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BioShock 2 |OT| of Big Sisters, Delta Daddies, and Creepy Uncles
- Thread starter The Librarian
- Start date
Conrad Link
Member
Oh that reminds me, hated the Bio 2 map. I got use to it after awhile but the overlapping floors and stuff just gave me a headache to start with.
As someone who likes to clean out every stage I use the map to see what areas/rooms I haven't been to yet and the multi darked out rooms on other floors overlapping and mixing in with the dark redish rooms I haven't explored yet annoyed me.
Like I said got use to it eventually but still ugh.
Was Bio 1 like that? I don't seem to remember having that problem.
As someone who likes to clean out every stage I use the map to see what areas/rooms I haven't been to yet and the multi darked out rooms on other floors overlapping and mixing in with the dark redish rooms I haven't explored yet annoyed me.
Like I said got use to it eventually but still ugh.
Was Bio 1 like that? I don't seem to remember having that problem.
CadetMahoney
Member
the problem is your playing the ps3 version?j-wood said:
Alaskanbullworm
Member
TTG said:
I believe that
if you save at least one of the 3, Lamb will live, but if you kill them all she dies.
Anyone getting crazy lag playing the MP on PC? I'm not sure if it's my wacky uni network connection (with ports blocked for basically everything except XBL/GFWL) or just something the latest patch messed up. It literally feels like a guy with 512k DSL in Russia is hosting all the matches I get into.
DodgyGeezerFella
Member
SlickVic said:
Yup latest patch fucked it. Ive heard of 2 ways to sort it out. 1 requires alt tabbing out while in game, and back in. The other changing some value in an INI file. I havent tried either however so couldnt say for certainty that they work.
thunker 9000
Member
Yes, yes you canYoshichan said:
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
you have three chapters to go after the one you're up to. There's a substantial amount of content left, you're probably a bit less than two thirds of the way through the game.Weenerz said:
Scarecrow
Member
Question about the ending
That wasn't ALL of Rapture falling into the abys, was it? Elenor says the Rapture dream was over. I didn't know if she meant the entire city fell into nothing or it was just Fontain's digs.
Also, I love that music that plays as you're clinging to the sub, the World on his Shoulders theme. It just encapsulates the Bioshock mythos. Very merose.
Also, I love that music that plays as you're clinging to the sub, the World on his Shoulders theme. It just encapsulates the Bioshock mythos. Very merose.
Just finished the game on hard. Got 34 trophies. Not sure if I'll bother getting all the multiplayer ones, but definitely getting the 6 single player ones I missed.
I got all 14 power to the people upgrades, which is something I feared I might miss due to not being able to go back to previous levels. I did miss out on the research achievement, though, because the thuggish and spider splicer were not available in the latter levels.
I have to say the game kept getting better the more I played, but it's still no match for BioShock 1. It does a lot of things just as well as 1, and adds some new nifty things to the mix, but a large part of it feels like a retread.
I got all 14 power to the people upgrades, which is something I feared I might miss due to not being able to go back to previous levels. I did miss out on the research achievement, though, because the thuggish and spider splicer were not available in the latter levels.
I have to say the game kept getting better the more I played, but it's still no match for BioShock 1. It does a lot of things just as well as 1, and adds some new nifty things to the mix, but a large part of it feels like a retread.
Thoughts on Bioshock 3:
The story can still continue outside of Rapture. I forgot the exact words the game put it in, but
In other words, the horror that has become Rapture can and probably will begin to
It could be virtually anywhere, and the only thing stopping it from being as memorable is the idea. The location can and should be unique. It doesn't need to be art deco. It could be any iconic style, there are tons to choose from. But it doesn't need to be Rapture. They shouldn't go back.
The story can still continue outside of Rapture. I forgot the exact words the game put it in, but
a character mentions that "when the ADAM runs out, the only place left to look is the surface."
infect the outside world. Splicers and Gene Enhancements as cults spread across the world. In this way, it would be very easy to pick another amazing location to set Bioshock 3.
It could be virtually anywhere, and the only thing stopping it from being as memorable is the idea. The location can and should be unique. It doesn't need to be art deco. It could be any iconic style, there are tons to choose from. But it doesn't need to be Rapture. They shouldn't go back.
edgefusion
Member
Amir0x said:
But if we're talking about going to the surface, where would they go? What city is as unique as Rapture? Bioshock is intrinsically linked to the ocean and to the art deco style (just look at the logo), where else but Rapture has one unique and distinct style running throughout the entire city? If it's set in a surface city the thing can't be as tightly designed as Rapture and being above water will remove that sense of claustrophobia and (potential) imminent danger from leaks, drowning etc. I'd like to believe it could work, it's a logical conclusion to the series and I love the idea of all the splicers heading to the surface and spreading their gene enhancements but I disagree that anywhere could be as good as Rapture. It'd end up diluting the idea too much.
Personally I would like to see a version of Rapture discovered by some diver (or what-not) like Mark Meltzer and get trapped in the city as it slowly starts to break apart and fall into ruin, like one of those catastrophe survival games. Maybe something could happen that causes the destruction of Rapture and your final decision will either send Rapture to a permanent grave or be its saviour. But then again maybe that's just one too many times in Rapture.
Hypereides
Gold Member
Amir0x said:
I think it be best to give the Bioshock franchise a well deserved rest for 4 or more years. Its time for 2K to buy out the System Shock license from EA. Bioshock's universe is awesome and all, but Im starting to fed up by it. I dont want it to grow stale so I'd prefer if they laid the ice on it.
If 2k ever buys System Shock, they could switch between the 2 with some years interval to maintain the freshness without getting expired.
For anyone playing the PS3 version, make sure you set your XMB to 720p. Yeah, it's a hassle, but it's well worth it. The upscaled 1080p mode is one of the worst I've seen. Absolutely hideous. They should have just limited the game to 720p (or added 1080i support while leaving out 1080p upscaling).
PS3 version is not bad, however. Quite the opposite, really.
Yeah, the XMB chops up pretty bad when saving. Dunno why, but there it is. Honestly, I wish developers would stop using the OS save system and build their own. It just feels out of place.j-wood said:
PS3 version is not bad, however. Quite the opposite, really.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
I thought devs had to use the OS save system?
But then, Darksiders didn't. What's up with that?
But then, Darksiders didn't. What's up with that?
This.dark10x said:
The 1080p upscale is horrible and when I first got the game I thought the visuals were 'meh' at best. But as soon as I forced it to 720p it looked a world better.
They should have left 1080p upscaling as forced, not default, as it does the game no service.
rainking187
Member
Wish I'd tried hard mode before I put all that time into multiplayer. At the rate I'm going I might not beat it. I've been struggling with basically no ammo, health, or EVE the whole time. Died multiple times already. Potentially not getting platinum now.
Sanic
Member
Scarecrow said:
I would have to assume it was just Fontaine Futuristics. It's never specifically mentioned that there are explosives placed anywhere else. Eleanor probably means "the rapture dream is over" in the sense that there is no one left with any kind of humanity. It's only the splicers.
badcrumble
Member
Just finished it and loved it, but somehow it felt like the climax lasted for too long -
Fontaine Futuristics was an excellent level, and the prison was EXCELLENT at further showing just how ugly Rapture really was on a whole new level - especially the isolation ward, the electroshock ward, and the body furnace. Gave me chills. I'm glad Bioshock 2 explored the ugly, ugly underbelly of Rapture rather than the highly-tarnished high society parts - we only got a brief glimpse of that in the first game with some of the areas that Fontaine's people had taken over. Didn't like the story quite as much, but if you think of Rapture as the main character of Bioshock it was an excellent sequel in that regard. Also, the gameplay and RPG elements were much more polished than the first in a really great way. Looking forward to whatever comes next - I'm not sure if they should return to Rapture or not, because I'd like to see what happens when there's no ADAM whatsoever and people REALLY start mutating, not to mention seeing what happens when Rapture really starts to decay and rot with nobody trying to create any order there anymore, but on the other hand I feel like we've been shown all that's necessary and I don't want to have more side characters shoehorned into the plot.
Salz01
Member
For Bio 3, I wonder if they will have the US Military invade Rapture. Keeping Rapture away from outsiders for 10 years seems a little far fetched. I almost expected them to show up in 2.
If you take the story anywhere else out side of Rapture, they wouldnt call it 'Bio'shock, and thus loose the name brand. IMO
They just need to do something totally different down there to keep the story fresh.
If you take the story anywhere else out side of Rapture, they wouldnt call it 'Bio'shock, and thus loose the name brand. IMO
They just need to do something totally different down there to keep the story fresh.
badcrumble
Member
Fighting generic military grunts is as far from "fresh" as anything could possibly be.Salz01 said:
Well IMO we don't need Bioshock 3 any more than we needed Bioshock 2 (I enjoyed the game, but the story, characters and ideas weren't anywhere near as interesting), but if it must happen:
... it needs to have the return of a character like Andrew Ryan. Ryan wasn't just a character with a dream of his own version of Utopia - you could sympathize with him. Though ultimately he was wrong, at first he DID succeed - he built something amazing! I know I was conflicted when I had to kill him ... I hated him because of the terrible things he eventually did to the people of Rapture, but I still admired him for the amazing city he built.
Lamb was deficient in comparison, there was little doubt from the moment I stepped into the city that she was evil, and that all her preaching about unity and the greater good only meant depriving the individual of the ability to choose. Not once did I feel sympathy for her or that she had created anything of note. She merely took the work of others, stole Adam from the people of rapture, and used it to try and make her vision of a Messiah. And when she could not get that, she choose to kill everyone.
Lamb was deficient in comparison, there was little doubt from the moment I stepped into the city that she was evil, and that all her preaching about unity and the greater good only meant depriving the individual of the ability to choose. Not once did I feel sympathy for her or that she had created anything of note. She merely took the work of others, stole Adam from the people of rapture, and used it to try and make her vision of a Messiah. And when she could not get that, she choose to kill everyone.
badcrumble
Member
Bregor said:
I agree - my main objection to the story is the way Lamb was handled. I would have really preferred it if you originally got the sense that she'd somehow managed to scrape civilization back together somewhere in Rapture and get humanity back on its feet via caring for one another, and only later seen all of the cultist stuff and the erasure-of-the-self mentality. Ideally the game would make you question whether you were the bad guy or not toward the very beginning and make you wonder if Lamb really was the savior of Rapture.
Yeah, Ryan was a stronger villain, in that he wasn't evil, he was just 100% dedicated to his beliefs. Lamb seemed more manipulative and with bad intentions. I like that the sequel portrayed Ryan in a more human fashion, while in the first game he was more of a Wizard of Oz type of character.
badcrumble
Member
Well, really, Fontaine's the only character who was ever out-and-out 2-dimensional evil in terms of actively desiring to do harm for harm's sake. Ryan and Lamb just both had evil beliefs because neither one cared about people whatsoever and wanted to build a paradise on the suffering and destruction of others. But Lamb was never really given a chance to enter that grey area where you get a sense of why she held her beliefs or to get a sense of the paradise that she wanted (whereas in Ryan's case you can see it all around you). A pity - she could've been just as strong if she had had a more sympathetic portrayal earlier in the game.Truant said:
I played through most of Fontaine Futuristics last night and on top of great levels and gameplay the audio logs get quite fucked up!
So the Family, the ultimate socialist experiment, collides with capitalism, compromise and... what else can you call it but pure evil? As a citizen of Rapture everything you did, everything you became, is simply a memory to place into a vessel. Humans are reduced to a commodity on a scale that even Andrew Ryan never imagined. If Bioshock 1 took a few broadsides at 'right-wing' ideology then Bioshock 2 is doing the same at the left-wing. Really all it's doing is showing that any ideology might become monsterous once taken to an extreme. For this Bioshock 2 is proving to be a better written and more thought provoking story than practically anything to come out this gen.
How about:
Actually, that gets me into another flaw I felt Bioshock 2 had...
Rapture 2, built on the moon by a son / clone / compatriot of Ryan.
Actually, that gets me into another flaw I felt Bioshock 2 had...
The entire base concept for the plot requires a sci-fi mechanism for it to exist (that Adam somehow allows the genius of dead rapture citizens to be injected into a single individual). In Bioshock 1, the idea of the under water city is far fetched, but plausible. At least the base set up of a hidden Utopia based upon the philosophies of Ayn Rand and the civil war that eventually results doesn't require any imaginary technologies. Eventually Bioshock 1 does go there, but it starts with a grounding in reality that allows the ethical implications to have real meaning.
In Bioshock 2, the entire concept for Lamb's plans are so dependent on the (lets face it) fantasy technology, that the ethical implications are blurred.
The series needs to be careful not to keep pushing itself farther away from reality or it will lose a lot of what makes it interesting.
In Bioshock 2, the entire concept for Lamb's plans are so dependent on the (lets face it) fantasy technology, that the ethical implications are blurred.
The series needs to be careful not to keep pushing itself farther away from reality or it will lose a lot of what makes it interesting.
badcrumble
Member
Bregor said:How about:
Rapture 2, built on the moon by a son / clone / compatriot of Ryan.
Actually, that gets me into another flaw I felt Bioshock 2 had...
The entire base concept for the plot requires a sci-fi mechanism for it to exist (that Adam somehow allows the genius of dead rapture citizens to be injected into a single individual). In Bioshock 1, the idea of the under water city is far fetched, but plausible. At least the base set up of a hidden Utopia based upon the philosophies of Ayn Rand and the civil war that eventually results doesn't require any imaginary technologies. Eventually Bioshock 1 does go there, but it starts with a grounding in reality that allows the ethical implications to have real meaning.
In Bioshock 2, the entire concept for Lamb's plans are so dependent on the (lets face it) fantasy technology, that the ethical implications are blurred.
The series needs to be careful not to keep pushing itself farther away from reality or it will lose a lot of what makes it interesting.
I think it links up fairly neatly with the plasmid-ghosts you see in Bioshock - though it's really weird that they show up in the CG teaser for Bioshock 2 and yet not in the game itself. They're the memories of people whose ADAM you're using.
My point is that Lamb's Utopia requires a fantasy technology to even exist. Ryan's utopia does not. Of course we will believe in Ryan's Utopia more.
Also, Lamb's Utopia is not for us: It would consist of a race of spliced geniuses who would have no sense of self and act only for the common good. I doubt any of us would recognize such people as humans as we know it, since we value our ability to choose for ourself. Of course we would consider it evil.
Ryan's Utopia is, in contrast, a Utopia for humans: It is based upon his theories of what sort of society would be the best for humans to live in - though in the end it proved to be flawed. This means there is real ground for ethical debate in Ryan's case, over whether his society was good or bad. In Lamb's there is little or none.
Also, Lamb's Utopia is not for us: It would consist of a race of spliced geniuses who would have no sense of self and act only for the common good. I doubt any of us would recognize such people as humans as we know it, since we value our ability to choose for ourself. Of course we would consider it evil.
Ryan's Utopia is, in contrast, a Utopia for humans: It is based upon his theories of what sort of society would be the best for humans to live in - though in the end it proved to be flawed. This means there is real ground for ethical debate in Ryan's case, over whether his society was good or bad. In Lamb's there is little or none.
badcrumble
Member
You think? Laissez-faire economics require violence and authority to truly bring in prosperity (gunships to open up ports, the ability to smash unions, etc.) and that's a major part of the point of the first game. Ryan wasn't forced into his evil actions so much as they were an inevitable consequence of the wholly contradictory idea of planning and creating a laissez-faire utopia.Truant said:
If anything, Ryan is romantic-blind, Lamb is cynical-blind - they're both unaware of how awful they are, but you can tell Ryan believes in something beautiful whereas Lamb mainly believes in removing suffering instead of creating happiness.
Sanic
Member
Well, for Bioshock 3, I think it would be kinda of interesting if, as someone else said,
you have people from the semi-distant future heading down to rapture. Remember how those living in the 1950's envisioned their future in the year 2000+? People from that future would be, both visually and technologically, a stark contrast to rapture and I think they could do some cool things with that concept.
Now that I think of it, kinda like the world of the Fallout series, pre-nuclear catastrophe, heading down to rapture.
Now that I think of it, kinda like the world of the Fallout series, pre-nuclear catastrophe, heading down to rapture.
StevePharma
Member
After getting all the singleplayer trophies I'm digging into the multiplayer. Damnit this is fun, never expected it, I like it even more than MW2, even though it is not as polished and streamlined. But the hell, I guess it's the setting that does it for me. I'll try to get to lvl 40 to check all the plasmids and perks, keep myself occupied until Heavy Rain comes out :lol
TheFreshPrince
Junior Member
Just finished....great game, but I'm left confused......
Ultimately, what was
Also, am I mistaken, or is
Ultimately, what was
Eleanor supposed to be? A 'perfect' person? A perfect leader/dictator for The Family? I get the Lamb was trying to put all of Rapture's memories into her, so that she could in effect 'do it all'....but what was the end goal??
Also, am I mistaken, or is
Gil Alexander humongous in the tank???
Eurogamer selected more intense scenes, as they noted in the article, which did impact the PS3 framerate. I do notice this and it is slightly annoying, but in general, it stays pretty solid. It definitely doesn't tank during every encounter, but it isn't completely rare either.Lince said:
All told, I would have preferred the 360 version and only went PS3 due to the fact that that's where all of my friends would be playing it (for both multi and trophies). Unlike the original game, however, it looks exactly the same as the 360 version and generally runs smoothly (which was not the case with the first port).
It's a good port, but not a perfect port.
edgefusion said:
This just boils down to a limitation of your imagination, and should not determine where a franchise should head for the developers in charge.
Like many people, when they see the incredibly realized and unique location of Rapture, you assume "nothing can top this! Hell, it'd be hard for anywhere to even equal it!" And it is true, Rapture is one of the truly brilliant gaming locations ever devised.
But to say there's nowhere else that could be as creative or inspired? I think that's a little bit much. Now again, I am not the idea maker, but I can think of a few other places. Interesting locations for moguls and their twisted morals and philosophy.
Again, I'm not making money, but the world is filled with amazing architectures and styles to choose from. We're an incredibly diverse universe and there are so many possibilities it's insane to think "well, Bioshock has hit the peak. No other ideas are worth trying."
Take a look at some diverse architecture:
http://www.newhouseofart.com/wp-con...ern-float-ecopolis-lilypad-architecture-5.jpg
http://www.thecoolist.com/wp-conten...r_by-ashton-raggatt-mcdougal-architects_1.jpg
http://trishamillerthailand.info/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/UN_Memorial_modern-zen.com.jpg
I'm not making a statement on whether any of these are good, just a statement on the diversity of architecture. There's a plethora of legitimate styles to choose from, and amazing locations. And even better, this is gaming... where you can invent your own.
It could be a floating city, ringed by mist among the mountains, overrun with flora and fauna. It could be a decaying temple, a portrait of hedonism and religion gone mad. Who knows? It could be anywhere. Just, it can't be Rapture again.
I need some help. I shot a Big Daddy as he was putting a Little Sister in a vent and then killed him, however, the LS is not appearing. I have waited for 30 minutes and nothing. Do I have to wait for a BD to spawn and get her out of the vent or am I screwed?
Except for the water which looks terrible and is a big part of Bioshock.
dark10x said:
Except for the water which looks terrible and is a big part of Bioshock.
Returned to PC gaming with this, and Bioshock 2 has reminded me why I've not used my PC to play games in a while. Won't be buying a PC game again for god knows how long in the future now.
Crash crash crash crash. Happily plays through the first cut-scene when starting a new game, has a little audio quickly on a black screen, and then bam, locked up.
Can't understand people crying out for a PC version of Alan Wake in that other thread.
Will try and resolve the problems I'm having with Bioshock 2 tomorrow, shouldn't even need to do this.
Hardware if anyone's wondering: Q6600, 4GB ram, GTX260+.
Crash crash crash crash. Happily plays through the first cut-scene when starting a new game, has a little audio quickly on a black screen, and then bam, locked up.
Can't understand people crying out for a PC version of Alan Wake in that other thread.
Will try and resolve the problems I'm having with Bioshock 2 tomorrow, shouldn't even need to do this.
Hardware if anyone's wondering: Q6600, 4GB ram, GTX260+.