Support NeoGAF

[Hero of Spielberg]

Good idea to split up the Co-CEOs ...

 

[Gordon Fearman]

 

[nial]

We all bitch about DEI all the time but Phil Spencer and Herman Hulst failing upwards is typical of corporate America and a far bigger problem because these hacks run the studios and set the agenda at the top.

No accountability whatsoever for these men at the top while lowly workers are laid off like pawns and blamed on twitter for trash games that turn out that way because of poor leadership at the top.

Bitching over corporate America in a thread about changes pushed by top Sony Group management in Minato. I really can't with some of the high IQ takes here.

 

[SlimySnake]

Neither Herman Hulst nor Sony is American.

Such weird takes all around.

PlayStation hq was moved to America a few years ago. They are located in San Mateo California.

 

[nial]

PlayStation hq was moved to America a few years ago. They are located in San Mateo California.

No American is making these decisions, smoothbrain.

 

[RetroGamingUK]

So tldr

- A new position got created above Hulst

- Nishino promoted to that position

- Hulst effectively demoted

Its clear this generation that something has gone very wrong with the American gaming industry this past decade, pivoting back to Japan is the right move here.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

This happens in the corporate world frequently, I've seen it with my own eyes. Company hires two people to do the same job in the c-suite, it's basically an audition, one guy gets the job, the other guy leaves. People don't usually want to now work for the guy who has the job they wanted and half-had. You can say whatever you want, it's a demotion, I wouldn't be surprised if Concord was a big reason for this. Hulst will likely be gone in six months, executive recruiters are probably blowing up his LinkedIn.

Sorry, but I'm pretty sure the management structure over the roles of cooperative chief executive officers at a multinational gaming company owned by a Japaneae conglomerate is way more complex than what you believe.
In reality, upon Totoki becoming the CEO of Sony Group, he looked for a general CEO at SIE to basically replace his role of chairman. Hulst literally keeps having his role of CEO of the Studio Business Group, he will just need to report to a new superior at SIE, just like he had to report to another superior at SIE over the last 7 months (Totoki).

Would I be surprised if Hermen Hulst were to leave? No. Diffusion is right here that often when one person gets passed over for a job there is a tendency to leave. That doesn't mean a whole lot though.

Once again I think people like to push their own narratives when it comes to things like this. People overstate things with Concord, while simultaneously ignoring Helldivers 2, which they're now turning into a movie.

As I mentioned before, I think they were both auditioning for the chair and I think Nishino delivered a monster Q3 for the Platform Business Group.

• PS5 Pro launch
• Big Q3 PS5 sales, especially compared to Xbox
• PSVR2 sales looked pretty good on Amazon with the heavy discounting
• 30th Anniversary hardware sales sold out quickly
• Platform roadmap

Meanwhile, I think Herman has had less success. He gets a lot of credit for Helldivers 2 and Astro Bot, but I think you have a compilation of issues that popped up at the worst time for him

• Yes, Concord, but there were already concerns about Concord when Hermen was named co-ceo
• Fairgames has almost certainly been delayed for retooling
• Bend and Bluepoint games were canceled
• Issues/concerns around Bungie
• Neon Koi closed
• Poor launch of Until Dawn remake
• Underperformance of Lego Horizon and Horizon Zero Dawn Remaster
• Not his fault but the Horizon tv show not progressing at Netflix didn't help his transmedia strategy
• No showcase for the 30th anniversary of PlayStation, simply because games aren't ready
• Poor reception to some key titles like Ghost of Yotei and Intergalactic

So if you compare the track records since June, Nishino obviously looks considerably better. If you delay the decision until after Spider-Man 2 hits PC, TLOU Season 2 hits HBO, TLOUP2 hits PC, Until Dawn hits theaters in April, Ghost of Yotei releases, and Marathon releases, it could potentially look very different.

Moving forward, Nishino's going to be graded on the success of the PlayStation handheld, cloud gaming, PS+, and probably a PC Storefront, and maybe even VR.

I could envision the following platform roadmap

Summer 2025 - Wireless PSVR2
By the end of 2025 - Cloud Streaming on Android TV and Android phones
Holiday Season 2025 - PS5 Super Slim
Holiday Season 2026 - PlayStation Handheld
Holiday Season 2028 - PS6

I think if I'm right about this roadmap, it's why Nishino has been given the reigns so quickly. He needs to be empowered to deliver on these things and he needs to ensure that the Studio Business Group is lined up around his strategy.

If Hulst were to leave, I imagine Scott Rhode would be next up.

 

[Kacho]

We all bitch about DEI all the time but Phil Spencer and Herman Hulst failing upwards is typical of corporate America and a far bigger problem because these hacks run the studios and set the agenda at the top.

No accountability whatsoever for these men at the top while lowly workers are laid off like pawns and blamed on twitter for trash games that turn out that way because of poor leadership at the top.

Firewalk would have made woke live service slop regardless. Hulst just gave them a pat on the ass and a shit load of money.

 

[yogaflame]

Im sure there was a board election and Hulst got the vote of no confidence. It always comes down to a vote in corporate world.

 

[nial]

Meanwhile, I think Herman has had less success. He gets a lot of credit for Helldivers 2 and Astro Bot, but I think you have a compilation of issues that popped up at the worst time for him

• Yes, Concord, but there were already concerns about Concord when Hermen was named co-ceo
• Fairgames has almost certainly been delayed for retooling
• Bend and Bluepoint games were canceled
• Issues/concerns around Bungie
• Neon Koi closed

I think these are fair, the rest are kinda out of place.
Except for Bungie, he wasn't actually involved with them before June of last year, and he still had to deal with their whole production autonomy thing. If anything, they've been doing a pretty decent job evaluating the staff at Bungie and seeing what/who could be integrated within SIE.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I think these are fair, the rest are kinda out of place.
Except for Bungie, he wasn't actually involved with them before June of last year, and he still had to deal with their whole production autonomy thing. If anything, they've been doing a pretty decent job evaluating the staff at Bungie and seeing what/who could be integrated within SIE.

I think the lack of displaying Marathon means theyre struggling to deliver and they're pushing off a public showing. I think their decision while not Hermen's fault to focus on keeping Destiny 2 going rather than building Destiny 3 was a mistake. I think making Marathon this extraction shooter with no campaign mode and seemingly little reference to the original games is going to create an uphill battle. Again, not Hermen's fault, but at the end of the day he's holding the bag.

 

[nial]

I think the lack of displaying Marathon means theyre struggling to deliver and they're pushing off a public showing. I think their decision while not Hermen's fault to focus on keeping Destiny 2 going rather than building Destiny 3 was a mistake. I think making Marathon this extraction shooter with no campaign mode and seemingly little reference to the original games is going to create an uphill battle. Again, not Hermen's fault, but at the end of the day he's holding the bag.

I wonder if they could be showing it next month, though it won't be long before Bungie will have to report to PlayStation Studios management (Scott Rohde, in particular). I'll be waiting for that day.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

PlayStation hq was moved to America a few years ago. They are located in San Mateo California.

Fair enough, completely forgot about that.

That does explain a thing or two.

 

[nial]

Posting a recent favorite SIE trailer before going for today.

 

[saintjules]

Happy to see Hiroki Totoki getting promoted over his successful strategy of going multi-platforms. With his new position, we should see an even more aggressive push towards that strategy

This is a quote from February of LAST year FYI.

 

[diffusionx]

Sorry, but I'm pretty sure the management structure over the roles of cooperative chief executive officers at a multinational gaming company owned by a Japaneae conglomerate is way more complex than what you believe.
In reality, upon Totoki becoming the CEO of Sony Group, he looked for a general CEO at SIE to basically replace his role of chairman. Hulst literally keeps having his role of CEO of the Studio Business Group, he will just need to report to a new superior at SIE, just like he had to report to another superior at SIE over the last 7 months (Totoki).

 

[Rentahamster]

Let Shu run it.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

CONSEQUENCES!!!!

And look $5 BILLION. great minds think alike.

 

[Vroadstar]

This is a quote from February of LAST year FYI.

Don't bother. It's from Arthands. Naturally, expect nothing but pure Sony troll perfection. I mean, did you see his all threads?

As soon as he spots a Sony PlayStation, he can't help but don his clown mask. Classic!

 

[SkylineRKR]

Yeah hes obviously demoted. He has to report to Nishino while previously they were equal.

Normally when this happens you can bet their are on the way out. Not to mention he's effectively been demoted within 7 months after he started.

 

[Yoboman]

CONSEQUENCES!!!!

And look $5 BILLION. great minds think alike.

How'd we get to $5 billion

People just making up numbers now

 

[cormack12]

How'd we get to $5 billion

People just making up numbers now

That's how much Concord cost now

 

[SkylineRKR]

That's how much Concord cost now

Plus Bungie. And inflation.

Guys are making up numbers.

 

[Thief1987]

Don't bother. It's from Arthands. Naturally, expect nothing but pure Sony troll perfection. I mean, did you see his all threads?

As soon as he spots a Sony PlayStation, he can't help but don his clown mask. Classic!

Clowns tend to be funny though, this one is just pity and miserable

 

[Hypereides]

Funny how I've always been open to discuss anything with you, while you just decided to throw dumb hate over me instead, as if anyone gives a fuck, LOL.

Hate? I do it out of love, sweetcheeks.

Your moisty love for Hulsty outdoes me though.

 

[Yoboman]

Plus Bungie. And inflation.

Guys are making up numbers.

They actually lost $76 billion (PlayStation is an Xbox)

 

[salva]

I found footage from this article:

 

[DForce]

 

[Felessan]

Man if PlayStation goes full Japan I’m so in

You should be careful. Japan local market is like 90% live service games.

Hulst took that Horizon Online cancelation pretty hard, I guess.

It's not cancelled though?

3. GAAS

GaaS initiative as a whole probably a reason why he was put into position in the first place.

Plus Bungie. And inflation.
Guys are making up numbers.

Bungie still earns money

 

[Ashamam]

GaaS initiative as a whole probably a reason why he was put into position in the first place.

Probably? Doesn't mean they are entirely happy with the execution though.

Also that linked comment up the page that talks about a few mill less in compensation really needs a citation. Does anyone even know his renumeration has changed? I mean it's possible, either direct or in stock options, but seems like the OG poster threw a dart at a wall.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

CONSEQUENCES!!!!

And look $5 BILLION. great minds think alike.

Luke Stephens is such a grifter.

 

[Radical_3d]

Good morning GAF! What a nice day today, uh?

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Luke Stephens is such a grifter.

I would take someone like him instead of colt, jez or David Jaffe any day of the week.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

This happens in the corporate world frequently, I've seen it with my own eyes. Company hires two people to do the same job in the c-suite, it's basically an audition, one guy gets the job, the other guy leaves. People don't usually want to now work for the guy who has the job they wanted and half-had. You can say whatever you want, it's a demotion, I wouldn't be surprised if Concord was a big reason for this. Hulst will likely be gone in six months, executive recruiters are probably blowing up his LinkedIn.

I think Concord definitely plays a part into the leadership restructuring happening here.

Especially if the reports of Herman considering it "his baby" are true (maybe he was the one that pushed for purchasing the studio too? Not unlikely), to see it be the biggest snafu from SIE in several years software-wise doesn't look good for Herman considering his attachment to the game.

Neither Herman Hulst nor Sony is American.

Such weird takes all around.

SIE is headquartered in California, USA.

 

[kazuyamishima]

Q3 FY2024 results are in 2 weeks time.

So, are they doomed or ARE THEY DOOMED??

 

[yurinka]

Does this mean Horizon is over?

Hermen continues as SIE's CEO of Studio Business Group, in charge of the first party games and their adaptations. So will continue doing the same.

Nishino continues SIE's CEO of the Platform Business Group, in charge of hardware, services, accesories, 3rd party or marketing. So will continue doing the same.

The difference is that before, in addition to this both also had the title of co-CEOs of SIE and now only Nishino will have this.

Other than this, Totoki leaves the SIE Chairman position to become Sony Group CEO. Lin Tao moves from SIE's SVP of Finance to Sony Group CFO.

 

[Days like these...]

TL;Dr Does this mean they're exiting the hardware business?

 

[Fabieter]

So japan isnt fully on board with hulst as well. What a shocker with the shitty work he has done.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Q3 FY2024 results are in 2 weeks time.

So, are they doomed or ARE THEY DOOMED??

I'm expecting a very strong Q3, maybe not for the Pictures business though.

 

[laynelane]

Personally I don't have a problem with the live-service initiative existing. The problem is that SIE went about completely stupid, missed so many easy opportunities (Factions 2, Spiderman GAAS being the two big ones, no MLB on mobile being a runner-up), and put 1P studios on GAAS that had no business making GAAS and now might go the entire gen without a new major release because their GAAS got cancelled (Bend, Bluepoint).

So of course they'll continue the initiative; I just hope they go about it much smarter going forward. Guess we'll find out depending on how Fairgame$ and Marathon turn out, or what ways they keep up/expand on Helldivers 2.

I have some serious doubts about Fairgames$. Unless they shake up a lot of things, all the things people mocked in the reveal trailer, I think it's going to really struggle.

Agreed on their approach to GaaS too. I get why they went all in on it, but putting certain studios on now-cancelled titles shows a real lack of foresight. Concord showed a lack of that and oversight too. Makes me wonder if that particular failure caused the evaluations which resulted in the recent cancellations and, if so, I suspect those evaluations were done by people higher than Hulst in the food chain.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Posting a recent favorite SIE trailer before going for today.

Might have a new game to look into. Hope there's an English version.

I have some serious doubts about Fairgames$. Unless they shake up a lot of things, all the things people mocked in the reveal trailer, I think it's going to really struggle.

Agreed on their approach to GaaS too. I get why they went all in on it, but putting certain studios on now-cancelled titles shows a real lack of foresight. Concord showed a lack of that and oversight too. Makes me wonder if that particular failure caused the evaluations which resulted in the recent cancellations and, if so, I suspect those evaluations were done by people higher than Hulst in the food chain.

The funny thing about Fairgame$ is IIRC, it was announced for a Q1 2025 release but we've heard nothing of it since the reveal trailer. The best-case scenario there is, following Concord's disaster, they internally delayed the game to flesh out character designs to be sexier/cooler/more pronounced (I know it's not a hero shooter, but it'd help), tightened up any gameplay inconsistencies, got rid of any overt modern far-left political virtue-signaling (but don't add anti-woke virtue signaling in there either; just leave modern political & culture war crap out of it altogether) and, since it's going to PC Day 1 (maybe?), work out the PSN account linking issue with Steam so it's available in more regions at launch.

If they do all that, I don't think a delay would hurt and in fact would help the game. They also need to have a wider beta period, and be open to feedback from players in adjusting some parts of the gameplay & balance before officially launching it. Concord didn't have a large beta period and the first one was locked behind preordering customers only. That probably deterred people from checking out the open beta afterwards (that, and the game just not being that appealing).

Honestly, if ducks were in a row earlier, SIE would've never acquired Firewalk or done so for Concord. But I think part of the reason they rushed into doing it was because stupid shareholders were pressuring them to answer Microsoft buying ABK, and wanted to know what SIE were going to do if MS foreclosed COD on PlayStation (which they WERE considering at one point during 2022, hence those leaked redacted emails). Doesn't absolve Ryan & Hulst from making the mistake of acquiring them, but when a rival announces a M&A that wipes $20 billion in your market cap, I can understand why you might look at something like Concord and go "Yeah, that's worth buying".

I need to get some sleep ; let's see where this develops in 12 hours, see if any other details come out.

 

[Hero of Spielberg]

'The gaijin has been demoted, buy buy buy!'

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Hermen continues as SIE's CEO of Studio Business Group, in charge of the first party games and their adaptations. So will continue doing the same.

Nishino continues SIE's CEO of the Platform Business Group, in charge of hardware, services, accesories, 3rd party or marketing. So will continue doing the same.

The difference is that before, in addition to this both also had the title of co-CEOs of SIE and now only Nishino will have this.

Other than this, Totoki leaves the SIE Chairman position to become Sony Group CEO. Lin Tao moves from SIE's SVP of Finance to Sony Group CFO.

Sounds more like streamlining of corporate structure rather than a demotion for Hulst.
Having two Co-CEOs was a weird decision to begin with, imo.

 

[ArtHands]

Nope, Nishino is the console focused guy. With any luck, he will be the Trump of PlayStation Nation. Deporting PC and multiplatformism ASAP!

He already said he will be pursuing a more aggressive multi-platform strategy back then. He will be on releasing Playstation 1st party AAA games on non-Playstation console platforms here.

 

[EDMIX]

PlayStation hq was moved to America a few years ago. They are located in San Mateo California.

um.....you do know they always had one in America right? The first one in 1994 was in Foster City California

Capcom, Square, Nintendo etc have headquarters here too. They didn't "move to America" , they never left as their existence has been here for some time, like 1994 some time lol

Here is an interesting article about Nintendo's HQ's that have been in America over the years

https://www.acriticalhit.com/a-brief-tour-of-nintendo-of-americas-early-hq-locations/

Please note folks ,that doesn't mean they are not owned by Japan, it merely means a branch of them exist in the United States

I think Concord definitely plays a part into the leadership restructuring happening here.

Especially if the reports of Herman considering it "his baby" are true (maybe he was the one that pushed for purchasing the studio too? Not unlikely), to see it be the biggest snafu from SIE in several years software-wise doesn't look good for Herman considering his attachment to the game.



SIE is headquartered in California, USA.

the lolz, lets make this clear, almost every major publisher has some HQ in America

Sony is still Japanese

https://www.nintendo.com/us/about/?srsltid=AfmBOoq7CXo9RM4PcpQNUu94-dM65aARywfN8UcwSlaJxCnBLhcFk9ok

^ I guess Nintendo is now no longer Japanese lol Toyota also has headquarters in America too in Texas

So his comment that Sony isn't American is justified.

 

[awwr999999]

Man if PlayStation goes full Japan I’m so in

Need to make the return to 100% Japanese silicon and give PS6 a Sony CPU/GPU.

 

[Dirk Benedict]

Need to make the return to 100% Japanese silicon and give PS6 a Sony CPU/GPU.

I've that Japan has plans in place to start a fab(s) for chips, to the tune of 60+ Billion. <--Shigeru Ishiba, PM's plan which was announced sometime toward the end of last year.

 

[laynelane]

If they do all that, I don't think a delay would hurt and in fact would help the game. They also need to have a wider beta period, and be open to feedback from players in adjusting some parts of the gameplay & balance before officially launching it. Concord didn't have a large beta period and the first one was locked behind preordering customers only. That probably deterred people from checking out the open beta afterwards (that, and the game just not being that appealing).

That is so important and was a glaring issue with how Concord was handled - there was a lot of feed back from the beta and it was all pretty much ignored. I really noticed that and it begged the question - why give a venue for feed back and then completely ignore it? It's a waste of everyone's time.

Good night, have a nice sleep.

 

[Insanemaelstrom]

Wonder if the 3 ceos at insomniac is a similar deal. A temporary measure to select the best candidate to move the company forward. If both of these are successful we might see this repeat for other Sony studios

 

[awwr999999]

They've always been the same.

Not in terms of HW(CPU/GPU): PS1 and PS2 are Sony/Sony, PS3 is Sony/Nvidia while PS4 and PS5 are AMD/AMD.
PlayStation has literally never been less PlayStation.