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Crackdown 2 |OT| of Orbs, Freaks, and Exploding Pedestrians

Why For? said:
One problem with your analogy.

Imagine you had 8 months and a broken engine to make Crackdown 2, and still managed to get 4 player co-op and 16 player deathmatch in an open world sanbox game.

Why do people still talk like Ruffian have spent the last 3 and a half years sitting on their asses doing nothing?

Realtime wanted to make Crackdown 2, but MS didn't take the option. Realtime moved on to APB, and the Crackdown IP went into hibernation. Only last year did MS decide they wanted a sequel, and put Ruffian together to make it, and gave them less than a year to do so off the existing Realtime engine.

Fuck me.

So fuck having a fulfilling experience and take what you can get? Btw, versus mode sucks donkey balls. Put the in your pipe and shove it. In your arse?

Do you work for Ruffian? You seem to be taking the criticism personally...just sayin'
 
VALIS said:
That doesn't even make any sense. You "LOVED" the first one, Crackdown 2 is more of the same, and yet you deleted it after 20 minutes and hope to wipe it from memory. Jesus, that's a dumb troll attempt. :lol


http://www.giantbomb.com/profile/nightskies/achievements/?upid=567097&sid=11798

I played the hell out of the first game, but was kinda expecting the game to get better, not worse after three years. You think that because I bought a game for $10 and loved it that i would want to pay $60 to play a slightly worse version of the same thing?

Man, Bobby Kotick must love you....
 
Why For? said:
One problem with your analogy.

Imagine you had 8 months and a broken engine to make Crackdown 2, and still managed to get 4 player co-op and 16 player deathmatch in an open world sanbox game.

Why do people still talk like Ruffian have spent the last 3 and a half years sitting on their asses doing nothing?

Realtime wanted to make Crackdown 2, but MS didn't take the option. Realtime moved on to APB, and the Crackdown IP went into hibernation. Only last year did MS decide they wanted a sequel, and put Ruffian together to make it, and gave them less than a year to do so off the existing Realtime engine.

Fuck me.


None of those things are my problem. I don't get to pay $20 for the game since they had an absurdly short development cycle. Nope. MS still wants me to pony up the same money that I could use to buy red Dead Revolver, or any other AAA game.

This game should have launched at $30.
 

Why For?

Banned
Assembly Required said:
So fuck having a fulfilling experience and take what you can get? Btw, versus mode sucks donkey balls. Put the in your pipe and shove it. In your arse?

Do you work for Ruffian? You seem to be taking the criticism personally...just sayin'

So you think it perfectly reasonable to expect the impossible?

Awesome. Nice talk.

There are sequels out there that give less than CD2 did, and yet people still bought them and were happy to hand over their cash. Why does CD2 get so much crap for it?

And not ONCE have I seen anyone post what they could have done different. All they've posted is whining.
 
Why For? said:
One problem with your analogy.

Imagine you had 8 months and a broken engine to make Crackdown 2, and still managed to get 4 player co-op and 16 player deathmatch in an open world sanbox game.

Why do people still talk like Ruffian have spent the last 3 and a half years sitting on their asses doing nothing?

Realtime wanted to make Crackdown 2, but MS didn't take the option. Realtime moved on to APB, and the Crackdown IP went into hibernation. Only last year did MS decide they wanted a sequel, and put Ruffian together to make it, and gave them less than a year to do so off the existing Realtime engine.

Fuck me.
Why are you defending this?

The fact that Ruffian moved mountains and managed to put out a game that's still fun in eight months doesn't change the fact that it's a horrifyingly disappointing sequel that barely deserves to be called one. It's the same damn game I played three years ago, except now with goofy, boring zombies, four-player co-op that is welcome but not a game-changer in the least, and a really awful competitive mode. It doesn't matter if Ruffian or Microsoft is to blame for this, because the fact is that someone fucking messed up.

Crackdown deserves better than a cash-in sequel that can barely keep up with three years of evolution, and when this game tanks like I'm afraid it will and the Crackdown franchise dies with it, I'm not going to be happy.
 

Why For?

Banned
outunderthestars said:
None of those things are my problem. I don't get to pay $20 for the game since they had an absurdly short development cycle. Nope. MS still wants me to pony up the same money that I could use to buy red Dead Revolver, or any other AAA game.

This game should have launched at $30.

What do you want to hear?

They put a demo of the game which was pretty much the FULL game capped at half an hour. They weren't being secretive about anything.

Most of us who aren't simply here trolling for the fuck of it, pretty much knew what we were getting.

I wasn't expecting anything more than the first game with some new shit to do. The only thing I expected were better graphics really, and some bug fixes from the first game.

Once I found out what was going on behind the scenes, it was hard to be pissed when the game is still so much fucking fun.

And people still complaining about narrative and story in Crackdown ? :lol :lol Now I know some of you are just trolling.
 
Something they could have done differently? ...ask (convinced) MS for more development time. Make up BS about "expanding the audience". Contractual agreement/obligation? Timeframes? Who needs 'em.

Better luck next time I guess...
 

SapientWolf

Trucker Sexologist
Assembly Required said:
Something they could have done differently? ...ask (convinced) MS for more development time. Make up BS about "expanding the audience". Contractual agreement/obligation? Timeframes? Who needs 'em.

Better luck next time I guess...
The engine's too old and this gen is on its last legs. Might as well keep a skeleton team for DLC and start prepping Crackdown 3 for the next round of consoles.
 

ReBurn

Gold Member
So people are still bitching about a game that they haven't even played. There must be something to it if people are this up in arms about it.
 

VALIS

Member
outunderthestars said:
http://www.giantbomb.com/profile/nightskies/achievements/?upid=567097&sid=11798

I played the hell out of the first game, but was kinda expecting the game to get better, not worse after three years. You think that because I bought a game for $10 and loved it that i would want to pay $60 to play a slightly worse version of the same thing?

Man, Bobby Kotick must love you....

No, your statement doesn't make sense. I also loved Crackdown. One of my three favorite games this generation. So while I'm disappointed they recycled the city, I've also been having a blast with Crackdown 2 all night long and have already put more time in with it in one night than I have with Red Dead Redemption in one month.

Point being, if you loved the first I think you'd be disappointed the second game is very similar, while at the same time excited to do more of the same. Not that you'd necessarily want to buy it at $60, but you wouldn't spout some hyperbolic "I deleted the free demo after 20 minutes and am sticking an ice pick up my nose so I can wipe it out of my memory!!" bullshit.
 
ReBurn said:
So people are still bitching about a game that they haven't even played. There must be something to it if people are this up in arms about it.
Yeah, it's not like people have been playing the game since Sunday or anything.
 

hamchan

Member
ReBurn said:
So people are still bitching about a game that they haven't even played. There must be something to it if people are this up in arms about it.

It's out in both North America and Australia :lol
 

theultimo

Member
hamchan said:
It's out in both North America and Australia :lol
Whats nice is the cool little map when you start it up. Shoot about 3-4 people playing it in Georgia and about 1 or so in Russia! Sadly, ZERO in Africa.

Edit: Current stats:
s13pO.jpg
 

ReBurn

Gold Member
I AM JOHN! said:
Yeah, it's not like people have been playing the game since Sunday or anything.
Out, yes. But there's no way all of the whiners are people who plunked down cash and were disappointed. This seems to be the game that people love to hate right now. I've seen very few "I spent 60 bucks and this thing is crap!" posts. But I've seen an ass load of "The crappy devs didn't spend enough time making it for me to be happy" posts.

*shrugs*
 
ReBurn said:
Out, yes. But there's no way all of the whiners are people who plunked down cash and were disappointed. This seems to be the game that people love to hate right now. I've seen very few "I spent 60 bucks and this thing is crap!" posts. But I've seen an ass load of "The crappy devs didn't spend enough time making it for me to be happy" posts.

*shrugs*


well there is a 30 minute demo. If you played the demo then you know exactly what is in store for you.


Anyone find it amusing that the two people who are defending the game the most are Sonic fans? Shouldn't you people be disqualified from ever discussing game quality? ;)
 

obonicus

Member
jjasper said:
GAF was harsher on GTA4.

Not at first. GTA4 was 'game of the forever' at launch. A lot of post-release chatter about GTA4 was about PS3 vs. 360 version differences, backlash started later.

And Saint's Row 2 gets most of its hate from people who think it's too close to San Andreas.
 

Saterium

Member
Just finished it.

A friend and I played it all Co-op. Took us about 8 hours or so? We rushed through at the end because we got tired of the repetition. We managed to get everything to level 5 except for driving and collected the important weapons.

Here's the problem...

Crackdown 1 had the "take down gang leaders" formula which was fun enough. Each gang had it's own quirk followed by a decent boss.

Crackdown 2 has several repetitive formulas. You can either capture 3 blue towers and guard the orb, take over points or seal the tunnels. The problem here is every single thing feels the exact same as the last, there's no real variety to the city anymore and the enemies are pretty much the same with the exception of slightly larger guns.

Ending spoiler if anyone cares (you shouldn't)
It also follows pretty much the exact same story as crackdown 1, even the twist/ending is the same

Collecting orbs and messing around in the city is fun enough but open world games have evolved a good amount since Crackdown 1 came out. Saint's Row 2 and even Mercs 2 we're both a much more enjoyable experience on co-op then Crackdown 2 imo.


I doubt either of us will go back to collect more orbs or capture all the strongholds. Crackdown 1 was great 3 years ago, Crackdown 2 feels kinda empty. Kinda unfortunate, I was really looking forward to this game too.
 
Saterium said:
Collecting orbs and messing around in the city is fun enough but open world games have evolved a good amount since Crackdown 1 came out. Saint's Row 2 and even Mercs 2 we're both a much more enjoyable experience on co-op then Crackdown 2 imo.

No, just no. You can make an argument for Saints Row 2, but that's it. Mercs 2, the dumb co-op tether, and all of its glitches can stay far the hell away from this discussion. The fact that you can do anything you want in Crackdown 2 all while 3 other people can be doing anything THEY want in the same co-op campaign kicks the crap out of Mercs 2, and most free roam co-op experiences.

Let's not go crazy now people.
 

Kujo

Member
I got every single achievement in the original game, something I doubt most people here have done, so if anyone should bitch i'd think it would be me.
True, though I also got all 1250g in C1 and I'm sorta the opposite. After renting C2 I feel the original is better in most ways (though the UV shotgun is a nice addition). I really liked the colour and setting of the original, I hate the gritty look of 2. Technically it's probably better, but IMO it's sorta ugly. And the freaks, I've never liked dumb zombie AI in games, it just brings the game down for me. Original had them, but there were very few on the streets, nothing at all like in 2. And of course a lot of the world is unchanged outside of textures and some destruction, with many orbs in the same spots, that part of the game can feel too much like a re-tread. Though this is all said by a single player fan, so I can see how co-opers can find fun here. I'd give the SP probably about a 6/10. For a sequel, I do want more Crackdown, but in a new sandbox.

But I feel MS might just disregard this series if the sales are poor for this game, which would suck.
 

Saterium

Member
Net_Wrecker said:
No, just no. You can make an argument for Saints Row 2, but that's it. Mercs 2, the dumb co-op tether, and all of its glitches can stay far the hell away from this discussion. The fact that you can do anything you want in Crackdown 2 all while 3 other people can be doing anything THEY want in the same co-op campaign kicks the crap out of Mercs 2, and most free roam co-op experiences.

Let's not go crazy now people.


Haha I stand by that.

It's impressive to have people running around doing whatever they want online. Alot of the time it just made me and my buddies run and do their own thing though. That forced circle forced everyone to stick together.

Mercs 2 was a buggy piece of shit but man there were certain moments where I laughed till I cried playing that game at how absurd some of the situations were. It allowed you to do some crazy stuff where as Crackdown 2 felt very 'by the books for me'. I had all the fun and laughs 3 years ago when I played Crackdown 1.
 

Bebpo

Banned
Also wtf at friendly fire. Why give those UV Shotguns for the lair if they have a huge spread and send your friends reeling.

The main problem I have with the missions is kind of a combination of what Ghaleon & Saterium said.

Here are your Crackdown 2 "missions"

New for Crackdown 2
-Power up ORBS - this consists of standing still on a circle and shooting things around you. This is super boring.

-Breaches - this consists of meleeing a punch of zombies until a meter drops. This is super boring.

-Lair - this consists of spinning around shooting marked targets while moving through the mob. This is super boring.

Lifted from Crackdown
-Rooftop Races - These are fun

-Car Races - These are fun

Kind of new, kind of lifted from Crackdown
-Shoot guys to secure spot. Shoot guys. This is fun. It's also pretty much what the Crackdown 1 missions were until you hit the boss.

Maybe I'm missing some mission types as I haven't tried everything yet. But basically every "mission" Ruffian created consists of incredibly dull gameplay. STAND ON DOT....really? Also how is that different than Lair missions? In both you're basically protecting an area and shooting stuff that comes at you. Breaches are just a way to say "go crazy! kill zombies!" which you can normally do anyhow, but now it's a mission. I dunno, the new mission types seem about as creative as a rock.
 
I haven't had a chance to play this at all because none of my friend's are picking it up but...

What are these reports of the Crackdown engine being broken as hell, etc.? It seemed to play fine to me when my xbox was working....
 

mjc

Member
I think its fun...it's certainly not very different from the first game but I'm fine with that.
 
Saterium said:
Haha I stand by that.

It's impressive to have people running around doing whatever they want online. Alot of the time it just made me and my buddies run and do their own thing though. That forced circle forced everyone to stick together.

Mercs 2 was a buggy piece of shit but man there were certain moments where I laughed till I cried playing that game at how absurd some of the situations were. It allowed you to do some crazy stuff where as Crackdown 2 felt very 'by the books for me'. I had all the fun and laughs 3 years ago when I played Crackdown 1.

If a spider web of cars, an agency helicopter causing all sorts of destruction, a ton of freaks on the screen, one guy bouncing everything around with a UV Shotgun, and one guy in a Buggy flying off another guy in the Supercar all on the same block is "by the books" then cotdayum I need to know what games you're playing.

Not enough has changed since the first Crackdown, I'll give you that, but there is still a ton of fun to be had here IMO.
 
Sinatar said:
I don't remember Saints Row 2 getting this kind of shit for recycling the city.

Or Skate 2.

With that said I'll be waiting for a price drop. After the Steam sale I just have to put my wallet away for a couple months.
 
And not ONCE have I seen anyone post what they could have done different. All they've posted is whining.

Ruffian could have made a story. There's no emotional attachment to anything because there are no characters, plot progression, or end payoff.

Mission structure or lack there of. Where are the set piece moments? Helicopter battles? Chase sequences? There's no variety. Red Faction Guerrilla did this right. Missions were very scripted yet still very open to complete them however you pleased.

Where was an RPG style level up system? If the game is based upon collecting orbs and evolving, shouldn't there be a stat tree that you can customize to your own liking? If not for in game abilities then at least cosmetic.

Add to the fact that CD2 looks no better, runs a little worse, and controls worse, makes CD2 a poor excuse of a sequel in 2010.
 

Saterium

Member
Net_Wrecker said:
If a spider web of cars, an agency helicopter causing all sorts of destruction, a ton of freaks on the screen, one guy bouncing everything around with a UV Shotgun, and one guy in a Buggy flying off another guy in the Supercar all on the same block is "by the books" then cotdayum I need to know what games you're playing.

Not enough has changed since the first Crackdown, I'll give you that, but there is still a ton of fun to be had here IMO.

But they're all getting instantly blown up by lock on missile launchers on the last island unless they constantly jump and shoot. The helicopter and cars can't get within 10 feet of the chaos because they get blown to bits by the AI. The guy with the shotgun is accidental shooting his team mates off the large skyscraper.

Once they started introducing the rocket launcher and sniper rifles on the AI the game lost alot of it's fun.
 

derFeef

Member
Sorry, but I would not want anything you mentioned in a Crackdown game. You just described Prototype and that game was horrible.

edit: uh, it has arrived! Ready for some Crackdown-after-work action in the evening. Feel free to add me everyone for some coop mayhem. I´ll make it open to friends.
 

Flavius

Member
Finally popped it into my 360 last night. Aaaaaaah...this is the puzzle-platforming, orb-collecting fun that I remember. Agree with those who feel the mission structure is worse than the original. It may have been incredibly simple, but "X"ing off gang bosses and sub-bosses was a much better carrot than what's here. Glitched into a building and spent 5 minutes or so trying to find my way out before I gave up, saved, and popped back in. No big whoop, but...odd!

Game looks great (or at least, good enough for me), controls fine, and is more of a game that I enjoyed a great deal. Still very happy that I pre-ordered, and content with the value offered here for $60.
 

soldat7

Member
Put in another 2 hours last night. 20% complete and having a blast. There's actually some challenge here, unlike Crackdown 1. And I'm not so sure about the platforming complaints. I'm at 20 hidden and 150 agility and having no problem scaling buildings. The targeting is working just fine for me as well. I've completed two of the freak lairs with nothing but an assault rifle.
 
GhaleonEB said:
Fortunately, those are a small part of the game. I'm just running around territory way too dangerous for me trying to get weapons and being opportunistic about about snagging the minor objectives.

Just finished a 45-minute battle for a rocket launcher. Playing in the hardest area of the game on Psychotic while under-leveled and under-armed is actually quite satisfying. I had to infiltrate a sniper-laden area by doing a lot of sniping myself, scouring the rooftops until I had a rocket launcher dude pinned down. (Or rather, we had each other pinned down.) Lots of deaths, but some fantastic shootouts. I'm sort of making the game be what I want it to be, and it's working pretty well.

One comment touching on what I said earlier, about the developers not quite getting what made Crackdown, well, Crackdown. I'm in this territory, and the announcer keeps telling me what I can't access. He tells me when an orb is too fast for my current level. When one of those energy beam stations is too high for me to get to (he let me know I'd need to be level 4). And so on.

In Crackdown, when I look at the city, I see possibilities. Can I get up there? I wonder if I can make this jump....and so on. In Crackdown 2, the announcer is shutting those down without my having to experiment to find out. Trying, failing, and later succeeding is a big part of the joy of the game. Why on earth would you discourage someone from trying to reach something in Crackdown?
You could turn the announcer off. :p
 
i only got in a short play session last night. managed to get the 'you can play as an agent that isn't drab' code thankfully.

can't say much more at this point, than yeah, it's crackdown and it's fun.

and yeah, skate 2 and saints row 2 as far as i know didn't get bagged on for being the same city. were their cities more evolved or what?

i know the real answer though as to why they got a pass.

they weren't exclusives.
 

soldat7

Member
plagiarize said:
i know the real answer though as to why they got a pass.

Critically, Crackdown 2 is scoring pretty much in line with what's expected (keep in mind, GAF can be a drama queen sometimes)


IGN

CD 8/10
CD2 7.5/10

Gamespot
CD 7.8/10
CD2 7/10

Eurogamer
CD 9/10
CD2 8/10

Edge
CD 8/10
CD2 8/10

GameInformer
CD 8.5
CD2 7.25

1UP
CD A-
CD2 B-

Gametrailers
CD 7.5
CD2 7.9

G4
CD 5/5
CD2 4/5

etc, etc. A lot of the other reviews follow the same trend.
 

G_Berry

Banned
Just played a massive session. Got home from work at around 530pm, installed and just finished playing now 1130 pm.

As a huge fan of the first (I got all the orbs with no guide) I have to say that this game is pretty bad ass. I actually enjoy roaming round the old city hunting for orbs again, feels like home.
 

Barrett2

Member
Why For? said:
What do you want to hear?

They put a demo of the game which was pretty much the FULL game capped at half an hour. They weren't being secretive about anything.

Most of us who aren't simply here trolling for the fuck of it, pretty much knew what we were getting.

I wasn't expecting anything more than the first game with some new shit to do. The only thing I expected were better graphics really, and some bug fixes from the first game.

Once I found out what was going on behind the scenes, it was hard to be pissed when the game is still so much fucking fun.

And people still complaining about narrative and story in Crackdown ? :lol :lol Now I know some of you are just trolling.

Im' sorry, but comments like these are stroke-inducing. Wow.
 

Curufinwe

Member
soldat7 said:
Critically, Crackdown 2 is scoring pretty much in line with what's expected (keep in mind, GAF can be a drama queen sometimes)


IGN

CD 8/10
CD2 7.5/10

Gamespot
CD 7.8/10
CD2 7/10

Eurogamer
CD 9/10
CD2 8/10

Edge
CD 8/10
CD2 8/10

GameInformer
CD 8.5
CD2 7.25

1UP
CD A-
CD2 B-

Gametrailers
CD 7.5
CD2 7.9

G4
CD 5/5
CD2 4/5

etc, etc. A lot of the other reviews follow the same trend.

Which is reflected in the average Metacritic scores of 83 and 71.
 

Pimpbaa

Member
I really don't see how people are thinking this game is worse graphically. It has much better lighting, very long draw distance (for everything even pedestrians and freaks), better shader effects, more steady framerate, and looks much cleaner due to AA and full 720p. The only thing that looks worse is the texture resolution, but CD2 perhaps has more texture variety (CD1 looked like it tiled very small textures over and over).
 

Marvie_3

Banned
Pimpbaa said:
I really don't see how people are thinking this game is worse graphically. It has much better lighting, very long draw distance (for everything even pedestrians and freaks), better shader effects, more steady framerate, and looks much cleaner due to AA and full 720p. The only thing that looks worse is the texture resolution, but CD2 perhaps has more texture variety (CD1 looked like it tiled very small textures over and over).
Me either. I think the game looks better than the first Crackdown.
 

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Shurs said:
Can people please stop with the "8 months" bullshit?

This game was in development for over a year.

Ironically the 8 months meme would probably just result in people giving Ruffian more of the sympathy they deserve for their plight.
 

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Marvie_3 said:
Me either. I think the game looks better than the first Crackdown.

It's the art direction thing; for a lot of people whether or not they like the aesthetic determines how sophisticated they feel the graphics are.

CD2 is definitely a much cleaned up from CD1, but I agree that the aesthetic is much more repetitive than CD1.

Infamous actually had this problem as well where its grimy dark city looked almost identical on every island. It did benefit from looking more organic and cluttered however. Crackdown shows its age in how empty and sterile many of the environments are, which doesn't do its aesthetic any favors.
 

hamchan

Member
soldat7 said:
Critically, Crackdown 2 is scoring pretty much in line with what's expected (keep in mind, GAF can be a drama queen sometimes)

I wasn't expecting those scores when I heard a sequel to Crackdown was being made. >_>

I wanted Crackdown 2 to have scores at least equal or better than its prequel.
 

Dipswitch

Member
I think it's obvious that Ruffian made the best game they could given the time allotted. Recycling most of the city was an obvious design choice considering the compressed development timeframe. And I suppose it's understandable that MS wouldn't want to shell out funds for a protracted development to a brand new studio (Albeit one familiar with the franchise). So they asked for a quick sequel and Ruffian delivered as best they could, considering they were building the studio at the same time. I'd say they've proven themselves at this stage.

In regards to the game itself, I played the demo and it seemed to keep most of the fun elements of the first title intact. It definitely seems rough around the edges however, so hopefully they can smooth out some of that stuff with a title update or two. And since they've outsourced at least some of the DLC to that other studio, hopefully that means they're already working on the full fledged sequel everyone expects. And that better include a brand new city Ruffian!
 
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