScope1
Member
Did someone say FDS?
Analogue NT is actually sized to sit with the FDS:
Ah, well then, that's pretty cool.
You could pick up an NES, SNES, and a Genesis for less than $60 combined? If you say so...
Saying it's bad doesn't make it so and appears irrational at worst, particularly with arguments like above. As for reasons, convenience, cost, and ready availability are three big ones. But hey, kneejerk badmouthing works for some people, so more power to you.
Wouldn't a top loader be a fairer comparison? What about the multi tap? And doesn't the NESRGB kit destroy composite output? Is it even capable of component output as well? I'm genuinely curious, for as expensive as the AnalogueNT is, given the niche it serves, it doesn't seem to be quite as insane a markup as one would initially think.
baphomet
Member
Yes, I pick them up all the time for that and less.
Have you ever looked inside one of them? Have you seen customers come back asking why their trio/retron isn't working anymore because carts bent the pins in the console?
And no, the nesrgb outputs better composite than an unmodded nes, and yes, it outputs component with the add-on board.
RadarScope1
Member
So when I first saw the above pic of the Nt with the FDS, I was on my phone and didn't see that it's the same size as the FDS and is in fact sitting on top of one (turned sideways). That's neat - nice design touch.
NoFaceNico
Member
Ah, a reseller. Okay, no one's going to argue with you. I'm sure you can give me $3.50 in store credit for a top loader.
I laughed when you were talking about build quality and pins. Is there any console out there that has a more infamous reputation with its pins than the front-loading NES? They had a Kickstarter to create a solution.
I'm not aware of the bent pin problem with the SR3, but I've heard too many horror stories with the Retron 5. Also my local retro shop sells both and specifically recommend the SR3 over the R5 because of the pin problems they've seen first hand. A quick look at Amazon reviews seem to confirm this.
Speaking of quality, have you heard the one about the new clone console that hacks up the plastic on your carts? Want to hear something even funner? They're charging people almost $600 for it. Hell, I say they should just roll with it. Call it the Analogue NT Ginsu Edition.
Would you recommend someone pick up one of those cheap red colored Wii systems that Nintendo released late last gen? The ones that only support composite video and lack networking capabilities? If your ONLY concern is price then, by all means, something like a Retro Trio is not a bad choice. At that point, however, it seems silly to continue to invest in catridge games (which aren't getting cheaper) if you're going to use such a machine.
The Retro Trio strips away video features available on stock hardware. You cannot output in RGB, which both the Super Nintendo and Genesis are capable of out of the box. It is not 100% compatible with all games nor does it display games with perfect accuracy. There are currently emulators available which produce more accurate results.
What you get with the Retro Trio is low quality video output, inaccurate audio, and reduced compatibility. These things cannot be denied.
*IF* you want to save money and do not mind poor video output quality then the Trio is a decent choice. For anyone recommending the device I feel that its shortcomings need to be put forward. For myself, and many other retro gamers today, composite video simply is not acceptable (which is what the NES portion is limited to).
I believe that someone could do these clones better. They're all using similar variants of the same system on a chip. If someone were to take another shot at creating a better clone SoC while offering higher quality video output solutions then you might actually have a clone worth talking about. That's what we're really missing here. While I always prefer original hardware I would be interested in looking at an improved clone system that focuses on accuracy.
The NESRGB does not destroy composite output. On the contrary, it improves it while offering S-video and RGB output as well. It may be possible to implement component but it won't be necessary if RGB is handled properly.
We were the ones that brought this point up. It's a real issue on their part. The aluminum case is a problem.
The system is not, however, a clone system. Whether or not something is clone is not dictated by the external shell - it's all about the core components. It's original hardware slapped onto a new board. It's not a clone.
I still think an NES with an NESRGB board installed is the best solution and can be made for less money. You get the best results possible for a reasonable price.
Nostalgic Nightmare
Member
I sure as hell hope not. There is tech out there to get these systems on your flat screens without having to pay for some overpriced aluminium husk containing pillaged parts. This tiny lag introduction argument isn't very convincing either because if people cared that much they would have a CRT in the first place. Instead of raping consoles for chips, get a crt and a scart to component converter. You don't have to get some BVM/PVM for a great picture.
If these systems didn't take parts from existing consoles I wouldn't care, and I don't believe for a second these are all harvested from dead consoles.
$500 base / $80 for HDMI upgrade / $40 for an OEM controller should you desire and $19 for each extension cable. (You're going to need at least one to get from your entertainment kiosk to your Herman Miller chair)
I'm pretty sure this will fall on blind eyes anyways as people that would want this thing probably think the original famicom is ugly and having a crt visible will ruin chances of getting laid.
#sweeping generalizations/old jaded man
Chittagong
Gold Member
El Pescado
Member
I'm an old jaded man with a RGB modded SNES, but if Analogue put out an HDMI SNES with the same feature set as the NT I'd snap that up in a heartbeat. Hell, I'm super temped to get a HDmyboy and my RGB SNES with a Super GameBoy on a FrameMeister does pretty much the same thing
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
I don't like the idea of tearing apart old consoles to make some overpriced cart shredder.
If the original chips work then anything wrong with the original console is likely repairable.
I'd rather get a NESRGB modded frontloader with Blinking Light Win installed and use it with S-Video on my CRT.
If the original chips work then anything wrong with the original console is likely repairable.
I'd rather get a NESRGB modded frontloader with Blinking Light Win installed and use it with S-Video on my CRT.
magnumpy
Member
what a ripoff. $600? I can play NES emulators on my phone for free. I can play emulators on my PC for free.
I'll keep my $600 thanks. even when it was brand new the NES didn't cost $600. even the latest current generation consoles don't cost $600.
it was a funny bit of comedy I suppose. it's good for a laugh. everyone come and laugh at the funny joke.
I'll keep my $600 thanks. even when it was brand new the NES didn't cost $600. even the latest current generation consoles don't cost $600.
it was a funny bit of comedy I suppose. it's good for a laugh. everyone come and laugh at the funny joke.
IrishNinja
Member
fellow gaffer baphomet can RGB your NES for like, half this
real hardware, better IQ too - just puttin it out there
real hardware, better IQ too - just puttin it out there
Can he mod it to play Famicom games as well???=O
And the kind of people who would want something like this absolutely know this. They aren't satisfied with emulators.
A Twisty Fluken
Member
Allow me to echo, baphomet did a bang up job with my toploader and the thing is a monster.
baphomet
Member
Yes I could. They're the same hardware.
Nice!!!
RadarScope1
Member
You're good for a laugh. Thanks for playing. Maybe take a glance at the thread before commenting? Just a thought.
Chittagong
Gold Member
There is a valid argument that Analogue NT is overpriced compared to a NES + NESRGB + Kevtris HDMI kit, and that people are paying a lot for the design and convenience.
But Analogue NT being more expensive than playing pirated games on your phone or PC?
If you really understand this little of the topic you post in, and don't bother to read any of the information provided in the thread, then why post at all?
EDIT - It's sarcasm innit?