The whole Gaikai thing might take off, but it certainly is not for me. I have no interest in playing video games with added extra network input lag.
Also, has the overall reaction been positive? You know considering MS were slammed so hard for pushing always online / games locked to accounts etc. This seems the ultimate end of that.
The reaction has been positive because it's just another useful service they're pushing out while still giving people a choice. You can still buy all your games physically on PS4.
Basically they're just letting any transition to always online happen naturally as more people get used to the idea and more people start using it. They're not trying to force it like Microsoft did.
The reaction has been positive because it's just another useful service they're pushing out while still giving people a choice. You can still buy all your games physically on PS4.
Basically they're just letting any transition to always online happen naturally as more people get used to the idea and more people start using it. They're not trying to force it like Microsoft did.
Oh I completely understand that, but I was suggesting that streaming service is the ultimate end game. Not that it is at the moment.
And, btw, what choice. You can't play your existing PS1/2/3 games on your PS4. So the only choice is a streaming service. I presume where you have to repurchase/subscribe to your previously purchased content?
I know I am being slightly obtuse here, but I do find the differing takes on it interesting from a consumer perspective and how effective Sony was at marketing that 'no drm' thing to the nth degree, so much so that they got away with adding extra payment layers to their new console (ie. pay to play MP).
I don't hate the idea of a subscription service that lets me access a large back catalogue of old games on a ton of different devices, but like many things, it comes down to price and performance.
If it ultimately means that future systems are online, subscription based only, then
Well, if you have existing games you can likely play them on the existing console. If you don't like the streaming service you can still hunt down the second-hand games and systems. It's not perfect but whatever.
Oh I completely understand that, but I was suggesting that streaming service is the ultimate end game. Not that it is at the moment.
And, btw, what choice. You can't play your existing PS1/2/3 games on your PS4. So the only choice is a streaming service. I presume where you have to repurchase/subscribe to your previously purchased content?
I know I am being slightly obtuse here, but I do find the differing takes on it interesting from a consumer perspective and how effective Sony was at marketing that 'no drm' thing to the nth degree, so much so that they got away with adding extra payment layers to their new console (ie. pay to play MP).
Should't we expect more out of these companies? Like, you know, software emulation, it's been done by individuals not affiliated with the console manufacturers for years, I am sure Sony, Microsoft and to a lesser extent Nintendo could do this but instead we pat them on the back for a streaming service.
edit: obviously emulating PS3 and 360 games is probably a big ask but the older games should be doable.
Should't we expect more out of these companies? Like, you know, software emulation, it's been done by individuals not affiliated with the console manufacturers for years, I am sure Sony, Microsoft and to a lesser extent Nintendo could do this but instead we pat them on the back for a streaming service.
I'm surprised an ISP hasn't already struck up a deal with Sony to provide unmetered content. Would be great if iiNet did, but don't they already have a deal with MS?
Should't we expect more out of these companies? Like, you know, software emulation, it's been done by individuals not affiliated with the console manufacturers for years, I am sure Sony, Microsoft and to a lesser extent Nintendo could do this but instead we pat them on the back for a streaming service.
Lesser extent? They're the worst of them all! Their consoles are much easier to emulate compared to the old PS consoles and they have the biggest library of games to put out but they aren't doing anything with it.
Heck, they're even drip feed re-releasing all the VC games that already came out on the Wii, like SMB3 which just came out on Wii U.
Emulating PS1 games on PS4 should be done, I agree. PS2 games are a little trickier, it's been done on PS3 before but from all accounts it really is a huge pain in the ass.
PS3 emulation is probably impossible to do with the PS4 hardware.
Lesser extent? They're the worst of them all! Their consoles are much easier to emulate compared to the old PS consoles and they have the biggest library of games to put out but they aren't doing anything with it.
Heck, they're even drip feed re-releasing all the VC games that already came out on the Wii, like SMB3 which just came out on Wii U.
Emulating PS1 games on PS4 should be done, I agree. PS2 games are a little trickier, it's been done on PS3 before but from all accounts it really is a huge pain in the ass.
PS3 emulation is probably impossible to do with the PS4 hardware.
As much as his games aren't good these days, I say it needs some big hitting titles to start getting people interested in it from a consumer point of view.
Speaking of the rift has the CES rift been revealed yet?
With a multitude of compatibility problems and bugs for every individual title. You put up with that stuff when you're downloading an emulator and getting things running on your own, but it would not be acceptable as a commercial product.
Ownership is overrated. It's nice to have as an option, but what percentage of games you've played have you gone back and played to completion again? I bet for the average punter that figure is extremely low, less than 1%. I'm not convinced of the tech of game streaming yet, but if I can have a working Spotify like service for games where I can subscribe and play everything available, that would suit me better than have ten worthless copies of FIFA in my cupboard.
With a multitude of compatibility problems and bugs for every individual title. You put up with that stuff when you're downloading an emulator and getting things running on your own, but it would not be acceptable as a commercial product.
edit: I know we can talk value proposition, ie gaikai brings a return, it just irks me when people thank a company for something like this, as if it's a pro-consumer thing. But in all seriousness nothing is business is pro-consumer, that doesn't make money.
It's giving them control of both the emulation, and the hardware that it's running on. Maybe they'll change the soundchip manufacturer in PS4 slim or something, who knows. So now they need to make sure not just that all the PS4 games run, but that all their emulators do too. I doubt this is economically viable for games that barely anyone plays. Backwards compatibility for a twenty year old console is really just a marketing tick box and not really something that end users are going to spend much money on.
Sony have been doing more right lately than the other two. When they fuck up, people will pounce on them. Of course there are the staunch unwavering supporters of all 3 "teams", but most aren't afraid to put the boot into any of them if they do something stupid.
Really, the Microsoft hate from a few months back has cooled down a lot now, and even Nintendo has been getting a decent amount of love based on their quality game releases in the later half of 2013.
On the topic of depth, something that I really only noticed since owning High Speed is that depth really isn't the be-all and end-all of pinball machines. For example (this will take a bit) the main rule of HS is as follows: There are three banks of targets, each have a green, yellow and red (traffic lights, duh). You have to light all targets to start the main mode (running the red light aka multiball) and they can only be lit in their colour groups from green to red. So green three times, then yellow, then red. Then you have to make a somewhat tricky loop shot twice, once to "run the red light" and then next to "escape/get away" from the cops. Multiball starts, then if you hit this loop again during multiball, you get the jackpot. That's basically the entire game, save for a few features here and there (certainly not full modes).
But, I can't stop playing it. That's because it's tricky as hell, so it's likely there's a balance between how easy a game is (to keep the ball in play, not to necessarily complete) and how deep the ruleset needs to be. Another great example is Bride of Pinbot (which Mar will be able to attest to). I'm yet to play it in person, but it has a similarly basic aim and there's not necessarily much to do other than that. But it's easy to understand, not as brutal as High Speed and it's known as a great table for good players and beginners because it's not so deep in that you feel you're missing out if you don't play the hell out of it.
Um, so none of that probably makes much sense, but my point is that you shouldn't think you need to get a game that's deep in order to get extended playtime out of it. I guess it's like going to a carnival... if it's only got a few rides but they're all rad, you don't mind (even if it means you don't stay there for too long) as long as you have fun with them. But if you go some place that has lots and lots of rides, it can take a lot of effort to see all of them and feel like you've gotten your money's worth (and that's if they're all good).
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I guess when I say depth I'm really saying 'oh God I don't want to get bored of this in a month and have this giant expensive thing in my mancave that I'm already sick of'. But hell, you could say Street Fighter is boring, or Crackdown, or whatever because it's relatively simple as far as video games go, but they're my home.
Funny you should mention Jurassic Park, because I was about to say that's up there in the 'good and affordable' bracket! Fiona loves this machine actually and wanted us to buy one...
A couple that I've thought of listed in the order I'd rank them:
If you wanted to go a bit more retro and give up the 'deep' ruleset requirement, I think these are just as good machines and can be had for less and are just as playable in my opinion, just much less complicated:
Wow. Thanks so very much for posting this. I think there's some great machines in here! And it's good to get more opinions on the Jurassic Park machine, I wasn't sure if I was just being nostalgic
OK so two things that come to mind after reading this post. The first is that I realised that many of these tables, while I have never played them before, were in the Williams Pinball collection game I have for the Wii, so I fired that up last night to give them a bash. I was expecting many of them to feel simple and outdated a bit, but good lord I ended up staying up way too late having a blast with some of them. Even though it's a video game version of pinball it really delivered the 'mechanical' feel and certainly made me realise how artificial (but still fun) the tables I play in Pinball FX 2 are.
Of the Williams tables, the ones I enjoyed the most are Gorgar (WELL DONE MAR ON SCORING THIS!), I've always heard positive things about it but never had a chance to play it before. Pinbot kinda left me cold but I absolutely loved Whirlwind for some reason. Maybe the bright visuals, maybe the spinners in the middle of the table which kept things interesting. Space Shuttle was a lot of fun, even though the table itself looked mostly empty, and I'm looking forward to going back to it. I think I need to pick up the PS3 version of this for the nicer visuals though, I mean, I love my retro game graphics but 580i on the Wii is not pretty. The Black Knight table felt too busy for the Wii screen (and how far away I sit from the TV, I might as well be playing on a 3DS XL)...
Oh! Funhouse! That was cool! I actually figured out how to get somewhere in it! That's a big achievement for me.
Yeah, mostly the same...UNTIL I REMEMBERED THE OTHER THING THAT CAME TO MIND, A REPRESSED MEMORY OF LITTLE GAZUNTA:
I totally forgot that, when I was about 11 or so, my parents rented a pinball table for a week! Man. I had completely lost that memory until I was playing the Wii last night and got reminded about how mechanically clunky and loud these machines were. My parents knew someone who worked for an amusement machine operator back in the day, and he'd always have an arcade machine of sorts at his house when we visited. I remember being besotted with a Space Invaders cocktail cabinet they had a lot. For some reason (I guess I was really good at nagging? I was a spoiled little bastard) the parents decided to rent out a pinball table for our spare room for a week and man WAS I THE COOLEST KID IN CLASS. It was like that episode of Simpsons where they get a pool.
No idea what that machine was. I'm tempted to spend the day going through images of random machines and hope something clicks.
Damn, I loved having a pinball machine. FUCK. This is gonna be an expensive exercise haha.
Few things (screw multiquoting):
So, having a kind of a think... this is what comes to mind:
* The Data East/Sega cheapies: Last Action Hero, Baywatch, Batman Forever, WWF (though I believe this might fetch good prices), Back to the Future.
* Lesser-loved/cheaper Bally/Williams titles: Congo, Demolition Man, Johnny Mnemonic, No Fear, Flintstones, Dirty Harry.
Almost forgot, the two Terminator games could probably also be had for a good price. I have a feeling T2 might be a bit of a bargain at the moment?
Oh, and Star Wars Trilogy might be going for a good price too.
Ooooh man Demolition Man was a good table. For some reason we had a Demolition Man machine in the comic shop I worked at. It was supposed to make money from the kids wandering in from the school across the road but we ended up just putting it on free play all day.
Was T2 the one with the gun on it that you could aim?
And is the Back to the Future table actually....good?
Wow. The more I think about it the more I realise I actually have a bit of a pinball history.
I really like it. Funny story, back in the day when I basically lived in arcades and thought pinball machines were stupid, Police Force was the only pinball machine that I enjoyed playing. I hadn't touched it since those days until I found one at Pinfest last year and fully expected to have 'outgrown' it, now that I supposedly understand pinball and have learnt how to play. But nope, still a fantastic machine to play. I hope to own one of my own some day.
I said so on Twitter which is the only place I actively talk these days. I don't post much in forums or anything anymore. I got it for a bargain price through a friend in one of my leagues who knew I loved the game and he wanted to make some room for a new pin or two. I wasn't looking to buy a Gorgar just yet as there are a number of machines I'd rather get, but at the price I couldn't say no.
And I really do love Gorgar.
Descending into madness buying a second pinball machine...
Edit: Oh and when I say a bargain price, I actually mean a fair price as opposed to the bloated prices you pay for everything these days. That's the advantage of getting to know these guys in leagues, they treat you like an equal and aren't out to steal your wallet.
Blah, just realised tonight how much of a depressed shell I've been for the last few weeks since I hadn't seen any classic Simpsons since November. Beer Baron has cleansed the soul. Might have to really treat myself and breakout the DVD commentaries later on tonight.
Simpsons commentaries got me through the last few months of my previous job. No need to actually watch the video, and it gave me something to listen to while processing sales figures from one spreadsheet into another all day every day.
Yeah, good use of my skillset there guys, well done
Congrats! You now officially meet the requirements to be on the front bench of parliament! Make sure to pick up your chosen bigotry topic on the way past Tony's office. I think we still have given (legitimate) non-profit organisations an easy run lately, taking a shot at them should get you into the Brandy Club in the old boys chambers pretty quickly.
Awesome! Here's my 3-point plan for running Australia:
1) Change the national anthem to Cold Chisel's "Cheap Wine and a Three Day Growth'
2) Enclose Western Sydney in a plexiglass bubble
3) Hand over complete control of the company to Google
And thanks for the heads up about PSN. I'll just stick to my AU account I guess? Is it easy to switch accounts on PS3?
So so true. I'm making my life harder than it needs to be with the book, too. There's three strips to do this week for the book (in addition to the usual one for the site) and I stupidly made one of them really complex and a full page. Agh. I'm an idiot. Gotta keep plugging away at it too. I keep telling myself it'll get better when I eventually get that bastard Surface Pro 2
Hey Gaz, Mar: Just found this site which has eBay auction results from around the world (including AU) for all pinball machines listed. Might be a good way to get ideas on pricing
Ownership is overrated. It's nice to have as an option, but what percentage of games you've played have you gone back and played to completion again? I bet for the average punter that figure is extremely low, less than 1%. I'm not convinced of the tech of game streaming yet, but if I can have a working Spotify like service for games where I can subscribe and play everything available, that would suit me better than have ten worthless copies of FIFA in my cupboard.
Yeah. I've been coming to that way of thinking a fair bit lately (hence me buying almost zero video things on disc last year (just a single BluRay of an anime series)) and being more and more comfortable just using streaming video services.
Music has been a bit different though simple to to content access (theres types of music I like that no music subscription service in Australia offers) as well as my preference for non lossy audio formats.
And books I still continue to buy in dead tree, especially non fiction. In part because I get heachaches from longterm tablet use that I don't get from dead tree books, and also fonts and layout on ebooks (leaving aside PDFs) is just godawful. That matters less with fiction, but for non fiction its a big deal for me.
You can use any accounts you want on PS3.
You can buy games on the US PSN with a US account and then play them on your AUS PSN account.
Main thing is deciding which digital PSN account you are already keen on. I had an account name picked out well in advance and then bought a few games on it, so I decided to stay with my AUS account rather than buy a US PS+ subscription.
Also future proofs it in case the PS5 is region locked even though Sony have never done it before!
Vita makes you use only one account per memory card, so having everything on my AUS account makes it easy to transfer stuff back and forth.
And books I still continue to buy in dead tree, especially non fiction. In part because I get heachaches from longterm tablet use that I don't get from dead tree books, and also fonts and layout on ebooks (leaving aside PDFs) is just godawful. That matters less with fiction, but for non fiction its a big deal for me.
Yeah. I've been coming to that way of thinking a fair bit lately (hence me buying almost zero video things on disc last year (just a single BluRay of an anime series)) and being more and more comfortable just using streaming video services.
Music has been a bit different though simple to to content access (theres types of music I like that no music subscription service in Australia offers) as well as my preference for non lossy audio formats.
And books I still continue to buy in dead tree, especially non fiction. In part because I get heachaches from longterm tablet use that I don't get from dead tree books, and also fonts and layout on ebooks (leaving aside PDFs) is just godawful. That matters less with fiction, but for non fiction its a big deal for me.
I think it's come to the way I like to consume things. I still like the sensation of 'ownership' in terms of stuff I, well, want to own, but Netflix etc. and other streaming services are just fine for stuff I think of as disposable entertainment.
It's kind of crept up on me. I think the real kicker was signing up for Crunchyroll last year and watching a shittonne of anime on that. Now, I don't really actually want to own a lot of anime because a lot of it is not very good, but I sure as fuck want to watch it to see if it's worth owning.
PS+ is kind of the same thing: stuff I may want to 'own', but stuff I definitely want to at least try to play.
You're right about books though, books, especially ones you want to flip through non-sequentially or to reference, need to stay in dead tree form otherwise they're not as good. But comics... comics might be something I'd pay a monthly fee for a streaming service access...
I've thought about it, but I have been waiting on colour eInk. Which I guess at this point won't happen given Amazon has embraced non eInk displays for kindles.
It's kind of crept up on me. I think the real kicker was signing up for Crunchyroll last year and watching a shittonne of anime on that. Now, I don't really actually want to own a lot of anime because a lot of it is not very good, but I sure as fuck want to watch it to see if it's worth owning.
Yeah. Netflix, Crunchyroll turned me around on it. Part of it was pretty low cost for streaming quality that's good enough. I've started to feel less of a need to own everything in pristine 1080p/5.1 lossless than I have in the past. Of course part of that is I'm spending more and more watching time watching anime and so that content benefits less from the BluRay treatment anyway.
You're right about books though, books, especially ones you want to flip through non-sequentially or to reference, need to stay in dead tree form otherwise they're not as good. But comics... comics might be something I'd pay a monthly fee for a streaming service access...
Comics I actually prefer digitally these days. Though non onsale US comics are a bit too expensive for me and Manga is a bit of a pain due to the hoops I need to jump though (having to use US only services from Australia).
The person who got eliminated first, can someone tell me (spoiler tags plz) what their profession/specialty/claim-to-fame was? I don't want to try looking it up because it might spoil the rest of the show.
Man, that was INTENSE. I take it the first episode is only a taste of how full-on it gets?
to be honest, the most convenient way to access manga these days is STILL, amazingly, to [snip! - ed]. I buy the stuff I really like, of course. Fucking hurry up with those Toradora releases, damnit.
Wow that looks awesome. I can't say there were too many good Ocean games back in the day (they mostly farmed out sub-par movie licenses), but I bet the book is a hell of a story of one of the biggest publishers of the day.
As for pinball (again). My advice is to keep an eye on this site. They just received another couple of container loads of games and sell a lot of them 'as is', meaning 'bargains'. I got my Bride of Pinbot from here for a fantastic price and it works perfectly (after a couple of tweaks): http://www.pinball-machines-australia.com.au/category/forsale/
I know. Its a crime the best option is scanlation apps. Which is why I've been so happy to see Crunchyroll get into it. They just need to expand to other publishers.
A few members of the AusGAF Steam chat have been using it to just post whatever the fuck we see. It's kind of just a collection of photos that AusGAF decides to take.
If any of y'all want to get in on this extremely dumb, pretty cool thing, get the popular phone executable, "Snapchat", add the account "open-snaps", and start sending random pictures. And look at other people's dumb, random pictures!
I dunno, I find this shit real neat. Figured some people in the thread might, too.
That makes no sense to me! Why call it an Australian server but don't have it in Australia? Do they just block any IP address that isn't in Australia? Seems odd!
Are our servers overpriced or something?
