Yeah I'm not a dumbass like my teammates and jump out of the tank. If u get me than kudos to you. I had nothing but dumbasses on every game. Who the fuck jumps out of the one advantage you have on canals. Fucking idiots
Nah. TDM on Canals is turn your mind off mode. On other maps it devolves into a few camping areas, sure. But that's why you hang back. If you hang back they have to come to you instead (and opens up new areas to spawn if you fail to get them instead)
Sorry I'm just very upset at GAF. All I ever see is either teams stackin or playing against powder puff girls. Only a few times where they actually play against some competition.
First of all dawn and I got kicked by admin. And than when I joine back I was on their team and dawn joined me. 2 vs 2 aint team stacking especially when u had a 200 ticket lead and us capped out.
I'm just joking...as I said I couldn't resist! ;-)
So 8 clan guys (SYN and GUN) plus 2 gaffers against 2 gaffers and 3 random guys is not steam stacking? OK! Haha!
We were outnumbered from the moment I joined man. You guys left (or got kicked I didn't knew that) seconds after I started playing. I checked the scoreboard because I thought you guys had set up a new squad, it was 5 against 9.
Then Dawn joined our squad again later when we were already dealing with people on A, but he left in less than a minute. I thought he had quit since you guys had quit the 2 earlier games and then invited us to join another match.
I only noticed you were playing again when you killed me once, I checked the scoreboard again it was still 5 against 9, we were already losing...
2 guys joined us when we were already trapped in our spawn.
Anyway, I think it's just dumb to complain about this kind of stuff. People want to play with their friends, if that's team stacking we're all guilty of it.
We should set up GAF vs. GAF games or just quit complaining about it.
The real problem is that it's been really hard to find good games on BF3 for quite some time. You're either spawn trapping or getting spawn trapped.
I've always tried and play games out even if it's 1 vs 5. Check out my favorites. I don't care if I lose to GAF but I do care when I see more GAF members join in a game and automatically stack one side.
Sorry I'm just very upset at GAF. All I ever see is either teams stackin or playing against powder puff girls. Only a few times where they actually play against some competition.
Anyway, I think it's just dumb to complain about this kind of stuff. People want to play with their friends, if that's team stacking we're all guilty of it.
We should set up GAF vs. GAF games or just quit complaining about it.
The real problem is that it's been really hard to find good games on BF3 for quite some time. You're either spawn trapping or getting spawn trapped.
I understand that you guys want to play together but when it's 4-6 GAF vs 1, that's ok with you? If it happens to be where we start a round and it's 3 vs 1 than whatever
It's not just one game JJD. It's about competition and I just don't understand how you guys have fun stomping on scrubs. I mean when we play against really good teams I get a rush but when it's 6 or more GAF vs abunch of low levels than its just boring. By the way I don't care about MVP. I care about winning only.
I understand that you guys want to play together but when it's 4-6 GAF vs 1, that's ok with you? If it happens to be where we start a round and it's 3 vs 1 than whatever
It's not like it's OK, but I don't think it as an issue either. Instead of getting angry I would be proud if I played against 6 gaffers with a squad of randoms and still got MVP pin...
Every now and then we try to join someone and end up in the other team. The last time it happened to me I joined Olimpia on Metro and ended killing him a couple of times when he tried to make a run through backstairs! Lol! As soon as the game ended and people left I finally could join his side.
The one person I was most disappointed in was evolved. The guy talks about how GAF team stacks and that he is gonna join the other team that needs help. And than he teams stacks, wins three games and leaves when his team finally has less players than us.
2-3 v.s many(4-6) gaf victories been done many times.
Especially depending on the combination of players >.>
It has happened 2-3 times in conquest, and plenty of times in rush.
And that's one thing that I can get annoyed about you, you often ragequit right when we're about to turn things around.
Anyway, I think it's just dumb to complain about this kind of stuff. People want to play with their friends, if that's team stacking we're all guilty of it.
We should set up GAF vs. GAF games or just quit complaining about it.
The real problem is that it's been really hard to find good games on BF3 for quite some time. You're either spawn trapping or getting spawn trapped.
I understand that you guys want to play together but when it's 4-6 GAF vs 1, that's ok with you? If it happens to be where we start a round and it's 3 vs 1 than whatever
*beep* complained about team stacking once. Saying that it kills the challenge and that people should switch over to balance the game.
Ever since then, I've been brainwashed to stick in the other team when I'm playing against *BEEP* (you screwed me over with your brainwashing!).
However, then I realize never once did he switched over to help me/balance the team despite of all things he said *cries*
So here's my problem:
1)Everyone in here has been guilty of team stacking at one time or another.
2)You can't trust anyone when they say "people should switch to balance" (even I only did it 2-3 times, although I never made any bs promises to people about team balancing)
i dunno why, but since sometime on saturday, i've been getting unplayable amounts of lag, teleporting and rubberbanding on 360, and today after being tired of it, i played on PS3 and ... game is running smooth!
try again on 360, unplayable lag, again on PS3, smooth... WTF!?
Nah. TDM on Canals is turn your mind off mode. On other maps it devolves into a few camping areas, sure. But that's why you hang back. If you hang back they have to come to you instead (and opens up new areas to spawn if you fail to get them instead)
It's not like it's OK, but I don't think it as an issue either. Instead of getting angry I would be proud if I played against 6 gaffers with a squad of randoms and still got MVP pin...
Every now and then we try to join someone and end up in the other team. The last time it happened to me I joined Olimpia on Metro and ended killing him a couple of times when he tried to make a run through backstairs! Lol! As soon as the game ended and people left I finally could join his side.
Sorry JJD this is the one time I'm not going to agree with you. I've switched teams midway through a game knowing im gonna lose to balance out GAF vs GAF. Ask hunting beast. I'm not gonna back down from what I said team stacking is for punks. That's why I have beating GAF 1 vs 5 as my favorite because you all had a chance to switch over but you decide to stay 1 vs 5 and got beat. Dan you joined late so this doesn't refer to you.
2-3 v.s many(4-6) gaf victories been done many times.
Especially depending on the combination of players >.>
It has happened 2-3 times in conquest, and plenty of times in rush.
I never claimed anything otherwise. Why you're feeling like pointing the finger?
You can call me stacker if you want, but I was never a quitter or swapper and I don't back away from hard games. Usually I join a side and stick with it, specially if there's friends on my squad/team.
As I said if people are going to complain about stacking best admit it first that we're all guilty of it in some way or another.
And frankly if we are going to talk about people better name names, this way anyone can defend himself.
Throwing things in the air is just not nice IMO...
And by the way, I don't agree with THN about evolved. I played enough against him since he went "rogue" to know that he really seems to enjoy it.
And I hate it, I mentioned here that he seems to always get the jump on me! :-(
I never claimed anything otherwise. Why you're feeling like pointing the finger?
You can call me stacker if you want, but I was never a quitter or swapper and I don't back away from hard games. Usually I join a side and stick with it, specially if there's friends on my squad/team.
As I said if people are going to complain about stacking best admit it first that we're all guilty of it in some way or another.
And frankly if we are going to talk about people better name names, this way anyone can defend himself.
Throwing things in the air is just not nice IMO...
And by the way, I don't agree with THN about evolved. I played enough against him since he went "rogue" to know that he really seems to enjoy it.
And I hate it, I mentioned here that he seems to always get the jump on me! :-(
I'm not calling you a stacker or anything.
As I've said, almost everyone in here has been guilty of it at one time or another.
Just saying that you've complained about team stacking before also, and I think you should be more considerate of thn's viewpoint (ex: getting the MVP pin doesn't make things better.)
It always suck for the receiving person, and that's just an unfortunate thing cause we're not always that considerate(?) lol.
The point of bring up the example isn't to name and shame a particular player.
The point is that I don't trust anyone in here when they say they won't team stack/want challenge/gonna go rogue (not referring to evolved, sorry dude, although I don't 100% believe you either. Not even 75%), blah blah.
In general I just don't think anyone in here should make those sort of statements unless they're really going to stick to it.
Nor should anyone trust those statements.
Otherwise it's more hurt feelings for the poor guy who ends up on the inferior/lesser team, waiting for some idealistic gaffer to switch over.
Things would be much easier if everyone was just like Faceless lol.
I never claimed anything otherwise. Why you're feeling like pointing the finger?
You can call me stacker if you want, but I was never a quitter or swapper and I don't back away from hard games. Usually I join a side and stick with it, specially if there's friends on my squad/team.
As I said if people are going to complain about stacking best admit it first that we're all guilty of it in some way or another.
And frankly if we are going to talk about people better name names, this way anyone can defend himself.
Throwing things in the air is just not nice IMO...
And by the way, I don't agree with THN about evolved. I played enough against him since he went "rogue" to know that he really seems to enjoy it.
And I hate it, I mentioned here that he seems to always get the jump on me! :-(
What don't you agree with? You saw the report didn't you? I said I was disappointed in him. I just pointed out that he mentions going rogue and than he joined a stack GAF team. Where was the rogue than, because I've could of used some help. Anyways when I talk shit I'll tell you straight up.
And I don't think dream call you out. He was just pointing out that everyone team stacked. Anyways I'm just upset at GAF vs GAF team stacking. If its GAF vs anyone else and you team stack than I don't care because you obviously want to play with your friend. But when it's GAF vs GAF team stacking than it gets stupid.
Sorry JJD this is the one time I'm not going to agree with you. I've switched teams midway through a game knowing im gonna lose to balance out GAF vs GAF. Ask hunting beast. I'm not gonna back down from what I said team stacking is for punks. That's why I have beating GAF 1 vs 5 as my favorite because you all had a chance to switch over but you decide to stay 1 vs 5 and got beat. Dan you joined late so this doesn't refer to you.
That's OK man, I'm not trying to convince you I'm just giving my 2 cents. I love playing with you as I said it over and over again on this thread after some great games (like that firestorm one were we won with just 13 tickets against a 2 clans), but for the record: I was not even playing today, if I was and I joined on the "stacked" team I doubt I would swap unless I was asked to. I got no problems admitting it.
But do you realize that on your favorite list you also have a game were you won playing along with 6 gaffers against Olimpia with a team of randoms?
When I linked that Metro game you argued that it was 2 gaffers against 2 gaffers and that was OK.
As I said there's probably no one here in the clean when it comes to team stacking.
So with that I'll back out from this discussion because I really don't want to keep arguing with people I respect and like. It's just not worth it, no one is going to change their opinion.
The point of bring up the example isn't to name and shame a particular player. The point is that I don't trust anyone in here when they say they won't team stack/want challenge.
I invited Olimpia to that game, when it started and he joined after he finished his other metro round. He chose to stay and play on that team and his team was full. So that game has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.
Would you of rather I join your team that had all 3 objective points and a 200 ticket lead? I thought we were gonna lose anyways and I didn't want to leave dawn by himself after he switched to be on my team. Like I said earlier dawn and I were kicked off that game and when we rejoined I was on the admins team.
I'm not calling you a stacker or anything.
As I've said, almost everyone in here has been guilty of it at one time or another.
Just saying that you've complained about team stacking before also, and I think you should be more considerate of thn's viewpoint (ex: getting the MVP pin doesn't make things better.)
The point of bring up the example isn't to name and shame a particular player. The point is that I don't trust anyone in here when they say they won't team stack/want challenge.
Please man, I know you're busy with your studies and all but if you can just quote that post because I frankly don't remember ever saying something like it.
I do remember that a guy who almost didn't play with us before complained about it and I did the same thing I did now.
If I'm wrong and I've said something like that I'll openly admit that I'm stupid and shut my big mouth because I really, really don't remember it.
What don't you agree with? You saw the report didn't you? I said I was disappointed in him. I just pointed out that he mentions going rogue and than he joined a stack GAF team. Where was the rogue than, because I've could of used some help. Anyways when I talk shit I'll tell you straight up.
And I don't think dream call you out. He was just pointing out that everyone team stacked. Anyways I'm just upset at GAF vs GAF team stacking. If its GAF vs anyone else and you team stack than I don't care because you obviously want to play with your friend. But when it's GAF vs GAF team stacking than it gets stupid.
He played against us a lot on this past few weeks/months why be disappointed with him on this one game he played with most of the guys? Seriously man, did you ever join his side purposely when he was facing GAF?
With all respect TH I think you're pissed just because that's the game you lost. You and no one else were complaining when our stacked team won against evolved and his team of randoms before.
Again I was not there, I don't know who joined who, and who was there first.
And frankly I don't care I already regret making that joke...
JJD I took your recommendation and bought Premium. I wasn't fully aware that the DLC goes a quarter of the way into 2013, that's good shit. I can't wait for armored kill and I hope there are a good number of vehicles on that desert map to make up for low player lobbies on console.
Favorite guns I'm rockin' right now would be the AUG A3, the MTAR, the L86 (support), the L96, PP-19, and my baby: the MK3A1 (for which I got the 5th service star and mastery dog tag the other night)
Please man, I know you're busy with your studies and all but if you can just quote that post because I frankly don't remember ever saying something like it.
I do remember that a guy who almost didn't play with us before complained about it and I did the same thing I did now.
If I'm wrong and I've said something like that I'll openly admit that I'm stupid and shut my big mouth because I really, really don't remember it.
He played against us a lot on this past few weeks/months why be disappointed with him on this one game he played with most of the guys? Seriously man, did you ever join his side purposely when he was facing GAF?
With all respect TH I think you're pissed just because that's the game you lost. You and no one else were complaining when our stacked team won against evolved and his team of randoms before.
Again I was not there, I don't know who joined who, and who was there first.
And frankly I don't care I already regret making that joke...
Name one game where I've stacked against evolved. Just because you guys stacked against him doesn't mean I have. And why can't I be disappointed? He was the one that brought up GAF team stacking and than he did it against me. So I feel like I have that right. But anyways I'm pissed because I'm just tired of how most of GAF doesn't like competition. That one game just set me off.
JJD I took your recommendation and bought Premium. I wasn't fully aware that the DLC goes a quarter of the way into 2013, that's good shit. I can't wait for armored kill and I hope there are a good number of vehicles on that desert map to make up for low player lobbies on console.
Favorite guns I'm rockin' right now would be the AUG A3, the MTAR, the L86 (support), the L96, PP-19, and my baby: the MK3A1 (for which I got the 5th service star and mastery dog tag the other night)
I always worry about people regretting taking my advice after I recommend buying stuff! Haha!
Glad you're enjoying the game! If you're on PS3 don't forget to add people (my ID in on my profile!), we have a great and really, really passionate community! ;D
Name one game where I've stacked against evolved. Just because you guys stacked against him doesn't mean I have. And why can't I be disappointed? He was the one that brought up GAF team stacking and than he did it against me. So I feel like I have that right. But anyways I'm pissed because I'm just tired of how most of GAF doesn't like competition. That one game just set me off.
"In general I just don't think anyone in here should make those sort of statements unless they're really going to stick to it.
Nor should anyone trust those statements.
Otherwise it's more hurt feelings for the poor guy who ends up on the inferior/lesser team, waiting for some idealistic gaffer to switch over."
-Dream
Also, I don't need to trust/not trust dawn, cause he never said he's against or for team stacking.
Lesson learned, calm down, give it rest and tomorrow this thread just moves on as usual ~("~)
Please man, I know you're busy with your studies and all but if you can just quote that post because I frankly don't remember ever saying something like it.
I do remember that a guy who almost didn't play with us before complained about it and I did the same thing I did now.
If I'm wrong and I've said something like that I'll openly admit that I'm stupid and shut my big mouth because I really, really don't remember it.
He played against us a lot on this past few weeks/months why be disappointed with him on this one game he played with most of the guys? Seriously man, did you ever join his side purposely when he was facing GAF?
With all respect TH I think you're pissed just because that's the game you lost. You and no one else were complaining when our stacked team won against evolved and his team of randoms before.
Again I was not there, I don't know who joined who, and who was there first.
And frankly I don't care I already regret making that joke...
lol. Thanks for worrying about my studying man.
If you really want to I'll dig the post out when I'm at work tomorrow (a.k.a. not doing work.), although I can hardly find my own posts with how freaking fast this thread goes. Although again, I'm not calling you out man - read thn's post above.
-----------------
As for evolved.
Even when I joined him over and over during his first week of rogue mode, he left the game as soon as I joined him anyway lol. I knew his rogue mode wasn't going to last for too long anyway .
Everyone has their up/down/right/wrong times.
You're too quick to defend people sometimes. Like when I said rockscar play 500% metro conquest whenever he's alone, and you told me to cut him a break. Even though he's still doing it now lol (nothing wrong with that):
I always worry about people regretting taking my advice after I recommend buying stuff! Haha!
Glad you're enjoying the game! If you're on PS3 don't forget to add people (my ID in on my profile!), we have a great and really, really passionate community! ;D
Name one game where I've stacked against evolved. Just because you guys stacked against him doesn't mean I have. And why can't I be disappointed? He was the one that brought up GAF team stacking and than he did it against me. So I feel like I have that right. But anyways I'm pissed because I'm just tired of how most of GAF doesn't like competition. That one game just set me off.
I'm assuming you played against him based on the amount of time we played together. And since I have played against him a bunch of times I bet you have too.
And really there's no way to prove either point, battle logs only goes that far, and we're all in the hundred hours playtime already.
I'm not telling you how you should feel, I'm telling you how I feel this is a discussion without merit. You even said don't trust in yourself when it comes to team stacking man...
I'm assuming you played against him based on the amount of time weplayed together. And since I have played against him a bunch of times I bet you have too.
And really there's no way to prove either point, battle logs only goes that far, and we're all in the hundred hours playtime already.
I'm not telling you how you should feel, I'm telling you how I feel this is a discussion without merit. You even said don't trust in yourself when it comes to team stacking man...
Then just add Faceless and you'll get to know everyone in no time at all!!!
Have you applied to the 360 platoon? There's a link in the OP.
Well you can check bf3stats.com/thn2008. I try to update my reports daily. And when I said that to dream, I said it because I already know he doesn't trust me. Ask anyone that has asked me to switch. Ask dawn or hunting beast. The only time I remember not switching was when dream did and no one else joined him on metro. Again when I refer to team stacking, I am talking about GAF vs GAF and not GAF vs randoms.
I had an epiphany today... maybe because I started drinking at 8 am.. I'm not sure... but i realized, is a win really a win? How many of my wins were like my losses today? Leaves kind of a bad taste in my mouth. I realize it's not about the wins, but the competition. These guys are good players. Maybe better than me... probably better than me.
Let's see.
Fuck w/l.... I'll take a thousand losses. You can only do what you can do. How often do you really get a true 1v1? Guy on the better team wins that confrontation, but is unaware that the other guy was dealing with locks and from every angle, helicopters and jets strafing, infantry rockets... I realize this now. Piling on doesn't mean shit.
So if I'm going to celebrate a victory... it will be from behind. Against odds. With smurfs. You win a game with the assholes we had on or team today, that carries some weight.
And I think it will be fun playing against really good players, instead of rolling over weak competition... today I turn merc.
Dream it takes forever to type XMB messages and I was in the middle of a game. I replied as you were logging off, but basically: i'm not playing with gaf anymore. you guys don't need any help to win. i'd rather play with people who are behind and outnumbered. i don't believe in spawn camping and just running up the score on people. i've never been that guy and frankly i'm ashamed to have started doing it in BF... i only join the gaf games because I know it will be an uphill climb, since gaf is very good and pretty much always has the other team on the ropes. but that Kharg game is a good example of why i'm not playing with you guys anymore. it isn't sporting to pummel an undermanned team to the point they can't even get into their vehicles because they're being tanks shelled from afar and strafed by jets. i'm not telling people how they should play, i'm just not going to take part in it. i'd rather play against.
that last game you joined me... where we took a team that was being decimated and snagged a victory despite the odds, that was more fun than any game I've had will gaf in months. we helped that team win and that felt really good.
Here are his quotes. And I have nothing against evolved, these quotes just rubbed me the wrong way after the lost on canals. Evolved is a good player and he even helped me cheese the EOD bot kill.
Well you can check bf3stats.com/thn2008. I try to update my reports daily. And when I said that to dream, I said it because I already know he doesn't trust me. Ask anyone that has asked me to switch. Ask dawn or hunting beast. The only time I remember not switching was when dream did and no one else joined him on metro. Again when I refer to team stacking, I am talking about GAF vs GAF and not GAF vs randoms.
Well you can check bf3stats.com/thn2008. I try to update my reports daily. And when I said that to dream, I said it because I already know he doesn't trust me. Ask anyone that has asked me to switch. Ask dawn or hunting beast. The only time I remember not switching was when dream did and no one else joined him on metro. Again when I refer to team stacking, I am talking about GAF vs GAF and not GAF vs randoms.
Yeah maybe I should of asked someone to switch. Nostyle switch after that game and thank god because I was already losing my mind on how pathetic are team was. Sorry nostyle for all my bitching but I was just so pissed already from that canals game.
Yeah maybe I should of asked someone to switch. Nostyle switch after that game and thank god because I was already losing my mind on how pathetic are team was. Sorry nostyle for all my bitching but I was just so pissed already from that canals game.
Yes we lost as the russians. The sad part is that we should of won. We had a ok lead and than some noob gave up one of our tanks. And than I got it back by destroying it but than another noob gave out tank away. So frustrating when you have nothing but losers on your team and they keep giving away your only hope.
Your right I don't make statements about balance or challenges. Because of exactly what you said. I don't want there to be a time when I don't switch and I get quoted on it. Anyways I have tomorrow off so I will be up for evolved's rant.
Canals is actually balanced in my eyes but you have to play smart. IMO the LAV is better than a tank because of the armor piercing rounds. The first thing I would do is have 3 engineers in the LAV and Amtrac. Than I would rush the LAV and Amtrac to A and than C. An of course destroying the tanks in between. Now with the two little birds, I would rush both to destroy the Russian chopper and than cap B. Than split up the little birds and use on to either camp/steal the Russian chopper while the other helps out on harassing the tanks. You should be fine with this strategy.
Yes we lost as the russians. The sad part is that we should of won. We had a ok lead and than some noob gave up one of our tanks. And than I got it back by destroying it but than another noob gave out tank away. So frustrating when you have nothing but losers on your team and they keep giving away your only hope.
I know the feeling. I lost a canals game with Dream and Olimpia a couple days ago where our team tank stayed inside the garage (with a random driver piloting) and the other parked on the hills behind C (not the first hill, the hill were the third set of canals rush mcoms are placed) for half the game. Olimpia even switched squads for a second to call out the driver on the hill! Lol!
When the randoms tried to push forward they allowed the enemy to steal the tank...
I even discussed with Dream here if I should try to destroy the tank or not.
Anyway all of us were pretty angry with our teammates incompetence. If we had one or two more gaffers with us I'm certain we could win.
I think most of us don't mind losing if we have a competent team and the enemy is just better. There's lessons to be learned then, you can improve your play style and playing a competitive game is fun and exciting.
But when you're alone, doing all the heavy work and still getting steamrolled it's just horrible.
On that particular Metro game, even outnumbered I knew me and nostyle could deal with the two clan squads with our 3 random friends. They were just horrible, kicking people on the when you already have more players or even teams is just an indication of that.
But when you and Dawn joined it was just too much for us and we lost ground quickly. They were so bad that Dawn managed to score second place even after joining the game past the middle.
That's why I said that I would feel proud of getting MVP on a game like that. It's an indication that you were doing things right, and that if you had more support from squad/team mates you could have won the game.
I will throw him an invite! Err stupid me I tried adding both Faceless and The Faceless Master on live, the former isn't registered the latter wouldn't fit character wise. I goofed, I guess I will have to uh talk to the guy haha?!?/
I will look into the platoon but if it's a clan again sadly I am already in one =( (but I did just get promoted in it too!)
Canals is actually balanced in my eyes but you have to play smart. IMO the LAV is better than a tank because of the armor piercing rounds. The first thing I would do is have 3 engineers in the LAV and Amtrac. Than I would rush the LAV and Amtrac to A and than C. An of course destroying the tanks in between. Now with the two little birds, I would rush both to destroy the Russian chopper and than cap B. Than split up the little birds and use on to either camp/steal the Russian chopper while the other helps out on harassing the tanks. You should be fine with this strategy.
I don't know man, I feel that with even skilled teams the russians are always going to win.
The LAV is awesome, and on a 1 on 1 fight can take out a tank out faster. But both the LAV and the AMTRAC are too much in the open, vulnerable without solid means of counterattacking when they are traversing the water, easy targets for tank sniping or javelin/RPG abuse.
The little birds are the biggest US advantage on the map IMO. But only if the pilot is skilled, most of then just march head-on on guided shells, and the russians have one chopper too.
I think a great way of balancing that map would be adding another flag on that little base on the left side of the map (russian POV) under that big bridge kinda between C and B, forcing defenders to spread more. On PC there's already a flag there on conquest 64 players.
Or at least making one of the russians tanks spawn on B or C, making it the most important flag in the map and letting the other two with less defenders, easier to capture.
