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Better Call Saul S3 |OT| Gus Who's Back - Mondays 10/9c on AMC

I

IggyChooChoo

Member
iShouldGoPro said:
I really don't expect them to drag the show on just for the sake of it. They have a story to tell and when they've told it, they'll end it.

No one even knows for sure if we'll get a present day Saul Goodman in hiding season, so take that into consideration
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That scene with the shoplifting kid at the mall really makes it feel like they have a present-day arc in mind. Maybe not a season, but something more than just a final episode.
 
C

Cornballer

Member
peanutbutterlatte said:
Any news how many seasons we're getting? I hope they don't drag it out too long when the quality is this damn good!
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The original estimate was five seasons, but they might stray from that. Here's a recent Gilligan quote from an Den of Geek interview:
Q: On that note then, Chuck and Jimmy's relationship continues to get pushed further and become more frayed. You can only go so far here. Breaking Bad’s third season is when things really started to accelerate. With that show you had a set five-year plan that you more or less stuck to. Now that you’re three seasons into Saul, do you know how long this show is going to end up running?

A: You're exactly right. We couldn't really give you an exact amount of episodes. The reason being—and I'm not being coy here—it’s just hard to know exactly. But you did put your finger on something important. Just from watching this show you can tell that it's a finite story. And we know that even further from the fact that this show has to butt up against the beginning of Breaking Bad. So there is a finite nature here. But there's one difference in Better Call Saul’s finite nature that wasn't there with Breaking Bad, which is that there is yet again the possibility of a whole other story to be told through the black-and-white beginnings of a post-Breaking Bad world that we've put at the top of each season. So while I think that there is a definite end in sight for the pre-Breaking Bad story, there still seems like there could be a lot in the post-Breaking Bad world. I'm kind of fascinated by that, simply as one of the first fans of the series. What could come out of that? No promises, but it seems to me that there's a little more opportunity for scope there than there even was in Breaking Bad.
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A couple of considerations...

Gilligan and Gould do have some vague master plans in place, but to a large extent they write stuff on the fly and work themselves out of problems organically. It isn't as meticulously planned as some other shows on an overall story arc level. (Note that they are extremely meticulous and thoughtful when they're actually breaking specific seasons and episodes.) So, more so than some other shows, things can change and their estimates are just that.

They've developed a cast and crew in Albuquerque and Gilligan is, by all accounts, one of the genuinely nice guys in TV. When they end the show, those people have to get new jobs, and I think he takes this into consideration.

Anyway, I think 5 seasons total is still a smart bet, though they might lengthen it slightly past there or even look into another spinoff. Another spinoff seems like a bad idea at face value, but so did BCS and look what we got.
 
Grizzlyjin

Grizzlyjin

Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
Cornballer said:
The original estimate was five seasons, but they might stray from that. Here's a recent Gilligan quote from an Den of Geek interview:A couple of considerations...

Anyway, I think 5 seasons total is still a smart bet, though they might lengthen it slightly past there or even look into another spinoff. Another spinoff seems like a bad idea at face value, but so did BCS and look what we got.
Click to expand...

I'd bet on 5 seasons as well. We'd probably already know if next season was the last. AMC LOVES their final season run ups. I also don't think AMC would box them in creatively. They'll be able to see the end coming and write towards it like what happened with FX and The Americans. 5 or 6 seasons just feels like the sweet spot for prestige shows like this.
 
ElRenoRaven

ElRenoRaven

Member
Protome said:
I feel Howard needs more love in here, from how he had enough foresight to know that Chuck taking the stand was a bad idea to his face when asked to clarify his nepotism statement to his reactions in the background during the cross examination he was damn perfect character in this episode.


Really? Chuck's illness being mental has been hammered home time and time again. I wouldn't really say he's a fraud, he believes he's sick.
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Yea. Howard is a great character. He was done so perfectly that you wanted to completely hate him in the beginning until you found out he wasn't the raging asshole he was painted to be. If anything he seems like a good guy who liked Jimmy and has some loyalty to Jimmy's brother and so he's caught in the middle. Like you said he knew Chuck shouldn't have done it and tried to warn him. He even asked if they really needed to do that. You have to figure at some point down the road Howard is gonna get tired of Chuck's shit and just tell him and Jimmy to completely fuck off.
 
I

IggyChooChoo

Member
PsychoRaven said:
Yea. Howard is a great character. He was done so perfectly that you wanted to completely hate him in the beginning until you found out he wasn't the raging asshole he was painted to be. If anything he seems like a good guy who liked Jimmy and has some loyalty to Jimmy's brother and so he's caught in the middle. Like you said he knew Chuck shouldn't have done it and tried to warn him. He even asked if they really needed to do that. You have to figure at some point down the road Howard is gonna get tired of Chuck's shit and just tell him and Jimmy to completely fuck off.
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Fully agree. Both the writing and the portrayal of Howard are great, and have unexpectedly made him into a character I look forward to seeing. I would just add that I think Howard will be forcing Chuck into retirement starting immediately. Chuck looked sloppy with Mesa Verde and now he looks crazy in a spectacular way. Gossip will be off the charts. Howard has no choice if he wants to protect the firm, despite the obvious respect and loyalty he has for Chuck. And it'll have to be a big, public signal to work, unfortunately.
 
D

Darth Pinche

Member
I'm jumping on the Howard love train too. He can be an ass, but he is also stuck between a rock and hard place sometimes. You can see the conflict he has before he has to do these dick moves. Such a great performance!

Also Howard jumping over the fences to sneak into Chuck's place is underappreciated comedy gold.

Secret Agent Howard.
 
I

IggyChooChoo

Member
Darth Pinche said:
I'm jumping on the Howard love train too. He can be an ass, but he is also stuck between a rock and hard place sometimes. You can see the conflict he has before he has to do these dick moves. Such a great performance!

Also Howard jumping over the fences to sneak into Chuck's place is underappreciated comedy gold.

Secret Agent Howard.
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That scene where he warns Kim then mechanically snaps on that smile to meet with clients was awesome characterization. I really appreciate how the BB/BCS team can get us to enjoy tight-ass, unlikeable corporate weirdos like Howard and Lydia.
 
S

Saty

Member
So what was the importance of having Chuck acknowledge a copy of the tape to the actual plan Jimmy carried out this ep?
 
I

Ignatz Mouse

Banned
Saty said:
So what was the importance of having Chuck acknowledge a copy of the tape to the actual plan Jimmy carried out this ep?
Click to expand...

They needed them to play it.

If Chuck just went with "my brother broke in violently and broke open my desk to destroy a tape that showed him breaking the law" there's not lot Jimmy could counter with. That alone probably would have gotten Jimmy disbarred (especially since he confessed to it legally). But since Chuck played the tape, and explained the whole story of his illness and his plan to trick Jimmy, it gave Jimmy leverage to discredit him.

Basically, they knew Chuck would overplay his hand at that point.
 
C

crisdecuba

Member
Ignatz Mouse said:
They needed them to play it.

If Chuck just went with "my brother broke in violently and broke open my desk to destroy a tape that showed him breaking the law" there's not lot Jimmy could counter with. That alone probably would have gotten Jimmy disbarred (especially since he confessed to it legally). But since Chuck played the tape, and explained the whole story of his illness and his plan to trick Jimmy, it gave Jimmy leverage to discredit him.

Basically, they knew Chuck would overplay his hand at that point.
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And as I understand it, it all began before that point as well. When they were negotiating over the wording of gimme's statement, Jimmy and Kim included verbiage that made it look like they were trying to be ambiguous about what Jimmy destroyed. Chuck honed in on this and pushed for the tape to be more explicitly mentioned. I saw this as a move to in sure that Chuck was pushing toward having the contents of the tape played Chuck honed in on this and pushed for the tape to be more explicitly mentioned. I saw this as a move to ensure that Chuck was nudged toward having the contents of the tape played ( by jimmy and Kim pretending that they wanted to avoid the tape altogether ).
 
M

Morrigan Stark

Arrogant Smirk
daninthemix said:
I was completely surprised - I expected whatever Huell planted on Chuck to start causing him to freak out, get headaches, lose concentration in court, etc - had no idea it was to prove him a fraud.
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Um, really? For one thing, Chuck's illness isn't faked/fraudulent, it's just mental, as opposed to physical (which he denies of course, because there's no social stigma attached to physical illnesses unlike mental ones), and for another thing, we've seen many times before that Chuck's symptoms are entirely psychosomatic. Remember in S1, when he's in the hospital, and the doctor pretty much proves it by turning on a machine near Chuck without him knowing, and he has no reaction?
 
K

Kalor

Member
This week's episode was great. It was almost 40 minutes of the court room scene but it flew by, partly due to how strong everyones performance was.

I didn't pick up on the possibility on Huell appearing with the tight spaces line so that was a nice surprise.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
Hermii said:
He is exellent at what he does, and he is making the cartel billions. Isnt that a good enough reason?
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Elario shies away from killing Gus in the first pool scene, when Gus doesn't even work for him, and they kill his meth cook instead.

He specifically says he knows he can't kill Gus. So it's not just about the money because Gus isn't making any money at that point.
 
A

awesome_pants

Banned
Not sure if it was previously posted, but final 3 episode titles were revealed and may allude to some spoilery stuff:
3x08 - Slip
3x09 - Fall
3x10 - Lantern
 
D

Darth Pinche

Member
pigeon said:
Elario shies away from killing Gus in the first pool scene, when Gus doesn't even work for him, and they kill his meth cook instead.

He specifically says he knows he can't kill Gus. So it's not just about the money because Gus isn't making any money at that point.
Click to expand...

There was a line about Gus' family being important back in BB, so that is probably the reason Elario can't directly harm him. Rival cartel?
 
I

IggyChooChoo

Member
Darth Pinche said:
There was a line about Gus' family being important back in BB, so that is probably the reason Elario can't directly harm him. Rival cartel?
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I don't think the Chileans had any drug cartels that would've intimidated them. A Pinochet connection, on the other hand...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Orlando_Letelier

Edit:
Actually, this dude could COMPLETELY fit into a story somewhere between Walter White and Gus Fring:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenio_Berríos
 
D

Darth Pinche

Member
V

VAD

Member
That episode was masterful. Jimmy just killed his brother by discrediting him in front of his exwife. That was so cold blooded but I can't say Chuck did not deserve it. His meltdown scene was satisfying and sad to see at the same time.
I also liked the very subtle facial expression Kim makes when the tape plays the part of Jimmy's confession where he admits he did it to avenge her.
 
B

BobTheFork

Member
awesome_pants said:
Not sure if it was previously posted, but final 3 episode titles were revealed and may allude to some spoilery stuff:
3x08 - Slip
3x09 - Fall
3x10 - Lantern
Click to expand...


hmm. They mentioned that there was a hint in the show titles this time but said their previous one last season was way too obvious. That seems even more so.
 
C

crisdecuba

Member
Morrigan Stark said:
Um, really? For one thing, Chuck's illness isn't faked/fraudulent, it's just mental, as opposed to physical (which he denies of course, because there's no social stigma attached to physical illnesses unlike mental ones), and for another thing, we've seen many times before that Chuck's symptoms are entirely psychosomatic. Remember in S1, when he's in the hospital, and the doctor pretty much proves it by turning on a machine near Chuck without him knowing, and he has no reaction?
Click to expand...
Have we really seen it many times? I only recall that S1 example you gave...
 
U

UltimaPooh

Member
I really want them to have a whole season or most of a season dedicated to post BB. I think it would be really interesting to see the post world shake out and whether or not Jimmy stays in hiding forever.
 
H

Hermii

Member
pigeon said:
Elario shies away from killing Gus in the first pool scene, when Gus doesn't even work for him, and they kill his meth cook instead.

He specifically says he knows he can't kill Gus. So it's not just about the money because Gus isn't making any money at that point.
Click to expand...
Ah I forgot that scene.
 
P

Protome

Member
PsychoRaven said:
Yea. Howard is a great character. He was done so perfectly that you wanted to completely hate him in the beginning until you found out he wasn't the raging asshole he was painted to be. If anything he seems like a good guy who liked Jimmy and has some loyalty to Jimmy's brother and so he's caught in the middle. Like you said he knew Chuck shouldn't have done it and tried to warn him. He even asked if they really needed to do that. You have to figure at some point down the road Howard is gonna get tired of Chuck's shit and just tell him and Jimmy to completely fuck off.
Click to expand...


I feel it'll either go that way or this is the end for Chuck, be it either death or institutionalisation or maybe even his ex wife feels bad for him and they get back together and go away somewhere alone. Then Chuck's absence and Jimmy being the direct cause of it with Kim helping out will force Howard into the main antagonist role again like the first series but this time without Chuck pulling his strings and he feels betrayed for giving Jimmy so much leeway.
 
L

lamaroo

Unconfirmed Member
What an episode.

What a performance by McKean, and even an amazing, but subtle performance from Odenkirk, he continues to impress me.
 
L

lamaroo

Unconfirmed Member
Hella Lugosi said:
He had other clients and a life outside of his interactions with Walt. The question is whether or not there'd even be an interesting story to tell there
Click to expand...

Well I think this team can do just about anything, and I have no doubt they would make a storyline concurrent with Breaking Bad just as enthralling, but I hope they focus on the pre and post Breaking Bad story, as we've already seen how Saul changes throughout Breaking Bad.
 
S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
pigeon said:
I wonder whether BCS will actually resolve the still unresolved question of what ties Gus has that make even Don Elario scared to kill him.

Or will that have to wait for the Gustavo Fring spinoff in four years?
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Would Gus even make for a good spinoff? It would just look like Narcos. I don't know how interested I am in a character with zero emotional variance and kills people for Pinochet.
 
L

Lothar

Banned
Einchy said:
Saul was definitely up to something with the Cartel during BB. Here he tries ratting out Nacho.

https://youtu.be/1ehS9xgXLa0?t=25s

[edit]

Holy shit, Saul tells them to just kill Badger like it's nothing. What happened to you, Jimmy? Damn...
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He also suggests to kill Hank and Jesse twice. All of which are too much for even Walt to do. Things are going to have change dramatically in a short amount of time if this is a 5 season show.
 
Kadin

Kadin

Member
BobTheFork said:
hmm. They mentioned that there was a hint in the show titles this time but said their previous one last season was way too obvious. That seems even more so.
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I thought Vince in one of the more recent podcasts said there wasn't a hint in this seasons titles when talking about how quick last season's was figured out.
 
P

-Pyromaniac-

Member
Lothar said:
He also suggests to kill Hank and Jesse twice. All of which are too much for even Walt to do. Things are going to have change dramatically in a short amount of time if this is a 5 season show.
Click to expand...
lets keep in mind these are completely different circumstances. In BB his very life was in danger. He could die at any moment being surrounded by those crazies. I could see Jimmy doing absolutely anything to save his own hide when it's his life on the line vs a buncha hooligans.

But yeah there's still room for him to get there.
 
L

Lothar

Banned
-Pyromaniac- said:
lets keep in mind these are completely different circumstances. In BB his very life was in danger. He could die at any moment being surrounded by those crazies. I could see Jimmy doing absolutely anything to save his own hide when it's his life on the line vs a buncha hooligans.

But yeah there's still room for him to get there.
Click to expand...

Jesse wasn't a threat to his life in Season 3 though, yet ir was still a time to talk options. Neither was Hank. Hank was only a threat to Saul going to jail.
 
M

Mechanical Snowman

Member
BunnyBear said:
Indeed, though I could do without the whiny editor. Just let Vince host it.
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Man, what! I think she's great.

Needs more Bob Odenkirk, but dude sounds like he juggles multiple projects so I imagine he's busy all the time.

Edit: actually, the one huge gripe I have with this podcast is that the audio volumes are all over the place, have to constantly turn up and down my speakers depending on who's speaking. Considering it's produced by a professional editor on one of the best edited shows on TV, it's kinda funny.

The podcasts on cave comedy radio are produced better, and I'm pretty sure those guys record in the basement of a bar.
 
R

RecRoulette

Member
crisdecuba said:
Have we really seen it many times? I only recall that S1 example you gave...
Click to expand...

There have been many times where Chuck has been able to power through or just ignore his illness. Last season when he took back Mesa Verde from Kim and this season when he's just standing out in the sun immediately come to mind. I'm sure there are more examples.
 
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