Support NeoGAF

[FluxWaveZ]

Man, you guys need to chill about brainwashing. Can you come up with a reason for why any of the stuff that happens in the games/shows happen that makes some sort of sense? Seriously, there is so much that has to happen in such a short amount of time that no matter what the reason was, it was going to either feel weak or unrealistic.

Each member of the DR2 cast had built-in reasons for why they would want to see the world go to shit in the game they originated from. Combine that with Junko's perceived charisma before DR3, and it'd just be a simple means of "come with me to the dark side" bad guy speech like she did for Izuru, but for everyone else as their life situation devolves (Twilight Syndrome would be a crucial part of this), thus amassing her cult of personality. It's not the most inspired idea, but it's at least the expected one and it would work just fine within the context of the DR universe. It seemed to be implied that the world burned not because the brainwashing video was broadcast all over the place, but specifically because of Hope's Peak imploding. DR2 cast's heel turn + first killing game + Reserve student madness was all that was needed, and it could have been achieved in any number of ways.

Brainwashing for the mass suicides and the craziness of the Reserve students? Sure, yeah, whatever. They're not the crux of the story; use that Diabolus ex Machina as a crutch to move the story forward. But if it was always going to feel weak or unrealistic to have a 12-episode prequel anime, maybe it shouldn't have been done in the first place?

 

[Based Calla]

Sometimes leaving things to imagination is better, than giving an explanation to everything.

True, but some things need explanations like how did they become Remnants of Despair, or how the entire planet became engulfed with despair in just a year? I'm fine with leaving some mysteries, but when you introduce a world changing concept you need to have a reason why there was change.

Each member of the DR2 cast had built-in reasons for why they would want to see the world go to shit in the game they originated from. Combine that with Junko's perceived charisma before DR3, and it'd just be a simple means of "come with me to the dark side" bad guy speech like she did for Izuru, but for everyone else as their life situation devolves (Twilight Syndrome would be a crucial part of this). It's not the most inspired idea, but it's at least the expected one and it would work just fine within the context of the DR universe.

Brainwashing for the mass suicides and the craziness of the Reserve students? Sure, yeah, whatever. They're not the crux of the story; use that Diabolus ex Machina as a crutch to move the story forward. But if it was always going to feel weak or unrealistic to have a 12-episode prequel anime, maybe it shouldn't have been done in the first place?

Only explanation I could think of as for why not just use each characters' seeds is that it would be easier to just brainwash them if she already had the technology to use it for everyone else, but I can agree with that. It would of been more interesting to see each character get manipulated by Junko based on those seeds, but it wouldn't be enough time for a 12 episode series that includes important plot lines for another 12 episode series.

 

[Maebe]

My biggest worry about the OVA is that it will, in fact, actually be connected to V3.

This worry is not just because I very much want V3 to actually be the reboot I expect it to be after all this, but because if it being connected is a twist, it will have to be spoiled to ward off all of us who can't play the game yet.

The existence of "monokuma children" makes me think it isn't gonna be totally unattached to Junko's saga. I know he's a mascot so they can't discard him completely but he's also undeniably a Junko motif so there may be some unavoidable plot connection.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

True, but some things need explanations like how did they become Remnants of Despair, or how the entire planet became engulfed with despair in just a year? I'm fine with leaving some mysteries, but when you introduce a world changing concept you need to have a reason why there was change.

I disagree. In the context of the games, maintaining the mystery for how the world went awry would be fine and maybe even preferable, since it served only as window dressing for the killing games themselves. What was always important to me in Danganronpa was the killing game aspect, and not the greater world aspect.

Like, for all I care, the motivation for a V3 mastermind could just be "I hate criminals and they should all die" ala Light from Death Note and I'd be fine with it, because it's the isolated cases and the personalities around them that matter most to me. The world building doesn't really matter to me and, now, it seems that I should actively hope against it since it doesn't seem like they're able to pull it off effectively. Inevitably turns into a Zero Escape situation.

 

[UberTag]

Very disappointed how the series turned out.

Spoiler

Asahina better be okay.

Spoiler

She'll be okay but she'll never swim again. Hence she'll be useless and sink into a donut-eating despair.
She'll join the V3 cast as an overweight version of herself. The twist will be that it turns out she's actually the Impostor... again... somehow.

 

[Eumi]

The existence of "monokuma children" makes me think it isn't gonna be totally unattached to Junko's saga. I know he's a mascot so they can't discard him completely but he's also undeniably a Junko motif so there may be some unavoidable plot connection.

Not necessarily. If this is another form of canon, then things could be the same but for different reasons. Hell, my avatar is a character from a manga reboot who is exactly that: the same character, but has a different backstory, different goals, lived in a different time period etc.

 

[lazyproblems]

okey dokey, time to pick this thing apart.

• Chisa gave the videos to the leader of the FF instead of broadcasting the despair video to brainwash the world. She should have no qualms about this since its exactly what Junko did.

The only thing I can think of is that until the game started only Tengan could've initiated the broadcast. After they all died that would've left Ryota as the only person who was alive who could use it, so he set up those permissions prior to the game starting.

Still, why she didn't just show the video to the Branch Heads and plunge the world into utter chaos after removing the hopes of the world is never explained, unless her former self was somehow preventing her from doing so?

Was the extra person on the counter ever explained? Or is that just Hagakure?

No, they haven't explained it. They also haven't revealed who the 13th Branch Leader is.

Literally nothing this anime does will ruin DR1 and especially DR2 for me. I've completely disassociated with the source series.

I'm definitely ignoring this anime after it's over.

My biggest worry about the OVA is that it will, in fact, actually be connected to V3.

This worry is not just because I very much want V3 to actually be the reboot I expect it to be after all this, but because if it being connected is a twist, it will have to be spoiled to ward off all of us who can't play the game yet.

At this rate I expect some sort of connection or reference(s), I just hope they're minimal.

 

[dakkumauji]

Can somebody tell me how exactly Mitarai got to the surface? For that matter, how the fuck did Hagakure even find Naegi in the building? If they got to the underwater building afterwards, how did they learn about it?

Is it me or is there some huge plothole in there about the two buildings?

they showed future foundation soldiers getting into the underwater base through the ceiling

and now brainwashed soldiers escorting mitarai out of the underwater base

we can easily assume hagakure and togami came in with said soldiers

 

[h0tp0ck3t]

No, they haven't explained it. They also haven't revealed who the 13th Branch Leader is.

It's totally

Spoiler

Chiaki

PLOT TWIST!

 

[A Link to the Past]

Danganronpa should just be like Black Adder

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

Zero Escape won.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Zero Escape won.

Not really, no.

 

[The Bankslammer]

there are only losers

 

[dakkumauji]

It's totally

Spoiler

Chiaki

PLOT TWIST!

Spoiler

i'm expecting izuru for lols

 

[PK Gaming]

Zero Escape won.

 

[A Link to the Past]

I could write a book on everything they did wrong in Zero Time Dilemma, and everything they could have done to make it go write

A literal >100 page book

Danganronpa 3 is slowly tripping towards the finish line, and it is ultimately a disappointment, but even if it doesn't satisfy my wild theories, I think that the sum of its parts are much stronger than Zero Time Dilemma.

Also, Virtue's Last Reward had a useless character in the form of Quark and a kind of desperate attempt to capitalize on the success of Monokuma with Zero III, whereas Danganronpa 2 actively improved on nearly everything of the first game

The only thing that's worse in 2 than in 1

Is the (Improved) Hangman's Gambit

Literally how does this even work

 

[StrikeFirst117]

Future 12: Mind-hacking, the anime.
Also love the fact that the soldiers have as bad aim as stormtroopers.

 

[UberTag]

I could write a book on everything they did wrong in Zero Time Dilemma, and everything they could have done to make it go write

That should actually be the title of your book... "How Zero Time Dilemma made everything write... instead of right." I haven't actually finished my playthrough of it but I assume it has its own sweeping failure generalization to match Danganronpa 3's "everything was brainwashing videos" and Corpse Party Blood Drive's

Spoiler

"everything was Ayumi being a gullible idiot"

?

 

[Byronic Hero]

Zero Escape won.

I agree.

Spoiler

Mind hack

was stupid, but at least it successfully tied up most of the loose ends given in VLR. Though I think that had this DR3 been a a game, it would be closer for me, but nah.

Zero Escape won.

 

[RecRoulette]

I'm just glad that Professor Layton has prepared me in dealing with a series meeting a terrible end. DR3 and ZTD are gems compared to the bullshit that game rolled out

 

[McMoneyman]

Spoiler

She'll be okay but she'll never swim again. Hence she'll be useless and sink into a donut-eating despair.
She'll join the V3 cast as an overweight version of herself. The twist will be that it turns out she's actually the Impostor... again... somehow.

You meanie...

 

[Kalor]

Even with it's faults I've enjoyed the show, Future more so than Despair. Some of its problems would have been solved with more episodes but splitting the show in half made that difficult.

 

[JulianImp]

The only thing that's worse in 2 than in 1

Is the (Improved) Hangman's Gambit

Literally how does this even work

Be thankful that they didn't fit a (double improved) hangman's gambit into the anime, at least.

I kind of only liked the nonstop debates and the closing argument as far a courtroom mechanics go, since the rest tended to add weird stuff that used action game mechanics to move the plot forward at certain times, and don't appear to have any thematic relevance besides being very blunt metaphors for convincing someone, thinking about a word or a sequence of events and the like.

 

[Permanently A]

Zero Escape won.

But Ace Attorney still the king.

 

[T-Rex.]

Hajime about to Ultimate Hope Spirit Bomb the world on Thursday.

 

[GoldandBlue]

At this point the final episode should just have the ghost of Junko show up. Then have the ghost of everyone killed through out the series show up to send her spirit to Hell.

 

[JulianImp]

Talking about my issues with using brainwashing as a device, I get that it was a simple way to wrap things up in a single cour, but like others and I have already pointed out, almost everyone in the 77th class harbored some kind of resentment or weakness that would've made them ripe for Junk-o's pickings, so having them all get paralyzed and brainwashed at once was just a simple and convenient way to get things done with as fast and as simply as possible, which screamed lazy writing and time constraints.

But Ace Attorney still the king.

Since we're talking AA, did the anime get any better? It was meh well into the Gourdy case so I ended up dropping it before its final episode.

 

[Maebe]

Not necessarily. If this is another form of canon, then things could be the same but for different reasons. Hell, my avatar is a character from a manga reboot who is exactly that: the same character, but has a different backstory, different goals, lived in a different time period etc.

Good point, but I still feel wary because Kodaka seriously loves Junko.

 

[Sgt.Pepper]

I sure as hell "hope" Mitarai doesn't get a redemption bs.

Worst character.

 

[Burbeting]

If someone makes an abridged version of this, Munakata better be dubbed as "Super High School Level Drama Queen" due to how he was portrayed 75% of the time.

 

[The Creator]

What episode is that scene from?

 

[Doctor_Mosh]

well so the last episode on thursday will be 1 hour long?
or am i mistaking, i kinda believe i read something about that.

 

[NEO0MJ]

But Ace Attorney still the king.

The benefit of a story that doesn't take itself too seriously.

 

[Azure Phoenix]

I guess that makes two ADV/VN trilogies this year that end with a "what the fuck was that all about?". Hope better have some decent answers, or this has just been 24 episodes of complete stupidity and Zero Time Dilemma branded Complex Motives™

 

[Eumi]

One day people will accept ZTD's

Spoiler

MIND HACKING

as the work of genius it really is.

Spoiler

Im legit serious. I love it so much and think I'm crazy because of how much everyone else hates it.

 

[NotLiquid]

Future 12-... no, Danganronpa 3 in general

This made me respect Zero Time Dilemma so much more honestly

 

[NeonZ]

God I wish Munakata was the mastermind instead.

My fanfiction: I keep everything the same except Future 12. Tengan is a red herring and the real mastermind is Munakata. Munakata became obsessed with rooting out Despair because (from a chance encounter with Nagito) he believes that if even a single seed of Despair remains, Hope can never truly bloom because Despair will always grow and always be able to corrupt Hope. He has always held these beliefs subconsciously but his worst fears are realized when he learned that Chisa was secretly Despair and that Juzo was lying to him.

Munakata's interactions with Tengan - questioning him about the killer and being incredibly disturbed by the answer, alongside needing Monaka's computer to learn the NGs, pretty much ruled him out from being the mastermind. At that point, the only way he still could have been behind it all would be if he had actually erased his own memories of planning everything.

 

[Yasumi]

Zero Escape won.

Don't kid yourself.

 

[A Link to the Past]

I guess that makes two ADV/VN trilogies this year that end with a "what the fuck was that all about?". Hope better have some decent answers, or this has just been 24 episodes of complete stupidity and Zero Time Dilemma branded Complex Motives™

Nagito is going to be the mastermind to end all masterminds

This was the first prediction I made of this show, and I guess the least crazy since it's like one of the only ones that could still come true lol

My disappointing failed predictions:

1. Great Gozu is a villain
2. Real Miaya is a villain
3. Juzo's NG will be something else

Ultimately, I give you my final prediction maybe

The Hope anime is being utilized by many different parties.

1. Tengan, who forced Mitarai to use it by creating a situation where without it, despair could never otherwise be defeated
2. Mitarai, who created it
3. Nagito, who wants to experience a hope to end all despair, at the most desperate moment
4. Chisa, who wants Mitarai to upload it - because instead of instilling hope, it will instill despair in the guise of hope, and thereby justifying Munakata's actions to some extent if he is indeed not the mastermind

 

[The Silver]

Nagito is going to be the mastermind to end all masterminds

This was the first prediction I made of this show, and I guess the least crazy since it's like one of the only ones that could still come true lol

My disappointing failed predictions:

1. Great Gozu is a villain
2. Real Miaya is a villain
3. Juzo's NG will be something else

Ultimately, I give you my final prediction maybe

The Hope anime is being utilized by many different parties.

1. Tengan, who forced Mitarai to use it by creating a situation where without it, despair could never otherwise be defeated
2. Mitarai, who created it
3. Nagito, who wants to experience a hope to end all despair, at the most desperate moment
4. Chisa, who wants Mitarai to upload it - because instead of instilling hope, it will instill despair in the guise of hope, and thereby justifying Munakata's actions to some extent if he is indeed not the mastermind

boy are you gonna be disappointed when Nagito doesn't get anything but a cameo showing how excited he is for hope

 

[TheGeniusArcana]

Zero Escape won.

Being slightly less offensively bad doesn't really constitute a win and it's still super close. If anything, we lost in both cases.

Despite my feelings of DR3 being a little worse, it's easily been far more enjoyable than ZTD for me.

 

[A Link to the Past]

I've already prepared myself for disappointment TBH

If all he does is cameo, then the show is ZTD levels of disappointment. Not less - ZTD absolutely doesn't earn the right to be better - but not any higher either. I have some faith that this is the case though.

1. Nagito's entire arc has been about hope vs. hope, and that despair is just a supporting character in that battle.
2. The climax of the entire story is a battle of Mitarai's hope vs. Naegi's hope.

I'm not sure ATM whether he had anything to do with getting Mitarai into that situation or helping the killing game to take place in the first place (either directly or indirectly), but if it is not that, I expect that this is just a matter of Nagito's luck making all of the pieces fall into place so that he may witness two ultimate hopes clashing. I mean, how perfect a situation is this for Nagito? Izuru, Naegi, Mitarai, Munakata, and himself - all people who have been considered, consider themselves, or want to be considered, as Ultimate Hope, all in the same room. All we need is Chiaki, the hope of Class 77, to show up, and then it'll be a party.

Honestly, if I wasn't trying to predict what was going to happen with DR3, I don't think I would have enjoyed it quite as much as I have It was fun while it lasted.

 

[Pop-O-Matic]

Honestly, they should have just done the DR2 adaptation instead of this.

 

[NEO0MJ]

I have some faith that this is the case though.

Let it go, and move on.

 

[DrunkShogun]

I guess that makes two ADV/VN trilogies this year that end with a "what the fuck was that all about?". Hope better have some decent answers, or this has just been 24 episodes of complete stupidity and Zero Time Dilemma branded Complex Motives™

This got me thinking to ask whether any visual novel franchise with a story continuing in multiple games ended with a satisfying conclusion.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Let it go, and move on.

Don't lose hope now

 

[The Silver]

This got me thinking to ask whether any visual novel franchise with a story continuing in multiple games ended with a satisfying conclusion.

I don't remember Higurashi's ending pissing me off,(though I don't remember loving it either) of course Umineko went so far up its own ass it came out the other side.(though it was still entertaining)

 

[Ludger Kresnik]

Honestly, they should have just done the DR2 adaptation instead of this.

Where's the option for neither?

 

[FluxWaveZ]

This got me thinking to ask whether any visual novel franchise with a story continuing in multiple games ended with a satisfying conclusion.

I mean, I'd count the first Ace Attorney trilogy being like this with the Fey clan through line, and it has a fantastic conclusion.

 

[mrmickfran]

Just finished episode 12 and trying to figure out what happened

where did it all go wrong

Future 12-... no, Danganronpa 3 in general

This made me respect Zero Time Dilemma so much more honestly

Someone shop Kodaka's face onto this pls