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COMICS! April 2012 |OT| It's a new month? Already?!

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E

ElNarez

Banned
krypt0nian said:
I'm saying his comics are but the man himself is an out of touch kook. Making great art does not put you above people. Just like Frank Miller.

Not to mention a hypocrite with his use of the characters of great lit.
Click to expand...

Using public domain characters is not the same as if not outright stealing at least using a loophole to keep the rights to characters away from their creators and then proceeding to use these characters in derivative works against one of the creator's wishes while he is still alive. The creators of works that fell in the public domain got to enjoy the fruits of their labor to their fullest extent.

And just because you happen to disagree with him, he deserves to be screwed by DC? That's a fucked-up way to look at things to say the least.
 
K

krypt0nian

Banned
ElNarez said:
Using public domain characters is not the same as if not outright stealing at least using a loophole to keep the rights to characters away from their creators and then proceeding to use these characters in derivative works against one of the creator's wishes while he is still alive. The creators of works that fell in the public domain got to enjoy the fruits of their labor to their fullest extent.

And just because you happen to disagree with him, he deserves to be screwed by DC? That's a fucked-up way to look at things to say the least.
Click to expand...

He deserves to be screwed to the extent that he didn't read the contract. Just like anyone else who chooses that road.

And using the characters of someone else PD or not, is exactly the same. Especially the way Moore iniitially worded it. And then tried to back peddle out of so as not to look quite as much of a hypocrite.
 
M

Mistouze

user-friendly man-cashews
I understand the anger Moore feels, I feel sad when he tries to produce excuses of argument to justify it, but man... why didn't he read that contract for fuck's sake?
 
notworksafe

notworksafe

Member
MARVEL
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E

ElNarez

Banned
Mistouze said:
I understand the anger Moore feels, I feel sad when he tries to produce excuses of argument to justify it, but man... why didn't he read that contract for fuck's sake?
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He's not that stupid. I do believe both parties signed the contract in good faith. After all, it was made back when collected editions weren't as common a thing as they are today.

The real shameful part is, DC never tried to make things right when the success of Watchmen got out of control. Legally they're in the right, but this is as morally wrong as it gets.
 
L

LiQuid!

I proudly and openly admit to wishing death upon the mothers of people I don't like

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Uhm... I don't think I would eat a cereal called "Things"
 
N

NawidA

Banned
From Ed Brubaker
The main problem I have with this whole thing, is that the summer Watchmen was announced was the same summer that pros and fans rallied around Jack Kirby, it was the beginning of the “creators bill of rights” and many other things. And in that summer, DC touted Watchmen as a victory for creators rights.

They proclaimed that the creators would own it and have control, that this was a new era, not like what happened to Siegel and Shuster, to Kirby, to countless comics creators that came before. They were saying DC was better than the other publishers by giving this great deal to Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons.

Now it turns out, that’s not the case, and it’s just like all the others that came before, and they’re acting like they never said that.

I don’t care what’s in the contract, I don’t have any animosity for my friends and peers working on these books. And I totally understand why DC is doing it, and that they have the right to.

But I was there when they announced it, and I remember how they talked about it then, and say whatever you want about Marvel and Kirby, etc. But no one ever held up the Avengers as a victory for creators rights.
Click to expand...
 
N

NawidA

Banned
krypt0nian said:
So in essence, Ed is saying the Avengers were always a screw job so the movie is more of the same so it's ok.

Great. :)





And he is an out of touch kook. That's not upon unpopular opinion.

Any other points you'd like shot down?
Click to expand...
Nah, dude you're just silly.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
krypt0nian said:
He deserves to be screwed to the extent that he didn't read the contract. Just like anyone else who chooses that road.

And using the characters of someone else PD or not, is exactly the same. Especially the way Moore iniitially worded it. And then tried to back peddle out of so as not to look quite as much of a hypocrite.
Click to expand...

Exactly?

I don't 100% remember Jules Verne being told by Top Shelf Comics he'd always retain the rights to Nemo.
 
E

ElNarez

Banned
krypt0nian said:
And he is an out of touch kook. That's not upon unpopular opinion. Did I call you names? Why would I? All I know about you is that you jump in threads calling names.

Any other points you'd like shot down?
Click to expand...

Again, how does that matter? Why would that make it okay for him, or anyone who's crazy and out of touch, to get screwed? Why are you using this as an argument?
 
Tizoc

Tizoc

Member
Comixology is having a sale on the recent Transformers series-
http://www.comixology.com/Transformers-Sale/comics-collection/337
If you can handle the art for the first few books then you may enjoy it. The final chapters have some awesome Megatron moments.
...really hope they add Christopher Priest's B. Panther run, having read it some weeks ago I find it to be his magnum opis and showcasing what an amazing character Panther is (I still enjoy Hudlin's run, but will need to re-read it someday).
EDIT: A shame Last stand of the Wreckers isn't on sale, might've gotten more people to try it out. Regardless get this if you want some awesome and bloody (in robot terms) robot action.
 
Jedeye Sniv

Jedeye Sniv

Banned
parrotbeak said:
After reading Severed, I'll probably pick up AV next.

Not a vampire book but Severed is also by Scott Snyder and is very good.
Click to expand...

I read Severed in one sitting the other day and it was masterful. There was this one reveal in #6 that literally gave me goosebumps and made my skin crawl, it was so horrible! I don't think I've ever had that subtle feeling of terror mixed with revulsion in a comic before, I always admire when a team can make you feel a very specific emotion.
 
K

krypt0nian

Banned
ElNarez said:
Again, how does that matter? Why would that make it okay for him, or anyone who's crazy and out of touch, to get screwed? Why are you using this as an argument?
Click to expand...

Again, he didn't read the contract. Anyone that stupid gets what he signed on for. Good faith means too foolish to read the contract, which could have literally said anything for all he knew.

He has no one to blame except himself. Just like anyone else that goes in blind to a financial contract.


BenjaminBirdie said:
Exactly?

I don't 100% remember Jules Verne being told by Top Shelf Comics he'd always retain the rights to Nemo.
Click to expand...

From the terms he put forth yes. He claimed they were out of ideas and had put out crap comics since his holy Watchmen, which is 100% self-aggrandizing bullshit. Well I guess he was out of ideas when he used someone else's characters that already had their story told.

All he did was make excuses when confronted. Creators rights are a cop out, when the base of it was a hypocritical asshole statement of creative bankruptcy.

Semantics is all he has and plenty saw right through it. You can choose to boycott, but I'll buy the book with a smile. I respect creators actually doing work over someone putting his past work on some sort of pedestal anyday. Those creators he himself slammed saying that they'll never do work outside the industry, and even going so far as to not deign to call them creators at all, since they work on corporate properties.

You know like the hypocrite is doing with Supreme.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
krypt0nian said:
Again, he didn't read the contract. Anyone that stupid gets what he signed on for. Good faith means too foolish to read the contract, which could have literally said anything for all he knew.

He has no one to blame except himself. Just like anyone else that goes in blind to a financial contract.




From the terms he put forth yes. He claimed they were out of ideas and had put out crap comics since his holy Watchmen, which is 100% self-aggrandizing bullshit. Well I guess he was out of ideas when he used someone else's characters that already had their story told.

All he did was make excuses when confronted. Creators rights are a cop out, when the base of it was a hypocritical asshole statement of creative bankruptcy.

Semantics is all he has and plenty saw right through it. You can choose to boycott, but I'll buy the book with a smile. I respect creators actually doing work over someone putting his past work on some sort of pedestal anyday. Those creators he himself slammed saying that they'll never do work outside the industry, and even going so far as to not deign to call them creators at all, since they work on corporate properties.

You know like the hypocrite is doing with Supreme.
Click to expand...

He's not writing Supreme is he? Weren't those just lost scripts or something?

Anyway, I'm not boycotting anything out of some stance. I'm just not buying it because I think it's creatively bankrupt (the same reason I just realized there are no more DC books I read). But that's just personal taste.

And as far as creators "doing work," Moore has actively been writing comics his entire life.

LOEG Century 2009, in bookstores and your local comic shop this summer!
 
M

my name is ed

Banned
Moore being naive about the contract he signed doesn't really make it right. How many instances have there been of something similar in the music industry? Or in the movie industry? The line shouldn't be 'tough titty asshole!' The Beatles lost the masters of their stuff didn't they? It doesn't matter if the artist or creator is being an asshole or a totally adorable human being. Being 23, I wasn't around when (according to Brubaker) Watchmen was released and DC trumpeted the contract as a new step for creator's rights. The tune changed when Watchmen started making money. Its been over 20 years now, and he hasn't gotten back any part of those rights. He's got the money, but obviously he doesn't care about that.

I don't know why Kryptonian continuously brings up Alan Moore's character. The worst thing that dude has done is bash comics creators like an idiot. He's not racist, he's not Frank Miller. Even if he was, it still wouldn't matter.

also, what Supreme stuff are y'all talking about? Is there something outside the stuff he did in the 90s?
 
H

Haemolacria

Member
Jedeye Sniv said:
I read Severed in one sitting the other day and it was masterful. There was this one reveal in #6 that literally gave me goosebumps and made my skin crawl, it was so horrible! I don't think I've ever had that subtle feeling of terror mixed with revulsion in a comic before, I always admire when a team can make you feel a very specific emotion.
Click to expand...

I read the first issue of Severed when it came out but wasn't really "feeling it" and didn't read any further. After reading this comment, I became convinced enough to order that collection :D
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
my name is ed said:
Moore being naive about the contract he signed doesn't really make it right. How many instances have there been of something similar in the music industry? Or in the movie industry? The line shouldn't be 'tough titty asshole!' The Beatles lost the masters of their stuff didn't they? It doesn't matter if the artist or creator is being an asshole or a totally adorable human being. Being 23, I wasn't around when (according to Brubaker) Watchmen was released and DC trumpeted the contract as a new step for creator's rights. The tune changed when Watchmen started making money. Its been over 20 years now, and he hasn't gotten back any part of those rights. He's got the money, but obviously he doesn't care about that.

I don't know why Kryptonian continuously brings up Alan Moore's character. The worst thing that dude has done is bash comics creators like an idiot. He's not racist, he's not Frank Miller. Even if he was, it still wouldn't matter.

also, what Supreme stuff are y'all talking about? Is there something outside the stuff he did in the 90s?
Click to expand...

They just did two issues he wrote with art by Erik Larsen. I'm assuming they're scripts that were never published.

And I totally agree. For me, character is a really thin reasoning, but people have hated shit for less.
 
P

parrotbeak

Member
Jedeye Sniv said:
I read Severed in one sitting the other day and it was masterful. There was this one reveal in #6 that literally gave me goosebumps and made my skin crawl, it was so horrible! I don't think I've ever had that subtle feeling of terror mixed with revulsion in a comic before, I always admire when a team can make you feel a very specific emotion.
Click to expand...
Ya, I read it in one sitting too. I'm not all that into the time period and my interest in horror has been fading in the last few years. It's just a great book.

Haemolacria said:
I read the first issue of Severed when it came out but wasn't really "feeling it" and didn't read any further. After reading this comment, I became convinced enough to order that collection :D
Click to expand...
It does start off a bit hokey with the opening--I always feel like I want to know what's going to happen right now, I don't want to go back 50 years to see the background. But it had such high praise, I just trusted the writers to take me on the journey. And they did. Great storytelling. Except for that initial stumble I had with it in the beginning, I saw no flaws. And the beginning works out in the end so it wasn't really a flaw in the first place.
 
O

Owzers

Member
Batwing tpb vol 1 $7.50
Defenders tpb vol 1 Fraction $10.99
Incognito OHC collection $22.99
Incredible Hulk Aaron OHC #1-7 $17.99, may include digital copy

What would you get out of here if you liked money and were trying to cut back ( DCBS special prices, mostly half off)?

I've only read the first issue of Defenders which was iffy, but i hear it got a lot better with #4 on and i want to start buying it monthly at #7 due to digital codes being included.

I also read the first Incognito trade and thought it was pretty good but ended up selling the tpb, not sure if the second volume would be worth buying the whole thing.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
sillymonkey321 said:
Batwing tpb vol 1 $7.50
Defenders tpb vol 1 Fraction $10.99
Incognito OHC collection $22.99
Incredible Hulk Aaron OHC #1-7 $17.99, may include digital copy

What would you get out of here if you liked money and were trying to cut back ( DCBS special prices, mostly half off)?

I've only read the first issue of Defenders which was iffy, but i hear it got a lot better with #4 on and i want to start buying it monthly at #7 due to digital codes being included.

I also read the first Incognito trade and thought it was pretty good but ended up selling the tpb, not sure if the second volume would be worth buying the whole thing.
Click to expand...

Defenders and Incognito are the top picks there. Hulk is amazing fun stuff but the art is terrible. Batwing is a DC book.
 
V

ViewtifulJC

Banned
I dropped Hulk, but I'm picking it up again next issue for the "Stay Angry" story arc. It sounds like Crank, starring the Hulk, where he has to do crazy, over-the-wall MU shit to stay mad and fueled up. Series of one-shots with different artists like Dillion and Ferry, and it's the Hulk battling gangsters in Mexico with the Hulk, or fighting monsters in the Savage Land led by Kraven the Hunter. Sounds wacky, the kind of crazy I had hoped to see from Jason Aaron.
 
T

tm24

Member
ViewtifulJC said:
I actually rather have it broken up into 7 nice trades then 60+ issues in one stupidly huge collection.
Click to expand...

Especially since DC sucks at hugeass collections. The new TT omni is a significant improvement, but still doesn't match the work Marvel puts into those things
 
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