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Canadian General Election (OT) - #elxn42: October 19, 2015
- Thread starter matthewwhatever
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firehawk12
Subete no aware
We basically are on the verge of electing Hilary Clinton. Take that for what you will. lol
Happy days but could have been happier. We were close to getting an NDP government like a month ago. That would be Bernie Sanders to you. That's no longer possible. We're expecting a Liberal minority tomorrow. That would kind of be Democrats to you (not the Clinton kind, more Obama, I think).
Even if the Conservatives win, the Liberals and NDP have vowed to take them down as soon as they get the chance. As long as the Liberals hold to their word, the Conservatives should get tossed out even if they win (which isn't likely at this point).
For real I thought the NDP moving closer to the center is how they squandered their lead.
No.
So tired of this.
What they've emphasized is more centrist than usual for the NDP, but overall their platform is definitely still to the left of the Liberals in goals. The only parts that are disjoint from people's expectations are that the NDP don't plan to raise personal taxes on anyone (instead raising corporate taxes), and that they planned to balance the budget (which is actually a populist position, not exactly a right wing position).
This election sounds like a repeat of the Ontario provincial one. Liberal outflank NDP.
Depends on who you ask. There are some key issues where liberals are taking a lefter approach, or took one quicker than the NDP (niqab, pot, budget) but the NDP still has a few left leaning positions that are uniquely theirs.
BigJonsson
Member
Quito Maggi ‏@quito_maggi 53s53 seconds ago
After tonight, I can comfortably say, I was right on the 13th, @liberal_party majority expected tomorrow #elxn42
Oh snap
After tonight, I can comfortably say, I was right on the 13th, @liberal_party majority expected tomorrow #elxn42
Oh snap
Campaign to the left....
That's it? This kind of speculation from a pollster seems kind of irresponsible imo. Oh well.
Thanks guys, good luck tomorrow!
Final Forum poll. Liberals are gonna be happy with this.
gutter_trash
Banned
it's raining polls
God help this country.
BigJonsson
Member
gutter_trash
Banned
Jason Kenny has done lots of calculative work trying to woo ethnic minorities into voting Conservative in 2011
now many of them are pissed that the Cons made it difficult for families have family members become Canadian citizens, making it harder to become citizen and all this talk about Old Stock Canadians and taking away dual citizenship
the Conservatives have lost what they have worked for in 2011 and they screwed themselves over in 2015
One last look at what I hope will be the past:
http://moiz.ca/harper/
http://moiz.ca/harper/
firehawk12
Subete no aware
A Liberal majority will be as bad as a Conservative majority. 
For me, government subsidised programs that increase equality (health care, national pharmacare, free university, free daycare, etc) are left wing. Tearing those things down and believing that the free market will solve those problems is right wing. Basically, governments doing stuff to solve problems = left wing. Sitting on hands and doing nothing when faced with problems = right wing.
Also racism/nationalism = right wing.
So, what happened between Sept. 14 to 24? I wasn't really paying attention at that time since I'm out of the country.
Hear, hear. Electoral reform is my single-issue vote right now.
Simon Belmont
Banned
I wonder if Harper will cry? MacKay cried!
A Liberal majority will be as bad as a Conservative majority.
Do note this is trudeau's liberals
With majority, electoral reform is for sure on the cards... which is the best thing anyone can ask for
gutter_trash
Banned
I rather have 4 years of stability and get hard things done that would be beneficial for the long term than be stuck in perpetual campaign mode in a minority government with short term candy that does nothing for the long term.A Liberal majority will be as bad as a Conservative majority.
tough decisions have to be made and it's best done in a majority and stable government.
minorities downspiral in calculative scheming and cheap politics
a Majority would be best to allow Canada get shit done without the specter of snap election
A Liberal majority will be as bad as a Conservative majority.
I can't envision a world in which this is true.
They'd certainly like you to think it is, but I wouldn't consider the shallow tax tweaks and minor deficit spending to be a more significant left wing agenda than what the NDP is proposing.
Someone earning around $80k-$200k benefits the most from the "middle class" tax cut the Liberals are proposing. That hardly seems like a progressive campaign promise to me.
The biggest difference is that the Liberals are going into deficit for more immediate, greater spending promises, whereas the NDP is promising more ambitious, more difficult to implement, changes over a longer term (ie. $15 a day daycare, zero interest student loans).
The Liberals are promising good things, better things than the Conservatives, but there is a lot of hot air there, and it's certainly not left of the NDP in my opinion.
I certainly understand why Canadians would support the Liberal campaign promises of quicker, easier to implement change.
Support for minority rights, the labour movement, and the continuation and expansion of the welfare state are the key elements of leftism. Liberals in Canada are an odd mix of leftism and traditional liberalism, but the NDP are not really liberals at all. Their staunch opposition to free trade is a big part of that (I have no doubt the Liberals will pass TPP, awful copyright provisions included). They also proposed expanding universal health care to cover drugs, which is huge.
It seems as if the discussion of left vs. right in Canada has devolved to fiscal liberal vs. fiscal Keynsian, which is to my mind absolutely bizarre.
As a key practical example of the difference between the two parties, the Liberals would never filibuster back to work legislation.
Nah, you have to remember there are many posters here that hate the LPC as much the CPC. I recall some wanted the LPC to be completely wiped out after the 2011 election and during the NDP surge.
And those weren't CPC Gaffers either.
Mainstreet is officially predicting a Liberal majority(not just Quito Maggi stating his personal opinion).
That's definitely not true, and I started this election supporting the NDP.
A Liberal majority will be as bad as a Conservative majority.
That's definitely not true, and I started this election supporting the NDP.
A Liberal majority will be as bad as a Conservative majority.
Oh come now. Maybe they'll suddenly get shy about electoral reform, but at least we'll get the long form census back, more infrastructure investment and legalized weed, compared to what we'd get with a Conservative government.
matthewwhatever
Member
Aw crap. I was feeling moderately optimistic for tomorrow, but if Forum is saying this, they're clearly screwed.
A Liberal majority will be as bad as a Conservative majority.
No.
This is one of those Rabble-esque statements that's so self-evidently absurd, it doesn't even deserve to be refuted. It's just wrong.
gutter_trash
Banned
yup, the NDP and CPC both want the Liberals gone because the Liberals always spoil the plans of both the NDP and CPC
both the NDP and the CPC want an American style 2 party system .... a polarized 2 party system. Both thrive on polarization
the Liberal Party is the stable conscious of normality that balances ph levels to be just right for the pool
D
Deleted member 126221
Unconfirmed Member
The niqab issue, combined with the weak reaction from Quebec to the NDP platform, caused a slip in Quebec support. This created a drop in national horse race numbers for the NDP and in Ontario this caused ABC voters to begin to coalesce behind the Liberals.
I will eat a hat if a liberal majority produces PR.
gutter_trash
Banned
yes
identity politics, being anti multiculturalism, questioning the voting patterns of ethnic minorities = Right Wing Nationalism , ethnic nationalism. A right wing trait.
Parizeau yelled out loud that "REAL" Quebecers voted YES at over 60% in the 1995 referendum
do you want me to link you his speech? If that is not right wing then I don't know what is
NDP bleeding support to the Cons and the Liberals (strongest effect in Quebec afaik). How much you can ascribe to niqabs or balanced budgets or whatever is up to debate.
What kind of hat are we talking about here?
I expect it would depend on how durable they thought the majority was.
I'm not expecting a majority, anyway. Numbers in the high 30s have only every produced majorities in the face of really severe vote-splitting among opposition constituencies, and the now-united Tory vote is too solid for that, I think.
A Liberal majority will be as bad as a Conservative majority.
This is a severe an overreaction!
I am hoping for a Liberal minority but that's because PR is probably my #1 issue of this election, and if the Liberals win a Majority government there's really zero incentive for them to implement PR (or any voting changes for that matter).
Liberals leading in Quebec? I'm assuming this is more than just the Montreal area?
To be honest, i would be more inclined to vote liberal, but since they lost pretty badly in my riding in 2011, i'm not sure if I would be wasting my vote by voting for them against CPC rather than NDP(who barely won against them in 2011).
"Do any of you actually eat fedoras?"
You can get straw trilbies that might actually be
Probably made of nachos. My father had a gambling problem, so I tend to avoid actual gambling.
I don't see the Liberal getting much more than 25 seats in Quebec at this point(20-26 seats most likely in the province) so it looks like a majority is going to be really hard for them unless they get a ton of seats in Ontario(like 90+ seats). The bloc may sneak in and get a few seats(4-8 seats) and the ndp will dominate quebec still, but not as much as before.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Well, beyond the PR thing being off the table if a majority happens, I'm also afraid of the old "Canada's natural governing party" tendencies rearing its ugly head again.
I'd be happy with perpetual minorities for the rest of my life, to be honest.
I'd be happy with perpetual minorities for the rest of my life, to be honest.
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