CEO of Sony Interactive Entertainment, Hideaki Nishino, to hold a keynote speech on the first day of TGS over the industry impact of PlayStation Store
Iced Arcade
Member
removing PS games from Steam to exclusively release on its own store to combat MS new PC xbox hybrid lol
yurinka
Member
Around 90% of the physical + digital full game sales (which combined are around 23%).
You have to add there the 3rd party part of the addons (around 30%) and game subs (around 10%).
Most money comes from addons (so mostly GaaS), and Sony still has a small GaaS portion of the PS market, smaller than the one they have for game sales: most top GaaS are 3rd party. And most games included in the game sub are 3rd party.
Meaning, way over 90% of the addons revenue must be 3rd party (around 30%) and a huge chunk of game subs too.
TLDR: Adding everything, pretty likely somewhere above a half of the total SIE revenue (including hardware, accesories and off-PS) comes from the 30% cut they get from selling 3rd party games and addons plus the money Sony makes from gamesubs thanks to 3rd party content.
I think the Asus PC handheld will continue selling less than the Valve PC handheld even if they included an Xbox logo or button.
And the Valve one sold around 4M units so far. So the effect of the 'xbox' PC handheld will be practically zero.
Sony won't care if thanks to this MS supported PC handheld now Sony sells a few copies more in Steam. Specially when Sony will have now the home console market only for them.
Xbox Series may end having sold somewhere between 30-35M once it gets discontinued. Let's say around 10M of them plus the few remaining ones at XBI already have a PS or will move to PC/Switch and not PS.
It means 20-25M extra new users for PS. Jim Ryan always wins.
According to the yen to USD done now via google, this quarter SIE made in revenue:
- Total of the division 936,533M yen ($6.34B)
- 'Game software' 540,189M yen ($3.65B, which is 57.68% of the total)
- 'Other software' (a.k.a. first party games outside PS) 25,330M yen ($171.41M, which is 4.69% of their 'game software' and 2.7% of the total of the division)
If you want to know what aprox. do the first party games in PS, if you assume that in digital+physical full game sales minus the 89.53% of 3rd party in units can also be applied to revenue to get a rough idea:
- full game sales revenue in PS: 22,711+199,538 = 222,249M yen ($1.50M)
- 3rd party estimate part of it: 89.53% of 222,249M yen = 198,980M yen ($1.34B)
- first party estimate part of it: 222,249M - 198,980M = 23,269M yen ($157.48M)
So my super rough estimate of Sony first party game revenue (full games + addons) would be for this quarter:
- 1st party in PS: $157.48M+$59.4M=$216.88M
- 1st party off-PS: $171.41M
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Felessan
Member
Yeah, my bad, mixed different others.
Hudo
Member
You usually hold a keynote at a conference like this when you're introducing something new that you want to sell. And since Sony went out of the way to already announce the topic, they're probably either relaunching the Playstation Store or make it available to more platforms.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
Considering relaunching it doesn't make much sense given it's relatively functional (could definitely benefit from new key features tho, but you don't need a keynote presentation for that I'd think), it's probably the latter.
The latter would also fit with SIE's established MO, even going from the fireside chat, let alone what they've been outlining in previous fiscal calls. I'd guess it's PS Store to PC and, well.....good luck if it's going to be 1:1 unchanged from console (and without much of the 3P releases the store has on PS consoles). You either go balls-out and compete on features or you fail in the face of Steam, it's that simple.
And if they're going to put that effort into a PC launcher, they should also bring those new features to the console version. Else that's just more bleed of console users to PC (even if it's to your own storefront, which at least in that case is a lateral transfer/conversion...at least for 1P games).
Tiago Rodrigues
Member
Yall really think Sony will announce a pc store on a random panel on TGS?
Sony releasing a storefront for pc would be suicide. Unless they still release on Steam of course.
Sony releasing a storefront for pc would be suicide. Unless they still release on Steam of course.
Hector Hall
Member
I dont think so, the income outside PS has been decreasing and decreasing, probably in one year with Helldivers 2 on Xbox and Marathon everywhere it will be higher, but percentage wise it will remain the same, this quarter there simply wasn't any first party game released outside MLBA The Show and thats multi.
yurinka
Member
Not -enterely- true: it's in a growing trend since the PC push started in 2019.
It kept growing every single year with a huge CAGR and had a huge peak in Q4FY23 due to the record Helldivers 2 release disrupted the trend. Obviously after it went back a bit to normaly recovering from the record peak, but still continues in growth trend.
Before reporting first party off-PS revenue they shown this PC specific data in one of their fiscal reports (please notice FY23 is an estimate):
This graph counts Bungie since the moment its acquisition was completed.
As they started to release MLB in other consoles and acquired Bungie, they started to report instead their off-PS (nonPS consoles+PC+mobile) first party game revenue as 'other software' in their fiscal reports instead of a PC specific graph:
- FY22 67,725M yen ($458.22M) *
- FY23 105,358M yen ($712.80M)
- FY24 96,425M yen ($652.47M)
* = Here Bungie is counted for the whole fiscal year and not only in PC
We know they are working in a PC store/launcher, but I think will be formally announced later, once they have a bigger PC lineup and userbase.
Maybe to say that in the next gen buying a game in PSN once you'll be able to play them in the PS5+PS6 home consoles, PS6 portable console, their PC PSN store or in mobile via cloud gaming thanks to crossbuy.
This talk is supposed to be about the history of the PS Store and how it impacted the gaming industry, so I think will focus on its present and specially past. Regarding the future, other than hinting again that they have plans to expand to PC and mobile I think he won't share details.
Sony first party games apparently generate roughly almost the same outside of PS than in PS. If a portion of that gets the extra 20-30% they new pay to Steam would be a significant increase.
The increase would be higher specially if they also -make sure they'll do it- include 3rd party games in their PC PSN store.
I assume ideally for them they'd have a -maybe transitional time- where they'd continue releasing their PC titles in Steam but with the current delay they have now versus the PS5 games regarding the tentpole titles. All games including tentpole would release day one in the PC PSN store, because in case it would be the same PSN than in PS (full crossplay, crossbuy, trophy list, chat etc).
Depending on the progress, after a few years of transition they could stop releasing new games on Steam or Epic Store and would stop selling the previously available ones there for further competition in PC (which remember, would include PC handhelds/consolized PCs including the ones with an Xbox sticker on it).
Assuming console PSN maybe gets 10-20M extra MAU compared to now in the next gen as Xbox refugees plus just continuing the current growth, the PC PSN only would need to add on top a few million MAU, pretty likely half a dozen or less to push PSN to have a bigger active userbase than Steam, becoming the largest AAA game store/ecosystem in all platforms.
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playbignbox
Member
At least in my country, this shit store sells third-party and indie games more expensively than any other (including the Nintendo eShop, when the game is released simultaneously). I have nothing to celebrate about its 20th anniversary, and if it comes out on PC, it will be hilarious.
asdasdasdbb
Member
Continuing to release their games on PC, especially once XBoxPC arrives, is suicide.
I could see the PC Store being an experiment. Because if using a seperate launcher is that big of a barrier, that might be enough to convince those within Sony who want to do Day 1 that it's a bad idea.
awwr999999
Member
Have you ever stumbled onto an arcade game that you've never heard of and just played it?
Hands-on gameplay is the fastest way to form an accurate opinion of a video game.
Rich people do this thing where they buy games based solely on box art and just plow through them until they find one that they like.
"Discovering" a video game organically based on box art and hands-on gameplay adds to the gaming experience.
Normal people invest time into learning about games before they play them, forming opinions based on other people's opinions as opposed to organically forming their own.
A bad reviewer can turn millions of people away from a great game that they would have naturally enjoyed.
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March Climber
Member
Potentially yes, because their timing with new announcements doesn't always line up with summer or winter shows. They have revealed things around TGS before.
Depends on if it has crossbuy. If it does, that's the instant save. If the crossbuy is backwards compatible in some form (like some random PS4 game I bought years ago is now playable on Sony's PC launcher), that's even better.
I think they still might.
Hector Hall
Member
Not -enterely- true: it's in a growing trend since the PC push started in 2019.
It kept growing every single year with a huge CAGR and had a huge peak in Q4FY23 due to the record Helldivers 2 release disrupted the trend. Obviously after it went back a bit to normaly recovering from the record peak, but still continues in growth trend.
Before reporting first party off-PS revenue they shown this PC specific data in one of their fiscal reports (please notice FY23 is an estimate):
This graph counts Bungie since the moment its acquisition was completed.
As they started to release MLB in other consoles and acquired Bungie, they started to report instead their off-PS (nonPS consoles+PC+mobile) first party game revenue as 'other software' in their fiscal reports instead of a PC specific graph:
- FY22 67,725M yen ($458.22M) *
- FY23 105,358M yen ($712.80M)
- FY24 96,425M yen ($652.47M)
* = Here Bungie is counted for the whole fiscal year and not only in PC
We know they are working in a PC store/launcher, but I think will be formally announced later, once they have a bigger PC lineup and userbase.
Maybe to say that in the next gen buying a game in PSN once you'll be able to play them in the PS5+PS6 home consoles, PS6 portable console, their PC PSN store or in mobile via cloud gaming thanks to crossbuy.
This talk is supposed to be about the history of the PS Store and how it impacted the gaming industry, so I think will focus on its present and specially past. Regarding the future, other than hinting again that they have plans to expand to PC and mobile I think he won't share details.
Sony first party games apparently generate roughly almost the same outside of PS than in PS. If a portion of that gets the extra 20-30% they new pay to Steam would be a significant increase.
The increase would be higher specially if they also -make sure they'll do it- include 3rd party games in their PC PSN store.
I assume ideally for them they'd have a -maybe transitional time- where they'd continue releasing their PC titles in Steam but with the current delay they have now versus the PS5 games regarding the tentpole titles. All games including tentpole would release day one in the PC PSN store, because in case it would be the same PSN than in PS (full crossplay, crossbuy, trophy list, chat etc).
Depending on the progress, after a few years of transition they could stop releasing new games on Steam or Epic Store and would stop selling the previously available ones there for further competition in PC (which remember, would include PC handhelds/consolized PCs including the ones with an Xbox sticker on it).
Assuming console PSN maybe gets 10-20M extra MAU compared to now in the next gen as Xbox refugees plus just continuing the current growth, the PC PSN only would need to add on top a few million MAU, pretty likely half a dozen or less to push PSN to have a bigger active userbase than Steam, becoming the largest AAA game store/ecosystem in all platforms.
Projections made in 2022 over 2023 aren't going to cut it, it's now down 4 quarters YOY even counting the Bungie stuff in Xbox, Lego Horizon on Switch etc.
It can bounce back again, sure, specially if Marathon is a success and Helldivers 2 sells in Xbox, but traditional SO first party games have rock bottomed and they don't have too much left to port. Astro Bot I think will remain exclusive and DS2 whenever it's ported it will be released by Kojima and other publisher as with DS1.
Note that if you remove the amount earned of Stellar Blade 2 million copies on PC, the whole of Other Software is amounting to very very little, those catalogue games simply aren't selling, just as MLBA keeps most of its sales in Playstation and not the ports on Xbox and Switch.
Astray
Member
That works when I'm <20.
I'm much older now and my gaming time is very limited with a LOT of competition for it. Some method is needed to separate the wheat from the chaff.
awwr999999
Member
Look up why Xbox was founded. Xbox isn't in gaming to make a profit it's in gaming to undercut PlayStation and bolster Microsoft/Windows/PC.
Hari Seldon
Member
If this store doesn't at a minimum have 1P crossbuy it is DOA. EA and Epic have much bigger PC franchises and they lost to Steam.
Durin
Member
One obvious feature would be cross-platform save support for games if they're going to do a launcher.
Zathalus
Member
Hah, bullshit.
CamHostage
Member
It's possible that they may make an announcement for something new, but it's also possible that this will be the dry, uneventful history lesson that it's on the schedule as being. Sony has plenty of history of just talking business at TGS, when I was a journo I recall the crapshoot of booking time on these talks, sometimes they'd have something to show like DualShock 3, other times it's just a long Powerpoint presentation. (One time, they did both; they had the boring biz talk, then scheduled another room time to show a few games.)
Sony TGS 2009 keynote
Sony Computer Entertainment president Kaz Hirai delivered his keynote address at the Tokyo Game Show today and spoke of…
www.eurogamer.net
Not in about a decade or more though. The last one which Sony put effort into was I believe TGS 2015.
TGS is a tough time to make an announcement which will matter outside of the Japanese market; it's close to Christmas and all the big title launches, if it's a long-time pre-hype announcement for a distant new 20XX product then it's also a bad time for that because all eyes are hopefully on product which needs to leap off shelves in 2 months, it's still not far enough away from E3 or CES or Gamescom for that matter to be a strategic time for announcements it's usually after several previews when it's a hands-on showing of say new hardware, and now PS Japan isn't even the epicenter of PlayStation (and Sony Corp likes CES if it has a brand-level announcement to make.)
I mean, tune in if you like, but I would not lose sleep over it hoping for megatons.
March Climber
Member
CamHostage
Apologies, to clarify a bit, I didn't mean reveal at TGS, I simply kept it at revealing around TGS.Sony likes to reveal things and bring up big changes around September or slightly later, for example the PS5 pro last year. TGS just happens to take place during that time.
I think if it weren't for the fact that Hideaki will be in the area during TGS, Sony probably would have had Herman reveal whatever Hideaki's (maybe) about to announce, during a September reveal stream or State of Play.