• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Covid 19 Thread: [no bitching about masks of Fauci edition]

I wonder why this is only true in America? There are fully vaccinated still dying in the UK.
I heard that it was because if you have had the vaxx that if they die of a respiratory illness their death is not counted as "Covid-involved" regardless of what their PCR test shows. I also heard that if you are vaxxed that they do a lower level PCR cycle test than if you are not vaxxed.

Now I cannot confirm this so take this a hearsay, but it would be an explanation of why we do not show numbers like the UK.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
I wonder why this is only true in America? There are fully vaccinated still dying in the UK.

Creative counting methodology? AstraZeneca sucks? Who knows, but until the source of this claim is laid out clearly, I’m very skeptical of the figure.
 

BadBurger

Many “Whelps”! Handle It!
I work in a MO hospital. it is wonderful ^_^

I just saw on ABC news a segment about how a hospital there had to open a sixth COVID-19 ward. Hopefully that's not you :messenger_persevering:



mRNA vaccines use a different method to train our immune system than traditional vaccines. That's all. The testing was greatly expanded beyond any we've seen before, by leaps and bounds.

That's all, that's the science and the truth.
 
Last edited:
Is the idea that you can belittle people into getting the vaccines? Because that is a stupid approach that will not accomplish anything. Now maybe the people in here doing it don’t really care if anyone gets the vaccine. Maybe they just want to flaunt some sort of empty superiority like some kind of asshole. Either that or they’re just very stupid.
 
Last edited:

ManaByte

Gold Member
That's just not true, sorry. If you want to redefine well tested as "rushed as quickly as possible" then I could agree. Vaccines are nothing new but mRNA vaccines are. Vaccines haven't always been safe in history either, I'll refer back to polio. It's safe now, but it sure wasn't in the beginning. Why do some people keep pushing the idea that these are well tested? I really don't understand, because someone said so? A government someone with a fancy hat or something?

Just think about it for a little bit longer, how could there be an entire handful of BRAND NEW drugs developed in RECORD TIME and they're all just totally safe for your children and pregnant women. I mean we know that's not true, we're seeing negative outcomes but we just don't know the full scale yet.

BadBurger, don't you think it's backwards to put the theoretical greater societal good above a patient's own personal health concerns? Someone said before and I couldn't agree more with them, please nobody do any medical procedures on my behalf. I don't want anyone to do that for me.

I do want people to decide for themselves what's best and have all the information possible available to them. That's why ivermectin was brought into this discussion. That's why potential risks of the vaccine that aren't being widely discussed have been brought in here. I don't fault any person for making the decision to get the vaccine, but I think that respect should absolutely go both ways. We're all adults and we can decide what to put in our bodies. Enough with the shaming and name calling, people have legitimate concerns.
What anti-vaxxer FB page is this copypasta from?
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
mRNA vaccines use a different method to train our immune system than traditional vaccines. That's all. The testing was greatly expanded beyond any we've seen before, by leaps and bounds.

That's all, that's the science and the truth.

It’s not “training” anything. They literally get your own cells to produce the harmful proteins that trigger an immune reaction. It would be an absolute disaster if anything went wrong and your cells didn’t stop producing the protein as engineered, for example, or the instructions to produce somehow spread throughout the body.

They seem fine for the most part given the sheer number of injections administered thus far and hell, it may turn out to be a miracle technology that we use to cure all sorts of disease in the future, but as you know it’s very different to a traditional vaccine where a finite amount of a weakened version of a harmful virus/protein is injected and dealt with by the immune system.

The fact of the matter is that they are new and we simply do not have years of data post-administration because we cannot, so some level of faith in the brilliance of the engineers is required.
 
Has there been anything new on a possible IP waiver for the vaccines?

If the vaccines were to go open source, so to speak, it would be pretty interesting to see how quickly the vaccines get reiterated and improved upon.
 

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
I wonder how many anti-vaxxers there would be if Facebook was suddenly deleted worldwide.
There would be significantly less of them. But then again if Facebook was deleted there would be less conspiracy nuts in general so it's not isolated to the antivax crazies.
 
Last edited:

Chaplain

Member
In December 2019, Taiwan‘s government learned that at least seven atypical pneumonia cases had been reported in Wuhan, China. Because of Taiwan’s proximity to China and the number of flights back and forth, it was expected to have the second-highest number of Covid-19 cases worldwide. Instead, Taiwan has had one of the lowest Covid-19 death rates in the world. Thanks in part to a sophisticated digitized health care system and a mandatory two-week quarantine for all travelers, life in Taiwan went on with relative normalcy. But then, in May 2021, a new wave of cases complicated the country’s success. So how did Taiwan, the ninth-most densely populated nation in the world, avoid a more severe spread of a highly contagious virus for so long? And what lessons can be learned from their response to the outbreak?

 

Loki

Count of Concision
I just saw on ABC news a segment about how a hospital there had to open a sixth COVID-19 ward. Hopefully that's not you :messenger_persevering:




mRNA vaccines use a different method to train our immune system than traditional vaccines. That's all. The testing was greatly expanded beyond any we've seen before, by leaps and bounds.

That's all, that's the science and the truth.

Are you suggesting that the "testing" was more extensive (i.e. had a greater number of subjects, a greater diversity of subjects, and/or was for a longer duration) for these mRNA vaccines than for vaccines of the past? I'd definitely need a source on that, because it strains credulity, and goes against things I recall reading in the fall/winter.
 
Are you suggesting that the "testing" was more extensive (i.e. had a greater number of subjects, a greater diversity of subjects, and/or was for a longer duration) for these mRNA vaccines than for vaccines of the past? I'd definitely need a source on that, because it strains credulity, and goes against things I recall reading in the fall/winter.
I think they were just saying the process was greatly accelerated which is surely true. It's also surely true that the testing is therefore not as thorough, by definition, because it was rushed.
 

12Goblins

Lil’ Gobbie
Insisting that skepticism and hesitance toward COVID vaccines is just the same as being anti vaxx in general and antagonizing people based on that is a really stupid strategy.
it's hard to call these people "skeptics" when they care not to take the time to understand how any of this works and just resist things for the sake of not understanding it. but ultimately these are the people that pay the price so you are right that antagonizing them is completely senseless.

4e31witu3ta71.png


sigh
 
Last edited:

CloudNull

Banned
You know, I hope this is bullshit. I don't fucking want people to get sick from the vaccine. My wife already has weird autoimmune issues I really hope this doesn't trigger something and then have everyone condescendingly tell me it couldn't be from the vaccine.
It is probably extremely rare as are most the side effects but I think the people in power need to be more transparent. I am not anti-vaccine but believe people need the whole truth. They can then make their decisions from there.
 
Last edited:
It is probably extremely rare as are most the side effects but I think the people in power need to be more transparent. I am not anti-vaccine but believe people need the whole truth. They can then make their decisions from there.
Yeah totally, it's just that if evidence keeps rolling in about health issues (that particular one sounds really nasty) the squawkers are still gonna squawk conspiracy theory and more people suffer needlessly, it sucks.
 

Cyberpunkd

Member
Very brief Covid related summary from France:

All professions having contact with the public are obliged to be vaccinated by September 15th

From July 21st: test PCR or full vaccination to get anywhere that can hold more than 50 people e.g. museums, cinemas, theatres, Disneyland

From beginning of August: same as above but for restaurants, taking the plane, taking the train, etc.

Tests PCR will be paid without medical prescription starting this autumn
 
Last edited:
it's hard to call these people "skeptics" when they care not to take the time to understand how any of this works and just resist things for the sake of not understanding it. but ultimately these are the people that pay the price so you are right that antagonizing them is completely senseless.

4e31witu3ta71.png


sigh
Shame. I had to look into this a bit. So she got covid in early July and was dead by July 11th. That’s pretty atypical. Most people, even old people, can last for weeks on oxygen, ventilators and ECMO machines. So it turns out she didn’t die from pneumonia. It actually sounds like she died from encephalitis, likely due to immune system overreaction to the virus. Hence the attempt to give her high doses of steroids and them talking about the pressure on her brain. Encephalitis is a pretty rare thing, generally speaking.

Of course, had she been vaccinated, it is almost certain she would still be alive. I just thought the situation was interesting. Definitely out of the ordinary. Even for covid.
 
Last edited:
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
it's hard to call these people "skeptics" when they care not to take the time to understand how any of this works and just resist things for the sake of not understanding it. but ultimately these are the people that pay the price so you are right that antagonizing them is completely senseless.

You seem to imply that if only people understood how it works they would be lining up for the vaccine regardless of their risk factors. That’s just not the case. A great many people have really looked into it and decided they want to wait or not get it at all. That’s their choice.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
Last edited by a moderator:

Cyberpunkd

Member
I'm a pro-vaccine guy but this talk about mandatory vaccines and going door to door is kind of terrifying. I'm fairly confident neither will happen in the states but it's scary to think about. OBEY
Let me break it down for you since you seem to be shook to the core:

People are not vaccinated, new wave comes, non-vaccinated end up in hospital, ICU, pressure on healthcare mounts.

Two options: you let people die or you lock things down again.

You let people die? Lol, good luck with that in a democracy.

You lock down? Ok, do you punish people that were vaccinated? Because of yes - why do you think it’s fair? They did their part, they got vaccinated, they are protected. During each of the lockdowns in the past we had no vaccine or not enough doses, that is not the case anymore.
 
Last edited:

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
I know, but given enough time, will more cases emerge?

We don't know.

This covid shit... I swear man, I went through the 92 depression, the 2007 great recession and when things were looking good boom here comes China to fuck things up.
It will pass. The vaccines are already approved and will only get better as time goes on. Stressing yourself out over every single cases of a bad side effect or reaction when we have had god only knows how many of doses delivered safely and without issue is just silly.


Also just like the events you mentioned this too will pass and it's already in the process of doing that outside of the delta variant. So try not to stress yourself out over that either. None of this is going to last forever.
 

ManaByte

Gold Member
It will pass. The vaccines are already approved and will only get better as time goes on. Stressing yourself out over every single cases of a bad side effect or reaction when we have had god only knows how many of doses delivered safely and without issue is just silly.


Also just like the events you mentioned this too will pass and it's already in the process of doing that outside of the delta variant. So try not to stress yourself out over that either. None of this is going to last forever.

You probably have a better chance of dying in a plane crash than from the vaccine.
 

Bitmap Frogs

Mr. Community
It will pass. The vaccines are already approved and will only get better as time goes on. Stressing yourself out over every single cases of a bad side effect or reaction when we have had god only knows how many of doses delivered safely and without issue is just silly.


Also just like the events you mentioned this too will pass and it's already in the process of doing that outside of the delta variant. So try not to stress yourself out over that either. None of this is going to last forever.

I hope so. Thanks.

Doctor Who Reaction GIF
 
Let me break it down for you since you seem to be shook to the core:

People are not vaccinated, new wave comes, non-vaccinated end up in hospital, ICU, pressure on healthcare mounts.

Two options: you let people die or you lock things down again.

You let people die? Lol, good luck with that in a democracy.

You lock down? Ok, do you punish people that were vaccinated? Because of yes - why do you think it’s fair? They did their part, they got vaccinated, they are protected. During each of the lockdowns in the past we had no vaccine or not enough doses, that is not the case anymore.
We let people die all the time. All the time. From tons and tons of things. That’s why smoking is legal. That’s why alcohol is legal. That’s why cars exist instead of forcing people to travel on trains. It’s why we allow fast food to be eaten. All of those things kill people on some level. The idea that a democracy requires to the government to force you to take care of yourself is… well, it’s dumb.

The vaccines allow people the option to take care of themselves, for the vast majority of people. We can have a debate about whether it is appropriate to force people to vaccinate. But the way you have framed the argument here is fairly ridiculous.
 

Cyberpunkd

Member
New info: one of the major platforms in France to schedule your shot is currently experiencing 20 000 visits being booked each minute.
 

Lupingosei

Banned
My 2nd shot sure was something.

All Sunday headache, fever, my joints hurt and they probably never tested on people with neurodermatitis because my skin burned like hell. Had to take cold baths to at least make it bearable.

Today joints still hurt and had to take pain medicine.
 

Cyberpunkd

Member
The idea that a democracy requires to the government to force you to take care of yourself is… well, it’s dumb.
It is not when unlike US everyone pays to the common treasury to then be used for treating people. I do not want to pay for your bad life choices. On the other hand I have no problem paying for a treatment of your cancer not related to your lifestyle, we are civilised unlike the US.
 
Last edited:
It is not when unlike US everyone pays to the common treasury to then be used for treating people. I do not want to pay for your bad life choices. On the other hand I have no problem paying for a treatment of your cancer not related to your lifestyle, we are civilised unlike the US.
And yet you do. All the time. Smoking is common in France, for instance. Obesity is responsible for increases in heart disease and cancer. You pay for the health consequences of all kinds of behaviors. So your point is, again, dumb.

Hell, by your logic I could force people to get abortions because you shouldn’t have to pay for the consequences of other people’s reproductive choices.
 
Last edited:

Alx

Member
Not surprising. People aren’t in a hurry to get a vaccine if it’s for the good of community, but if it’s to be allowed in restaurants and night club it’s « oh shit I need that jab NOW ! »
 

Cyberpunkd

Member
And yet you do. All the time. Smoking is common in France, for instance. Obesity is responsible for increases in heart disease and cancer. You pay for the health consequences of all kinds of behaviors. So your point is, again, dumb.

Hell, by your logic I could force people to get abortions because you shouldn’t have to pay for the consequences of other people’s reproductive choices.
Ok, I give you that - it boggles my mind how prevalent smoking is in France.
 
Ok, I give you that - it boggles my mind how prevalent smoking is in France.
All I can tell you is that the argument that because the government pays for your healthcare, the government gets to tell you what to do with regards to your health is not a selling point for socialized medicine. In fact, it’s the number one reason many people oppose it. Almost everything you do impacts your health. What you eat, who you have sex with, where you go, how much you exercise, what activities you enjoy. All of it impacts your health.

It’s not “civilized” to be able to force people to take a medicine they don’t want to take. Even if it’s good for them. That’s tyranny dressed up as benevolence. It’s supposed to be their life to live. That’s the point of a free society.
 
Last edited:

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
Dude, you eat snails
What does that have to with being civilized?


There are cultural delicacies from all over the world that would seem weird to us just like some of the things that we eat here in the United States would be bizarre as hell to people from other countries.
 
Top Bottom