It's not optional, as many have said multiple times in this thread. This is literally the only proven and effective method that treats Gender Dysphoria.
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California Funds First Prisoner Sex-Reassignment Surgery and Move to Women's Prison
- Thread starter Horse Armour
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It's not optional, as many have said multiple times in this thread. This is literally the only proven and effective method that treats Gender Dysphoria.
excelsiorlef
Member
GRS is treatment it is no different than pills for bipolar disorder.
Well I mean it already happened so yep would be the correct answer here.
Side question: shouldn't this be called Sex Dysphoria? Genitals/hormones don't have anything to do with gender as I understand it.
actually, it turned out yup.
Agent_Carnage
Member
My beef with this is there are more deserving people out there that cannot afford it. While someone who committed various heinous crimes is able to get it.
I'm not the doctors who classified it, so I wouldn't know. I believe it's called that because the issue is that the public gender and sex of the person do not match their gender identity.
That's an issue with the U.S. healthcare system, not the prison system. People like me should get it, they deserve to get it, a lot of them actually need it, but that's something we're trying to fight for with universal healthcare of any sorts. Luckily, some state provided medicaid insurance plans does cover SRS and other treatments for trans health, mine does thankfully and so does California's services.
metalslimer
Member
ANd once again, this applies to literally every healthcare treatment we give to prisoners.
excelsiorlef
Member
Then get mad at the health care system outside of the prison system...
Denying prisoners surgery isn't going to magically grant other folks surgery, it's just gonna mean neither get it.
I'm still confused but I won't derail further. Thanks for explanation.
Butterfly Witch
Member
Stone cold.
excelsiorlef
Member
bluntly it's also probably because Sex Dysphoria sounds like something else entirely.
Yeah, that makes sense.
SolicitorPirate
Member
This thread is perfectly illustrative as to why I dislike progressives.
You are all so ready to shit on some conservative cunt who goes on about their bullshit, but the moment the time comes for you to live up to your ideals, suddenly you have a hundred excuses why this time it doesn't count.
Trans rights means the world when some alt right fuck is attacking a trans person, but when you have to defend a difficult position, suddenly you're on the other side, arguing why people shouldn't have surgery or why SRS is apparently something people do for fucking fun or something
Y'all can just go fuck yourselves. At least the right is an enemy that attacks from the front rather than a friend who stabs you in the back.
You are all so ready to shit on some conservative cunt who goes on about their bullshit, but the moment the time comes for you to live up to your ideals, suddenly you have a hundred excuses why this time it doesn't count.
Trans rights means the world when some alt right fuck is attacking a trans person, but when you have to defend a difficult position, suddenly you're on the other side, arguing why people shouldn't have surgery or why SRS is apparently something people do for fucking fun or something
Y'all can just go fuck yourselves. At least the right is an enemy that attacks from the front rather than a friend who stabs you in the back.
Gender isn't the only thing that exists on a spectrum. People will agree with your ideals to varying degrees. It's not 100% with you or 100% against you.
Monocle
Member
So your definition of "luxury" is a medically justified treatment of a severe health issue? Stop using terms you don't understand, please. Callous and ignorant is not a good look.
Butterfly Witch
Member
Sadly when it comes to trans rights, it is.
You're either in full favor or you're just perpetuating stigma, taboo, discrimination and bigotry.
I can't tell whether this is sarcasm or not.
SolicitorPirate
Member
Next time I need a fair weather friend, I'll let you know
People's understanding of the world and morality aren't "friendship."
Butterfly Witch
Member
Trans rights are not sarcasm.
Or people who don't realize that this is the only effective solution for a class of people who have a suicide rate over 40%.
Most people who have heard about trans issues have been told that genitals are irrelevant to gender. So it wouldn't be obvious to them that this is necessary, even if they are trying to be liberal and progressive.
excelsiorlef
Member
Transphobia propaganda has done a lot of damage in this regard.
I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but even the trans community doesn't agree on what "full support" is. Does it include non-binary genders? Do we need multiple pronouns or is 'they' sufficient? These are disagreements I've read at least in Reddit's trans community.
Expecting full support and agreement from everyone is just not realistic, and ignoring any shades of grey between levels of disagreement is absurd.
Butterfly Witch
Member
Just because genitals genitals are irrelevant for gender it doesn't mean that they're irrelevant for mental health.
Not, not in this thread. In general life outside this thread.
Inside this thread it has definitely been made clear, thankfully.
excelsiorlef
Member
And any of this has what to do with trans health?
SolicitorPirate
Member
Lmfao. Really? Is the rest of the shit you spout this transparent?
If you want to claim this is some ethical creed, I better see you protesting every time a prisoner, even a murderer, gets medical care.
excelsiorlef
Member
We're replying to people in this thread...
Huh? I'm in favor of providing this care.
Butterfly Witch
Member
"Full support" is a society free of social bigotry, where a trans person is not treated any differently than a cis person of the same gender. A society where a trans person can seek and find medical and mental health without prejudice, shame or gatekeeping.
Of course it includes non-binary folk, they're human too. Don't try to sea lion me with the pronoun question, just ask people what pronouns they want, it's really not that hard.
Not every trans person needs HRT, therapy or surgery however they should have those options available in case they do. I don't need a triple heart bypass, doesn't mean I should tell people who do to go suck on a lemon and pay the costs out of pocket.
All of this can be true, but it still doesn't mean people are either 100% with you or 100% against you. People can agree with some parts, but not others.
Anyway, I seem to have derailed the thread unintentionally. I agree that the procedure is medically necessary when diagnosed as such, given the facts about suicide rates.
excelsiorlef
Member
Care to provide your thoughts on trans health?
SolicitorPirate
Member
*sigh*
Yeah alright, I should probably step back and cool off if I'm not even attacking the right people. I'm sorry for that.
My first post still stands however. I have seen this happen far too many times to chalk it up to just different morals. I remember the thread where people were more concerned by the driver who hit a trans teen rather than the fact her family drove her to suicide. I remember the thread where people thought freedom of speech trumped trans students rights not to have their university offer a platform of hate towards them. And I will remember this thread, where people kept trying to diminish the importance of trans specific health care.
I see this all the time. Progressives talking a big game, but never following through. I see it when they abandon trans people and I saw it when they abandoned minorities, when after Trump won, progressives where declaring the death of identity politics while simultaneously arguing the Democrats needed to listen to the white working class.
So I apologise to you for my rudeness and aggression. But I do not apologise for my initial post. My frustration, disappointment and anger with many progressives is real, and is unlikely to abate until they actually live up to their stated values.
Chmpocalypse
Blizzard
Agreed. Some posters in here should be fucking ashamed.
Butterfly Witch
Member
The majority cannot rule over the rights of the minority.
HalfBakedProphet
Member
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
heck why do prisoners deserve roofs when there's countless homeless people much more deserving of a roof. We should rip off all the roofs in prisons in the USA.
HazySaiyan
Banned
Instead of getting mad at a prisoner being granted SRS, why don't you get mad at the system that means a lot transpeople in general can't afford to get it? Medical care should be a right not a privilege, this is a necessary medical procedure and should be available to everybody who needs it, regardless of past discretions. If this woman had cancer and required chemotherapy would you think it OK to deny treatment and let her die a slow, painful death just because she's a prisoner? Regardless of what they've done prisoners are still people and have rights.
Part of me feels this whole tirade of yours is a bit hypocritical given the way trans progressives were treated on this board during the primaries.....even how we were treated in the general despite supporting Hillary.
In essence, you should really take a step back to look both at yourself and the greater picture of who is actually doing what you claim. The problem isn't with progressives. The problem is Gaf is far more moderate/right-leaning than it would like to believe. Most particularly when it comes to trans-rights.
And unfortunately they tend to not actively engage with the trans community here despite how often we have to repeat basic information about our health care/rights/etc. etc. etc. Ignorance and wanting education on the matter in order to better understand is fine. Actively arguing hurtful things against us and dismissing our issues at a moment's notice is not. The problem is people can't seem to help but do the later constantly.
Vincent Grayson
Member
Then you should start fighting harder for better healthcare in wider society, because that's the only way your neighbor gets that.
If anything, this highlights how fucked up the situation with health care is for most people. If prisoners can get the care they need (and they should, at that), and regular citizens can't, that doesn't mean we're doing something wrong in the justice system. It means we're doing something wrong everywhere else.
Do some of you know how much better the healthcare is for prisoners than most everyday people you walk by everyday? Probably not.
Do some of you know how many tax dollars are spent on things that don't affect you, you don't know about, or don't care about? Probably not.
Drawing the line at a sexual reassignment surgery is laughable. You should be ashamed of yourself.
Do some of you know how many tax dollars are spent on things that don't affect you, you don't know about, or don't care about? Probably not.
Drawing the line at a sexual reassignment surgery is laughable. You should be ashamed of yourself.
Seen you say this about a million times, not bored yet?
This thread proves how some haven't a clue about transexuals.
John Kowalski
Banned
Very positive news.
TheExecutive
Member
Wait, so they are going to throw a male by birth into a female prison and one that is known to be violent? OK good job California.
I won't even get into why the taxpayers shouldn't foot the bill for this.
I won't even get into why the taxpayers shouldn't foot the bill for this.
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