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BritGAF |OT3| It's good, but it's not right.
- Thread starter BGBW
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Mine are all online too, but what about when their servers are having issues (like with Sim City) or during maintainance, or even when your internet goes down for whatever reason?
Always online will definitely make me hold off on new xbox at least until there's a year of smooth performance for me to trust that it won't be a constant fuckup.
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
I remember when Reach came out XBL was knocked offline for a few hours. I mean, yeah it's kinda sucky when you're excited for a new game, but the servers come back online and everything goes back to normal after a while. It would certainly be easier if everything was offline, but it also smacks of entitlement when people complain so much about the possibility of a delay in getting to play (something I'm guilty of as much as anyone).
QuicheFontaine
Member
Oh boy.
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
Oh boy? Engage or don't.
Hearing gamers winge and moan about a delay of a couple of days is a symptom of entitlement and lack of patience. From what I heard Sim City was indeed a clusterfuck and that's terrible, but it's still only a game, it's not like it has a genuinely negative effect on one's life if you can't play for a couple of days. Or weeks or months even. But you get the same thing even when day one deliveries are late too (as I said, I'm as guilty as the next idiot, I bought 2 copies of Halo 4 because I couldn't wait 24 hours to play the thing - but it's still a bit pathetic).
And new we're kvetching over the possibility that the online infrastructure might occasionally shit itself. OMG what do we do?? Maybe play with one of the other dozen gadgets around the house, or do something entirely different. Oh boy.
QuicheFontaine
Member
I'll have to write a proper response later (as I'm supposed to be working right now!), but the e-word gets thrown around a lot gaming side.
I dunno man - if you pay for a game, as much as any other product, I don't think it's entitled to shit the bed when you don't get what you paid for.
I always think of these scenarios (minus the dramatic 3rd act twist) - imagine the 13 year old kid who saved up his pocket money for months to get NEW GAME 4: THE ENJOYENING, which he does after school on a Friday. He's dizzyingly excited when his parents drive him to the game shop (or supermarket these days, but let's not get bogged down in that (actually, as we're getting bogged down, he'd probably have to download it from the console estore with their debit card...))
Congratulations, Jimmy - all your dreams have come true, surely this weekend will be the best weekend ever!
Oh no! What's that, Jimmy? Your Microsoft Xbox: On won't work because everyone's pounding their servers in desperation to complete NEW GAME 4 first (the bastards)? You can't even play the game? How sad
Well, at least your older brother Rob is back from college - now that you're incredibly jaded with the world, maybe now is the time to ask him for a hit on that bong, ripping you from innocent childhood into the shady world of drugs, alcohol and STDs?
Maybe you could even sell your Xbox: On for a bag of those sweet, sweet candies called DRUG PILLS.
Obviously tongue in cheek and stupid, but I think my point is still clear.
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
I don't really go over there so I've never seen it myself. But if it cries like a a baby and shits itself like a baby...
Little Old Man
Member
Steve Ballmer is going to be hunting down Adam Orth shirtless today.
Every time I think that thread has reached maximum velocity, it just keeps on giving.
Every time I think that thread has reached maximum velocity, it just keeps on giving.
This "always online" thing wouldn't work out well for me. There were a few instances where Virgin Media had to switch the internet connection in the area for a day or two because of maintenance. And even when it was online there were instances where it was unexpectedly cut off for 10 mins before coming back on. Sure, I can watch a DVD or something so it isn't a big deal but if that happens during/after a big major release then I won't be happy. Also, I sometimes take my consoles over to friend's houses with slow/no internet connections. Plus, why are they doing this? I can understand PC games doing this because piracy is high but piracy on consoles have sharply dropped* since the PS1 days of chipping your consoles etc.
*in the Western world anyway.
Still my favourite musical ever. Really need to pull my finger out and watch Book of Mormon.
*in the Western world anyway.
Still my favourite musical ever. Really need to pull my finger out and watch Book of Mormon.
Little Old Man
Member
Verification servers would fail after every big release. That would hilarious to see think Sim City on a bigger scale.
QuicheFontaine
Member
Basically the problem with always online DRM is the shift in control. It moves control over how and when you play the game you bought from the individual gamer to the publisher.
The whole SimCity thing has been a complete fuck up for a variety of reasons, but it's just a little window into a future where you can't play games when the server isn't working, can't lend games and can't resell them. However, even if the infrastructure was seamless they're still going to turn off those servers at some point. When? I don't know, five years, ten years, whatever. What's important is that your game now has an expiry date that it never had before. That's a fundamental change right there.
I don't really know why I'm having to argue this though, as you acknowledge that it would be "easier" if the next Xbox wasn't always online. I think we agree on that. Maybe, and this is what I'm getting from all the "pissing", "shitting", "whinging", "pathetic" etc. in your posts, is that you're just annoyed by people who overreact to all this? I'll concede that such people exist. But feeling chagrinned when power is taken out of your hands and given to someone else is only natural. And if you respond with OMG PREORDER CANCELLED, I'd say that's perhaps a tad immature, but at least understandable.
The whole SimCity thing has been a complete fuck up for a variety of reasons, but it's just a little window into a future where you can't play games when the server isn't working, can't lend games and can't resell them. However, even if the infrastructure was seamless they're still going to turn off those servers at some point. When? I don't know, five years, ten years, whatever. What's important is that your game now has an expiry date that it never had before. That's a fundamental change right there.
I don't really know why I'm having to argue this though, as you acknowledge that it would be "easier" if the next Xbox wasn't always online. I think we agree on that. Maybe, and this is what I'm getting from all the "pissing", "shitting", "whinging", "pathetic" etc. in your posts, is that you're just annoyed by people who overreact to all this? I'll concede that such people exist. But feeling chagrinned when power is taken out of your hands and given to someone else is only natural. And if you respond with OMG PREORDER CANCELLED, I'd say that's perhaps a tad immature, but at least understandable.
Darren870
Member
Really funny and not at all what I was expecting. Guess it helped I didn't read any of the plot before hand. You will definitely enjoy it.
Deaf Spacker
Memb
My behemoth is here, first impressions are HOLY FUCKING SHIT!
Assuming you're talking about BBT?
Deaf Spacker
Memb
If that means what I think it does then yeah, currently restoring my Steam games.
Exactly my thoughts.
There's no use throwing toys out of the pram and having a shitfit about it, but the idea of requiring an internet connection to play your games is ridiculous. I also hate the bullshit tweets from @adam_orth about;
How it's the same as needing electricity for a vacuum cleaner (yes, you need electricity for one, it's not an arbitrary requirement that Dyson decided to design into the thing)
'If you get no mobile reception, you don't return your phone' (actually, I did, and I got one that gave me the service I wanted. HINT ADAM: PS4 is the equivalent to the phone I didn't send back)
Or even worse - saying that electricity goes out sometimes too, so that counters the 'internet goes down' reason. OK, so now we have 2 things that could go down to stop us playing games. That's like if the Kindle always needed internet connection and they said "yeah, internet could go down but whatever, people go blind everyday so it's basically the same thing"
donkey show
Member
I need to go into recluse mode after this weekend. Can't keep staying out so damn late on school nights. :S
I have no idea how you manage it. After the drive home from work, I just have dinner and fall on the couch. Day/nights out are reserved for the weekend unless there's a gig on during the weekday. and even then I feel like complete shit the next morning after I get home at 3am and wake up at 7. I applaud your stamina.
Deaf Spacker
Memb
donkey show
Member
^ Yeah, that shit was dumb. xD
Haha, I honestly don't know how I'm keeping up. Y'all UK folk party hard.
Haha, I honestly don't know how I'm keeping up. Y'all UK folk party hard.
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
I'm getting a touch of the 'oh shit, I'm turning 30' vibe from you this month
ha! No I'm ok about getting older. Honest!
The loss of the used games market isn't too much of a bugbear for me, especially since, if you're comparing against Sim City, the PC used market has been dead for many years now. And I agree that the idea of a shelf-life on games is worrying, although I think that either the publisher or community would be able to find a way around this after a few years (maybe the pub could remove the DRM after a decade, or a community patch if EA suddenly went bust).
In a perfect world there would be no DRM, obviously. But that's not the world we live in, and the reality is that big publishers are becoming more paranoid and reactionary about how they release their games. And nothing much we can do will change this, so instead of resisting it I just take a "whatever" approach. I can count on one hand the amout of times DRM or always-online issues have affected my enjoyment of a game, and that's over the course of my whole life. And a few of those instances were from when Steam first launched. So really I'm not too fussed. If my internet went down I would be angry anyway - angry at losing GAF and Netflix first, games would be lower down the chain of trivial stuff that I would be upset about losing temporarily. I would then pick up a book and go on with my evening until the internet comes back (oh who am I kidding, I would try to find unsecured routers in my area and steal some internet...)
And yes you're quite right, it's the overblown hyperbolic reactions to this kind of progress (negative or positive, up to you to decide) that annoy me more than the DRM itself. Probably why I don't read the gaming side too much these days, but many people seem quite incapable of putting a disappointment in context and realising that, while you might not be able to play your new game right now, it does not mean you'll never get to play it, so chill out a bit.
I dunno - you can be against it as much as you want, but it's not goign to stop them doing it. Might as well go with the flow.
fizzelopeguss
Banned
I wanna headbutt you so badly.
Do you expect your vacuum to work without plugging it in? dealwithit.jpg
I think I'm doing this right. Now I've just gotta sit back and wait for some sweet cash money from Microsoft.
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
That's nice. Very constructive and reasoned argument, well done.
Gaming: where manchildren will complain about a console that's not even been announced yet.
Sure for the Xbox it's hypothetical but not for Sim City or Diablo 3 for when those came out. Where people were annoyed that they didn't work day one and had other people throwing the word "entitled" around like it was going out of fashion.
Rubbish King
The gift that keeps on giving
Morning GAF!
Jed, as much as I want to agree with you on any of these points...i can't
I think you're just annoyed at the people over on gaming side who are crying in a puddle of their own piss.
No matter how you spin it, this is bad news for console gaming...and gaming in general..
Prolly will end up in me never owning the next microsoft console, which kinda sucks due to me loving the shit out of halo
Jed, as much as I want to agree with you on any of these points...i can't
I think you're just annoyed at the people over on gaming side who are crying in a puddle of their own piss.
No matter how you spin it, this is bad news for console gaming...and gaming in general..
Prolly will end up in me never owning the next microsoft console, which kinda sucks due to me loving the shit out of halo
Rubbish King
The gift that keeps on giving
Because this is a forum for gaming enthusiasts.
And thus it's a bad idea. Why make a product that makes the competition look more attractive?
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
Well as I say, I don't really read the gaming side so I never saw the egregious use of the 'e' word. But it's a word that fits when people get so angry about what is only entertainment. And it's not like it'll never work, it just has teething problems for a day or two.
That said, XBL has been way way more stable in the past couple of years, I've not had a problem with any game on release day. If the new xbox works similarly then it's going to be fine. Apart from the people in Buttfuck, West Virgina that have no internet. I shall weep for them in my own way.
Rubbish King
The gift that keeps on giving
Gaming is just another artfrom, if you bought a movie and then had to wait a day or two to be able to use it, couldnt watch it without an internet connection or lend it to a friend to watch..wouldnt that annoy you?
So when you spend £30-£60 on something you shouldn't expect it to work straight away? There are teething problems and there are plain fuck ups that should be sorted before release, another part of this being it may make going into a store to buy games thus eventually destroying that part of the business and then giving price control to the company...and Origin is a fine example of how extortionate these companies are willing to be
Yeah I agree, it's not great for MS business, but perhaps they feel it won't have as big as an impact as people here do. Paying for gold isn't a good business practice vs competition but it's worked out ok for them. You have to remember Gaf and the internet in general is polarizing.
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
Morning GAF!
Jed, as much as I want to agree with you on any of these points...i can't
I think you're just annoyed at the people over on gaming side who are crying in a puddle of their own piss.
No matter how you spin it, this is bad news for console gaming...and gaming in general..
Prolly will end up in me never owning the next microsoft console, which kinda sucks due to me loving the shit out of halo
That's fine, you totally do not have to agree with me at all. It's a business decision that MS will have to live with. But I'm saying that for me as a consumer it has a very negligable effect on my decision to buy it or not. The games are what matter to me, I'm going to wait and see what they announce before deciding.
Why are you not buying the next xbox though? Is it a stand of conscience, or is it because you're worried for technical/internet reasons?
I view it even simpler than that, I view games as a product and like any other product you expect it to work day one unless stated otherwise.
You can buy something for a couple of quid and the back of the packet will ask if you were satisfied. But apparently not being satisfied with a product that will set you back a couple of hundred makes you entitled.
Basically we have to wait for Which? to expand into gaming and the world will be a better place.
You can buy something for a couple of quid and the back of the packet will ask if you were satisfied. But apparently not being satisfied with a product that will set you back a couple of hundred makes you entitled.
Basically we have to wait for Which? to expand into gaming and the world will be a better place.
If they knock £30 off the price of games they can be as anti-consumer as they want.
Yea, but you're not allowed to complain because you can choose a different movie innit
Yea, but you're not allowed to complain because you can choose a different movie innit
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
I don't really buy movies via anything other than online services so the point is rather moot there I'm afraid. Maybe if it were a book or something. But I've gotten used to being always online for pretty much everything these days, it's not too much of an adjustment.
Anyway, I'm going to close the book on my side of the argument, it's becoming rather circular I fear. I realise that I hold an unpopular opinion, I'm going to retreat to my tower of contrarianism.
QuicheFontaine
Member
No, read a book or go play outside
Anyway, I think I agree with Kentpaul when he said videogame chat spoils this thread. Petty bickering over what console you are / aren't going to by can stay in gaming side for all I care.
To attempt to change the topic, I'm only 40 mins away from my weekend in Cornwall, the sun is shining, and someone brought an Easter egg into the office for people to take a bit. Life is kinda cool sometimes B-)
Rubbish King
The gift that keeps on giving
Mainly from a financial standpoint, no way to trade in or resell means no 2nd hand games means no cheap games means tom cant afford.
I'll bite my tongue if they compete with steam worthy sales, but A:I doubt they can and B: If they do I bet it will be with some extra money per month gimmick
The exclusives are the only reason I bought a 360, and it'll be the only reason I'll buy the next one, so if they're going to try and extort me for all I'm worth they can take their exclusives and shove em up their arse
Musha_Soturi
Member
I had a weird moment last night. I woke up about 11pm and everything was just strange. It was like having memory loss but still remembering everything. It was like life and the universe was unfamiliar, unreal. Or like super self conciousness. Actually freaked me out quite a bit.
I'm not making much sense I know, but has anyone ever experienced anything like this?
I'm not making much sense I know, but has anyone ever experienced anything like this?
Rubbish King
The gift that keeps on giving
It's looking bleak as fuck where I am
I'll be having an evening jog me thinks....
Rubbish King
The gift that keeps on giving
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