I saw something pop up today directly addressing this point: Naheed Nenshi on Bill C24
Is this for real? I thought the NDP slogan was 'Fuck Alberta'.
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Canadian General Election (OT) - #elxn42: October 19, 2015
- Thread starter matthewwhatever
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Again we have the NDP at their disingenuous best listing 70 confidence vote items the Liberals voted for... but how about just one example just to give some perspective... the Budget Implementation (Division 6) vote of February 12, 2009 was the vote for the motion that the budget bill be read a second time, and send it to committee.
Shocking indeed. This was 2009, with a minority Harper government... shall we topple the four month old government over the second reading of a budget bill?
You can't expect someone to stick to their word for that long though, come on, what is this? A fairy tale?
dragonfart28
Banned
matthewwhatever
Member
Avert your eyes, NDP-Gaf:
That article has a bunch of other data, all of it terrible news for you guys. From a broader perspective, it's a little worrying that among people who slightly want change, the Conservatives are almost tied with the Liberals (and both are well ahead of the NDP).
Things are equally bad for the NDP in Nanos:
He's also found that the NDP in Quebec has slipped to single digits, though he still has them up at 36.
That article has a bunch of other data, all of it terrible news for you guys. From a broader perspective, it's a little worrying that among people who slightly want change, the Conservatives are almost tied with the Liberals (and both are well ahead of the NDP).
Things are equally bad for the NDP in Nanos:
He's also found that the NDP in Quebec has slipped to single digits, though he still has them up at 36.
gutter_trash
Banned
that Abacus poll. Ouch
dragonfart28
Banned
Conservatives niqab trick worked.
This is bad news for all of 'us'. This trajectory leads to a conservative majority.
gutter_trash
Banned
still 2 weeks to go guys
this is just a blip
the desire to replace Harper is still strong
this is just a blip
the desire to replace Harper is still strong
PumpkinSpice
Banned
Racist "old stock" Canadians who have no idea what a swearing in ceremony even is.
NDP is disappointing me lately. They're losing incredible ground to the Conservatives, but they're trying to mine it back from the Liberals.
I really envy those who don't follow politics, or, more specifically, those who don't feel the need to follow politics. It's horribly depressing 95% of the time. Can you imagine happily living your life, oblivious to all this shit show?
Those polls + monday morning = fuck everything
PumpkinSpice
Banned
It's pretty easy honestly. Just stop reading news for the next month, go and vote for your party of choice on election day, and just wait for results the next day.
I know. I just can't seem to bring myself to do that.
And the people I'm talking about don't vote. They have things all figured out. Why would they? "All politicians are crooks anyway".
matthewwhatever
Member
This might be the most bizarre leak story I've ever seen: Trudeau Says Terrorists Shouldn't Be Stripped Of Citizenship In Leaked Audio
CTV is running with it too. Except it's not exactly a secret -- they've been really vocal about their position on the issue. In the audio, Trudeau even says he anticipates being attacked over it:
I get that the Conservatives are trying to paint Trudeau as sympathetic to non-white people, but I'm pretty sure he'd be more than happy to restate his opposition to C24.
I'm wondering how Mulcair is going to present himself in the debate tonight. It's his last chance to speak to a national-ish audience (since I don't think the French debate will be nationally televised), which means it's his last chance to go after Harper in front of Canada. It would make sense for him to break out Angry Tom, and hope that it connects with voters who want change, but at the same time he'd run the risk of turning off people who were attracted to the NDP because of Layton's sunnier disposition.
And speaking of the debate, anyone know any details of where it'll be available? I can't find any links, even on the Munk website.
CTV is running with it too. Except it's not exactly a secret -- they've been really vocal about their position on the issue. In the audio, Trudeau even says he anticipates being attacked over it:
Justin Trudeau said:
I get that the Conservatives are trying to paint Trudeau as sympathetic to non-white people, but I'm pretty sure he'd be more than happy to restate his opposition to C24.
I'm wondering how Mulcair is going to present himself in the debate tonight. It's his last chance to speak to a national-ish audience (since I don't think the French debate will be nationally televised), which means it's his last chance to go after Harper in front of Canada. It would make sense for him to break out Angry Tom, and hope that it connects with voters who want change, but at the same time he'd run the risk of turning off people who were attracted to the NDP because of Layton's sunnier disposition.
And speaking of the debate, anyone know any details of where it'll be available? I can't find any links, even on the Munk website.
Could be a strategic leak. Maybe they've realized that "LEAK" stories get more attention and they're using it as a way to solidify their platform.
No one should ever be stripped of their citizenship. Ever. Citizenship is a fundamental right of the international community. Removing citizenship is counter to what governments should be doing -- preventing and punishing crimes. (edit: And rehabilitation)
gutter_trash
Banned
Mulcair the lawyer going for the Chewbacca defense
incredibly stupid, naive and terrible timing. If people want to discuss it, wait after the election. Defending badguys during a campaign is a bad strategy.
It is like as if they really want Harper to win a majority on these stupid issues.
It's a way to go "not mine, he's not Canadian, just a terrorist" instead of owning up to it.
Personally the whole second class citizen bs is beyond stupid.
Also, we're totally fucked aren't we? Harper is totally gonna win, isn't he (not voting conservative , FYI) ?
We are going into the shitter aren't we?
Earthstrike
Member
I'm getting real close to contacting my M.P. and letting him know that whether or not I vote for him is contingent on formation of a coalition government. No more fucking bullshit. If one leader extends out a hands towards a coalition and the other rejects, I'm simply never voting for the party that rejects for the rest of my life. If there ever was a time where we needed a coalition, it's now.
My prediction is that he's going to go after the liberals to be honest. He sees he can't get those voters the cons gained so he's going to try and strip votes for the libs.
matthewwhatever
Member
I found the details for tonight's debate:
Munk Debate on Canadian Foreign Policy, 7 pm EST
TV: CPAC, CHCH
Online: https://www.munkdebates.com/live-stream-landing or https://www.facebook.com/munkdebates
So not during primetime, and not even streaming on YouTube. And it was $100 a ticket to get in. This thing is going to be a trainwreck, but at least no one will be around to view it.
You know, for an immigrant to Canada who loves to rant about how evil Harper is, you sure are...something. But hey, it's not like this government passed a law saying that bashing the government online can be counted as inciting anti-government sentiment, right? I'm sure you have nothing to worry about when it comes to the creation of multiple classes of citizenship.
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If anyone wants to play around with possible election outcomes, Hill & Knowlton finally have their Election Predictor 2015 up. If you're into regional breakdowns, they've added that feature this time around, which makes it even more fun.
Munk Debate on Canadian Foreign Policy, 7 pm EST
TV: CPAC, CHCH
Online: https://www.munkdebates.com/live-stream-landing or https://www.facebook.com/munkdebates
So not during primetime, and not even streaming on YouTube. And it was $100 a ticket to get in. This thing is going to be a trainwreck, but at least no one will be around to view it.
You know, for an immigrant to Canada who loves to rant about how evil Harper is, you sure are...something. But hey, it's not like this government passed a law saying that bashing the government online can be counted as inciting anti-government sentiment, right? I'm sure you have nothing to worry about when it comes to the creation of multiple classes of citizenship.
...
If anyone wants to play around with possible election outcomes, Hill & Knowlton finally have their Election Predictor 2015 up. If you're into regional breakdowns, they've added that feature this time around, which makes it even more fun.
dragonfart28
Banned
Can someone clarify the minority government situation for me?
If the Conservatives get a minority government and both Liberals and NDP vote no confidence in Harper, do we have to have another election or can we just have the NDP and Liberals work together?
If the Conservatives get a minority government and both Liberals and NDP vote no confidence in Harper, do we have to have another election or can we just have the NDP and Liberals work together?
Except, that would be the absolute stupidest thing you could do if you wanted the conservatives out.
matthewwhatever
Member
Depends how large their plurality is, and when the non-confidence vote happens. If the Conservatives are only ahead by a couple of seats -- say it breaks down something like CPC 120/LPC 110/NDP 100 -- and they fall before Christmas, then I imagine the GG would ask the other two parties if they could work together to form government, even if it's on an informal basis.
If it's something like CPC 150/LPC 90/NDP 90, though, and the government falls next spring, I think the GG would call another election.
gutter_trash
Banned
it's the wrong time to debate it on the campaign trail. If this gets brought up today a the Munk debate and sound clips get used against Trudeau and Mulcair. Harper wins a majority
On this issue, best let it go for now or else = Conservative Majority
Perception is everything and this is a lose lose issue not matter the legality, no matter the Constitutionality. Let the Supreme Court deal with it later
gutter_trash
Banned
it's the wrong time to debate on the campaign trail. If this gets brought up today a the Munk debate and sound clips get used against Trudeau and Mulcair. Harper wins a majority
On this issue, best let it go for now or else = Conservative Majority
Perception is everything and this is a lose lose issue not matter the legality, no matter the Constitutionality. Let the Supreme Court deal with it later
Tonight decides if it is a Conservative minority or a Conervative Majority government depending on the words chosen by both Trudeau and Mulcair
I disagree about the timing, if you do it the right way. You don't have to 'defend the bad guys' to say that you believe in defending this country from harm while doing it in a way that follows the constitution.
Looks like there is around a 10% difference between the independent candidate and the CPC candidate in the riding I live in now according to forum.I seriously hope the independent candidate does get enough momentum to beat the CPC candidate and keep his seat.
http://poll.forumresearch.com/post/1393/brent-rathgeber-in-second/
http://poll.forumresearch.com/post/1393/brent-rathgeber-in-second/
Here's the brutal graph.
This is what the NDP get for their unpopular position that women can wear whatever they want.
Buba Big Guns
Banned
Holy shit...I think a CPC minority is almost certain at this point. Most likely a strong one too. Depressing.
You can see that the uptick is split between Bloc and Conservative, so it's possible that if support divides evenly then the NDP could hold the seat. I don't know Quebec seats that well so I don't know the implications of this graph in terms of seat count change. It seems likely that the Cons will pick up several seats around Quebec City as I believe they're in direct competition with the NDP there.
If the NDP lose seats in Quebec to the Bloc and Conservatives we're certainly headed for a minority government.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
Here's the brutal graph.
This is what the NDP get for their unpopular position that women can wear whatever they want.
This shouldn't shift the seat numbers all that much in Quebec right? I mean the bloc might still survive and the Conseratives will probably pick up a few more than expected but the map will still be a sea of orange and red.
I believe NDP has said that they are open to a coalition a few times but Trudeau refused because he hates Mulcair.
The fact that the NDP dropped that much in Quebec only because of the niqab issue is pathetic and sad. This is why I feel the way I do about that place.
And I'm not disagreeing with you, but they already do attack ads against the liberals
The bloc is definitely looking at 0-5 seats still. The NDP are looking at around 50 seats with these numbers and the Liberals probably 15.
The thing is that if the niqab thing is working that well in Quebec, the west will probably follow. An NDP collapse in Quebec and BC and losing the gains they have in the prairies doesn't mean a Conservative minority -- it means a Conservative majority, or at least a CPC minority with the Bloc spoiling any kind of governing agreement between the LPC and the NDP.
It's not like people turned off the NDP over the niqab are going to flock to the Liberals, where Trudeau took an even more overt stance on it right off the bat.
It's not like people turned off the NDP over the niqab are going to flock to the Liberals, where Trudeau took an even more overt stance on it right off the bat.
Hey now the Conservatives' anti-niqab stuff is propelling their momentum in Ontario and BC as well. Let's not let the rest of Canada off easy. They too will need to shoulder the blame for the upcoming Conservative victory.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
I've long expected if the NDP vote starts to collapse you'll see Trudeau at the last minute trotting out the ol' "vote Liberal to stop Harper" to NDP voters -- it's helped them in the past and I see no reason it wouldn't work again, if that message is accompanying a poll with the Liberals in a strong 2nd place.
matthewwhatever
Member
I hope Rathgeber can make it up. He's a solid MP, and he deserves to get back in.
Here's the brutal graph.
This is what the NDP get for their unpopular position that women can wear whatever they want.
Except that's the Liberal stance, too, and they went up a little in Quebec (within the margin of error, of course, but still). I don't think it's just the niqab -- I think the bulk water ads are having an impact, too, along with a general dissatisfaction with Mulcair's campaign. A lot of the NDP gains in Quebec last election were because of Layton's personal popularity. I think the niqab is definitely playing a role, but I don't think that's all of it.
People are so easily manipulated, it's really amazing.
Forget about progressive values, or wanting a better country, people are willing to ditch it all because they want to impose an open face sermon.
Truly, this is idiocracy in action.
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