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COMICS!!! |OT| February 2017 All You Need is Love (and Rockets)

That is not the entire arc though if you are thinking about the hero's journey in a classical sense

The hero's willingness to give her life is what makes her worthy of resurrection. This is a hero's journey, certainly...dying heroically and being reborn are key components of these stories.
And that's a fair point. Her getting resurrected by Mjolnir would be powerful (given the recent revelations about its origin and abilities), but I do fully believe her death has to happen. Resurrection or not. I mean, otherwise what's gonna happen to Ultimate Mjolnir?
 
And that's a fair point. Her getting resurrected by Mjolnir would be powerful (given the recent revelations about its origin and abilities), but I do fully believe her death has to happen. Resurrection or not. I mean, otherwise what's gonna happen to Ultimate Mjolnir?

Yeah I misspoke somewhat as I agree she must die, I just firmly believe she will then come back, and not in a three years later kind of way, probably in the same arc that kills her or perhaps even the same issue
 

caliph95

Member
I know i's comics but she either has to die or be bedridden or the whole cancer would be pointless even if they resurrect her at least pretend the cancer matters.
 
I know i's comics but she either has to die or be bedridden or the whole cancer would be pointless even if they resurrect her at least pretend the cancer matters.

It will matter and matters even now. Already she has walked away from magic cures and refused to let her chemo help her; every time she becomes Thor she rejects her self in a powerful way
 

Sandfox

Member
What should I pick up from the Image Comixology sale? The only books I'm reading right now are Saga, Paper Girls, I Hate Fairyland, and Wayward.
 
I'll never understand why people don't want more diversity in comics. Even looking at it from a shallower perspective, more types of people = wider variety of characters = a wider array of stories. Some of these stories would never have been told before today. Why do they want the same recycled storylines over and over again? I'm actually upset Odinson is getting a Mjolnir before Jane dies. Uru arm having, War Goat riding, Celestial-killing axe wielding, bearded Thor js the best.

Because comics readers fear changes from the status quo. They want the illusion of change, not actual evolution.

See any character shift.
 
Yeah I misspoke somewhat as I agree she must die, I just firmly believe she will then come back, and not in a three years later kind of way, probably in the same arc that kills her or perhaps even the same issue
I'd support that.
It will matter and matters even now. Already she has walked away from magic cures and refused to let her chemo help her; every time she becomes Thor she rejects her self in a powerful way
Can we all just appreciate that it's the best thing to happen to Jane in, oh, ever?
Because comics readers fear changes from the status quo. They want the illusion of change, not actual evolution.

See any character shift.
Supports the stereotype of a bunch of psychologically stunted man-children.
 
It really depends on the person because some people solely hate Jane because she is a woman, while others had their favorite characters taken out of the spotlight and are upset over that.

This is my view on people's dislike of Marvel's diversity push. Ex. people will rage for eternity over Iceman turning gay (not that his "outing" doesn't deserve to be mocked forever) but either don't care/actively like gay characters getting their own books like Midnighter and Batwoman. As another DC example, nobody gets upset at New Superman, Jessica, or Simon Baz while getting angry when a Marvel staple gets replaced by a brand new character. Of course the flipside is that DC's line-up is less diverse (I don't actually have the facts to back this up, but it seems pretty obvious) but they don't draw 1% of the ire Marvel does.

You also need to factor in the general angry racist/sexist nerd crowd i.e. people who don't actually read comics getting mad at diversity pushes. Marvel screams from the top of their lungs whenever a big diversity push happens so people react more strongly (if Marvel was releasing a solo book focused on a Lesbian it would be a big deal, meanwhile DC is like "yup, here's Batwoman"). I don't doubt that there are people attacking comic book writers on Twitter that don't actually know that the current Green Lanterns on the Justice League are a Latina and a Muslim.

This is just the opinion of a fairly new comics reader that is fine with diversity in comics and just wants good stories to read. Not calling out anyone in this thread (I don't think this has actually happened in this thread, more so in the OT) but I do think there's a tendency to call everyone on the opposing side a racist/sexist when there may be legitimate criticisms of a character being swapped for a new character who happens to be of a different race/gender. The thread about the rumor of Michelle = MJ in the new Spider-Man movie is a good example of this. (For the record, I actually want Michelle to be an original character because I think it would be interesting to see Peter with a new character after two movie series focusing on MJ and Gwen respectively).

Also I wanted to say that it's pretty funny thinking about how while Marvel is trying to create their own Wonder Woman (iconic woman hero) in Captain Marvel, DC is trying to create their own Black Panther (iconic black hero) in Cyborg. Only DC has kinda accepted that nobody will ever give a shit about Cyborg while Marvel will never stop pushing Captain Marvel.
 
Midnighter by Steve Orlando deserves and OHC. The DCYou series plus Midnighter and Apollo

Midnighter also deserves a 100+ issue ongoing. If there's one thing I want to return from the old days, it's long-ass runs. I'm talking multiple-omnibus runs.

Also the Big Two need to really commit to change. Like, really commit.
 

Sandfox

Member
I just noticed that I Hate Fairlyland is getting a price increase when it returns.

This is my view on people's dislike of Marvel's diversity push. Ex. people will rage for eternity over Iceman turning gay (not that his "outing" doesn't deserve to be mocked forever) but either don't care/actively like gay characters getting their own books like Midnighter and Batwoman. As another DC example, nobody gets upset at New Superman, Jessica, or Simon Baz while getting angry when a Marvel staple gets replaced by a brand new character. Of course the flipside is that DC's line-up is less diverse (I don't actually have the facts to back this up, but it seems pretty obvious) but they don't draw 1% of the ire Marvel does.

You also need to factor in the general angry racist/sexist nerd crowd i.e. people who don't actually read comics getting mad at diversity pushes. Marvel screams from the top of their lungs whenever a big diversity push happens so people react more strongly (if Marvel was releasing a solo book focused on a Lesbian it would be a big deal, meanwhile DC is like "yup, here's Batwoman"). I don't doubt that there are people attacking comic book writers on Twitter that don't actually know that the current Green Lanterns on the Justice League are a Latina and a Muslim.

This is just the opinion of a fairly new comics reader that is fine with diversity in comics and just wants good stories to read. Not calling out anyone in this thread (I don't think this has actually happened in this thread, more so in the OT) but I do think there's a tendency to call everyone on the opposing side a racist/sexist when there may be legitimate criticisms of a character being swapped for a new character who happens to be of a different race/gender. The thread about the rumor of Michelle = MJ in the new Spider-Man movie is a good example of this. (For the record, I actually want Michelle to be an original character because I think it would be interesting to see Peter with a new character after two movie series focusing on MJ and Gwen respectively).

Also I wanted to say that it's pretty funny thinking about how while Marvel is trying to create their own Wonder Woman (iconic woman hero) in Captain Marvel, DC is trying to create their own Black Panther (iconic black hero) in Cyborg. Only DC has kinda accepted that nobody will ever give a shit about Cyborg while Marvel will never stop pushing Captain Marvel.
Things will probably be a bit better if the rumors are true.
 
Can we all just appreciate that it's the best thing to happen to Jane in, oh, ever?

uCeTT6e.jpg
 
Supports the stereotype of a bunch of psychologically stunted man-children.

Yeah, to a point.

Basically, a number of changes we love now? Looking back fans hated them.

Ben Reilly is a great example. People haaaaaaaaaaaaaaated Ben, until he was gone. Rhodes replacing Tony. AzBats.

It's also why the number of breakout new characters is rather small: Deadpool, Harley Quinn, Ms. Marvel.

This is my view on people's dislike of Marvel's diversity push. Ex. people will rage for eternity over Iceman turning gay (not that his "outing" doesn't deserve to be mocked forever) but either don't care/actively like gay characters getting their own books like Midnighter and Batwoman. As another DC example, nobody gets upset at New Superman, Jessica, or Simon Baz while getting angry when a Marvel staple gets replaced by a brand new character. Of course the flipside is that DC's line-up is less diverse (I don't actually have the facts to back this up, but it seems pretty obvious) but they don't draw 1% of the ire Marvel does.

DC had its own issues during New 52. The hate over New 52 Superman for example was amazing. There's no reason to hate the others when you feel the core is broken.

This is just the opinion of a fairly new comics reader that is fine with diversity in comics and just wants good stories to read. Not calling out anyone in this thread (I don't think this has actually happened in this thread, more so in the OT) but I do think there's a tendency to call everyone on the opposing side a racist/sexist when there may be legitimate criticisms of a character being swapped for a new character who happens to be of a different race/gender. The thread about the rumor of Michelle = MJ in the new Spider-Man movie is a good example of this. (For the record, I actually want Michelle to be an original character because I think it would be interesting to see Peter with a new character after two movie series focusing on MJ and Gwen respectively).

When it comes to an adaptation, the argument is largely guff, given the wide variety of changes already made. Scarlet Witch in the movies is little like Scarlet Witch in the comics, but the ire only comes from race changes.

Also I wanted to say that it's pretty funny thinking about how while Marvel is trying to create their own Wonder Woman (iconic woman hero) in Captain Marvel, DC is trying to create their own Black Panther (iconic black hero) in Cyborg. Only DC has kinda accepted that nobody will ever give a shit about Cyborg while Marvel will never stop pushing Captain Marvel.

Eh? Cyborg is in the films, on the current Justice League, and on his second volume in two years. He's absolutely getting the same push.
 
Yeah, to a point.

Basically, a number of changes we love now? Looking back fans hated them.

Ben Reilly is a great example. People haaaaaaaaaaaaaaated Ben, until he was gone. Rhodes replacing Tony. AzBats.

It's also why the number of breakout new characters is rather small: Deadpool, Harley Quinn, Ms. Marvel.

So true, I was around for most of those changes and god people hated them as they were actually happening. Ben fucking Reilly, blows my mind how popular he is now. Spider-Man fans were out for blood
 
Yeah, to a point.

Basically, a number of changes we love now? Looking back fans hated them.

Ben Reilly is a great example. People haaaaaaaaaaaaaaated Ben, until he was gone. Rhodes replacing Tony. AzBats.

It's also why the number of breakout new characters is rather small: Deadpool, Harley Quinn, Ms. Marvel.
I can understand some changes being disliked (never hated). I haven't seen a single soul praise AzBats even in retrospect. It just that it feels like every. Single. One. And it doesn't help that they are all changes to increase diversity.
 
I can understand some changes being disliked (never hated). I haven't seen a single soul praise AzBats even in retrospect. It just that it feels like every. Single. One. And it doesn't help that they are all changes to increase diversity.

Not AzBats in particular, but Azreal's profile overall grew far larger for being Batman than it was otherwise. Jean Paul Valley isn't really all that great a character, but people could not let him go.
 
Wow IST already delisted war of kings aftermath omni. Amazon hasnt even released it due to the whole 1 week hold thing but never seen one delist that fast. Wonder if they got less copies than usual.
 
So that whole Cosmic Marvel stretch is collected in 5 omnibuses - $625 at full price. Pretty decent series but not worth that much...


Wow IST already delisted war of kings aftermath omni. Amazon hasnt even released it due to the whole 1 week hold thing but never seen one delist that fast. Wonder if they got less copies than usual.

You mean realm of kings? I understand IST is expecting a restock but it could take a few weeks.
 
Not AzBats in particular, but Azreal's profile overall grew far larger for being Batman than it was otherwise. Jean Paul Valley isn't really all that great a character, but people could not let him go.
Interesting. I read some of the issues of his run (back when all the comics I got my hands on were random pick ups from antique shops and magazine aisles) and it seemed like an interesting idea: brutal killer has to learn to take it back a notch (SpOck). But god that costume is awful. It's also fun to read Chuck Dixon trash him (I'm reading Dixon's Robin run as it's being traded)
Nick Spencer is throwing shade at Rebirth on twitter lol.
Oh god why?
 

Sandfox

Member
Interesting. I read some of the issues of his run (back when all the comics I got my hands on were random pick ups from antique shops and magazine aisles) and it seemed like an interesting idea: brutal killer has to learn to take it back a notch (SpOck). But god that costume is awful. It's also fun to read Chuck Dixon trash him (I'm reading Dixon's Robin run as it's being traded)

Oh god why?

I'm pretty sure he has been against the idea/concept of Rebirth from the beginning.
 
So that whole Cosmic Marvel stretch is collected in 5 omnibuses - $625 at full price. Pretty decent series but not worth that much...




You mean realm of kings? I understand IST is expecting a restock but it could take a few weeks.

Yeah. I got my order in already ao Im good. 625 is a lot but I guess Im at 312.5 since grabbed them all at 50% off. Well more if I include the Infinity Gauntlet omni...plus side is if I decide to sell Ill make a good chunk back off Annihilation and Infinity Gauntlet alone.
 

caliph95

Member
Honestly after the shit he got for the Nazi punch and Hydracap, and the Sjw shit he is probably numb to any additional shit he is going to get.
 
We've had 75 year of Bruce Wayne Batman. 55 years of Tony Stark Iron Man. 55 years of Odinson Thor. Maybe we should try out something new... #NOTMYTHOR
 

Sandfox

Member
What did he do?
He had Sam attend a gay pride parade and got crap over that. in 2015 Fox News got upset because Spencer had a group of white supremacist as villians in Captain America and they confused the group with themselves and their audience
 

caliph95

Member
He had Sam attend a gay pride parade and got crap over that. in 2015 Fox News got upset because Spencer had a group of white supremacist as villians in Captain America and they confused the group with themselves and their audience

Oh right forgot about that shit.

t's always funny when people who don't read comic books complain about something that happen in comics without any context. Like the gay green lantern thing
 
What should I pick up from the Image Comixology sale? The only books I'm reading right now are Saga, Paper Girls, I Hate Fairyland, and Wayward.

Kill or Be Killed and The Fix are both good.

I like Snotgirl a lot too but I dunno how everyone else feels anymore. But Leslie Hung's art is amazingly pretty and I like the emphasis on blogging culture and shit. It's good fun.
 
He had Sam attend a gay pride parade and got crap over that. in 2015 Fox News got upset because Spencer had a group of white supremacist as villians in Captain America and they confused the group with themselves and their audience
I would say that identifying with a KKK stand-in that's had a long history in comics is probably not the best for almost half of the US' major political parties, but given where we are now I'd also say it's a moot point.
 
When it comes to an adaptation, the argument is largely guff, given the wide variety of changes already made. Scarlet Witch in the movies is little like Scarlet Witch in the comics, but the ire only comes from race changes.

You're right, I definitely underplayed the impact of race changes on characters. I can't imagine the reaction to the rumor would have been nearly as huge if she was white. But something about the left's reaction to Michelle ?= MJ peeved me more than any other reaction I'd seen to race/gender changes in characters. I think there was a general reduction of the argument against people who didn't want a quiet/antisocial MJ to them just being racist, though that's more a result of the internet being a shitty place to have arguments with strangers.

I will say I'm more concerned about the film pulling the "'ugly' girl suddenly becomes beautiful with make-up/better clothes" with Michelle which is extremely problematic even though the rest of the movie is extremely diverse.

Eh? Cyborg is in the films, on the current Justice League, and on his second volume in two years. He's absolutely getting the same push.

I suppose Carol's push is just more obvious due to Marvel's general editorial direction with like 4(?) relaunches in the last few years. I don't see DC ever trying creating some kind of wide-line event where it turns out that Cyborg is the winner and also totally right (at least I think that happened, I haven't touched CWII).
 
I will say I'm more concerned about the film pulling the "'ugly' girl suddenly becomes beautiful with make-up/better clothes" with Michelle which is extremely problematic even though the rest of the movie is extremely diverse.

I think that's more a side-effect of them pulling more from the Ultimate side of the pond. People forget she was much closer to Peter's nerd side than her 616 counterpart.


I suppose Carol's push is just more obvious due to Marvel's general editorial direction with like 4(?) relaunches in the last few years. I don't see DC ever trying creating some kind of wide-line event where it turns out that Cyborg is the winner and also totally right (at least I think that happened, I haven't touched CWII).

Carol has had more series in a shorter period of time, but the beginnings of their push was around the same. Captain Marvel Vol 7 #1 was September 2012 (yep, volume #7, Captain Marvel has never done well). Justice League #1 was 2011.

I understand why both are being pushed, even though they've been unsuccessful for different reasons.

I caught up with JL rebirth... I don't know why I did tbh it's kinda mediocre.

It's just sort of there.
 
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