The Faceless Master
Member
you have to complete a game for it to count as a win or loss.
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Battlefield 3 | Console Community Thread | Pleasant Entertainment
- Thread starter Dreamgazer
- Start date
you have to complete a game for it to count as a win or loss.
Dreamgazer
Member
Yep, but if you look at the stats, JJD and Dan are not playing predominately recon.
Also, I said your statement is false based on this:
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
Dreamgazer
Member
While we're on the subject, let's also start up a convo on the validity of all engineer squads (on kharg, capsin). 
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
While we're on the subject, let's also start up a convo on the validity of all engineer squads (on kharg, capsin).
100% good...ish
I'll give you that. I'm just trolling you guys right now til the diablo servers are back online.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
Gonna wait untill "Starter Edition" goes public to see if my comp can play it
Was offered a code, but may be leaving for 2 weeks
Since my friends are not cool and only play FPS or sport games I got two passes for Diablo III.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
I'll wait...
Dreamgazer
Member
I'll wait till it's free to play + whenever I pass the cpa, cgma, cfp, and my health exams.
orz.
Should just cut bf3/porn from my life also.
orz.
Should just cut bf3/porn from my life also.
The Faceless Master
Member
While we're on the subject, let's also start up a convo on the validity of all engineer squads (on kharg, capsin).
need 1 support.
Yeah, but who's going to play that support when everyone on GAF wants to play Engineer 24/7.
Oh, wait, that's me. Just like I have to fucking play Recon because neither class wants to be used.
TN: You so mad, bro. Chill. The issue is: Recons can give proper heads up but most recons don't want to do that and think it's a "sniping class" more than a "gives a heads up" class. Therein is the issue and why you think it's a bad class for Metro.
Far from it: If you put the beacons where they can show someone coming around a corner (or even in a hallway) you can catch people off guard. And since half the maps are chokepoints this is powerful.
Sure, heals and revives are nice, but if someone is shooting you and you don't know where they are because someone didn't put a beacon down, that's two tickets lost. That's my point. Sure, spotting someone is nice, but that means you have to see them. With the beacons: You don't! *gasp!* Amazing technology I know.
The Faceless Master
Member
Reconnaissance is the military term for exploring beyond the area occupied by friendly forces to gain information about enemy forces or features of the environment.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconnaissance
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconnaissance
I'm not mad because I already know
I'm right. I just find it comical that you guys defend recon class so much as if its better than assault in METRO CONQUEST. Can recon be helpful on METRO CONQUEST? Sure, IF done properly it can be a helpful tool. Is recon class MORE valuable to the team on METRO CONQUEST than assault? IMO no, and all I'm complaining about is why do we need 2 or more recons in a squad. I'm not agruing don't use recon or recon sucks in battlefield. Because I know recon is probably the most valuable class in RUSH.
The_Hitcher89
Member
Regular Conquest 24/7 All Maps Original Rules Normal Tickets
'At last, a server that'll be like it used to be before the new servers fucked it all up'
437 tickets remaining
'Fuck off'
*Turns PS3 off*
'At last, a server that'll be like it used to be before the new servers fucked it all up'
437 tickets remaining
'Fuck off'
*Turns PS3 off*
The Faceless Master
Member
Dreamgazer
Member
We should change it so that botack's server is the officla conquest server, and I'll just change my server to 24/7 rush server.
No, that's the point. I'm terrible as a recon right now.
At least when I think about the way I would like to play it.
I want to return to having the option to go rambo recon on infantry maps (and engineer on tank maps) with a x4 GOL like bolt action riffle, quick scoping anything and everything that gets in my way while running around like crazy capping any flag that's being contested without worrying about my K/D ratio in the least.
Right now I can't really do that because I've just started playing the class in a somewhat serious manner. I don't have the scopes or equipment to do this atm due to the unlock system and most importantly, I don't have the skills needed to pull this off.
Took enough time to get to that point in BC2, but that's what made me fall in love with the game once it did.
My point was that even though I feel I'm useless at this point, I can see this working out in the long end as the results objectively speaking aren't that terrible.
They are just far from what I'd like them to be.
I'm actually extremely guilty of that.
When I see a flag blinking, I rush towards it like a dog chasing a car.
Basically because I like the thrill and action that comes with it.
I much prefer spending a full game chasing blinking flags and capping one after the other instead of locking down every single one of them, at which point our team automatically starts to spawn camp.
Witnessed that way too much in BC2 and hated it then, still hate it now. Unless the other team deserves it due to being douchebags themselves.
I do have to say that on Wake Island, when I'm at C(or E) and A is blinking, I probably won't go there due to what you said. But I would think of moving to B (or C) if they capped the flag completely and were clearly moving up and not attacking my side at all.
Do whatever you want with mine.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
Sounds dirty
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
endlessflood
Member
For the BFBC2 vets: now that BF3 has been out for more than 6 months, how do you rate it in comparison to BFBC2? Is it more fun to play?
Put a motion sensor of MAV in the area where everyone is fighting. You can literally see the entire enemy team on the radar some times. And let's not forget how incredibly useful spawn beacons can be.
In related news; I just got the Recon service star.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
Nearly instant parachute and not getting damage from falling 1 story... be able to use the parachute at anytime while in the air... wait.. BF3.. umm
Dieing even with the parachute is FUNNNNNNNNNN
olimpia84
Member
Maps are worse, weapon physics and feel are way worse, vehicles control better, I like some of the movement additions like being able to sprint while looking diagonally. Overall they're both fun games but I still give the edge to BC2.
I dunno. Caspian and the B2K maps are good.
I'd reverse the physics opinion and have Infantry movement is good but vehicle controls are bad (tanks have tendency to "slide" like an icecube compared to BC2, why?)
Also TN: I'm not the one that spent a whole round hunting for a spawn beacon while their team bled tickets in babby mode despite having the flag advantage. Just saying, bro. You can whine about revives but if someone with a decent beacon placement made you do that... *cough*
And if someone put a proper beacon/prospecting they'd see that beacon IIRC.
http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf3/battlereport/show/45719065/4/188837097/
Here is the game your referring too.
Most important base in conquest is the one closes to your flag.
Yeah I spent half the match looking for and finding 3 of their beacons and guess what? I died each time because I was the only one trying to cap A back while Dan and Dream try to cap C. Found 3 of their "well place" beacons but herp derp, I was only one there and when it's 3 vs 1 you are not gonna win much of those. All because no one wanted to cap and hold the flag the nearest to the our base. And when we get capped out guess who got by their awesome defense twice? Me the assault player with smoke. Not the 3 recons Dan, Dream, and Dave. Notice how Dave finally switched to assault and he became the MVP in the game?
Yeah recon is SOOOOOO awesome and the spawn beacons and motion sensors are SOOOOO great that we lost. The fact that you bring this game up PROVES my point. If 3/4 of GAF members were playing recon and we LOST what does that say? Either they SUCK as recon or it's not a viable class on that map.
The game we won on metro that day
http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf3/battlereport/show/45729729/4/176071332/. No one played recon and people finally listened to me. We held B and C and DESTOYRED THEM.
PS so obvious you guys are butthurt over my rage on recon on metro conquest. I'm guessing since that's your go to class SEKS.
I've never held a gun in my life, but I found the shooting and physics a lot better. Perhaps need more testing.
I'm gonna tell you the true reason GAF loses on metro. One has to do with the awesome recon class, GAF uses the recon class to get by the enemies line and try to place a beacon to cap the base closes to the enemy. GAF doesn't realize we don't need to get past the enemies line if we just hold either A and B or B and C. So when I talk trash about your precious recon class it's because it gives them the mentality IF I can put a beacon in a good spot we are gonna win for sure. But from what I have seen is that either everyone here is playing recon wrong or recon is useless. Why? Because they don't use the motion sensor to setup a defense on B, but rather do it at C or A to cap that flag. So really they are just being selfish by lone wolfing it.
The second reason correlates with the first. Why do people want to capped out the other team so bad that they leave holes in their defense to let the enemies team by? Hold 2 points and the choke points and you win! But nope, every recon wants to be THAT guy that gets pass the enemies line and plants a beacon to supposedly change the game.
Third, what class has the best chance to get pass a good defense? Assault with smoke, revive, and heal.
I LOL when you guys cry about rush defense and holding a crate when on conquest everyone that cried about it rather cap a flag then hold it.
Waiting for the obvious reply from SEKS to defend the best class in BF3 recon.
The second reason correlates with the first. Why do people want to capped out the other team so bad that they leave holes in their defense to let the enemies team by? Hold 2 points and the choke points and you win! But nope, every recon wants to be THAT guy that gets pass the enemies line and plants a beacon to supposedly change the game.
Third, what class has the best chance to get pass a good defense? Assault with smoke, revive, and heal.
I LOL when you guys cry about rush defense and holding a crate when on conquest everyone that cried about it rather cap a flag then hold it.
Waiting for the obvious reply from SEKS to defend the best class in BF3 recon.
THN my man, do you realize that both times you listed me I was using an assault rifle, playing as an assault?
I rarely play recon but that's not because I believe they are worse than anything. It's just that my play style is more suited to Assault/Engineer. I'll run recon if nobody else is doing it and if I think it will benefit the team.
In most games it's good to have a recon player that knows what he is doing on your squad, preferably a recon with PDWs or at least an SKS. No squad should have more than 2 players in the same class, but we're not a clan and even if we were I would not like to enforce roles on people. Play as you like, contribute as much as you can. That's why I like GAF.
BF3 is well balanced class wise IMO. They should only bump Recon SPM potential a little and it would be almost perfect. As it is it's much better balanced than BC2. Can't say anything about the older games though.
This whole argument is kinda stupid to me. All you need to make a "bad" class better is a skilled player. In the same sense a bad player can't do shit with a "good" class.
I rarely play recon but that's not because I believe they are worse than anything. It's just that my play style is more suited to Assault/Engineer. I'll run recon if nobody else is doing it and if I think it will benefit the team.
In most games it's good to have a recon player that knows what he is doing on your squad, preferably a recon with PDWs or at least an SKS. No squad should have more than 2 players in the same class, but we're not a clan and even if we were I would not like to enforce roles on people. Play as you like, contribute as much as you can. That's why I like GAF.
BF3 is well balanced class wise IMO. They should only bump Recon SPM potential a little and it would be almost perfect. As it is it's much better balanced than BC2. Can't say anything about the older games though.
This whole argument is kinda stupid to me. All you need to make a "bad" class better is a skilled player. In the same sense a bad player can't do shit with a "good" class.
I'll listen to you JJD since you actually play conquest with me unlike SEKS. I agree with you about the balance class choice and skill>class choice. But I just hate losing and in my eyes when I play with 2 or more recons in my squad it puts us at a disadvantage. I'm not gonna tell people what class to play since yor right, GAF isn't a real clan. It's in my nature to be competitive and I shouldn't let that effect the way I treat GAF members on that matter. I want to apologize to everyone for attacking your play styles. I won't comment on anyother recon comments and if you want to lash out go ahead.
That being said, I think I'll just go with the SKS for my recon style.
It seems to suit my overly aggressive play style the most for BF3. Well, as far as this class is concerned anyway.
Hope BC3 is a lot more like BC2 than BF3 and we can go back to a more "arcade like" FPS, if you can call it that...
It seems to suit my overly aggressive play style the most for BF3. Well, as far as this class is concerned anyway.
Hope BC3 is a lot more like BC2 than BF3 and we can go back to a more "arcade like" FPS, if you can call it that...
Dreamgazer
Member
*sigh*
1)
You do realized that you just contracted yourself?
If 2 flags are so important, why did you waste half a game looking for a spawn beacon at A - instead of getting B/C back with Dan, dave and I. We got it b back twice, C three times before you joined us. Do you not remember Dave's cry for you to "stop with the beacon nonsense" (which was pretty sad)?
If A is so important, why did you finally gave up on "A" to "break through" in the end and get B/C back?( at which point I mocked "geez, ticket bleed is back, could have done this earlier!")
The fact of the matter is, half of the reason we lost that game was because most of team was too occupied about A. No one even moved a freaking inch when we had A/C back. They all kept at A worried about the enemies popping up.
The home flag is NOT all that important.
You need to be able to tell yourself, "A is a freaking lost cause, I need to get over it" (which you did in the end.)
2)
Don't be misguided. All the assaults in the world wouldn't have won us that game
What, you think I managed to cap C three times cause I can teleport through B? You think Dave and I could have hold down the flags as an assault class?
That's great your smoke assault got us through in the very end with less than 10 tickets. What, does that discredit all the other time the recons capped flags? Or do you really believe I would have capped more flags if I was an assault instead? Personally, I doubt it.
Look, if you actually capped a crap load of flags in that game, shouldered the game, kicked ass, while I was a pussy sniper, and then point out all the tactical flaws I had. I would have no problem agreeing with you. Yet, no. All you're doing now is raging on the recon class with no good argument.
Now, do alot of gaffers suck at playing recon? Yeah I totally agree.
If you want to have a discussion on who should play recon/rush/tdm, and who shouldn't - I am totally open to that convo.
3) I can't open up battlelog at work, but....don't be misguided about any win/stat/mvp either.
Otherwise, I would be slamming my w/l ratio on the table and saying "oh ho ho, I won more than you won, me better!". That would be stupid. Just as it would be stupid to call faceless and I bad players, since we have lower spms than many folks on here.
This is no different than when I complain about "close games."
There are many conquest games where gaf would go "man what a close game, good thing I was helping out in the chopper." -> even though it wouldn't even be a close game if people actually stayed on the ground and capped flags. (Don't even get me started on games where gaf had higher scorers, mvps, kills and ticket leads and still fucking loss, and call it a close game cause no one was capping flags til the last 2 minutes..)
Dreamgazer
Member
I hate losing too, and how do you think I feel when I play rush with some of you?
>.>
"CHOPPERZ! MUST TAKE IT OUT, EVERYONE GO ENGINEERS!"
"AH SHITZOR, SOMEONE ARMED US UP THE BOMB WHILE WE TRIED TO TAKE THE CHOPPER.
"DAMN CHOPPERZ! ARMING THE MCOMS WITH ITS POWERZ"
"but you wouldn't have the mcoms armed if you watched the mcom."
"STUPID DREAM, THE CHOPPERZ IS SO GOOD IT WOULD GET US NO MATTER WHERE WE WATCHED"
"but...I never got killed by the chopper, in fact I got killed by the two guys who armed it..."
"STUPID DREAM, IF WE DON'T GET THE CHOPPERZ, WE WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO DISARM IT!"
"then why did you allow someone to arm it in the first place...."
(actual convo)
olimpia84
Member
Regarding the role of the recon class in Op metro conquest I think it's critical depending on the situation. Usually it boils down to the following (assuming both teams have good players):
If you start on the RU side (the easy one) you will get B first so the best thing to do is to place a sensor near the flag in a concealed spot. This helps visualize where the US side is coming from and it's extremely useful to detect enemies trying to get past by using the A-escalator. Usually players on the RU side are obsessed with protecting the locker room area and the C-escalator so a well placed sensor is critical.
If you start on the US side and you face a very good team is pretty much a given that they will get B first. The way I deal with it is I don't generally even bother trying to cap B, go to the bottom of the A-escalator, place a sensor, look at the movement of the enemies and once I see a clear path in the minimap to go past the ticket office I run like a cheetah and go for A. Once you get to A is easier to hide a spawn beacon because the area is wider so you place the beacon try to cap A and once you have both C and A you can sandwich the enemy and attack them from both sides. Now, after that happens you would hope your team is smart enough to get B in the meantime. Capping A is a simple diversion to give the rest of the team time to get B back. Once the team gets B and they make sure everything is clear there is no longer any point in trying to get A back. From that point on, defending B should be good enough to win the game as long as some well placed sensors are set and people are distributed evenly below the ticket office area.
In fact, this is exactly what happened today when Dave and I played a long ticket Metro round. The other team was much better than ours (more colonels and they started on the easy RU side...sigh), they got B first, I sneaked by and got A, they went to get A back, our team got B in the meantime, by the time they got A we already had B and we set up a nice defense barrier. After that it was ticket bleeding time.
I think all classes with the exception of Engineers are useful in Metro conquest. Recons are not needed in big numbers like Support or Assault but they are still crucial to winning...the only problem is that the person using the Recon class has to be smart enough to know where to go and where to place the sensors and beacons.
If you start on the RU side (the easy one) you will get B first so the best thing to do is to place a sensor near the flag in a concealed spot. This helps visualize where the US side is coming from and it's extremely useful to detect enemies trying to get past by using the A-escalator. Usually players on the RU side are obsessed with protecting the locker room area and the C-escalator so a well placed sensor is critical.
If you start on the US side and you face a very good team is pretty much a given that they will get B first. The way I deal with it is I don't generally even bother trying to cap B, go to the bottom of the A-escalator, place a sensor, look at the movement of the enemies and once I see a clear path in the minimap to go past the ticket office I run like a cheetah and go for A. Once you get to A is easier to hide a spawn beacon because the area is wider so you place the beacon try to cap A and once you have both C and A you can sandwich the enemy and attack them from both sides. Now, after that happens you would hope your team is smart enough to get B in the meantime. Capping A is a simple diversion to give the rest of the team time to get B back. Once the team gets B and they make sure everything is clear there is no longer any point in trying to get A back. From that point on, defending B should be good enough to win the game as long as some well placed sensors are set and people are distributed evenly below the ticket office area.
In fact, this is exactly what happened today when Dave and I played a long ticket Metro round. The other team was much better than ours (more colonels and they started on the easy RU side...sigh), they got B first, I sneaked by and got A, they went to get A back, our team got B in the meantime, by the time they got A we already had B and we set up a nice defense barrier. After that it was ticket bleeding time.
I think all classes with the exception of Engineers are useful in Metro conquest. Recons are not needed in big numbers like Support or Assault but they are still crucial to winning...the only problem is that the person using the Recon class has to be smart enough to know where to go and where to place the sensors and beacons.
Dreamgazer
Member
The particular problem with the game that then and I lost was that there wasn't enough movement with the rest of the team.
We had A C capped at multiple times, and even B at a few occasions. However, the enemy recon was good enough in keeping people occupied at A, so no one bothered to spawn at B or C when we had them. Which was a shame.
It's cool man, I don't like losing too, but every now and then we get too comfortable with the wins, the game and the way we play so a loss here or there can actually be beneficial since it can make us take a moment to reevaluate our play style, tactics, kit choice etc.
I have gotten better since we shamelessly lost a Metro rush game on the first set with 7 or 8 gaffers playing together against a team mostly of randoms way back when the game launched. I wasn't used to paying attention to the mini map as much as I should and now I don't take my eyes off it. It helped me a lot.
I still think this discussion is a little redundant since player skill is more important than kit choice IMO (every class can be useful), but I'll hear whatever you have to say since I enjoy playing with you, and you're one of our best players. You got even better since we started playing together, it's been hard to keep up with guys like you and Olimpia, I'm really proud of the ace pins I get when you guys are around.
Dreamgazer
Member
dreamgazer said:
I kindly disagree, sir. In metro, securing the home flag and subsequent B capture maintains the enemy focus to a single direction. Having the enemy team's flag and B means they can come from behind or from the front, a clear disadvantage. I'm pretty sure you already know this, though.
That's why having A and C means an easy B capture.
The Faceless Master
Member
as far as Metro goes, i worry way more about the home flag if i'm on the US team. It's definitely more important than the RU home flag if i'm on the RU team.
Dreamgazer
Member
Except in our scenario, A was constantly getting capped and B/C is about to go orange.
We're not talking about a situation where both team have a fair ground.
A in this case is the hot ground, similar to bazaar B.
In those situations, focus should be shifted toward other flags so that 1) you can keep up the flag count, b) distracting people away from A. Unless the enemies are stupid, they should then start shifting back into B/C. A few extra people can then go cap A from base. Just as sometimes it's a strategy to get away from the B hot ground, cap the opposite flag to lure people away. It may feel unorthodox to do so, but that's exactly what the our enemies did - keep the team distracted at A while B/C was taken with no effort (literally no one outside of gaf ever went into B/C other than the last 2 minutes.)
This is similar to olimpa rage moments in bazaar, when people insist on going from C->B or A->B. When the obvious choice sometimes is to get away from the ticket bleeder, and go cap the opposite end flag. Strategy needs to change according to the situation, so no one flag is ever important forever.
Very good, only problem is finding official servers, but I believe that's been resolved.
Need a squadmate? Add me if you want: monsterfracas is my tag
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
Metro is OK... so no shame