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Arrow Season 4 |OT| A Tale of Salt and Fire
- Thread starter ZeroX03
- Start date
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CW probably can't even afford Ron Perlman
Anyone can afford Ron Perlman.
PHOENIXZERO
Member
Son of a... Thank you!
I really need to step up posting, not watching live kind of hurts.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
That box didn't look mystical on the inside. Anyone have a screengrab of it?
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
My money is on it being Thanagarian.
This almost mirrors my own thoughts. I feel that drinking scene between Diggle and Ollie is noteworthy. I hope the comic book readers like this character as much as the original TV incarnation.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
She felt uneasy about the relationship because she loved him. It is the most CW thing to ever happen on the CW: "I can't be with Oliver because I love him so damn much!"
Oliver should have left her when he caught that 'cause she be crazy. He should check the condoms for pin holes from now on.
It's also the most human thing. She was blaming herself for not being there to save Ray because she ran off like a fool to bang Ollie around the globe.
"I would have never left like that"
"Am I still the same person I was before all this?"
It's a perfectly normal reaction for some. The issue was that it took a front seat in terms of the episode.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
It would be out of character for her to try and assume Ray is alive. She never did it with Sara, Malcom, Ras, or who else of importance that "died". If she knew Ray was alive she wouldn't have left (Oliver wouldn't have left either cause they're friends). Felicity has only thought one person was alive after being "dead" and that's Oliver.
For her to find Ray after his "death" would have been out of character, so, no, you are wrong, and she's a liar who doesn't know her own god damn story.
1. Two of those are evil villains, the other is Ollie's ex, of course she'll easily assume they are dead (subconsciously at least). Also she was in a romantic relationship with Ray, of course she would give a damn
2. That's the whole point. That's where the conflict comes from. She shouldn't have left.
3. Ollie doesn't give a shit about Ray. He swooped in, took the girl, and electrocuted Roy half to death. He was willing to let Lyla die or at least take the risk, S3 Ollie gave zero fucks.
4. Her staying around trying to find the body or any shred of evidence is what Felicity would have done, it wouldn't be out of character. It's literally the entire point of the character moments.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
1. So? If she cares so much she would follow up but that's not her.
2. She had evidence he was dead. He was disintegrated in his experiment. She accepted that. She understood that. No reasonable person would have said, "maybe he somehow survived and is captured by someone?" Because you wouldn't assume after the explosion he was kidnapped if he was alive. There was no evidence for that and it would be out of character for her to go off "HE'S ALIVE". She wasn't being lied to by Malcom.
3. Oliver and Ray are friends. Do you not watch the show? Think Oliver would have said, "fuck him, let's bang" if he knew Ray was alive and kidnapped? That would be out of character as well.
4. When has she done this before outside of being fed information by the series ultimate antagonist?
You can admit something is corny and things will still be right with the universe.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
My god! By calling me a troll you've invalidated my argument! What an insightful post in a discussion you weren't even participating in.
1+2. She refused to accept that Oliver died after going to face Ra's.
3. I made a point to say Season 3 Oliver. You said if they thought Ray was alive, none of them would have left. Oliver at the end/near the end of season 3 was still a self-important dick who was willing to risk the life of his best friend's life.
4. I don't even know what point you're trying to make. I get it, you don't like the Felicity and everything that surrounds her. But there was nothing wrong with the story.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
1+2. Duh, she was being told that by Merlyn. They rarely believe anything that dude says anyway. Her disbelief has merit. She was told by investigators he was disintegrated in his experiment and by her own admission she accepts that. What thought process would she have had to go through to assume Ray was alive? This is the big part. She says she was blinded by love but that's BS since she would have had to heard Ray died and skipped town considering the time frame of the last episode.
3. And? He was doing that to stop Ras. He had no intention of killing them. He says this as well. This was part of Dig and Olly's friendship repair session.
4. This isn't a counter or response to my argument but a way to say I just hate thing and story is good. Need something more substantial than that.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
Ah, I forgot that Hawkman and Hawkgirl were going to show up. I didn't think they'd actually be aliens though.
I don't think they're supposed to be, pretty sure they're doing the reincarnated version. Unless it's a twisted combination of the two.
It doesn't matter if Merlyn brought back Oliver's severed dead arm. She still wouldn't have believed him and hoped Oliver was alive. She doesn't give up on those she has romantic interest in, we even saw a glimpse of that in the (god-awful) Felicity flashback episode.
And rational thinking isn't exactly something grieving people do. It's incredibly easy for someone to hear there is no body and be in complete denial. I don't think they ever intended to not return to Star City, though it's up for interpretation. But you're missing the entire point still. She is just now finally grieving over Ray only to find he is actually alive. She could have found him much sooner (and maybe before Dahrk found him) if she was back in the city and not banging Ollie 24/7. That's the entire point.
morningbus
Serious Sam is a wicked gahbidge series for chowdaheads.
My theory is that they're doing an origin somewhat similar to the Justice League cartoon, minus the invasion storyline.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
No one believes Merlyn because he's an asshole. He could have brought his corpse with DNA, video, etc. and no one would believe him. At this point the show makes him out to be the type to do this.
You can write the "point" how you want, it was still corny, dumb, and laughable. No amount of spin will make it good writing or consistent. You can try to make the characters more intelligent than they seem but we get what we're shown: Felicity loves Oliver, Ray dies, a quick amount of time passes and they move out, (during that time Felicity accepts Ray died because of the reports surrounding his death), Felicity finds out Ray is alive and she wants to save him (like every one else). Her questioning her relationship with Oliver is meaningless and melodramatic; this type of dialogue belongs on a soap opera. You're trying really hard to make something corny into something good.
PhoncipleBone
Banned
Amell in 9th grade after catching a garter at a wedding. There is hope for us all.
OdysseusVA
Banned
His eyyyyeeeesss
I'm not saying it's good, but it's not corny, dumb, or laughable either. It's a thing that makes sense in the context of what happened. Like I said the problem isn't the writing, it was how prominent those moments were. I'd agree with you if you said that Felicity's mom is the most useless character in the show. She only shows up for episode filler and does nothing but reminds us Felicity has a dad, and now the writers expect us to want her and Lance to do the deed.
Eh, we've had enough "mid-season big bad comes in and destroys everyone" sort of ordeal. I much prefer the brisker pace.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
You are saying it's good. You would not defend it like so if it was corny. You would admit it's corny and be OK with it.
It's not consistent because she's not consistent with deaths, and just because she doesn't give up on people doesn't mean she gave up on Ray's death. That's the crux of it all: she accepted Ray's death. Him being alive lets them play this card. Would she have brought this up if he wasn't alive? No.
Dongs Macabre
aka Daedalos42
Probably made of Nth metal or something.
I'm defending it because you're being overly negative towards something simply because you don't like the character. It's not corny, corny would be another stupid fucking love triangle because her former lover is alive. Processing emotions is not corny.
The only comparable death we have is Oliver's. That's all. And she didn't react to Ray as she did to Oliver's death. That's all there is to it, and that's why she got so upset. He accepted Rays death because she was so caught up in Oliver to properly grieve and process anything, and that's why she's upset now. It's not here to create melodramatic CW drama, but to actually grow and show character growth instead of them all being cardboard cutouts of people that they were in the first season and the one dimensional stand ins that they were in season 3.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
This isn't about grieving, it's about saving and believing they were alive. She says this in the episode. This is corny. She has only cared about 1 "death" so far and that's Oliver and she questions it because a very shady individual who has been known to lie (Malcom) said he's dead and listen to my orders. She was given reports on Ray's incident and accepted that. These are two different scenarios because 1 is questionable while the other appears sold (except if you think he can shrink and was kidnapped). Her looking for a dead person is out of character.
It's corny.
But Ray isn't just some random dead dude. She was in a relationship with him and loved him.
Septimus Prime
Member
I really, really would have liked to have seen Ra's vs Damien.
Maybe in a flashback about Damien's origins? We're due a backstory sometime at least
Subpar Spatula
Banned
And she didn't do anything. This situation allowed them to play a dumb card and it makes crappy sense. It's corny and dumb. It's CW relationship drama.
4x8 description.
PART TWO OF THE EPIC CROSSOVER WITH THE FLASH Oliver (Stephen Amell) and Barry Allen (guest star Grant Gustin) take Kendra Saunders (guest star Ciara Renée) and Carter Hall (guest star Falk Henstchel) to a remote location to keep them hidden from Vandal Savage (guest star Casper Crump) while they figure out how to defeat him. Malcolm (John Barrowman) arranges a meeting between Vandal, Green Arrow and The Flash that doesnt go as planned. Meanwhile, Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards), Thea (Willa Holland), Diggle (David Ramsey) and Laurel (Katie Cassidy) work with Team Flash to come up with a weapon powerful enough to destroy Vandal Savage.
You make it sound like it's all some sort of a master melodramatic plan to cause drama for no reason. Instead it's just "oh we did this, can't really ignore it, how should we address it?"
There is nothing inherently wrong or corny with how the episode unfolded. Like I said it would be corny to have another love triangle because Ray is alive. But they aren't going to do that thankfully. Though I'm not going to continue to run in circles.
Gee Malcom I wonder what could possibly go wrong >.> but hey we get Barry and the Barrowman on screen together maybe? What a time to be alive
Subpar Spatula
Banned
Not a master, just it comes off corny like a lot of things in Arrow. Do you honestly look at that segment and go, "Well, that was OK work?" Naw, it was bad, corny, and other words to describe it. The dialogue alone about it is bad. Makes little sense, badly written, and makes you cringe. The jokes online about it online should have cued you in into how bad it was.
He already did that enough, but I think they'll do another big fight in the mid-season finale.
BigJonsson
Member
I like how Sarah goes on a murderous rage and her dad is just happy to have his daughters back at home lol
"Hey, I changed my entire personality for this one guy. That is scary."
Which is something anyone that is really in love notices.
Yeah Felicity's dilemma is not a hard one to understand. People in relationships can be myopic and lose sight of their priorities. Ray aside, she abandoned Palmer Tech and the rest of her life for Oliver, until returning. It's not healthy, but it's incredibly common.
Like for The CW, other than the fruity "lose myself" phrasing it's actually a pretty realistic representation of whirlwind romance.
brotkasten
Member
I love Darhk, but I don't know why. I assume it must be the way he looks and the way he's portrayed. He's just so ... efficient and cold. The actor is doing that really well.
However, the problem is that there's nothing that sets him apart from the others. "First, I'm going to clean up Star City, and then, the rest of the wooooorld! *evil laugh and mustache twirling*"
Star City being this stand-in for Gotham, a city that can not be saved, is a little old. I'm not familiar with the Green Arrow comics, so I don't know what else they could do, but I wish it would be something other than "Star City needs to go doooooown!"
And whoever said the cast needs trimming is absolutely right. It's not even exciting anymore to see that many people fight at once. In the last episode it looked like a choreography and not some all out battle. At least Sara should be gone from TV City for a while now. Also, dear TV and movie people, please stop making furniture bulletproof. When a bullet hits a sofa, there are not to be any sparks flying around.
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