BAYONETTA An Action Game by Hideki Kamiya |OT|

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Dahbomb said:
This game is made for all action game fans. It's made for people who just want to experience kick ass action gaming fun and for those who want more than just a single walkthrough in Normal mode.

The game is extremely balanced on all difficulty settings and Witch Time is more or less a crutch that is thank fully removed in NSIC. You also don't experience EVERYTHING on your first time in Bayonetta, some stuff like abilities and weapons you receive after you have beaten the game more than once. The final difficulty is the culmination of everything that is Bayonetta. It is the Dante Must Die mode equivalent.

If this game was made just for the casual action game fan then there would only be 2 modes: Easy and Normal. Clearly the developer wouldn't have put in as much effort into the higher difficulties if that was the case.
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You are right, that this game is made to appeal to both the casual and hardcore alike, but my argument is that the gamer who spends around 3-4 hours per week playing would be more likely to play the game on the normal setting. Thus is the majority of people who buy videogames. I don't find it hard to believe that NIC and hard are frustrating to some people. Plus, WT was ABSOLUTELY meant to be in this game. It deepens the combo system that much further (as certain combos are only possible in WT), and allows players to experiment with different combinations. I've played the game largely without WT (with Jeanne), and certain parts become a repetitive PKP spam fest. Removing WT without a doubt hurts the overall gameplay experience for most people.
 
NSIC mode isn't meant for the casual gamer who plays 3 hours a week, it's meant for those who play this game regularly and are interested in getting better at the game and want to push themselves to the limits. They want to see the core of the combat of Bayonetta and want to see it pushed to its limits as well.

And for those people, Witch Time is a crutch and makes the game easier than it should be. Witch Time was supposed to help the player learn when best to avoid moves and get it to the point where it came natural to them and allowed them to learn the patterns of enemy attacks. It is a set of training wheels for the real thing, that is NSIC mode. The philosophy behind it is genius in fact.

The combos you can do while in WT are OP, sort of like the combos in DMC3 that you could do with Quicksilver. But they were limited in DMC3 to your DT gauge, in Bayonetta WT is available all the time as long as you got your dodging down. Having WT in NSIC wouldn't make the difficulty setting hard at all... it would be a pointless bump up from Hard mode.
 
I thought WT did make things a bit too easy on normal. And if you were frustrated, you could pretty much spam the dodge and kill the enemies in WT without any problems. I would've liked it more, if it demanded a bit more timing like the bat move.
 
GuiltybyAssociation said:
So I'm trying to get 1000 / 1000 achievements for this game now and I can't get the Treasure Fanatic one. I used a guide to collect everything + plus the alfheims, and have the all alfheim achievement but somehow missed the treasure one. I'm pretty positive it's a Blue Moon Pearl piece, but going through the guide again and backtracking to the BMP specific places I'm not getting anything new. I wish there was a way to check how many treasures you've collected for each chapter, like Assassin's Creed 2 did for feathers. As much as I love this game, I've never cared for collecting shit, and I don't wanna go back yet again with a guide ... but Jesus, not having 1000 / 1000 for Bayo really bothers the shit out of me lolz.

Argh.
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Look for an Umbra Resting Place guide. The hearts, and moon pieces aren't the only treasures in the game so you might have missed some of the other ones with an arcade bullet, or halos in them.

And not to drag this thread further down "not about Bayonetta lane" but coming from someone who loves the GOW series, I can't see how those games would be replayed more than something like Bayonetta, or DMC. They just don't feel like games made for replaying a ton of times honestly. From the save system to the story and level progression GOW seems fit more for playthroughs every couple of months rather than jumping into any level and playing over and over. I've put 45 hours in Bayo while I've never come close to that on either GOW game.

Back to Bayonetta discussion though. :D
 
zoukka said:
I thought WT did make things a bit too easy on normal. And if you were frustrated, you could pretty much spam the dodge and kill the enemies in WT without any problems. I would've liked it more, if it demanded a bit more timing like the bat move.
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If that's all you desire, then play Jeanne. That's the way it is with her all the time. Or play Little Zero, and be ready to die in ANY two hits! :lol

Seriously though, the game does a great job of being a balanced experience that caters to all difficulty levels and play styles. I only wished that there was a way I could play as Jeanne on her bike. :lol
 
I ran through Very Easy Automatic today & :lol that was a strange experience. I must say, that special accessory does more harm & than good.
 
GuiltybyAssociation said:
So I'm trying to get 1000 / 1000 achievements for this game now and I can't get the Treasure Fanatic one. I used a guide to collect everything + plus the alfheims, and have the all alfheim achievement but somehow missed the treasure one. I'm pretty positive it's a Blue Moon Pearl piece, but going through the guide again and backtracking to the BMP specific places I'm not getting anything new. I wish there was a way to check how many treasures you've collected for each chapter, like Assassin's Creed 2 did for feathers. As much as I love this game, I've never cared for collecting shit, and I don't wanna go back yet again with a guide ... but Jesus, not having 1000 / 1000 for Bayo really bothers the shit out of me lolz.

Argh.
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The last chest I was missing was behind a breakable section of the west wall early in Chapter 12. Have you checked there?

Edit:
NIN90 said:
That's the gunchuck, isn't it? I found it to be kinda useless to be honest.
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It's really great against fast enemies on higher difficulties because of its crazy range.
 
Monocle said:
It's really great against fast enemies on higher difficulties because of its crazy range.
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Like G&G? Hm, ima try that.
But what do you mean by "crazy range"? Melee or the charge attack?
 
Wow. I beat the game on 360 and PS3 now, getting rid of the PS3 version. After patch it is still absolutely pathetic by comparison. As for my 360 copy that I will keep, I have not been this enthralled with a game since Ninja Gaiden Black. I really hope we will see more of this, I am tired of cookie cutter RPG's and Shooter's, this game really retored my faith that games can still be crazy imaginative and just downright fun. Now off to third playthrough...............
 
That's somewhat disheartening. I find the performance on PS3 to be pretty good in general. Oh well... not getting a 360 now.

Funny how from what I hear, the situation is reversed for Darksiders. I'll have to pick that up sometime.
 
Mr Spliff said:
Wow. I beat the game on 360 and PS3 now, getting rid of the PS3 version. After patch it is still absolutely pathetic by comparison. As for my 360 copy that I will keep, I have not been this enthralled with a game since Ninja Gaiden Black. I really hope we will see more of this, I am tired of cookie cutter RPG's and Shooter's, this game really retored my faith that games can still be crazy imaginative and just downright fun. Now off to third playthrough...............
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Console warrior much?
 
Mr Spliff said:
No, just very disappointed that it doesn't play as well on my console of choice and that is the voice of frustration.
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The 360 version must shoot diamonds out of the USB ports if the patched PS3 version is "absolutely pathetic by comparison."
 
Mr Spliff said:
No, it just plays and looks significantly better.
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Yeah, I've seen the videos on my TV of the 360 version, and yeah it is smoother. Not justifying the poor job Sega did, but gamers are so spoiled these days. In the NES/SNES days the AAA titiles had slowdown and you just lived with it. Maybe that's why I don't notice it as much as some people. It's like the devs back then said, "You will get slowdown and you will like it," and guess what? We did.
 
I have to agree after having played through both, although I was only able to play through the 360 version once at a friend's house. Try chapter 10 on the PS3 version and watch the framerate severely stutter whenever Gracious and Glorious show up, for example. Or the beginning of chapter 6, especially if you're on higher difficulties and / or have the Gaze of Despair. Those are just a few of many equally poor-running sections, and they aren't even the worst parts.

I'm satisfied with Bayonetta as a game (over seventy hours put into the PS3 version), especially now that the patch fixed the loading, but as far as terrible ports go this is probably pretty high up there. There are way too many instances of major slowdown and framerate problems for a fast-paced action game like this. But I will say that I don't know if I would have used "absolutely terrible in comparison" now. Probably before the obscene loading was fixed, but not now.

palpabl_purpura said:
Yeah, I've seen the videos on my TV of the 360 version, and yeah it is smoother. Not justifying the poor job Sega did, but gamers are so spoiled these days. In the NES/SNES days the AAA titiles had slowdown and you just lived with it. Maybe that's why I don't notice it as much as some people. It's like the devs back then said, "You will get slowdown and you will like it," and guess what? We did.
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Because this is the kind of game that really, really suffers from slowdown to the point of being harder to play at certain points (when going for Pure Platinums, for example), and because it's not supposed to have slowdown like that. In the old days, there was slowdown, but there was no alternate version of the game that ran better.

It has nothing to do with being spoiled, just that I wish Sega had put more into it. They didn't even patch the game - they were going to leave PS3 owners with those unbelievable loading times, and I can't even imagine fighting
Father Rodin
if I had had to wait a long time to get back every time I died - thankfully I didn't make it there until after the patch.
 
Monocle said:
The last chest I was missing was behind a breakable section of the west wall early in Chapter 12. Have you checked there?
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I got that one and the one on the arch in Chapter 10. I have full health and magic, but I'm still missing something. Can anyone else think of any that are easily missable?
 
I got the PS3 version (waits for all of the laughs)... So... when does it start becoming unplayable, or run bad? Or was this a case of gaf over reacting? I've played it for a few hours, nothing so far. It do remind me of dmc's setting a bit. Going to try pushing through to hurry up and get to WKC.

Sir Ilpalazzo said:
I have to agree after having played through both, although I was only able to play through the 360 version once at a friend's house. Try chapter 10 on the PS3 version and watch the framerate severely stutter whenever Gracious and Glorious show up, for example. Or the beginning of chapter 6, especially if you're on higher difficulties and / or have the Gaze of Despair. Those are just a few of many equally poor-running sections, and they aren't even the worst parts.

I'm satisfied with Bayonetta as a game (over seventy hours put into the PS3 version), especially now that the patch fixed the loading, but as far as terrible ports go this is probably pretty high up there. There are way too many instances of major slowdown and framerate problems for a fast-paced action game like this. But I will say that I don't know if I would have used "absolutely terrible in comparison" now. Probably before the obscene loading was fixed, but not now.



Because this is the kind of game that really, really suffers from slowdown to the point of being harder to play at certain points (when going for Pure Platinums, for example), and because it's not supposed to have slowdown like that. In the old days, there was slowdown, but there was no alternate version of the game that ran better.

It has nothing to do with being spoiled, just that I wish Sega had put more into it. They didn't even patch the game - they were going to leave PS3 owners with those unbelievable loading times, and I can't even imagine fighting
Father Rodin
if I had had to wait a long time to get back every time I died - thankfully I didn't make it there until after the patch.
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Oh they fixed it? Good timing then.
 
Ploid 3.0 said:
I got the PS3 version (waits for all of the laughs)... So... when does it start becoming unplayable, or run bad? Or was this a case of gaf over reacting? I've played it for a few hours, nothing so far. It do remind me of dmc's setting a bit. Going to try pushing through to hurry up and get to WKC.
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Apparently the loading times made it unplayable. I didn't start til after the patch. I'm at chapter 12 now and frankly, maybe because of all of the hooplah being made over it, I'm pretty damn happy with the performance. I certainly expected much worse.

At the very least, it's never been the framerate or engine that has led to my death, just my own doe-like lack of skill :lol
 
Well to be honest I managed with the PS3 version, but I made a mistake by watching some 360 combo footage... the differences can be seen from youtube videos even D:
 
Yeah, alas the 360 version of multiplatform games still tends to look superior these days. But really it's not that much of an issue with Bayonetta. I think what matters most is that it hasn't hampered my enjoyment of the game. Maybe it would if I played the two versions side-by-side, I don't know.
 
For me only 2 places had such a bad framerate that it did affect the gameplay (Input delay) the first one was The Falling Clock Tower which is the first level if you wanna call it that I think it's more of a an intro you can play. The second time was when
the little girl is taken by Bayonetta clone and you have to chase here through a hallway while she shoots lasers at you

In the end Bayonetta is probably the worst PS3 port I've played this gen but at least it runs ten times better than Heavenly Sword, now that game had shitty performance for almost the entire game.


Anyway back to the game. I have 200k halos and I'm thinking of buying that accessory that counters every hit you take but before wasting 200k I gotta ask how generous are they with the timing of it ? is it as easy as pulling off WT or hard like Bat within (which I only pull off maybe 2 times out 10 so I didn't buy it)
 
TheThunder said:
is it as easy as pulling off WT or hard like Bat within (which I only pull off maybe 2 times out 10 so I didn't buy it)
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It's both, actually : the regular counter is as easy to pull off as WT, but if you have a perfect timing like for bat within, you will trigger a "real" counter, ie a specially long witch time + damaging counter-attack.
 
Alx said:
It's both, actually : the regular counter is as easy to pull off as WT, but if you have a perfect timing like for bat within, you will trigger a "real" counter, ie a specially long witch time + damaging counter-attack.
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Sounds awesome, definitely bought :D
 
TheThunder said:
Anyway back to the game. I have 200k halos and I'm thinking of buying that accessory that counters every hit you take but before wasting 200k I gotta ask how generous are they with the timing of it ? is it as easy as pulling off WT or hard like Bat within (which I only pull off maybe 2 times out 10 so I didn't buy it)
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You should get Bat Within anyway. It basically extends the time window to activate WT.
 
I finished the game for the first time last night and I wanted to put my thoughts in. I don't want to come off as negative because overall I definitely enjoyed it and look forward to hard mode and beyond and I can definitely see how this game would click with some people and be their favorite action game.

First I should describe where I'm coming from. As there are many types of action gamers and everyone wants something a little different. I'm a DMC fan. I love DMC3 to death and Nero's half of DMC4. I've played through DMC3/4 many times and 100%'d everything in the games. I also like NG very much, but it doesn't feel very replayable to me so I finished NG, finished NG Black, and finished NG2 once each and was done with them. I think because the games are so lengthy, have a few awful bits and have some bad bosses it keeps me from wanting to replay them. I'm not a big DMC1 fan. It's a great game with nice atmosphere, but the gameplay is too plain for my liking.

Basically before I went into Bayonetta, my action game ranking was DMC3 > NG > DMC4 > NG2 > DMC1 > all other action games.

I'll start off with what I thought was very well done:
-The combat. Very good and always fun. So much joy in fighting and a lot of options.
-Witch time. Interesting system that has a lot of neat uses (like frozen water spouts)
-Enemy types. For the first half of the game when they kept introducing new enemies every other battle I couldn't believe how varied the enemy set was. Though the 2nd half was mainly mix-ups of the enemies from the first half (and bosses), I thought it was a solid group of enemies with a lot of variety in their attack patterns and weaknesses.
-The graphics were gorgeous (x360 version). I'm playing Dante's Inferno now and :lol Bayonetta makes it look like a PS2 game.
-The controls are great. Being able to dodge while continuing your combo is rad. Everything feels super responsive.
-Lots of meat to the game in terms of replayability. All the hidden things, the ability to replay levels (like DMC) and multiple difficulties should give it a good amount of hours.
-Loved the music.
-Voice acting/writing was hilariously bad in a good way

Things that didn't sit well with me
1.the entire level design structure. The levels were like "fight 3-5 enemies!" -> walk -> cutscene -> "fight 3-5 enemies" -> walk -> cutscene. There are several things I didn't like about this:

a. The action always felt too short. The combat is pure fun and what makes these games great is fighting, fighting, and fighting. So when 3-5 enemies pop up and I kill them in 20 seconds and that's it...I'm left wanting more. I really didn't enjoy the split up verse aspect of the battles. My favorite level in the game was climbing the tower simply because it had so many fights. I wish this game had a mode like Bloody Palace in DMC4 where I could just fight non-stop.

b. Too many cutscenes. REALLY too many cutscenes. When I beat the game I was surprised my clear time was under 4 hours when my save time was 8-9 hours. I'm guessing the clear time doesn't include cutscenes. In that case FIFTY PERCENT OF MY GAME TIME WAS WATCHING CUTSCENES. holy shit! For an action game that is ridiculous. Sure you can skip them on future plays, but it really drags down the first play experience. I can't count the number of times an enemy shows up in a cutscene and I have my hands on the controller edging to fight the new monster and I'm sitting there waiting and waiting for the cutscene of Bayonetta fighting the monster (which I'm supposed to be doing!) ends so I can actually start battling. It's not even like the cutscenes were great aka. DMC. The cutscenes had style and were ok, but they went on too long and the action choreography is nothing special for most of the time.

c. Too many non-cutscene cutscene sequences where it takes away control from the player. When replaying levels I constantly have to hit start, move down to skip, and hit A to get back to playing. Sometimes if there's a qte or something it won't even let me! It's not a huge deal, but honestly replaying the levels doesn't feel as quick and smooth as it should be like other games where you just blow through the level and every time a cutscene pops up you hit start right away and you continue on fighting. Basically I just want to keep playing the game and not be constantly taken out of it.

tl;dr - my problem with the philosophy behind the level design is that everything felt like small bites instead of a constant orgasm of pure action bliss for 10-20 mins straight. Obviously the opposite end of the spectrum is endless waves which gets boring, but I'd like to think you can strike a middleground where satisfying combat does not go on too long.

2. The levels. When I first started playing the game and you were exploring the train station and the Vigrid city I was really excited to be playing an action game with actual LEVELS. Because as much as I love DMC, the game does not have much level design. It's mainly just a bunch of fight arenas. NG has level design but their levels suck. Otoh games like God of War/Rygar eschew deep combat design for long and varied level design. I was hoping Bayonetta would be the game with BOTH. A game that had NG/DMC level of deep satisfying combat and lots of varied and big locations to go through. Well about 4-5 chapters in when they game started repeating the same areas but with a different graphical flair I realized that was not going to happen. The game feels pretty lacking in level variety. I swear that little quaint cafe square type area, or the vigrid fountain type area makes up the majority of the game. I actually feel like the locations were so repetitive it was basically DMC3 budget-ish. I mean the game isn't that long and if you take out the boss fights and vehicle parts, there just aren't a whole lot of unique levels. Would have liked more.

3. The bosses. While I thought the early bosses (aka, actual normal enemies) were great, I'm not a fan of the big bosses. The boss fights felt like God of War style bosses. Big epic encounters that are more a puzzle than an intense duel. What I love about DMC and NG bosses (well most of them, there are some bad ones) is that they feel like awesome 1 on 1 matches. Fighting Agni and Rudi in DMC3 or the Minotaur or the first fire beast of DMC4 or Doku in NG or Alma gives really intense and exciting adrenaline rushes like no other game experience. That is the true moments of action gaming imo. Outside of the Jeanne fights (which were great), none of the other bosses do this and so I felt they were cool looking but gameplay-wise I'm not very interested in replaying them.

4. The mini-games sections. I thought the bike, afterburner, cannon shooting stuff was silly and fun but each time those sequence went on about 2x as long as they should have. While I was laughing and enjoying the afterburner sequence, when verse 1 ended and a 2nd verse showed up I did a double take and went "what?". Seriously, there should not have been a 2nd verse, it had already outgrown its welcome by the end of the first.

5. The QTEs. I'd never really cared about the arguments of qtes in action games until now. In the past with games like God of War the qtes didn't feel like they got in the way that much because at least for normal enemies they tended to be optional and for bosses they tended to be used at the end after you already won the fight. I don't mind the torture attacks because again, they are optional but I greatly disliked the multiple qte sequences in the middle of boss fights. When I fight a boss I want it to be an intense match to the death between the two of us from start to finish. The breaking up of the fights with qte sequences where I get to watch her spin her hair and stuff was not my thing at all and I dislike the qte sequences during actual levels mainly because I can't skip those cutscenes on replay.

6. The combo strings. This and the next point aren't flaws but come down to personal taste. I hate combo strings. I think they are the worst and most vile things in fighting games and action games. I hate Tekken because of this. I have bad memory and I do not enjoy sitting around memorizing 20 different strings and what the difference in the attack is if I do PPPKP or PPPKKP. VF is my fighting game of choice and I love how my combos/attacks in that are more like "well after I float him from my B,DF+P I see he's at waist height for a few seconds so my F,F+K move will probably juggle him". I play DMC the same way. I think of how I can link individual short input (ie B,F/F,F/K,P) moves and then try them out and create my own combos. So right from the start Bayonetta being all about dozens of strings was not my cup of tea unfortunately. Even by the end I tended to just learn a few I liked for each weapon (short ones) and alternate between them. Just don't like them darn strings.

7. The weapons. For me personally, the weapons in Bayonetta lacked personality. I felt like the weapons in DMC and NG were a lot more diverse in their attacks and their movesets. When I play NG and pull out the nunchucks their move list has absolutely nothing in common with the scythe. In bayonetta I felt like whether I had claws on my feet or guns on my feet or bazookas on my feet or skates on my feet, my sword combos of PKP or PKK or PPK were pretty much the same give or take some speed and power differences.

tl;dr on the last two points - I loved the combat, but it felt a lot less varied and unique to me than DMC/NG. I know there are a million moves and potential combos, but they all kind of blend together for me and don't feel as distinct and fun to pull off as "I'm going to do move A -> combo it into move B".

8. The difficulty. Not really a complaint because I'm sure Hard will be adequately challenging, but normal on this was way too easy. Especially after I bought the parry accessory which meant I didn't even have to dodge and got even longer witch time. I criticized DMC4 for being too easy on the standard difficulty as well (and NG2 after you got the scythe) so it seems that "normal" difficulty on action games in general has been dumbed down this generation.

I do think though that the parry accessory is amazingly broken. The timing window is just way too large. In SF3 I suck at pulling off parries because the window is fairly small. In here anytime I see an attack headed my way I just push toward them and parry it and it works!

Overall - as much as that sounds predominantly negative, I actually really love the game :lol The combat is insanely fun and satisfying and the enemies are great foes to fight again. I will definitely be playing it for another few weeks on the higher difficulties. I actually think some of my qualms (most of them?) are because all the hype (partly by Kamiya's trash talking) that this would be the greatest action game ever made and destroy everything else that has come before it. Which it might do for a lot of people! But it just didn't do that for me =P I feel like the game took DMC combat in DMC3 style short levels and mixed it with GoW style boss fights and QTE sequences. Which in theory sounds like the ultimate game because it combines the two styles of action gaming. But for me, the only things I like from GoW style action games (and I do like them!) are the level designs and set pieces. So my ultimate action game would be DMC combat with GoW levels and DMC3 bosses. And this isn't it, but then I can't put blame on Kamiya for not being able to read my mind :lol

Still, I think this is another gem on the Kamiya list and a definite improvement in every way over his last 3d action game start (DMC1). I'd give it a 9/10 and on my Kamiya ranking it'd go: VJ (10) > RE2 (10) > Okami (9.5) > Bayo (9) > DMC (9).
So on my action games ranking it'd go DMC3 > NG > DMC4 > NG2 > Bayo > DMC1 > all other action games.
 
In response to some of Bebpo's complaints:

a. The action always felt too short. The combat is pure fun and what makes these games great is fighting, fighting, and fighting. So when 3-5 enemies pop up and I kill them in 20 seconds and that's it...I'm left wanting more. I really didn't enjoy the split up verse aspect of the battles. My favorite level in the game was climbing the tower simply because it had so many fights. I wish this game had a mode like Bloody Palace in DMC4 where I could just fight non-stop

Beat Hard difficulty if you want your "bloody palace" equivalent.

c. Too many non-cutscene cutscene sequences where it takes away control from the player. When replaying levels I constantly have to hit start, move down to skip, and hit A to get back to playing. Sometimes if there's a qte or something it won't even let me! It's not a huge deal, but honestly replaying the levels doesn't feel as quick and smooth as it should be like other games where you just blow through the level and every time a cutscene pops up you hit start right away and you continue on fighting. Basically I just want to keep playing the game and not be constantly taken out of it.

Press a trigger + back/select to quick skip cutscenes


6. The combo strings. This and the next point aren't flaws but come down to personal taste. I hate combo strings. I think they are the worst and most vile things in fighting games and action games. I hate Tekken because of this. I have bad memory and I do not enjoy sitting around memorizing 20 different strings and what the difference in the attack is if I do PPPKP or PPPKKP. VF is my fighting game of choice and I love how my combos/attacks in that are more like "well after I float him from my B,DF+P I see he's at waist height for a few seconds so my F,F+K move will probably juggle him". I play DMC the same way. I think of how I can link individual short input (ie B,F/F,F/K,P) moves and then try them out and create my own combos. So right from the start Bayonetta being all about dozens of strings was not my cup of tea unfortunately. Even by the end I tended to just learn a few I liked for each weapon (short ones) and alternate between them. Just don't like them darn strings.

I can't really help you here. the combos are all super easy to memorize, and all look pretty different in set up so you always know which one you're about to do.

7. The weapons. For me personally, the weapons in Bayonetta lacked personality. I felt like the weapons in DMC and NG were a lot more diverse in their attacks and their movesets. When I play NG and pull out the nunchucks their move list has absolutely nothing in common with the scythe. In bayonetta I felt like whether I had claws on my feet or guns on my feet or bazookas on my feet or skates on my feet, my sword combos of PKP or PKK or PPK were pretty much the same give or take some speed and power differences.

Yes the weapons feature mostly the same combos, but it's the effects, and what HOLDING the button does that really changes up how you use them. Holding an attack with a Durga is completely different from holding one with the katana, or the Scarborough Fair.

8. The difficulty. Not really a complaint because I'm sure Hard will be adequately challenging, but normal on this was way too easy. Especially after I bought the parry accessory which meant I didn't even have to dodge and got even longer witch time. I criticized DMC4 for being too easy on the standard difficulty as well (and NG2 after you got the scythe) so it seems that "normal" difficulty on action games in general has been dumbed down this generation.

Hard mode throws the top enemies at you right from the beginning, and Infinite Climax does away with Witch Time completely.
 
Yeah, after starting Hard mode it's been a lot more fun and more of what I want in the game. Definitely challenging and fun. Kind of reminds me of how DMC4 sucked on normal but was good fun when the real enemies are there from the start in bigger packs on hard.

And thanks for the trigger+back info!
 
Net_Wrecker said:
In response to some of Bebpo's complaints:

Beat Hard difficulty if you want your "bloody palace" equivalent.
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Holy god, can't wait. I'm just going to power through Normal to get to Hard even though I missed some weapons and a ton of Alfheims for sure.

Press a trigger + back/select to quick skip cutscenes
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Ahhhhh awesome thanks!


Yes the weapons feature mostly the same combos, but it's the effects, and what HOLDING the button does that really changes up how you use them. Holding an attack with a Durga is completely different from holding one with the katana, or the Scarborough Fair.
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Agreed this is a brilliant way to add variety to the same combos. Hell, the difference between flame and lightning Durga alone, let alone Durga on Hands vs. Feet... goddamn

Just beat Prudence. Awesome boss fight.
 
Animator said:
How do you beat those enemies like the burning angels that are only vulnerable in witch time in that mode that has no wich time?
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Fire durga, guns(includes the onyx roses and the kilgore, though you have to make sure the projectiles and wicked weaves hit them, not your punches and kicks), or whip.
 
Finished this on Normal the other day and it was one of the best action games I've played to date. Started my 2nd play through on Hard and Jesus H Christmas it's WAY too much for me. I couldn't even finish the prologue. Guess it's back to normal again!
 
robot said:
Finished this on Normal the other day and it was one of the best action games I've played to date. Started my 2nd play through on Hard and Jesus H Christmas it's WAY too much for me. I couldn't even finish the prologue. Guess it's back to normal again!
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Can't wait for that feeling :D
 
Fuck this game right now!!! The last boss is ridiculous. The last level was bad enough but
Jublieus
is ridiculous. I may have to shelf this game for awhile. Frustration.
 
robot said:
Finished this on Normal the other day and it was one of the best action games I've played to date. Started my 2nd play through on Hard and Jesus H Christmas it's WAY too much for me. I couldn't even finish the prologue. Guess it's back to normal again!
Click to expand...

Are you sure you used New game+ ?

you can go through hard mode with everything you collected from normal mode you know.
 
Hawkian said:
Art thou on normal?
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Yes. And the other bosses didn't give me much of a problem. I was also fully stocked before going into the fight. I'm still getting my ass handed to me about three quarters of the way into the fight. It got to the point I through my controller down and said to myself 'that's it for awhile for this game'. I don't think a boss fight has frustrated me as much as it did since the final boss in Gears of War 1.
 
Bebpo said:
I finished the game for the first time last night and I wanted to put my thoughts in. I don't want to come off as negative because overall I definitely enjoyed it and look forward to hard mode and beyond and I can definitely see how this game would click with some people and be their favorite action game.


Still, I think this is another gem on the Kamiya list and a definite improvement in every way over his last 3d action game start (DMC1). I'd give it a 9/10 and on my Kamiya ranking it'd go: VJ (10) > RE2 (10) > Okami (9.5) > Bayo (9) > DMC (9).
So on my action games ranking it'd go DMC3 > NG > DMC4 > NG2 > Bayo > DMC1 > all other action games.
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Well you have perfectly described what I feel about this game. But I put it belove DMC1, couse thats the one who startet the whole deal for me.
 
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