Support NeoGAF

[Jinfash]

I did not find this fight easy but I finally conquered it today. The bloodred moss is helpful I guess but I found that it just left me vulnerable. I didn't wind up using it when I finally beat her. When you see her footprints get close together, run around her and try to attack a couple of times, but don't use up all your stamina. I had to be very patient with making her visible because I couldn't ever land a pyro hit on her when she was invisible. When I could finally see her the fight gets easier, but if you take too long to inflict enough damage she will go invisible again so you need to beast.

Yeah, I stopped using the Bloodred moss altogether. I was aware of the footprints, but it took too many hits for her to appear on my first few tries. What I did (on my third or fourth try lol) was wait for her attack, block, spray Fire Surge everywhere. I did that 3-4 times until she appeared, then I Fire Orbed her into oblivion. (Pyromancy Glove + 12)

My only regret was that I was able to cut her tail, but I was desperate to finish the fight I didn't care at the time.

I liked Aramis overall. The only parts I thought were annoying, was dealing withe skeletons and Knight on the bridge's stretch before the boss every time (having to get close to trigger the ambush, the second archer, mixed with the Knight), and the boss herself when my tactics weren't clicking.

Edit:

Question: how do you get the Brass armor set in Anor Londo. The guide shows it next to the second bonfire, but there's a statue blocking the suggested route. Is there a way around it?

 

[Owzers]

Do you have a 100% physical block shield, Iron Skin pyromancy? Iron Skin makes all bosses super easy.

lately all the boss battles i've fought have been me awkwardly brute forcing my way to victory doing everything poorly as possible and eventually winning. Four Kings was no different. *slowly flips between 4 pyro skills to get Iron Flesh back, taps the button to use it, doesn't register but i thought it did, take damage, notice i took damage and it doesn't show Iron Flesh on, cycle back to iron flesh, use iron flesh, heal twice, start hacking*

Ugly battles.

 

[DigitalDevil]

I just rang the second bell and I haven't employed any sorcery/pyro/miracles yet save the soul arrow (which I never use).

Is a pure melee playthrough viable? Our should I get breaking on the spells?

 

[DangerousDave]

Died 5 times with Taurus
Died 3 times with Gargoyles
Died once with Capra

And I died 5 times with butterfly and I'm not able to take more than 1/10 of life, so I'll skip it until I ring the other bell (or I get some spells).

So, the most difficult the battle is, the less times I die (and the easier the battle, I die more times). I'll kill those 4 kings without being hit.

 

[x3r0123]

just realized taurus is completely an optional boss..

 

[Psy-Phi]

Not understanding the dislike for the last leg of the game. I did use the shortcut through Lost Izalith, but I later went on down just to see what I was missing, other than the pain in the ass HDR lava, it was good, and what I'd expect a place like hell to be. Heck, Demon Ruins was super short, though not as short as Kiln, but even that area gave me a desolate feeling, perfect for the way the entire game feels honestly, dead with patches of unearth here and there. But I say dead in a good way, it creates such a sense of a world devoid of life that I can't help but be in awe of it all.

Other than the lack of a cutscene before the final boss, which I believe they did to put pressure on you as soon as you walk in, like with a few other bosses, iwas very satisified. Tomb of Giants had amazing atmosphere, Crystal Caverns was almost as frightening,

Spoiler

now I can see....but I can't see the ground in some places

. I enjoyed something about every area in this game. I'm surprised others weren't as impressed with the small touches, and the broad strokes of each area.

 

[Aeana]

Tomb of the Giants is pretty much terrible. Even with cast light. :|

 

[charsace]

Once again I'm back on the road building a paladin that wields big weapons. I've named my character Paksenarrion. Too bad you can't give a title to your character because I would use Soldier of the High Lord.

 

[Aselith]

just realized taurus is completely an optional boss..

Only if you have Master Key.

Edit: Well, on second thought, I guess you could go through Darkroot Basin and then Valley of Drakes to get there which would make Gaping Dragon an optional boss as well.

Edit2: Oh wait I thought you meant Capra. How is Taurus optional? You have to go through him to get to Undead Parish.

 

[killertofu]

Okay, I'm really getting sick of the Depths. What's the shortest route from the bon fire to the boss?

 

[Y2Kev]

I assume Great Hollows, Ash Lake, and Painted World all fall under the first two-thirds. I really like the optional areas (except Drake Valley, which was just short and dull).

Great Hollow is kinda mean, but it's okay.

My idea of shit is

Spoiler

Lost Izalith.

That's not design. That's a clusterfuck.

 

[Psy-Phi]

Tomb of the Giants is pretty much terrible. Even with cast light. :|

I disagree. The lack of vision gives a serious case of dread and fright that you just can't get with light. And when you find that lantern its the most glorious feeling, until you realize it's that or a shield. Swapping back n forth, using it to see your path for a split second looking for the next thing that might kill you. Then prepping to fight using your memory of what you saw.

My favorite part, even though I died thrice, was the beginning. Never has a game made me so afraid to go on. I was creeping so slowly, and still fell to my undeath. Loved it. This game is for masochists, and that area was the most masochisitic of them all.

 

[Yo Gotti]

Not understanding the dislike for the last leg of the game. I did use the shortcut through Lost Izalith, but I later went on down just to see what I was missing, other than the pain in the ass HDR lava, it was good, and what I'd expect a place like hell to be. Heck, Demon Ruins was super short, though not as short as Kiln, but even that area gave me a desolate feeling, perfect for the way the entire game feels honestly, dead with patches of unearth here and there. But I say dead in a good way, it creates such a sense of a world devoid of life that I can't help but be in awe of it all.

Other than the lack of a cutscene before the final boss, which I believe they did to put pressure on you as soon as you walk in, like with a few other bosses, iwas very satisified. Tomb of Giants had amazing atmosphere, Crystal Caverns was almost as frightening,

Spoiler

now I can see....but I can't see the ground in some places

. I enjoyed something about every area in this game. I'm surprised others weren't as impressed with the small touches, and the broad strokes of each area.

I loved Kiln.

Spoiler

Ashes and Black Knights, great atmosphere. The best farming spot in the game too.

I enjoyed Lost Izalith and TOTG also. TOTG was the most paranoid level in the game, even then I died only 3-4 times getting through it, Blight Town and the Painted World gave me more trouble difficulty wise. Lost Izalith... was hell in that beginning segment, but once you get through it the rest of the stage is just as good as earlier stages IMO.

Spoiler

The surprise pit with the 4 tentacle monsters made my skin crawl.. I hate those things.

. Overall I had a lot of fun in that level.

Demon Ruins gave me a chance to flex my leveled character against some of the

Spoiler

weaker bosses of the game.

It was an exercise in reflexes to not get hit when fighting 2

Spoiler

Taurus Demon's or Capra Demon's

at once. It's a classic gauntlet.

 

[vilmer_]

Okay, I'm really getting sick of the Depths. What's the shortest route from the bon fire to the boss?

There's a ladder going down hidden behind some boxes after you make a right from the bonfire.

 

[Insaniac]

ugh.... i wish they would hurry up and patch multiplayer. It feels utterly pointless sometimes. I really enjoy playing co-op but I have to literally sit in one area for too long to get summoned because every other doorway I walk through removes my summon sign.

 

[x3r0123]

Only if you have Master Key.

Edit: Well, on second thought, I guess you could go through Darkroot Basin and then Valley of Drakes to get there which would make Gaping Dragon an optional boss as well.

Edit2: Oh wait I thought you meant Capra. How is Taurus optional? You have to go through him to get to Undead Parish.

you just said it. Or go through new londo ruins, get the key and lower the water. Go through the valley of drake

 

[JVIDICAN]

Okay, I'm really getting sick of the Depths. What's the shortest route from the bon fire to the boss?

head out from the bonfire room take a right, drop down the ladder in the corner of the room, take the stairs down go to the end of that room and take another right.
you can skip most of the depths by using the waterfall in the giant rats room too.

 

[Aselith]

you just said it

So the Master Key? I mean I guess. Seems like a lot of extra work to skip a easy boss. I dunno that it would help speed runners too much as that's a long way out of your way.

As for New Londo...that's not possible. He won't give you the key until after you get the Lordvessel or does he drop it if you kill him?

 

[DigitalDevil]

just realized taurus is completely an optional boss..

The deets, man, the deets....

 

[Kalnos]

So the Master Key? I mean I guess. Seems like a lot of extra work to skip a easy boss. I dunno that it would help speed runners too much as that's a long way out of your way.

As for New Londo...that's not possible. He won't give you the key until after you get the Lordvessel or does he drop it if you kill him?

If you kill him he does drop it IIRC.

 

[corrosivefrost]

So the Master Key? I mean I guess. Seems like a lot of extra work to skip a easy boss. I dunno that it would help speed runners too much as that's a long way out of your way.

As for New Londo...that's not possible. He won't give you the key until after you get the Lordvessel or does he drop it if you kill him?

kill him.

 

[Ghost_Protocol]

Man the boss fights in this game are just ridiculous. Puts everything else in the industry to shame (except maybe SoTc)

 

[Aeana]

I disagree. The lack of vision gives a serious case of dread and fright that you just can't get with light. And when you find that lantern its the most glorious feeling, until you realize it's that or a shield. Swapping back n forth, using it to see your path for a split second looking for the next thing that might kill you. Then prepping to fight using your memory of what you saw.

My favorite part, even though I died thrice, was the beginning. Never has a game made me so afraid to go on. I was creeping so slowly, and still fell to my undeath. Loved it. This game is for masochists, and that area was the most masochisitic of them all.

Cool.
I hated it. I hated having to go through that room with the wheel skeletons every time I died on the way to the Tomb, and I hated being destroyed by giant skeletons coming out of nowhere and being ambushed from behind by archers while in total darkness. I finally made it to the bonfire and shut it off.

 

[Psy-Phi]

head out from the bonfire room take a right, drop down the ladder in the corner of the room, take the stairs down go to the end of that room and take another right.
you can skip most of the depths by using the waterfall in the giant rats room too.

Uh, you can't go that way until you open the door, and opening that door requires getting a key on your way through The Depths (or

Spoiler

Dropping down behind where the Fat Chef was, killing the Giant Rat, grabbing the key from the corpse on the bars, then sliding down on the left side,

AND THEN opening the door from there).

 

[Jinfash]

I know this has been asked many times, but search is as borked as always, so here goes: Silver Knight Archers of Anor Londo?

I thought Wolf Ring + Iron Flesh would work, but noooooooo. So it just "run like crazy and pray you don't get shot"?

 

[MechaX]

Personally, I think Lost Izalith doesn't get enough hate.

There is no semblance of level design in that area. Instead, From just decided to copy and past 30 T-Rex/Dragon legs in a lava filled area and tried to justify that as for the sake of "challenge." In addition, let's also have the game chug the moment you aggro more than one of these things. Also, good luck finding your bloodstain if you die in a field of bright red orange lava. Think there's treasure here? No, there are literally T-Rex legs guarding nooks that lead to nowhere; so why even place them there to begin with?

 

[demosthenes]

I know this has been asked many times, but search is as borked as always, so here goes: Silver Knight Archers of Anor Londo?

I thought Wolf Ring + Iron Flesh would work, but noooooooo. So it just "run like crazy and pray you don't get shot"?

You know the the little tower you run down to where they start shooting at you that has the 2 gargoyles in it? There are 2 spots in there (facing them) next to the columns that you can hit them where they won't shoot at you. Use poison arrows and wait.

 

[Haunted]

I disagree. The lack of vision gives a serious case of dread and fright that you just can't get with light. And when you find that lantern its the most glorious feeling, until you realize it's that or a shield. Swapping back n forth, using it to see your path for a split second looking for the next thing that might kill you. Then prepping to fight using your memory of what you saw.

My favorite part, even though I died thrice, was the beginning. Never has a game made me so afraid to go on. I was creeping so slowly, and still fell to my undeath. Loved it. This game is for masochists, and that area was the most masochisitic of them all.

I had hoped they'd done away with that for Dark Souls.

Then I saw what being cursed does.


*sigh* From Software, man. Able to craft atmospheric worlds as fuck, but it seems they can't help but fuck up with shit design decisions somewhere.

 

[Aeana]

I don't really agree with the assertion that this game is for mascochists. In most cases, it is very reasonable. The game is designed in such a way that when you do accomplish something, it feels like you accomplished something. I feel that most of the stuff in the game is quite fair.

 

[Jinfash]

I had hoped they'd done away with that for Dark Souls.

Then I saw what being cursed does.


*sigh* From Software, man. Able to craft atmospheric worlds as fuck, but it seems they can't help but fuck up with shit design decisions somewhere.

Fwiw, Curse doesn't stack anymore. So now it's basically being stuck in Soul form.

You know the the little tower you run down to where they start shooting at you that has the 2 gargoyles in it? There are 2 spots in there (facing them) next to the columns that you can hit them where they won't shoot at you. Use poison arrows and wait.

Uh oh, I have zero poison arrows.

Time to backtrack, I guess!

 

[Felix Lighter]

Great Hollow is kinda mean, but it's okay.

My idea of shit is

Spoiler

Lost Izalith.

That's not design. That's a clusterfuck.

They relied on gimmicks instead of level design for

Spoiler

Lost Izalith, Crystal Cave and the Tomb of the Giants. Ultimately, I enjoyed the Tomb after getting the lantern, Cystal Caves was short enough to be bareable but Lost Izalith and the boss battle were the absolute low point.

 

[IJoel]

I'm curious about something I've noticed recently. Every now and then a small ring of light will show up briefly, then disappear. What does it mean?

 

[Kalnos]

I don't think being cursed is that unfair. By the time you become cursed you will have already met 2 NPCs that sell a cure and it tells you what you should do once afflicted.

As far as zones, Lost Izalith and ToG are the only two that seem to get criticized for being utter shit. Blight Town does some but it really isn't that bad outside of the framerate.

 

[Owzers]

Cool.
I hated it. I hated having to go through that room with the wheel skeletons every time I died on the way to the Tomb, and I hated being destroyed by giant skeletons coming out of nowhere and being ambushed from behind by archers while in total darkness. I finally made it to the bonfire and shut it off.

I've played Dark Souls for 60 hours now, i'd estimate only 15 of those hours involved me having some type of fun, including boss grinding on Nito and Ornstein because i like helping people.

Ended up beating Four Kings and now i got lost in Duke Archives after running around in circles for half an hour. I think i might just sell the game and end the addiction.

 

[Psy-Phi]

I don't really agree with the assertion that this game is for mascochists. In most cases, it is very reasonable. The game is designed in such a way that when you do accomplish something, it feels like you accomplished something. I feel that most of the stuff in the game is quite fair.

That's because you have masochistic tendencies. Put this game in the hands of someone that plays hand holding, health regenerating, quick action titles, and see if they feel like this game is fair .

I'm curious about something I've noticed recently. Every now and then a small ring of light will show up briefly, then disappear. What does it mean?

I saw that too around undead burg and parish. Never figured it out, but I assume it's to condition your curiosity.

 

[Psy-Phi]

Double trouble.

 

[Haunted]

Fwiw, Curse doesn't stack anymore. So now it's basically being stuck in Soul form.

At least they're listening/re-evaluating as they go. That's encouraging.

Whoever came up with the concept in the first place should be shot anyway. Just to be sure. That's not good risk/reward design. That's just being overly punishing for the sake of being punishing.

 

[tokkun]

I know this has been asked many times, but search is as borked as always, so here goes: Silver Knight Archers of Anor Londo?

I thought Wolf Ring + Iron Flesh would work, but noooooooo. So it just "run like crazy and pray you don't get shot"?

Other than the poison arrow strategy that was mentioned, if you equip the fog ring you can sprint up into the face of one of the archers and the other one will stop shooting at you. You still need to be careful not to get knocked off the ledge.

Fog ring makes that part a lot easier in general since they don't agro unless you get pretty close to them.

I don't really agree with the assertion that this game is for mascochists. In most cases, it is very reasonable. The game is designed in such a way that when you do accomplish something, it feels like you accomplished something. I feel that most of the stuff in the game is quite fair.

The game would be a lot more fair if the comment and blood stain systems worked as well as it did in Demon's Souls. There are a lot of "Surprise!" kills that can be avoided that way like Mimics, unexpected ledges, collapsing floors, ambushes, over-powered early game enemies, dragon fire, etc.

 

[Ra1den]

I am also one that doesn't understand the dislike for the later parts of the game. I think the Demon Ruins in particular are fantastically designed, I really like the contrast from the other area designs. I love how massive and open they seem. Lost Izalith also, that was intense, even if the boss was easy. I think the only area that straight up sucks is Blighttown, and that's due to the framerate. New Londo Ruins was a pain in the ass also, I guess.

 

[Jinfash]

I'm curious about something I've noticed recently. Every now and then a small ring of light will show up briefly, then disappear. What does it mean?

I saw that too around undead burg and parish. Never figured it out, but I assume it's to condition your curiosity.

I'm not sure about "a ring of light" but I was curious about the golden/yellow fog you seem to randomly absorb at times. I just figured out today that it's a +1 flask, probably due to someone from your session kindling the last bonfire you rested at.

 

[Ra1den]

There are a lot of "Surprise!" kills that can be avoided that way like Mimics, unexpected ledges, collapsing floors, ambushes, over-powered early game enemies, dragon fire, etc.

A lot? I thought there were hardly any. And as for the mimics, I hate those damn things( in EVERY game, what a stupid idea), but after the first time it happens, you learn to attack every chest first.

 

[Aeana]

That's because you have masochistic tendencies. Put this game in the hands of someone that plays hand holding, health regenerating, quick action titles, and see if they feel like this game is fair .

I think that says more about them than me.

The game would be a lot more fair if the comment and blood stain systems worked as well as it did in Demon's Souls. There are a lot of "Surprise!" kills that can be avoided that way like Mimics, unexpected ledges, collapsing floors, ambushes, over-powered early game enemies, dragon fire, etc.

I think mimics are pretty fair, because if you look at the chests that are mimics, you can see them breathing. Once I noticed that, I just look at every chest before I open it.

 

[corrosivefrost]

At least they're listening/re-evaluating as they go. That's encouraging.

Whoever came up with the concept in the first place should be shot anyway. Just to be sure. That's not good risk/reward design. That's just being overly punishing for the sake of being punishing.

I disagree. I've been cursed all of three times. Once was intentional. The other two came from (1) not realizing my curse protection was lower in my current garb and (2) pushing my luck and not being patient/careful. The brilliance of being able to get cursed intentionally to permanently deal with the ghosts at new londo is a stroke of genius. I was dreading the hell out of that place until someone told me that.

 

[x3r0123]

So the Master Key? I mean I guess. Seems like a lot of extra work to skip a easy boss. I dunno that it would help speed runners too much as that's a long way out of your way.

As for New Londo...that's not possible. He won't give you the key until after you get the Lordvessel or does he drop it if you kill him?

as people mentioned already, he drops it once you kill him. Samething with andrei dropping the crest.

mainly people don't skip this boss because he's easy. Heck, i can one-shot him

 

[Jinfash]

I don't think a single mimic surprised me so far thanks to user comments.

 

[Hawkian]

Can you summon help for the new londo boss?

 

[Felix Lighter]

Can you summon help for the new londo boss?

Yeah. I helped a guy last night.

 

[corrosivefrost]

So the FROM software thing who was plaguing people early? Was it just a high level phantom? Or was it some monster from the game showing up in people's games?

 

[Sullichin]

Fwiw, Curse doesn't stack anymore. So now it's basically being stuck in Soul form.



Uh oh, I have zero poison arrows.

Time to backtrack, I guess!

I did it without poison arrows. I ran up to the right side guy, rolled through his arrow when I was on the ledge, blocked like crazy and waited for him to bounce off the edge. I never even killed the second guy

 

[Alucrid]

Progress question:

I downed the Gaping Dragon. Where should I go? Blighttown or should I head back to Darkroot Gardens since I haven't really explored that place yet?