Obligatory when talking about Billy Crystal:
Tom Scharpling vs Billy Crystal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CX2mClXKME8
Tom Scharpling vs Billy Crystal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CX2mClXKME8
I don't disagree. I am also totally for gay rights. I think they should get married, have kids, etc. However, I don't want to see 2 guys going at it on TV. To me it's gross. Is that homophobic?
You didn't elaborate on much.
I think he's just uncomfortable with gay sex scenes. No one has to feel comfortable watching softcore gay porn.
I personally don't give a shit, but I totally understand why it would make some people uncomfortable and don't hold anything against them, unless they're pre-occupied with it.
To everyone in this topic that has defended Billy, take one second to think about how prevalent heterosexual expressions of love/lust are on TV and then look at what you posted.
I can't believe what I'm reading here.
Maybe none of us get it right, and we should let it go until he provides more context.
I would love to hear a clarification. If he just misspoke, that would be great.I'm sure he'll clarify this (if he hasn't done so already).
I would love to hear a clarification. If he just misspoke, that would be great.
But this is what we've got right now, and I really struggle with some of the acrobatics people are pulling to try and soften/explain away these comments.
Basically this. Crystal isn't a homophobe.
Whoa, this is shocking coming from Billy Crystal of all people.
That being said, before you bust out the pitchforks, I kind of agree with him. The problem isn't the fact that homosexuality isn't being shown on TV, the problem is that it's being shown WAY too over the top.
Take Cameron and Mitchell on Modern Family. Yes, they are gay. But the show makes it a point to remind you through some action or joke EVERY TIME THAT THEY ARE ON SCREEN that yes, they are gay. Now, I love the characters and Eric Stonestreet and Jesse Tyler Ferguson are great actors but sometimes I feel the writers take things a biiiit too far. Yes it's a comedy show, but gay people don't act this way in real life. Also, why the hell do we still have to denote them as gay? They're just people.
I think he's just uncomfortable with gay sex scenes. No one has to feel comfortable watching softcore gay porn.
I personally don't give a shit, but I totally understand why it would make some people uncomfortable and don't hold anything against them, unless they're pre-occupied with it.
I disagree.That's not really acrobatics if you look at his quotes and ignore the editorialization by the author looking for a story.
I don't disagree. I am also totally for gay rights. I think they should get married, have kids, etc. However, I don't want to see 2 guys going at it on TV. To me it's gross. Is that homophobic?
Hours Left: I agree, but I would be interested in seeing what the thought process is. Is it just, "Oh, he said something that might be controversial. I like Billy Crystal, so I'm going to come up with an interpretation for what he meant to say that I find more acceptable"? Because I'd get that sort of defensive, emotional reaction even if it doesn't make sense upon examination.
But if they decided to make that character's romance a plot suddenly is that unacceptable and shoving it in their faces and reducing him down to "gay" as his only defining characteristic?
I think he's trying to say that a character can be gay. It just shouldn't be the defining characteristic, that homosexuals are regular people.
I don't disagree. I am also totally for gay rights. I think they should get married, have kids, etc. However, I don't want to see 2 guys going at it on TV. To me it's gross. Is that homophobic?
That's not really acrobatics if you look at his quotes and ignore the editorialization by the author looking for a story.
I disagree.
I don't disagree. I am also totally for gay rights. I think they should get married, have kids, etc. However, I don't want to see 2 guys going at it on TV. To me it's gross. Is that homophobic?
I don't see him saying that at all. This:
In the context of:
Doesn't make me think this has anything to do with him his empathy for the state of gay characters on television.
Sometimes I think, Ah thats too much for me,
It was very difficult at the time, said Crystal. Jodie was really the first recurring [gay] character on network television and it was a different time, it was 1977. So, yeah, it was awkward. It was tough.
I did it in front of a live audience and there were times when I would say to Bob [Seagren], I love you, and the audience would laugh nervously. I wanted to stop the taping and go, What is your problem?'
Sometimes, its just pushing it a little too far for my taste and Im not going to reveal to you which ones they are.
I hope people dont abuse it and shove it in our face to the point where it feels like an every day kind of thing.
Like, can any of us name five shows right now where a gay character is only propped as being gay and having no other characteristics? How many popular shows have gay sex scenes?
This.
It sounds like he's one of those people who are only ok with gay characters when their sexuality is mentioned in passing or alluded to. As soon as it's directly shown then it becomes too much.
Honestly, I totally see how you come to that conclusion. I think the article was way too much editorializing to go along with his quotes. Is there anywhere we can actually watch the panel and see what he said uninterrupted?
Here is all we know he said, free from editorializing:
To me, those thoughts don't flow into each other at all, and there isn't a description of what specifically he's talking about aside from what the writer of the Yahoo article tells us. The writer was even so kind as to cut out a chunk from that last quote. I think if we could hear his entire spiel, it would clear it up one way or the other.
Sometimes, its just pushing it a little too far for my taste and Im not going to reveal to you which ones they are.
I would love to hear a clarification. If he just misspoke, that would be great.
But this is what we've got right now, and I really struggle with some of the acrobatics people are pulling to try and soften/explain away these comments.
his love life has been in the plot before though, thats the thing. and it never felt to me like this guy was only on the show to be "the gay guy" and it's "all about him being gay". To me it felt like a natural extension, he has problems in his relationship, it showed in the show, they argued, laughed , were in bed together, it seemed like a natural extension of the character.
Brooklyn Nine Nine is the name of the show. I guess i want the characters to feel somewhat natural. I never look at Law and Order: SVU and think about the characters being straight, because there love lives simply serve as background to the over all show.
I think Southland also is a great example of what im talking about. Dude was gay, and it ended up being a major part of his story at one point, but it never became his only, defining characteristic.
Honestly, I totally see how you come to that conclusion. I think the article was way too much editorializing to go along with his quotes. Is there anywhere we can actually watch the panel and see what he said uninterrupted?
Here is all we know he said, free from editorializing:
To me, those thoughts don't flow into each other at all, and there isn't a description of what specifically he's talking about aside from what the writer of the Yahoo article tells us. The writer was even so kind as to cut out a chunk from that last quote. I think if we could hear his entire spiel, it would clear it up one way or the other.
He has made no other statements besides this to my knowledge, why do we have to wait to react to this? This is what we have to go on for now, so this is what we are discussing.You also disagree with waiting until we have clarification, so I guess you're kind of at an impasse with your own thread unless you want a discussion in which people are only allowed to demonize someone universally without knowing exactly what that person meant.
as a gay person I think the representation is great but the pandering in shows like American Horror Story kinda bothers me
I think he's trying to say that a character can be gay. It just shouldn't be the defining characteristic, that homosexuals are regular people.
I honestly don't see many ways to interpret the phrase:
“Sometimes, it’s just pushing it a little too far for my taste and I’m not going to reveal to you which ones they are.”
But that's just me. I'd like him to clarify, but I'm scratching my head how that could be in the context of wishing that gay characters weren't defined by being gay.
Did they really pander it though? What I got from AHS was that whenever it was brought up in season 1, it was reactive to some less favorable characters.
He has made no other statements besides this to my knowledge, why do we have to wait to react to this? This is what we have to go on for now, so this is what we are discussing.
And I already said I would welcome clarification. We don't have it at the moment, and possibly will never get it.
Did you watch the horrible season four Freak Show?
I think he's trying to say that a character can be gay. It just shouldn't be the defining characteristic, that homosexuals are regular people.
This this a thousand times this, there is a point where trying to normalize something can start to go to far, like when it seems like the only point of a character in a show is the fact that they're gay.
I can't think of any instances of this off the top of my head, but I can certainly see where he is coming from if that is indeed what he meant.
Yup, that sounds like what he meant, hate it when shows do this.
How I took it. Make a character who happens to be gay. Don't make a gay character.
I think you are over-reacting to one statement when you can take a look of his entire long career of work and statements.
Yeah, I would call that immature and homophobic.