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[firehawk12]

Nah, BC Bud is tops the world over, and BC smokers know where it's at, and I figure the same for the rest of Canada.

Where else do you think Cheech and Chong came from?

And Vancouver is home to the Crown Prince of Pot, Marc Emery and his wife Jodie Emery.

If kids are buying off brand Chinese vape pods or whatever, I'm sure they are going to want the cheap weed. lol

Sure it would. Instead of every other party seeing "3.5% of the vote for the Greens, nobody cares about their policies, environment's not a big deal", they'd see more like "15% of the vote for the Greens, let's try and include some of their policies in our big tent platform." There's more to elections to just winning seats the right % of seats.

I think that's really pie in the sky type thinking though. Because otherwise the Liberals would implement the NDP platform since almost 20% of Canada voted for it.

 

[Azih]

Representation is a guarantee of an opinion, not a guarantee to the representative of your choice.

I didn't follow the UK election. I can talk all day about what happened this election.

Well, I'm literally walking out the door for a teeth cleaning, so maybe not all day.

The logic of democracy is that the right of decision belongs to the majority but the right of representation belongs to all.

Both AV and FPTP fail on both those counts.

SheepyGuy If the Greens get 15% of the first choice but have no chance of winning in any riding then They Will Be Ignored. Just as the PCs were ignored when they got 2 million votes but got 2 seats in exchange. in '93. Seats in Parliament are what matter not vote share as FPTP has shown time and again and will continue to be true in AV.

In PR, seats in parliament actually reflects vote share. How the heck is this a thing that's scary to us?

Edit: And representation is not a guarantee of 'opinion' that's free speech. Representation means that my vote helped elect someone who represents me. Don't got that.

 

[firehawk12]

Guys, just google the breakdown of the Australian House and the Senate.

The House as AV, the Senate has STV. And look at how many Greens are in each chamber.

 

[gutter_trash]

okay guys, I had fun these past weeks but I will bow for a while because there is too much arguing about Electoral Reform, FPTP, IRV, PR

For me, I don`t care about Conservatives, I don`t care bout the NDP and I don't care about the BLoc

I am only interested in Liberal victories. So I favor preferential ranked whatever because it favors Liberals

so now you will call me to be too partisan, oh it is true. I only care about Liberal victories, no matter the cost.

See you guys later in a few weeks when more stuff starts to happen in Ottawa

 

[You Are Viewtiful]

Sure it would. Instead of every other party seeing "3.5% of the vote for the Greens, nobody cares about their policies, environment's not a big deal", they'd see more like "15% of the vote for the Greens, let's try and include some of their policies in our big tent platform." There's more to elections to just winning seats the right % of seats.

And there's more to parliament than confidence votes, even if you're supporting a loser party with a minority of votes their work as parliamentarians is important in committees, opposing the government when they do something stupid, and representing their constants. They can even bring in bills that can and do win enough votes to become the law of the land.

I think a lot of people forget that majority doesn't have to mean Harper style omnibus "my way or the highway" style of governing.

Greens will not get 15%-20% in any riding for one reason: if Liberals get less first-choice votes than a Green in a riding, then Liberals will be eliminated, and we have to rely on people who voted Green as second choice to defeat Conservatives. Now it gets really convoluted. If a lot of Liberal voters have Conservatives above Greens, then the Greens will not win overall. In AV, you still have to have winnable parties high up on your list or you risk your vote not getting counted.

I'm not sure why you're talking about parliamentarians of opposition parties in the same breath as AV. In AV, we will have two big parties, and that's really it. NDP and Greens will be close to extinction in AV, and that's by design (edit: as gutter points out above me, haha). FPTP may be super unrepresentative, but I still give it props for creating multi-party democracies, something which can't be said for AV.

 

[DopeyFish]

Maybe instead of a 6 vote system, we should do a 10 vote proportional tiered ballot

4/3/2/1. Whoever you choose as first vote can't be used for second or third vote. But 4th vote can be applied to anyone.

This way we just divide by 10 to get actual votes. Allows for an easy retrigger of a recount of a poll.

This way everyone has a strong voice, everyone can choose how much support they want to offer a party.

Helps with mixture, strength, strategic voting, fringe issues.

I will beat this drum forever lol

 

[matthewwhatever]

And when everyone else around goes

1. Liberal
2. ______
3. ______

1. NDP
2. Liberal

1. Conservative
2. Liberal

The Liberals get a huge majority and the Greens get shit all. Terrible voting system.

I'm still waiting for you to explain why it's a terrible voting system.

Lol PJSalt. The Green party did, arguably, get screwed around debate participation. Might be time for May to move on too.

Nah...May's the only reason they get any attention. If she leaves, they wither up and die. I think she stays in the House and as leader until she decides it's time to go.

To be fair, with the per-vote subsidy gone, it kind of is wasted. Bring the subsidy back.

Yep. Hopefully Trudeau does that ASAP. I'm not sure how it would be implemented, since basing it on yesterday's results wouldn't be entirely fair, but I hope they find a way to bring it back.

 

[firehawk12]

Maybe instead of a 6 vote system, we should do a 10 vote proportional tiered ballot

4/3/2/1. Whoever you choose as first vote can't be used for second or third vote. But 4th vote can be applied to anyone.

This way we just divide by 10 to get actual votes. Allows for an easy retrigger of a recount of a poll.

This way everyone has a strong voice, everyone can choose how much support they want to offer a party.

Helps with mixture, strength, strategic voting, fringe issues.

I will beat this drum forever lol

STV lets you rank parties and then have votes transfer over to the second place party. Of course it only works because you end up voting multiple representatives per riding.

 

[ItIsOkBro]

How about we first vote between Green / NDP / Liberal and then the winner goes up against the Conservatives

 

[lsslave]

How about we first vote between Green / NDP / Liberal and then the winner goes up against the Conservatives

No. That would be basically a system similar to the US. And it would end up as a 2 party system. No. Just never ever try to say that again.

 

[Azih]

How about we first vote between Green / NDP / Liberal and then the winner goes up against the Conservatives

Why not just use the kinds of systems used by ninety per cent of the EU & OECD countries? You know. PR.

Seriously. It's not like these things haven't been in use for many many years and aren't thoroughly studied or anything.

 

[firehawk12]

Why not just use the kinds of systems used by ninety per cent of the EU & OECD countries? You know. PR.

Seriously. It's not like these things haven't been in use for many many years and aren't thoroughly studied or anything.

Because then the LPC and CPC lose.

 

[You Are Viewtiful]

No. That would be basically a system similar to the US. And it would end up as a 2 party system. No. Just never ever try to say that again.

France is a more apt example. Also a two party system, with a neo-Nazi third party who get a lot of airtime during Presidential votes because of the second round. Yikes. PR can't prevent Front National, but at least it can limit their airtime and ensure they never get majority.

Interesting factoid: MPP was actually created in Germany to prevent an extremist party like the Nazi Party from ever winning again! Pretty cool eh. By design, it encourages moderation, consensus and collaboration.

 

[Mysterious]

Because then the LPC and CPC lose.

Uh, no? LPC and CPC would be ahead of NDP, even with PR. What are you smoking?

Especially with CPC.

 

[lupinko]

If kids are buying off brand Chinese vape pods or whatever, I'm sure they are going to want the cheap weed. lol

Who said anything about kids getting cheap weed?

Legalization puts a big roadblock for the underaged.

And I'm from BC, we know our product, Justin knows this too, since he's also from BC.

 

[Azih]

Uh, no? LPC and CPC would be ahead of NDP, even with PR. What are you smoking?

Especially with CPC.

I think he's pointing out they wouldn't get fake majorities anymore and so they do what they can to make PR seem weird and scary and threatening when it's just the default mode of democracy in almost every other place in the world.

 

[Mysterious]

I think he's pointing out they wouldn't get fake majorities anymore.

Oh, I thought he meant LPC and CPC would lose as Government of Canada.

 

[imBask]

Who said anything about kids getting cheap weed?

Legalization puts a big roadblock for the underaged.

And I'm from BC, we know our product, Justin knows this too, since he's also from BC.

Justin was born in Ottawa and lived in Montreal for most of his life though

 

[Ledhead]

Gutter stepped out on a Montreal street today and inhaled the brisk morning air. I love the smell of a Liberal majority, he thought. Smells like victory

 

[Perfect Blue]

Prime Minister-designate Justin Trudeau has a rally with supporters at 2pm EST. Press conference at 5. Hopefully we get some hints about who will be in his cabinet.

 

[Walpurgis]

SheepyGuy If the Greens get 15% of the first choice but have no chance of winning in any riding then They Will Be Ignored. Just as the PCs were ignored when they got 2 million votes but got 2 seats in exchange. in '93. Seats in Parliament are what matter not vote share as FPTP has shown time and again and will continue to be true in AV.

Good lord. This is absolutely insane. 22 years later and still no PR. Wtf.

okay guys, I had fun these past weeks but I will bow for a while because there is too much arguing about Electoral Reform, FPTP, IRV, PR

For me, I don`t care about Conservatives, I don`t care bout the NDP and I don't care about the BLoc

I am only interested in Liberal victories. So I favor preferential ranked whatever because it favors Liberals

so now you will call me to be too partisan, oh it is true. I only care about Liberal victories, no matter the cost.

See you guys later in a few weeks when more stuff starts to happen in Ottawa

Hahahaha! I like your honesty.

Interesting factoid: MPP was actually created in Germany to prevent an extremist party like the Nazi Party from ever winning again! Pretty cool eh. By design, it encourages moderation, consensus and collaboration.

Very cool! We should go with that.

Uh, no? LPC and CPC would be ahead of NDP, even with PR. What are you smoking?

Especially with CPC.

The right vote would split because provincial parties like Wildrose would go federal and new parties would pop up. They would just form a coalition with the CPC though.

 

[Perfect Blue]

Gutter stepped out on a Montreal street today and inhaled the brisk morning air. I love the smell of a Liberal majority, he thought. Smells like victory

 

[eBay Huckster]

Gutter stepped out on a Montreal street today and inhaled the brisk morning air. I love the smell of a Liberal majority, he thought. Smells like victory

Smells like Justin

 

[Walpurgis]

Smells like Justin

LOL

 

[lupinko]

Justin was born in Ottawa and lived in Montreal for most of his life though

Justin spent a lot of his early adult life in BC, and his mother and her family are from BC.

He has roots here.

 

[Walpurgis]

Man, I've been so focused on this election that I haven't checked gaming since the day before yesterday.

 

[Darksol]

Waking up knowing that Harper losing the election wasn't just a dream is a great feeling.

 

[Irminsul]

Did you miss the part where I'm happy voting for the Liberals who won in my riding? It's not a wasted vote.

Yes both would be fine for me, good improvements, certainly not as good as PR but maybe easier to make happen.

MMP is a form of PR. The best one in my opinion, but I'm biased (as a German).

 

[eBay Huckster]

so, we gonna be transitioning back to a dedicated Canada PoliGAF thread any time soon?

 

[DopeyFish]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/rally-for-prime-minister-designate-justin-trudeau-live-1.2867043

trudeau rally coming up

 

[Walpurgis]

so, we gonna be transitioning back to a dedicated Canada PoliGAF thread any time soon?

I think we should wait until parliament reopens. Right now, there's not much else to talk about but the election.

 

[Gurgelhals]

Congratulations Canada! If only our electorate on this Sunday's federal elections (Switzerland) wouldn't have been taken in by the right-wing shitshow as well :-( Oh well, at least I know which country to emigrate to if things get really ugly here...

 

[killer rin]

I'm listening to a Conservative radio talk show(CFRA 580) and, although there are a bunch of level headed Conservatives who are hopeful of Justin's leadership, the bitter tears of a lot of them are delicious, even to the point where the hosts think that some callers are being ridiculous.

Well then, it looks like we have a couple GIFs we need to make.

-Someone should really take the crying "He Can't Keep Getting Away With it" GIF and turn it into "But He's Just Not Ready!".
-We should take the Republican Tears drinking GIF and turn it into Conservative Tears

They'll make voter reform as it was political platform promise, but I doubt PR.

I'm hoping for online voting and perhaps mandatory voting.

Pretty much my thoughts on the matter. I can definately see the Liberals touching Electoral Reform, but I think they are going to do the other two things in their platform instead... aka Mandatory Voting and Online Voting. Then they can drag their feet on Electoral Reform while still saying they did something

I think we should wait until parliament reopens. Right now, there's not much else to talk about but the election.

This seems the most sensible, even the UK thread went on for awhile before they opened their new one. Lets ride this thread out until the usual 400 post closing, then we can transition to a new thread in Community.

Edit: Yay! And I finally caught back up to today

 

[Darksol]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/rally-for-prime-minister-designate-justin-trudeau-live-1.2867043

trudeau rally coming up

What's with the 90s megamix? lol

 

[ryan-ts]

What's with the 90s megamix? lol

They`re playing "Blue", haha.

 

[DopeyFish]

What's with the 90s megamix? lol

Because of our lost decade, trudeau will welcome us to the 00's

 

[Darksol]

They`re playing "Blue", haha.

Before that was Cotton Eye Joe.

Because of our lost decade, trudeau will welcome us to the 00's

Haha


Ah, here we go.

 

[crimzonflame]

So many pissed off people in the office this morning lol.

- " Borders will now be wide open and they will let no one but terrorists in"
- "Economy will go to shit"
- "Canada will be destroyed in 5 years"

Reminds me of when Obama was elected the 2nd time.

 

[Darksol]

So many pissed off people in the office this morning lol.

- " Borders will now be wide open and they will let no one but terrorists in"
- "Economy will go to shit"
- "Canada will be destroyed in 5 years"

Reminds me of when Obama was elected the 2nd time.

I'm going to assume you're on the west coast?

 

[Zombie James]

- "Economy will go to shit"

"Won't somebody PLEASE think of the wealthy?"

 

[killer rin]

...Did someone just hold up a surface to take a picture. That seems so impractical

"Won't somebody PLEASE think of the wealthy?"

 

[Kinsei]

So many pissed off people in the office this morning lol.

- " Borders will now be wide open and they will let no one but terrorists in"
- "Economy will go to shit"
- "Canada will be destroyed in 5 years"

Reminds me of when Obama was elected the 2nd time.

I haven't heard or seen any anger over the cons losing. Then again I live in Atlantic Canada and we made our stance on this very clear last night.

 

[Darksol]

Trudeau taking some good shots.

 

[ryan-ts]

Science <3

 

[Silexx]

I haven't heard or seen any anger over the cons losing. Then again I live in Atlantic Canada and we made our stance on this very clear last night.

Working for the public service here, there's seems to be a bounce in everyone's step this morning.

 

[DopeyFish]

oh snap

 

[Cake Boss]

Working for the public service here, there's seems to be a bounce in everyone's step this morning.

Even the directors!!

 

[Canon]

Working for the public service here, there's seems to be a bounce in everyone's step this morning.

I didn't follow this election at all, but what did Justin promise in terms of this?

 

[Impeccable]

That was a fun little speech.

We're back, bitches.

 

[Zombie James]

oh snap

What did I miss?