Dirtyshubb
Member
Is this him trying to win back support I assume?
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Brexit | OT3 | A Feast for Crows
- Thread starter theaface
- Start date
Snarfington
Member
There's literally nobody involved with this that isn't a complete fucking moron.
Where's their sense of adventure????
May should sack him.
PJV3
Member
Yeah, this is obviously more conservative party jobs bullshit, thankfully I'm sure the EU side can work that out.
It's kind of amazing how perfectly split this is. No wonder we can't decide on a government.
also who are those 5% that voted remain but look at it NOW and want to leave?
Wrestlemania
Banned
Before some people were saying he should have not only been sacked but also tried for Treason for his anti-brexit stances.
Enough to change the result if it was run again then. What a shitshow.
Yeah, surely there cant be 5% of remainers who look at whats going on now and think "I was wrong, everything happening now is all great!"
My only guess is that maybe its short sighted Labour voters happy that the Tories are all stabbing each other in the back?
Eh, there is that guy that posts here from time to time that thinks the leave vote will lead the UK into a socialist utopia.
Assuming we are thinking of the same guy, iirc he started off saying hes a socialist before reverting to the "too many coming in" type logic upon being probed on his beliefs by people on here (as is usually the case)
My friend pointed out that this 5% is probably made up of people buying into the "EU are just punishing us now!" logic, think he probably has a point
It doesn't help when Junker is so blunt and offers the perfect sound bite to get the foaming leavers riled up. I get what he is saying and he isn't being mean but just the headline is enough for loads of people to stick with screw the EU, take back control! even though, it's a load of nonsense. There is nobody sensible with enough support in Britain that can crush Brexit.
Hammond is just playing party politics to confuse the leavers, get out..wait yeah, screw the EU, rule Britannia!
Brexit is an embarrassment and Labour dealing with it is another version of awful.
Hammond is just playing party politics to confuse the leavers, get out..wait yeah, screw the EU, rule Britannia!
Brexit is an embarrassment and Labour dealing with it is another version of awful.
I have to say I'm surprised at how half of the studied sample is so stubborn they can't admit they made a mistake.
I think things have gone so bad, that you can easily blame the government for not being capable of getting a good deal, and therefore you've changed your mind without feeling ashamed.
edit: I also dislike the positioning of the question made by Yougov. The UK hasn't left yet, therefore it can't be wrong to have left. It makes it sound definitive, as if it couldn't be stopped. But maybe I'm reading it wrong.
I think things have gone so bad, that you can easily blame the government for not being capable of getting a good deal, and therefore you've changed your mind without feeling ashamed.
edit: I also dislike the positioning of the question made by Yougov. The UK hasn't left yet, therefore it can't be wrong to have left. It makes it sound definitive, as if it couldn't be stopped. But maybe I'm reading it wrong.
The Friendly Monster
Member
You have to remember that Juncker isn't primarily talking to UK citizens. They aren't his concern and there is also very little that they can do at this point.
I wonder how many people are lying in that survey, that is if they can see that Brexit is a bad idea now then they are more likely to say they voted remain.
It's gonna get to a stage when you go into a pub, or work, no one is gonna say they voted Leave.
It's already happening to me now. I've been to parts that were notable Leave areas and I can't find fucking one person that says they did.
And I'm an easy going outwardly non judgemental guy
The context is in how the situation is panning out currently. Everything looks like a mess, because it is a mess and will be a mess. No doubt it would skew even more once shit really starts hitting the fan.
Or alternatively the Old People that make up most of the Conservative constituency start dying off.
Commander Jameson
Member
On the C4 debate recently, there was one guy in the audience who had voted Remain but changed his mind because of how he perceived the EU were acting during the negotiations.
Think eventually a lot of people are going to end up believing the EU was a bad actor that caused an undesirable post-Brexit situation despite the best intentions of the British government. The same media that pushed for Brexit will ensure it.
PJV3
Member
The way these clowns are carrying on it will only be a minority, it's pretty clear that the Tory party is coming first over everything else.
No doubt they'll try and many will lap it up. Hopefully most use their brain.
Commander Jameson
Member
The politicians could have gone for an EEA/EFTA solution (or at least tried) which would have been the least worst choice, but they've condemned themselves by choosing the stupidest way and then going about it in such a cack-handed fashion.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
They'll try to but there's no way the conservatives are coming out of this unscathed. May decision to have an election has ensured that. Which is why they'll try to lay all the blame on her but I don't think that will work as the rest of the party really isn't acting much better.
Much like Tony's Blair tenure left a large impact on Labour, this will leave a large impact on the Tories for at least a generation.
All those students are going to grow up and they sure as fuck are going to remember.
That's certainly the perception here sometimes but it's only because the EU are negotiating in their interests which people still seem confused about.
The way the EU does business isn't a secret and people knew going in one of the ways they would try and control the process was with sequencing. It probably feels frustrating when you see the UK say good things and the EU always being so negative and the truth is probably somewhere boringly in the middle.
for all my pessimism I still feel like a deal with be done and most people will just shrug because it's all a bit crap. There's too many people involved and too much disruption on both sides for someone to do something really stupid.
To be fair, the UK could still try to opt for a EEA solution years after Brexit. The EU gets more money, and access to a large market, so I don't see them denying it. Assuming there is a no deal "solution" after 2019, it will likely lead to big economic shock that would likely sober most people up from their nationalistic fervor. One would hope, at least.
Linkstrikesback
Member
That is the governments position, leaving the EU is definitive.
We're fucked, basically.
-Plasma Reus-
Service guarantees member status
SporeCrawler
Member
Who cares what the british people think about whos fault brexit is? We will see in 50 years if UK is prospering or not. At that point it will be irrelevant what the press says
True. Given that Brexiters are absolutely convinced of the might of the British, it stands to reason that they believe that might makes right. Continuing down that line of thought, they shouldn't give a shit then if the mighty topple the weak.
Of course all that would be true, if they also weren't massive hypocrites.
SlipperyFishes
Banned
In that case I guess we caused mass genocide in the Americas, fought and lost a war of independence and spent hundreds of years suppressing other cultures.
Who needs friends like the British?
What the fuck, man. Lets not start punishing people for the sins of their fathers, here. Everyone deserves a fresh start!
So it seems the europeans are gonna offer a take it or leave it offer when they talk transition.
Offer apparently is keep all the obligations without having a seat at the table.
https://www.ft.com/content/bb39b0da-affa-11e7-beba-5521c713abf4
Also thought this was interesting:
Offer apparently is keep all the obligations without having a seat at the table.
https://www.ft.com/content/bb39b0da-affa-11e7-beba-5521c713abf4
Also thought this was interesting:
anonymous_abc
Member
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Last edited:
Dirtyshubb
Member
"we are taking the power back boys... Wait a minute, what do you mean I'm not allowed in? And I still have to pay my fee?... Oh"
So lets say they block a bad deal or no deal.
Time runs out-> Britain leaves with no deal anyway.
Are thesee people just mocking their constituents at this point?
I think the idea is more that if no suitable deal can be reached then the EU withdrawal should be cancelled altogether.
Commander Jameson
Member
What the grim reality of a bad-tempered Brexit means
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/oct/15/grim-reality-of-bad-tempered-brexit
I wonder who Hammond is talking about.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/oct/15/grim-reality-of-bad-tempered-brexit
I wonder who Hammond is talking about.
Or go back and negotiate something else at the very least. If the EU are offering the Norway option, then that shouldn't take much time to negotiate, and could possibly get sorted in early 2019, in an extreme situation.
It remains to be seen if cancelling the withdrawal is possible. Also i doubt they'd get a majority to get it through parliament.
I agree but this would mean complete capitulation by the UK. Would that even be feasable with 30-40% of the population being leavers?
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
No, it would still take a very long time. You can't just be like 'oh, we'll take the Norway option then'. That's not in the EU's power to give, since it stems from EFTA-EU treaties. To access this option, the UK would have to join EFTA, which would have to be renegotiated with consent from Norway, Iceland, and Liechtenstein. Imagine you're one of those countries - they're all tiny - and suddenly the UK demands to be in your club. You'd want heavy restrictions put on what the UK can and cannot demand, because e.g. Norway won't want to have its trade policy completely dictated by the UK. The UK is literally over ten times bigger than all the other members put together.
Daffy Duck
Member
What does keep all the obligations but not a seat at the table mean?
Commander Jameson
Member
Make some form of payment to the EU and abide by the four freedoms, but not involved in making new legislation, I think.
Basically stay an EU member without getting to be in the room when decisions are made.
I think this is the best scenario that is available for the EU.
Daffy Duck
Member
Oh I see.
Cant see them going for that at all.
Cant see them going for that at all.