dragonbane
Member
Minor spoiler:
As child Jodie you can drive fucking Barbie dolls around and have a tea party. The voice acting is amazing and it is very funny. Takes like 2 minutes lol
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BEYOND: Two Souls (Ellen Page, Willem Dafoe) |OT| Press Triangle to Aiden
- Thread starter Replicant
- Start date
I think this is going to be one of the most polarising games in recent years. I too have been hearing chatter from quite a few people that have played it already.
Some are proclaiming it to be "Game of the year" while others really did not enjoy it at all. One thing for sure is that the game is certainly going to have people talking.
Miles Quaritch
Member
I'm starting the game in a few seconds...
You're really posting the game disc knowing full well that some of us have to wait another four days?
What kind of monster are you?
dragonbane
Member
Look at me:
HAHAHA. I FUCKING HAVE IT!
No way I let "reviewers" sour me on something I waited 3 years for. I'm gonna beat these clowns to it. I'm going in full exploration mode and I will time my playthrough.
Let's see if this is a game or not...
BTW the game is usual David Cage sauce. Don't listen to the reviewers.
Raitosaito
Member
The Asian CIA trainer and the one you train fight with are terrible, and it's not because they might not be native speakers, is just that their delivery is shit. Cage did good with getting Ellen and Dafoe because they can deliver the dialogue even when it's poorly written.
aw yiss !! enjoying the excellent artbook (Spain, that's why the "Dos Almas" )
https://vine.co/v/hgPAVmzJIr5
https://vine.co/v/hgPAVmzJIr5
Miles Quaritch
Member
So you got it? You lucky sonofabitch. Oh how I lament the death of indie game stores.
As expected. Knew not to bother with reviews, but it's nice to have it confirmed.
A bad one I suppose
A heartless one if you ask me. I feel it's only right you send me the game (express delivery) as a way of apologising....
Do want!
ComputerMKII
Banned
For those who are interested in MBTI, I think Jodie is an ISTP. She's a "silent badass", doesn't talk unless she needs to and when she does, she doesn't say more than what's necessary. However, when people like her get really annoyed, they can explode in a fit of rage, shout at you and giving you the death stare. They're rebellious, adventurous and won't let others tell them how they're supposed to live (it doesn't mean they have no desire for company or even relationships).
She won't hesitate to tell someone he or she fucked up even if they're friends - she prefers justice to consensus. She just wants to live a normal life and is more practical-oriented than theory-oriented. ISTPs make for great action movie stars (unfortunately for ISTPs, real life is not an action movie). Therefore, I think she's an ISTP (it takes one to know one, I guess, also, Ellen Page herself is rumored to be an ISTP). "Secretive and unpredictable."
Ryan is definitely an ESTJ. Charismatic, no-nonsense and somewhat authoritarian, the typical badass leader, think Sgt. Hartman from Full Metal Jacket or Hillary Clinton. "Strict and aggressive".
Nathan is an ISFP. I first thought of INFP because he's a scientist but he seems quite practical and facts-oriented. He's more interested in how things work than why they work. Doesn't care about the bigger picture or theories. His attachment to Jodie, his will to negociate and his 'end justify the means' behavior makes me think he's more an F than a T. He takes decisions based on his feelings, not his sense of right and wrong. "Free-spirited and kind."
I haven't thought about Cole too much but at first glance he seems like an ESFP - the typical easygoing, social dude, life of the party. "Fun and entertaining."
She won't hesitate to tell someone he or she fucked up even if they're friends - she prefers justice to consensus. She just wants to live a normal life and is more practical-oriented than theory-oriented. ISTPs make for great action movie stars (unfortunately for ISTPs, real life is not an action movie). Therefore, I think she's an ISTP (it takes one to know one, I guess, also, Ellen Page herself is rumored to be an ISTP). "Secretive and unpredictable."
Ryan is definitely an ESTJ. Charismatic, no-nonsense and somewhat authoritarian, the typical badass leader, think Sgt. Hartman from Full Metal Jacket or Hillary Clinton. "Strict and aggressive".
Nathan is an ISFP. I first thought of INFP because he's a scientist but he seems quite practical and facts-oriented. He's more interested in how things work than why they work. Doesn't care about the bigger picture or theories. His attachment to Jodie, his will to negociate and his 'end justify the means' behavior makes me think he's more an F than a T. He takes decisions based on his feelings, not his sense of right and wrong. "Free-spirited and kind."
I haven't thought about Cole too much but at first glance he seems like an ESFP - the typical easygoing, social dude, life of the party. "Fun and entertaining."
Celestial Mortal
Member
Can this be added in the OT?
BlackBanditSho
Member
Really wanted to finish this by Monday, but it's starting to feel like a real chore to get through. I'm near the end at 'The Mission', and I've almost totally lost interest in this character. Cage does some fantastic mo-cap work, and there are points where visually, the game is a knock out.
However, I don't feel like i'm getting even the illusion of choice in this game. Cage wasn't kidding when he said that that there's no real death state, which makes the stealth sections in this game a joke.
It's the overall story that irks me more than the the technical or design foibles, which are really questionable.
This late in the game, and I'm still asking, "Why am I doing this?", and, "Why Should I care?" Jodie is weak, and far too often the damsel in distress. She's a largely uncommunicative character, who remains at odds and distrustful with the people closest to her, and even the entity Aiden, who is the co-star of the game.
She has struggled, and faced melodramatic mounds of betrayal most of her life. It's a journey that's tediously chronicled as we play snippets of it throughout the course of the game. Following a haunted young child, to an awkward teen, to an isolated adult woman finding her footing would've been a really fascinating experience if the player was given even the illusion that our choices throughout the game brought us to these places, but instead, Cage drags us along showing us moments in Jodie's life that he feels are important, but are emotionally distant for the player. At least for me.
Cage misses key marks frequently here.
Take for example, a potentially romantic date late in the game between adult Jodie and another character. We're charged as the possessive spirit, Aiden, the jealous spectre who has bonded with Jodie and has protected her throughout the game. During the date, you're given the option to wreck any chance at love, by being an ass and scaring the date away. In the end of the scene, after the date is ruined, anguished Jodie screams her hatred of Aiden for destroying everything.
How much more effective would it have been, I wondered, if Jodie began to yell at YOU, the gamer, directly? I consciously wanted to be mischievous, knowing how important this was to Jodie. There was a pretty easy disconnect for me. It was easy to blame my actions and any guilt on Aiden, not myself, which might have been different had the player been messaged directly into camera as Aiden. The mocap technology and beautiful texturing would've made this eerily effective. Milo come true.
Cage dances around sexism clumsily. You're playing a female lead, but at every opportunity, she's walking around in panties and a bra, or taking a shower that, while not showing nudity, begins to feel a little voyeuristic. Why are we lingering with her at all? The extended sequences of her drying herself, barely covered by a strategically placed towel, or letting the water run through her hair as the camera pans just before we begin to see the curves of her form, aren't moments of catharsis, but sexual innuendo.
We, not Aiden, watches as she strips into a fresh change of clothes, or walks around in her low cut shorts that are inappropriate for her dinner guest, but not for us, the audience.
More, Jodie is incredibly weak and squeamish, yelping and jumping at every sudden bump or fright, despite a significant portion of the game going towards her military training. Yet, this is the same girl that can enter a heavily armed African military town and single-handedly take on any adversaries with a rapid one-two take down and a little spectral assist.
To be fair, there are portions of the game that really work. "Navajo", for example, takes Jodie on an unexpected, albeit cliched spirit quest to find herself. It's tired territory handled surprisingly well, providing a somewhat intimate look at a family dynamic and culture that we don't often see in video gaming.
There's also "homeless", which, like Navajo, tries to handle the material with a fair bit of weight, and feels like a deliberate inclusion to, perhaps, broaden the perspectives of an audience that too often doesn't see the lives of the less entitled. It's a brief, and somewhat pivotal portion of the narrative, that the game could've used a whole lot more off, while trimming a great deal from the action portions.
I could go on for pages about the game, but I really should finish it.
And i really don't want to.
Much of what I liked in my early impressions, has faded. Context sensitive directional movements don't always match up with the direction you naturally think they should go. The result? Botched timing sequences during action heavy moments. It's good thing you literally cannot die.
The more spectacular battles with the sci-fi elements of the game are a cacophony of visual inkblots filling the screen with confusion, masking the tiniest of action prompts often lost in the center of the screen. Again, it's a good thing that Cage minimized the action to three basic command gestures ... which makes battles weightless and boring.
I could go on and on about the wasted potential of Aiden. How the ability to control people and objects through a distance is a fantastic mechanic that follows absolutely zero narrative rhyme or reason. There's an absurd inconsistency about where and when it can be used. Some guys you can mind control. Some guys can be forced to shoot other people. Some guys can only shoot themselves. Sometimes you can shake metal cans. Sometimes you can't. Sometimes you can blow electronic devices, sometimes you can't move a lamp two feet in front of you.
What a fantastic game this would've been if you had the same options, consistently, ALL the time. Again, the illusion of choice goes a long way.
However, I don't feel like i'm getting even the illusion of choice in this game. Cage wasn't kidding when he said that that there's no real death state, which makes the stealth sections in this game a joke.
It's the overall story that irks me more than the the technical or design foibles, which are really questionable.
This late in the game, and I'm still asking, "Why am I doing this?", and, "Why Should I care?" Jodie is weak, and far too often the damsel in distress. She's a largely uncommunicative character, who remains at odds and distrustful with the people closest to her, and even the entity Aiden, who is the co-star of the game.
She has struggled, and faced melodramatic mounds of betrayal most of her life. It's a journey that's tediously chronicled as we play snippets of it throughout the course of the game. Following a haunted young child, to an awkward teen, to an isolated adult woman finding her footing would've been a really fascinating experience if the player was given even the illusion that our choices throughout the game brought us to these places, but instead, Cage drags us along showing us moments in Jodie's life that he feels are important, but are emotionally distant for the player. At least for me.
Cage misses key marks frequently here.
Take for example, a potentially romantic date late in the game between adult Jodie and another character. We're charged as the possessive spirit, Aiden, the jealous spectre who has bonded with Jodie and has protected her throughout the game. During the date, you're given the option to wreck any chance at love, by being an ass and scaring the date away. In the end of the scene, after the date is ruined, anguished Jodie screams her hatred of Aiden for destroying everything.
How much more effective would it have been, I wondered, if Jodie began to yell at YOU, the gamer, directly? I consciously wanted to be mischievous, knowing how important this was to Jodie. There was a pretty easy disconnect for me. It was easy to blame my actions and any guilt on Aiden, not myself, which might have been different had the player been messaged directly into camera as Aiden. The mocap technology and beautiful texturing would've made this eerily effective. Milo come true.
Cage dances around sexism clumsily. You're playing a female lead, but at every opportunity, she's walking around in panties and a bra, or taking a shower that, while not showing nudity, begins to feel a little voyeuristic. Why are we lingering with her at all? The extended sequences of her drying herself, barely covered by a strategically placed towel, or letting the water run through her hair as the camera pans just before we begin to see the curves of her form, aren't moments of catharsis, but sexual innuendo.
We, not Aiden, watches as she strips into a fresh change of clothes, or walks around in her low cut shorts that are inappropriate for her dinner guest, but not for us, the audience.
More, Jodie is incredibly weak and squeamish, yelping and jumping at every sudden bump or fright, despite a significant portion of the game going towards her military training. Yet, this is the same girl that can enter a heavily armed African military town and single-handedly take on any adversaries with a rapid one-two take down and a little spectral assist.
To be fair, there are portions of the game that really work. "Navajo", for example, takes Jodie on an unexpected, albeit cliched spirit quest to find herself. It's tired territory handled surprisingly well, providing a somewhat intimate look at a family dynamic and culture that we don't often see in video gaming.
There's also "homeless", which, like Navajo, tries to handle the material with a fair bit of weight, and feels like a deliberate inclusion to, perhaps, broaden the perspectives of an audience that too often doesn't see the lives of the less entitled. It's a brief, and somewhat pivotal portion of the narrative, that the game could've used a whole lot more off, while trimming a great deal from the action portions.
I could go on for pages about the game, but I really should finish it.
And i really don't want to.
Much of what I liked in my early impressions, has faded. Context sensitive directional movements don't always match up with the direction you naturally think they should go. The result? Botched timing sequences during action heavy moments. It's good thing you literally cannot die.
The more spectacular battles with the sci-fi elements of the game are a cacophony of visual inkblots filling the screen with confusion, masking the tiniest of action prompts often lost in the center of the screen. Again, it's a good thing that Cage minimized the action to three basic command gestures ... which makes battles weightless and boring.
I could go on and on about the wasted potential of Aiden. How the ability to control people and objects through a distance is a fantastic mechanic that follows absolutely zero narrative rhyme or reason. There's an absurd inconsistency about where and when it can be used. Some guys you can mind control. Some guys can be forced to shoot other people. Some guys can only shoot themselves. Sometimes you can shake metal cans. Sometimes you can't. Sometimes you can blow electronic devices, sometimes you can't move a lamp two feet in front of you.
What a fantastic game this would've been if you had the same options, consistently, ALL the time. Again, the illusion of choice goes a long way.
SkyTurnsRed
Banned
I'm slightly worried because we were supposed to get a copy of this for review like many others, but nothing has shown up. Wondering if it got lost in transit or something.
dragonbane
Member
Yeah I got it. I walked in and the dude was just packing out the copies for rental. I pointed at it and said "I want to buy this". And so I got itSo you got it? You lucky sonofabitch. Oh how I lament the death of indie game stores.
As expected. Knew not to bother with reviews, but it's nice to have it confirmed.
Here are my first impressions:
Fascinating game. I feel the exact opposite. Also at least the first stealth sequence allows for failure (I lost twice), so I really enjoyed it. Will type up more once I beat it.
cleveridea
Member
wow feel bad for you people that dont get special edition for same price
cleveridea
Member
I'm starting the game in a few seconds...
ugly disc. see GTA V for how the disc should look. just set fire to it, thats unacceptable.
Rogue_Ledr
Banned
Will there be reviews tonight?
The game is out tommorrow, so I would hope so.
The game is out tommorrow, so I would hope so.
Embargo is tomorrow (afternoon in Europe, I think it's AM in the states?).
That's a promo disc. All/most review copies look like that, more often than not come in plain jewel cases as well
ComputerMKII
Banned
You should have posted that in the spoiler thread instead.
I agree with what you said about the big action scenes. They're a chore and if there's no death state, there's not much point in forcing you to press buttons (unless failure means the story takes a different path). The game would have been better by not having them or making them non-interactive.
timetokill
Banned
dragonbane, can you go into more detail why "Reviewers won't like this game period"?
It seems unexpected to me because games like this are usually something like "plaudit-bait" in this industry, and Heavy Rain reviewed extremely well (87 on Metacritic).
What does this game do so differently that will make reviewers turn on it?
It seems unexpected to me because games like this are usually something like "plaudit-bait" in this industry, and Heavy Rain reviewed extremely well (87 on Metacritic).
What does this game do so differently that will make reviewers turn on it?
WarrenMax007
Member
Let's go. Big electronics retailer in Russia broke street date. Game is 18+ so it's either US version or uncut. We'll see. Sorry for bad quality, low light.
dragonbane
Member
I know you hated Heavy Rain, so I will put one aspect in that is still present from HR. Therefore 3 main reasons IMO:
1. The game has no real plot for the first 1/3 of the game or even longer. Each scene is an important moment from Jodie's life, like a memory that will always be with you. Shocking moments, sad moments, happy moments, boring moments that somehow stuck with you. They have no real connection at first. So you are pretty much playing vignettes in random order. The plot IS Jodie for the most part. That's hard to grasp at first and even harder to accept. Many will find it boring immediately and quit ("nothing is happening"). Many will say it has no plot or focus on the "main plot", which does exist so the game can eventually end, but is of no real importance till later in the game and shouldn't be focused on. It's not something that should be done often, but I find it highly interesting in this case. It's like Cage said "playing the life of a character". I find it compelling and fascinating to participate in the life of this character. A lot of people won't enjoy that and I don't blame them
2. The subject matter won't appeal to everyone. This is mostly a story about being alone and depressed, to have no friends, no home or no anything pretty much. The game focuses on how to deal with that. It's also about growing and accepting who you are. Much harder stuff to identify with than a father who wants to save his son. I live in a similar situation, or I did a long time ago. Similar to Computer I feel invested in this character, because we align in some ways. Many people will just find it too depressing or boring.
3. The writing still has some issues, although less than Heavy Rain. After TLoU, this is harder to forgive when you are a reviewer and have to score in relation to everything else that came out this year. I don't really care, because most of these problems are related to the main plot I honestly don't care about (yet).
They both had like two lines so far, so it didn't bother me.
When has anyone ever had a fully clothed shower in a Quantic Dream game?
Acquiescence
Member
When has anyone ever had a fully clothed shower in real life?
Various Artists
Banned
So is there any censorship in the US version or is it completely uncut?
at my gym all the time.
I'm not sure about real life, but I remember Kel having one at the beginning of Good Burger.
Fully clothed showers always remind me of that film, for some reason.
Live Free or Die
Banned
So no PSN release for this?
BlackBanditSho
Member
Just finished. This post nails it. if you work through it, the game is better than some of the parts that make up the sum, but it's satisfying. Ambitious, too. I won't say that I love the game, and unlike Heavy Rain, I'm not compelled to play this again for a LONG time. Still, it's worth going through at least once. Reviewers won't like it. It's a hard game to commit to when you're in a score-based, pressure filled environment.
Can this be added in the OT?
Dafoe was incredible in that movie (Boondock Saints). A tour de force of overacting.
Ceaseless Discharge
Banned
I'm a lttp PS3 owner, bought a super slim recently for The Last Of Us, never played Heavy Rain and was mostly unaware of Beyond Two Souls until reading this thread on the train today.
Downloaded the demo and absolutely loved it. This is the perfect game to play with Mrs. Discharge as she loves the whole supernatural thing, and I can geek out on the graphics and environments. Definitely a game to enjoy at night with a bottle of wine. Get into the whole vibe and angle of it.
Really looking forward to the release.
Downloaded the demo and absolutely loved it. This is the perfect game to play with Mrs. Discharge as she loves the whole supernatural thing, and I can geek out on the graphics and environments. Definitely a game to enjoy at night with a bottle of wine. Get into the whole vibe and angle of it.
Really looking forward to the release.
Mrs. Discharge? Eeeeew. Not only do you need to rethink your user name but you need to play Heavy Rain STAT.
Dynamite Ringo Matsuri
Member
Im kind of flabbergasted that Sony greenlit this, because the subject matter definitely doesn't sound like something that the majority of people will enjoy. I know that there are hints at a life of solitude and despair in all the promo material but all the impressions so far make it clear that this game is pretty much steeped in pathos. Pretty damned gutsy of both Cage and Sony to stick to their guns, and I'm more curious than ever of what their PS4 title will embody
ComputerMKII
Banned
Excellent and fair piece of criticism. I agree. Your first point is particularly accurate. That's why the last few hours were very important and could not afford to suck. The first two thirds of the story are almost 'nothing special', they just lay the ground for what happens next so, if the conclusion was bad, the whole game would pretty much fail. However, I think the ending does deliver, it does make sense, therefore it gives meaning to the story as a whole. Your final choices wouldn't have as much weight if you didn't feel as familiar with Jodie.
You have to know the value of life before you can look death in the eye.
BlackBanditSho
Member
Computer and Dragon - would love to share thoughts on the ending in the spoiler thread. Not sure which ending I got, but I'm okay with it.
lunchtoast
Member
Amazon shipped earlier this afternoon. Curse this being a long work week!
something fishy
Member
Seems cagey folk like it but if you didn't like the last one its best left alone from the sense I'm getting.