Apple sells 3 million new iPads in 3 days

InsecureGAF and iOS threads are like moths to a flame. The iPad is a legit gaming device, people need to get over it already.
 
Calisto Glory said:
i dont care as long as i cant play Gears of War 3 on an ipad ;)
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But you can get Shadowgun the best Gears of War clone iOS has to offer, yes I bought it and it is a pile of poo compared to a Gears game, heck Binary Domain is miles ahead of it. For iOS it's all right though.:)
 
FGMPR said:
InsecureGAF and iOS threads are like moths to a flame. The iPad is a legit gaming device, people need to get over it already.
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People here still think PC gaming is a small niche, I had an argument with a guy a month ago who tried to argue that multiplats can't sell anywhere near a million copies on PC.
 
shinra-bansho said:
And yet, there are numerous references to other products.

Your comment to which I responded, as far as I'm aware, was about products in general being considered overpriced when they're not selling in quantity. Except a premium price strategy does not make a product overpriced, since such model isn't intended to move product in large quantity.
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You responded to me saying that the iPad wasn't over priced. I wasn't talking about any other device nor was the person that I quoted either. The 3DS is a perfect example of an overpriced item.
 
And let's not forget things like "online passes" and holding back content (that's already on the disk!) to sell as day 1 DLC. That's what's really hurting the industry -- the unavoidable feeling that we are getting fucked.
 
ClovingSteam said:
Nope. I think the $60 price point is way too expensive as is the $40-50 for handheld games. There are Indie games that cost 1/4th of the retail games that offer 4x the game.
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I don't disagree that the price point is an issue, but going to the extreme other end isn't the solution. It's not sustainable in the long run and there is going to be fallout because of it.

A friend of mine who also works in the industry makes a good point that Apple doesn't have a stake in this and that's part of the problem too. They don't care if the industry lives or dies. They'll gladly reap the benefits of their platform playing games regardless of what happens to it because it's not important overall to them. Having that type of influence without caring what you're doing to the industry isn't a good thing.

dream said:
And let's not forget things like "online passes" and holding back content (that's already on the disk!) to sell as day 1 DLC. That's what's really hurting the industry -- the unavoidable feeling that we are getting fucked.
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That's a factor but not the only factor. That's the industry responding to what they feel is how they're losing money. Just like Apple is one factor, this is another factor. There are a lot of factors to what is going on in the industry, and it's heading nowhere good. Apple is in a way accelerating that problem and the pushing the bottom of the barrel pricing is part of that reason.
 
Painraze said:
So many people threatened by Apple... wow. It's a great piece of hardware that has quite a few fun games on it.
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Yeah it's pretty sad. It's an amazing device. It by no means replaces my Vita as a gaming device but it still has some fun games available.
 
Marty Chinn said:
I don't disagree that the price point is an issue, but going to the extreme other end isn't the solution. It's not sustainable in the long run and there is going to be fallout because of it.

A friend of mine who also works in the industry makes a good point that Apple doesn't have a stake in this and that's part of the problem too. They don't care if the industry lives or dies. They'll gladly reap the benefits of their platform playing games regardless of what happens to it because it's not important overall to them. Having that type of influence without caring what you're doing to the industry isn't a good thing.
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But I can't feel sorry for the industry going tithe other side of the spectrum as long as we have such shitty publishers and developers who are pushing their customers away. I have thousands of games that will keep me busy for the rest of my life if no new games were released this day forward.

I look at Valve, Blizzard, Nintendo, Naughty Dog, and a few other big developers who release quality upon quality. Then I see Bioware and it's handling of DA2 and their forums. I see EA with their handling of the forums, Origin, passes. I see Capcom with on disc DLC and atrocious DRM. The bad apples are screwing it for everyone else.
 
Marty Chinn said:
So you don't think the expected price point that Apple brings to the table is hurting the industry?
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How about the expected price point that Android users being to the table? The "problem" is not with Apple. It's with people who do not see the difference between a console-like experience (most Vita games) and Angry Birds. At least games on iOS actually sell well.
 
ClovingSteam said:
But I can't feel sorry for the industry going tithe other side of the spectrum as long as we have such shitty publishers and developers who are pushing their customers away. I have thousands of games that will keep me busy for the rest of my life if no new games were released this day forward.

I look at Valve, Blizzard, Nintendo, Naughty Dog, and a few other big developers who release quality upon quality. Then I see Bioware and it's handling of DA2 and their forums. I see EA with their handling of the forums, Origin, passes. I see Capcom with on disc DLC and atrocious DRM. The bad apples are screwing it for everyone else.
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I don't disagree with you. Look at Activision. They took hot series and made them into yearly updates that is pretty much killing their franchises one by one as a result. They've killed so many following this formula. Why? Profitable in the near term, but bad in the long term. Apple may look good in the near term and is hot right now, but it's bad for the long term.

The bottom line is, gamers want more but want to pay less. Apple enables that by making people feel they can get more by paying a lot less. It's not realistic or sustainable in the long run.

Again, I'm not saying Apple alone is killing the industry, but they aren't helping it one bit. They're making it worse. The industry is scrambling to try plug the holes and make things stable, but like a drowning person, they'll grab on to anything that feels like it can save them. Apple is just putting more holes into the ship quicker than the industry can handle.
 
Marty Chinn said:
Because Apple is damaging the industry right now. It's not the only factor, but it is a major contributing factor.
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Apple is damaging the industry?

Apple is actually managing to keep thousands of experienced game developers in a role where they continue to make games rather than making banking software, working in copy stores, or serving coffee. They are also grooming millions of otherwise disinterested consumers into being gamers by virtue of their devices conveniently being able to source and play games.

Apple isn't damaging anything. It is helping build a new gaming ecosystem that is rescuing people from the fallout of a ravaged console industry that imploded in October 2009.
 
I think browser games are hurting the industry more than cheap apps. Pretty hard to compete with free ad supported games like Castleville.
 
Ninja Scooter said:
Apple is catering to a segment of the industry that was completely underrepresented in the past.
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Who? Casuals? Web social gaming and Wii were catering to them just fine. Or are we talking about cheap people who would never bother with gaming unless it was 99 cents?

Piggus said:
How about the expected price point that Android users being to the table? The "problem" is not with Apple. It's with people who do not see the difference between a console-like experience (most Vita games) and Angry Birds. At least games on iOS actually sell well.
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Any Apple fan will tell you that Android is irrelevant when it comes to being profitable in apps compared to iOS. It's a drop in the bucket by comparison.

Pctx said:
I don't get how they're damaging the industry at all, they simply understand it better than the other contenders.
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The price point is not sustainable in the long run. That's a huge factor. That creates an expectation of price and then there is drawing users away because Apple is the hot thing now. What does Apple understand? Apple doesn't care. They never have. I can't blame them for that. Why dip their hand into something that they have no reason to care about? They reap the benefits, and leave behind a wasteland once they're done with it.


Mario said:
Apple is damaging the industry?

Apple is actually managing to keep tens of thousands of experienced game developers in a role where they continue to make games rather than making banking software, working in copy stores, or serving coffee. They are also grooming millions of otherwise disinterested consumers into being gamers by virtue of their devices conveniently being able to source and play games.

Apple isn't damaging anything. It is helping build a new gaming ecosystem that is rescuing people from the fallout of a ravaged console industry that imploded in October 2009.
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You're looking short term and not long term. The price point of 99 cent games is not sustainable. People expect cheap games but it can't last. Look at the large gap between those who succeed and everyone else. Is anyone else making Angry Bird numbers? You get the top 1% banking and making money while everyone else makes none. Sound familiar? The iOS market isn't getting any less crowded and it's much harder to discover as a result. Sure anyone can hit the lottery but when most of the industry can't make money, that doesn't make it a healthy scenario.

Again, short term it looks good but the long term effects are damaging.
 
People are hurting financially. Apple bills the iPad as a jack of all trades type machine. I think people are more likely to shell out ten dollars or less for a game rather than 59.99. Gaming is simply too expensive now. Hell, I think most of the Xbox Live and PSN games are overpriced as well.
 
Marty Chinn said:
Who? Casuals? Web social gaming and Wii were catering to them just fine. Or are we talking about cheap people who would never bother with gaming unless it was 99 cents?



Any Apple fan will tell you that Android is irrelevant when it comes to being profitable in apps compared to iOS. It's a drop in the bucket by comparison.



The price point is not sustainable in the long run. That's a huge factor. That creates an expectation of price and then there is drawing users away because Apple is the hot thing now. What does Apple understand? Apple doesn't care. They never have. I can't blame them for that. Why dip their hand into something that they have no reason to care about? They reap the benefits, and leave behind a wasteland once they're done with it.




You're looking short term and not long term. The price point of 99 cent games is not sustainable. People expect cheap games but it can't last. Look at the large gap between those who succeed and everyone else. Is anyone else making Angry Bird numbers? You get the top 1% banking and making money while everyone else makes none. Sound familiar? The iOS market isn't getting any less crowded and it's much harder to discover as a result. Sure anyone can hit the lottery but when most of the industry can't make money, that doesn't make it a healthy scenario.

Again, short term it looks good but the long term effects are damaging.
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You talking hardware or software? The market demand makes the games what they are, not the developer. Apple is simply the conduit, there really is no reason to hate them for getting developers back in the game. Like the PS3, the iPad is a gateway to entertainment of which Apple has done extremely well on. If anything your outrage should be against Sony or Nintendo for failing to understand the demo graphs these days.
 
THIS SCREEN.

omg...you guys have no idea! (unless you have one, of course). Dat reference-quality color reproduction. Dat pixel density. Dat contrast.

I think I'll pick one up for my mother. She'd love this screen.
 
Marty Chinn said:
Who? Casuals? Web social gaming and Wii were catering to them just fine. Or are we talking about cheap people who would never bother with gaming unless it was 99 cents?
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People who never spent a dime on games before, who are now collectively spending (or otherwise generating) hundreds of millions. This is "new revenue".


Any Apple fan will tell you that Android is irrelevant when it comes to being profitable in apps compared to iOS. It's a drop in the bucket by comparison.
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iOS leads the way, but Android can be meaningful if you approach it right. It makes up about 25% of our mobile revenues. That is not insignificant.


The price point is not sustainable in the long run. That's a huge factor. That creates an expectation of price and then there is drawing users away because Apple is the hot thing now. What does Apple understand? Apple doesn't care. They never have. I can't blame them for that. Why dip their hand into something that they have no reason to care about? They reap the benefits, and leave behind a wasteland once they're done with it.
Click to expand...

Apple are providing the marketplace, but they are not dictating how publishers monetize their content. The marketplace with many sellers collectively drove the price of of paid apps down.

Luckily, Apple provide many avenues to monetize content on their platform, some avenues in which they don't even participate financially.


You're looking short term and not long term.
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I can tell you I'm not. I'm betting my company on it.


The price point of 99 cent games is not sustainable. People expect cheap games but it can't last. Look at the large gap between those who succeed and everyone else. Is anyone else making Angry Bird numbers? You get the top 1% banking and making money while everyone else makes none. Sound familiar? The iOS market isn't getting any less crowded and it's much harder to discover as a result. Sure anyone can hit the lottery but when most of the industry can't make money, that doesn't make it a healthy scenario.
Click to expand...

Everybody knows that. Hence why people are moving away from that model.

The console industry hit a brick wall with the retail model too. Unfortunately, it couldn't evolve fast enough (nor did the major players want to).

There are plenty of ways to monetize content on iOS and mobile in general - paid downloads, IAP, ads, sponsorships, subscriptions, incentivized traffic, transmedia sales etc. Every serious developer is exploring more than one of these.
 
Marty Chinn said:
Who? Casuals? Web social gaming and Wii were catering to them just fine. Or are we talking about cheap people who would never bother with gaming unless it was 99 cents?
Click to expand...
Web social gaming and the Wii weren't catering to the "casuals" on the go. Which is another reason why gaming portables are always first in the line of fire when Apple diehards proclaim the greatness of their consumer electronic overlords.

You're looking short term and not long term. The price point of 99 cent games is not sustainable. People expect cheap games but it can't last. Look at the large gap between those who succeed and everyone else. Is anyone else making Angry Bird numbers? You get the top 1% banking and making money while everyone else makes none. Sound familiar? The iOS market isn't getting any less crowded and it's much harder to discover as a result. Sure anyone can hit the lottery but when most of the industry can't make money, that doesn't make it a healthy scenario.
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Do we have any solid sales numbers on pricier iOS games (that aren't ports of existing games) yet? I wonder which pricing model breaks first - the $60 blockbuster or the $0.99 "look at me too!" software.
 
Marty Chinn said:
You're looking short term and not long term. The price point of 99 cent games is not sustainable. People expect cheap games but it can't last. Look at the large gap between those who succeed and everyone else. Is anyone else making Angry Bird numbers? You get the top 1% banking and making money while everyone else makes none. Sound familiar? The iOS market isn't getting any less crowded and it's much harder to discover as a result. Sure anyone can hit the lottery but when most of the industry can't make money, that doesn't make it a healthy scenario.

Again, short term it looks good but the long term effects are damaging.
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Sustainability? The way games are currently developed on consoles isn't sustainable either. You know, an industry where one project could sink a company because it didn't hit a certain metacritic score.
 
As someone who can afford to buy a $60 game every week, $60 is way too much for most games. If Binary Domain came out on the PC at $60 it would just go onto the wishlist, but at $40 its a day one purchase. Spending a $1 on something that looks interesting is a no brainer, but I'm willing to pony up for more on IOS if the game is worth it, like Final Fantasy Tactics, which I never got around to on PSX.

$50 for a handheld game will chase away most consumers for good.
 
Aaron said:
As someone who can afford to buy a $60 game every week, $60 is way too much for most games. If Binary Domain came out on the PC at $60 it would just go onto the wishlist, but at $40 its a day one purchase
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Do you need to buy everything on day one? If you wait 2-3 months, you can get most games at $40.
 
Mario said:
People who never spent a dime on games before, who are now collectively spending (or otherwise generating) hundreds of millions. This is "new revenue".




iOS leads the way, but Android can be meaningful if you approach it right. It makes up about 25% of our mobile revenues. That is not insignificant.




Apple are providing the marketplace, but they are not dictating how publishers monetize their content. The marketplace with many sellers collectively drove the price of of paid apps down.

Luckily, Apple provide many avenues to monetize content on their platform, some avenues in which they don't even participate financially.




I can tell you I'm not. I'm betting my company on it.




Everybody knows that. Hence why people are moving away from that model.

The console industry hit a brick wall with the retail model too. Unfortunately, it couldn't evolve fast enough (nor did the major players want to).

There are plenty of ways to monetize content on iOS and mobile in general - paid downloads, IAP, ads, sponsorships, subscriptions, incentivized traffic, transmedia sales etc. Every serious developer is exploring more than one of these.
Click to expand...

Wait, your studio created Shatter? Looooove that game!!
 
I'm enjoying gaming on my iPad. I'm sitting in front of a big HD tv with a Wii, 360 and PS3 all hooked up, but for whatever reason, I'm drawn to it for my gaming fix. Maybe it's just because it's a new toy, maybe I'm just getting old, but simpler, relaxing, touch gaming can be quite satisfying. I think Apple is on to something here, without them even really trying.
 
Mario said:
Thanks. Shatter might even make its way to iOS one day :)

A lot of the stuff we are doing now is in the mobile and tablet space (www.pikpok.com), though we aren't quite done with console or PC yet.
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Dude, YES. Bring it to iOS and it will be day 1. It's games like Shatter that make Steam so fantastic. Congrats on all of your present and hopefully future success!
 
Mario said:
Apple is damaging the industry?

Apple is actually managing to keep thousands of experienced game developers in a role where they continue to make games rather than making banking software, working in copy stores, or serving coffee. They are also grooming millions of otherwise disinterested consumers into being gamers by virtue of their devices conveniently being able to source and play games.

Apple isn't damaging anything. It is helping build a new gaming ecosystem that is rescuing people from the fallout of a ravaged console industry that imploded in October 2009.
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<3 <3 <3
Indie dev thrives on the appstore. It feels good supporting them.
 
I like gaming on the iPad and iPod as it's brought a lot of innovation and experimentation about what a game can be as well as reasonable versions of traditional games.
I've been gaming since the 80's and it does feel like that era of gaming where there were no set rules and risks were taken.

I see a lot of people against Apple gaming as they can see how popular the devices are and how much press coverage they are getting and probably assume that it will kill thier traditional consoles. I really doubt that will happen, what will happen is companies will learn from what's happening on iOS and take the best parts and build them into the console model benefiting all gamers.
 
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