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[ReplacementPelican]

he puts on his behavior must not know the people I know or suffer the temptations I face

Sure fam, sure.

Seriously, these people are more delusional fucks than anything. 'Yeah man, I go on a lunch with a woman and she's just thirsty as shit, better to just stay away. They can't control themselves.'

Ah well, idiots.

new one, women = ice cream

THERES A THING CALLED CONSENT.

Are they all potential rapists?

... Ah, okay then. I'm convinced.

Like, I can't believe this guy actually thought this was a decent analogy. A better one is, why not just remove that tree or a talking snake from the garden? Seems dumb as shit to just leave it there, with the temptation and all. Almost as though there may be an ironic Christian moral here.

 

[kinggroin]

I don't see the problem here and I cant stand the guy.

Not everyone is well adjusted, and a lot of religious folk are followers because they need that counter balance to a deep seeded problem.

Pence knows himself better than anyone I imagine, so if the guy feels this is necessary, then it's necessary. He could have self control issues.


That said, more fuel for the scathing fire that is, "Why the hell is he in Congress, let alone the vice president to begin with "

 

[Phoenix RISING]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

 

[crisdecuba]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

Id say standard for *some* groups of christians, because in my adult life I haven't come across the strict application aside from one of my social circles (specifically a conservative Chinese Christian church). And it's not a practice limited to men. It's not how I roll by any stretch, but it's not outrage inducing.

 

[neorej]

We're both hungry. That's a pretty good reason to get some food.

 

[kinoki]

We're both hungry. That's a pretty good reason to get some food.

As a married man who occasionally dine out with women I'm not married to I can attest to that this reason is adequate.

 

[karasu]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

My dad and a couple of uncles, from both side of my family, were preachers and I've never heard of shit like this.

 

[kinggroin]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

Lots of people, period. Ain't just christians.


Some may do it broader as a general rule, some have specific people the rules apply to. And it's across genders.


I'd still argue though that there are skeletons tucked away, that drive these decisions however.

 

[pirateluigi]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

When I was a kid, my Christian church liked to preach about how interracial relationships were dangerous. More recently it's about how gay relationships are evil.

Standard practice among Christians definitely shouldn't preclude criticism.

 

[crisdecuba]

My dad and a couple of uncles, from both side of my family, were preachers and I've never heard of shit like this.

My reply right below his:

Id say standard for *some* groups of christians, because in my adult life I haven't come across the strict application aside from one of my social circles (specifically a conservative Chinese Christian church). And it's not a practice limited to men. It's not how I roll by any stretch, but it's not outrage inducing.

Also, see the post right below yours.

 

[ChryZ]

Fundamentalism, oh no. The christian taliban perplexes me as much as the islamic one.

 

[Kurdel]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

It just that in 2017 it's seems like an retrograde way to view men/women interactions.

Not all women want to ride your dick, and not all men are hoping to score after sharing a meal.

 

[ManDudeChild]

We're both hungry. That's a pretty good reason to get some food.

Hungry for what? You heathen!

 

[legend166]

Fundamentalism, oh no. The christian taliban perplexes me as much as the islamic one.

Yeah, this is definitely the same as beheading converts.

 

[nynt9]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

We shouldn't be ok with misogyny just because religion promotes it.

 

[The Lamp]

We shouldn't be ok with misogyny just because religion promotes it.

Misogyny? Do you realize in these standards that women are usually asked to behave the same way because it's believed the temptation can go either way? Not dine with men who aren't their husband in private?

 

[thecouncil]

We're both hungry. That's a pretty good reason to get some food.

Also, probably the same reason for a married person to go out for a meal alone with a member of the same sex, I'd imagine.

 

[David Incorporated Esq.]

Misogyny? Do you realize in these standards that women are usually asked to behave the same way because it's believed the temptation can go either way? Not dine with men who aren't their husband in private?

You're not supposed to dine with the other sex because:

a) If you're a man, you're messing with another man's property, or
b) If you're a woman, you're letting another man take advantage of your husband's property (you).

Edit: These are old, old standards, and they're based on the concept of women being the property of their husbands or fathers.

 

[The Lamp]

You're not supposed to dine with the other sex because:

a) If you're a man, you're messing with another man's property, or
b) If you're a woman, you're letting another man take advantage of your husband's property (you).

Edit: These are old, old standards, and they're based on the concept of women being the property of their husbands or fathers.

Never ever heard it that way and I grew up in this culture and churches for 2 decades in Texas. It was always that you didn't want to be tempted into lustful thoughts or activities with someone who isn't your spouse, regardless of sex, and had nothing to do with being the property of a man so much as both spouses being exclusive to each other.

 

[ChryZ]

Yeah, this is definitely the same as beheading converts.

Give them a few years, they'll get there.

 

[pirateluigi]

Misogyny? Do you realize in these standards that women are usually asked to behave the same way because it's believed the temptation can go either way? Not dine with men who aren't their husband in private?

It's mysogony unless he refuses to do one on one dinner with anyone. Specifically excluding women is very much mysogony.

Imagine your boss takes every person on their team out to a one on one dinner to get to know them better. Now imagine he will only take his male employees.

Or if he'll show up at a social gathering with his male employees where alcohol is served, but refuses to go if a female employee is there.

He needs to schedule an important business trip that involves a week of travel. But he will only consider bringing his male employees because he can't be alone with a female employee.

Now extrapolate that up to the Vice President.

 

[The Lamp]

It's mysogony unless he refuses to do one on one dinner with anyone. Specifically excluding women is very much mysogony.

Imagine your boss takes every person on their team out to a one on one dinner to get to know them better. Now imagine he will only take his male employees.

Or if he'll show up at a social gathering with his male employees where alcohol is served, but refuses to go if a female employee is there.

He needs to schedule an important business trip that involves a week of travel. But he will only consider bringing his male employees because he can't be alone with a female employee.

Now extrapolate that up to the Vice President.

Oh okay, maybe he's doing misogyny, but his wife and other married women who follow this culture would also be doing male-centered sexism. It's about excluding the sex you're attracted to.

Some people, like your examples, take it overboard (I had a friend who wouldn't let me be alone in his house whenever his pregnant wife decided to be home the week I was staying with him because I was homeless in an apartment transition. I had to ask if she was home before coming to the house to sleep or eat or bathe or whatever), and some people are reasonable about it ("don't have private non-business meetings with my wife, it's weird and disrespectful")

 

[NewFresh]

Oh okay, maybe he's doing misogyny, but his wife and other married women who follow this culture would also be doing male-centered sexism. It's about excluding the sex you're attracted to.

Some people, like your examples, take it overboard (I had a friend who wouldn't let me be alone in his house whenever his pregnant wife decided to be home the week I was staying with him because I was homeless in an apartment transition. I had to ask if she was home before coming to the house to sleep or eat or bathe or whatever), and some people are reasonable about it ("don't have private non-business meetings with my wife, it's weird and disrespectful")

I don't think anyone is saying that I would be OK if reversed.

 

[pirateluigi]

Oh okay, maybe he's doing misogyny, but his wife and other married women who follow this culture would also be doing male-centered sexism. It's about excluding the sex you're attracted to.

Some people, like your examples, take it overboard (I had a friend who wouldn't let me be alone in his house whenever his pregnant wife decided to be home the week I was staying with him because I was homeless in an apartment transition. I had to ask if she was home before coming to the house to sleep or eat or bathe or whatever), and some people are reasonable about it ("don't have private non-business meetings with my wife, it's weird and disrespectful")

If you want to practice this in your private life, that's your choice. But the VP doesn't have a private life. Everything he does is part of business.

 

[The Lamp]

If you want to practice this in your private life, that's your choice. But the VP doesn't have a private life. Everything he does is part of business.

I agree with that. He shouldn't do things that obstruct his role as VP

 

[diunxx]

Jesus can't believe people are defending this shit and I thought christians in my country were backwards XD

I guess american christians dont go to the gym either? All those walking temptations with their yoga pants jesus help us!

 

[Sandoval]

In fairness... I'm pretty sure that I'm 100% for having sex with unrelated women that I've taken to dinner alone. Then again dinner is usually a third or fourth date because I'm cheap and coffee is affordable. Then again... yet again, I'm fairly certain that, as a reasonable person, I can have dinner with someone where the pretense of that dinner isn't a date and have a mutually respectful interaction with another human being wherein we discuss many and varied topics and then leave the meal with my only regret being that I ate an entire basket of bread.

I also don't believe that you can shock the gay out of homosexuals. So ya know... that's a thing, too.

 

[Bleepey]

To play devil's advocate, what's wrong with protecting yourself from scandal. I mean some bosses will refuse to be alone in a room with a female subordinate or have meetings behind closed doors to protect against sexual harrassment claims or similar.

 

[JP_]

These people think it's inappropriate to have friends of the opposite sex and think they're morally superior to others. Pretty pathetic.

To play devil's advocate, what's wrong with protecting yourself from scandal. I mean some bosses will refuse to be alone in a room with a female subordinate or have meetings behind closed doors to protect against sexual harrassment claims or similar.

Just take two seconds to think about the professional advantage this gives men at this company.

 

[Aaron]

He can just have women wear full length veils in his presence to remove temptation.

 

[driggonny]

There's really no defending this. A woman could not have gotten as far into a political career as Mike Pence with that kind of attitude towards men.

 

[Shake Appeal]

Last week I went drinking with six women while my wife was at home. She didn't mind, because this is 2017 and we're not insane people.

 

[IISANDERII]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

Shows how hugely detrimental Christianity is for the human race then.

 

[JP_]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

If this is standard practice among Christians, it suggests Christians are morally compromised.

 

[crisdecuba]

Last week I went drinking with six women while my wife was at home. She didn't mind, because this is 2017 and we're not insane people.

I don't know you but I think she didn't mind because she trusts you, not because "it's 2017."

 

[Chorazin]

Jesus can't believe people are defending this shit and I thought christians in my country were backwards XD

I guess american christians dont go to the gym either? All those walking temptations with their yoga pants jesus help us!

Those harlots wearing comfortable clothes to get covered in sweat! How dare they!! SAVE ME JEEEEEEEBUS!!!!

I'm with you, this is all insane. I have just as many female friends as male and I've gone out to dinner with women while my GF was home and there was never anything other than some bullshitting and food.

Shitty people cheat, Jesus in their lives or not.

 

[Bleepey]

These people think it's inappropriate to have friends of the opposite sex and think they're morally superior to others. Pretty pathetic.


Just take two seconds to think about the professional advantage this gives men at this company.

I can see what you mean but maybe it could just meetings may be conducted alongside female management.

 

[Chococat]

Lots of outrage for a standard practice among Christians.

This should not be acceptable in a secular nation. Treating 51% of the population as objects of lust does not belong in lawmaking.

 

[crisdecuba]

This should not be acceptable in a secular nation. Treating 51% of the population as objects of lust does not belong in lawmaking.

It should be acceptable as a personal practice in a pluralistic nation, with the understanding that in the workplace you either have to be willing to dine / drink privately with both men and women, or with no one. Apply it consistently across genders and in a manner that doesn't hinder professional effectiveness and I'm fine. (To be clear, it doesn't look like Pence is applying this consistently across genders, so he's wrong here in my eyes).

 

[NandoGip]

I feel bad for these people who are so fearful of "temptation" and whatnot. It sounds like they think about sex and guilt from it wayyyyyy more than people who really don't give two fucks about religion.

 

[kaching]

I don't know you but I think she didn't mind because she trusts you, not because "it's 2017."

I think the 2017 part has to do with the fact that we no longer necessarily consider 1 man going out with 6 women as some kind of mobile harem. He covered the "trust" part by pointing out they're not insane people

 

[Chococat]

It should be acceptable as a personal practice in a pluralistic nation, with the understanding that in the workplace you either have to be willing to dine / drink privately with both men and women, or with no one. Apply it consistently across genders and in a manner that doesn't hinder professional effectiveness and I'm fine. (To be clear, it doesn't look like Pence is applying this consistently across genders, so he's wrong here in my eyes).

No. Because it is straight up discrimination. Period.

People are equal in this country. No one's personal belief should be tolerated if they discriminate against another.

One may practice their faith, but everyone has the right to call them out on discriminating practices of that faith.

 

[Bolivar687]

Again, this seems more like he's not trying to give off the appearance of being on a date, out of respect for his wife, not that he's struggling with an uncontrollable sex addiction. It's sad that people want to go after the low hanging fruit of hysteria and sexism every chance they get, with a couple cheap shots at Christianity for good measure.

This all came to light in a Washington Post feature where the Pences come across as this really amazing couple.

 

[BrutishMrFish]

No. Because it is straight up discrimination. Period.

People are equal in this country. No one's personal belief should be tolerated if they discriminate against another.

One make practices their faith, but everyone has the right to call them out on discriminating practices of that faith.

Exactly. If Pence were refusing to meet gay men for the same reason, he'd be just as deserving of the criticism.

 

[PlayALLtheGames]

Well at least he recognizes he's a weak, pathetic clown.

 

[grap3fruitman]

He can just have women wear full length veils in his presence to remove temptation.

Why can't he wear a chastity belt to meetings?

 

[Derwind]

No one cares what Mike Pence does as a private citizen, that's to me what some Gaffers are stuck on.

He is not a private citizen, he is not an average civilian, he is the god damn Vice President of the United States of America, a secular, global leader of the free world.

So there are a few little issues with his conduct;

1. He must meet with colleagues in a professional capacity alone sometimes, more than just brief exchanges but meeting as well. How can he take a position of authority like he has if he feels compromised anytime he is alone with a colleague of the opposite gender? Can he not really trust himself to the extent he needs to extend his ground rules to his professional life?

2. Although debatable at times, the US is the leader of the free world and a nation that upholds separation of church and state, that the legislative body will be seperate from religion and will not favour any religion. So, if Pence, who is VP, one of the highest offices you can reach in the US government is so religiously compromised that he can not meet colleagues in a private capacity, how can we be sure he is not so compromised to legislate properly?

3. Sexism should hold no place in any governing office, ever. His accessibility to his colleagues are heavily skewed to his male staffers, in a historically male dominated establishment, this is extremely unacceptable. Keep your rules and your religion out of the office, otherwise you should not have run for office if you were so compromised in the first place to fairly do your duty.

4. This is a horrible and regressive example for a growing generation, we already have a serial rapist that was legitimized as President, this is just another strike at this administration on how they view women. As treating women as potential infidelities and a succubi, Pence & Trump have absolutely no fucking accountability for their own urges. It's not hard to operate as a decent human being towards others, its not, I don't care how married this man is, he shouldn't bring his marital issues to an office helping run an establishment that oversees the lives of 300 million lives. This is a horrible example for young men & women to look up to.

It's not too little to ask the person running for office to be a fractionally decent human being.

 

[Draft]

Honestly what's the big deal? How is this any different than side hugs, chaperoned dates, having 20 children, or forbidding your daughter from wearing pants? Coastal elites can be very intolerant.

 

[mckmas8808]

Literally afraid of being around women.

This is weird.

 

[APF]

A good way to deal with temptations is to expose yourself to them so they no longer seem important enough to rework your world around. I don't have to worry about being "tempted" by friends and colleagues because I don't fetishize common interactions with people other than my family.