• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

David Cameron: "...we will provide resettlement for thousands more Syrian refugees. "

Status
Not open for further replies.
I'm glad the offer is only for people still in Syria and not those already within the EU. This way it is only for actual refugees, not economic migrants like the people already in Hungary, Turkey, Greece, Italy, Austria, etc.

So much this. This is a great decision for this very reason. People trying to escape war and persecution should be helped as much as possible, those fleeing for economic reasons much less so.

There are plenty of refugees currently in those countries, but as you said there are also many economic migrants. This focuses aid where it is needed.
 

liquidtmd

Banned
Im not a massive Cameron fan but he's in a difficult position here and invariably whatever he does is going to draw fire depending on a person's ideology.

And then you've just got the people who make comments along the 'fucking Cameron' lines whatever the situation for all occasions without really coming up with an alternative

This news is a good move
 
Im not a massive Cameron fan but he's in a difficult position here and invariably whatever he does is going to draw fire depending on a person's ideology.

And then you've just got the people who make comments along the 'fucking Cameron' lines whatever the situation for all occasions without really coming up with an alternative

This news is a good move

Whatever he does he's going to receive lots of criticism from someone. There's been calls for him to do more and he has stepped up and done it (regardless of whether it was due to pressure) and now he's facing criticism.
 
The polarity in the European response is fascinating. Some countries are all for it. Some countries are vehemently against it.

I wish wealthy gulf countries would take this stance too.
Frankly, countries like mine (Italy) have been hit so bad by migrants flux these last years, it's not even funny..
Because most countries like to count, and on paper they have more migrant..
Unless we start counting the illegal migrant hiding on th borderà of society without being accounted for by any estimation..
If you do that, i'm sure the number of migrants in Italy would raise DRAMMATICALLY..
 
There has been a lot of anti-Saudi propaganda
regarding intake of refugees from Syria. It should
be known:

Saudi Arabia has suspended all immigration laws
regarding Syrians, regardless of how they entered
the country (Umrah, Hajj, Visit or Business visa)
they shall stay.

ALL Syrian lqamahs (residency permits) & visas
are valid & renewed until the war in Syria ends.
This is not a new rule, it was enacted during
Prince Naif's lifetime, the late Crown Prince.

The Saudi Arabian Ministry of Immigration
enacted laws treating all Syrian children the same
as their Saudi counterparts.

All Syrian children receive free healthcare along
with their parents and enjoy a free education.

Syrian parents are allowed to work as they
please without the fear of Labor Law violation/
penalty.

Saudi Arabia has also established or funded
multiple refugee camps in Jordan, Turkey
elsewhere


Saudi Arabia has been doing this for five years now, I just dont understand why internet are eager to spread any negative information regarding Saudi Arabia without checking facts, not just internet the western media in general. Its just baffling to me.

But that doesn't seem to be about refugees though, just a visa status change/extension for Syrians already in Saudi?
 
But that doesn't seem to be about refugees though, just a visa status change/extension for Syrians already in Saudi?

I don't think Saudi Arabia or the other GCC countries have offered a single place for refugees. I like how they stipulate visas are renewed until the Syrian war ends too, like imagine if European countries said in a couple of years the war is over now get out. Absolutely shameful. People would not be drowning if the GCC countries opened up to refugees.
 
Whatever he does he's going to receive lots of criticism from someone. There's been calls for him to do more and he has stepped up and done it (regardless of whether it was due to pressure) and now he's facing criticism.

I know, poor Cameron. Not like he's a hypocrite or anything, nah.
 

kharma45

Member
Im not a massive Cameron fan but he's in a difficult position here and invariably whatever he does is going to draw fire depending on a person's ideology.

And then you've just got the people who make comments along the 'fucking Cameron' lines whatever the situation for all occasions without really coming up with an alternative

This news is a good move

It's so easy to bash the 'evil' Tories.
 
Hm this is an odd one after all I am constantly being told that we "can't afford the NHS, we can't afford the welfare state, we can't afford all this social housing, we can't afford cancer treatments for those dying". Yet all of a sudden there is money available to bring in 4000 refugees (all that will need long term support costing millions) and hey lets chuck another 100 mill on top of the 900 mill we have already spent.

This government is responsibly for the death of thousands of it's own people through it's policies on welfare. It has carried out a campaign of persecution against some of the poorest in our society.

Now I am not against helping Syrian refugees (or any refugees) but if we can afford to do that then we can afford to stop the huge welfare cuts and decimation of the safety nets in British society.
 

pulsemyne

Member
Hm this is an odd one after all I am constantly being told that we "can't afford the NHS, we can't afford the welfare state, we can't afford all this social housing, we can't afford cancer treatments for those dying". Yet all of a sudden there is money available to bring in 4000 refugees (all that will need long term support costing millions) and hey lets chuck another 100 mill on top of the 900 mill we have already spent.

This government is responsibly for the death of thousands of it's own people through it's policies on welfare. It has carried out a campaign of persecution against some of the poorest in our society.

Now I am not against helping Syrian refugees (or any refugees) but if we can afford to do that then we can afford to stop the huge welfare cuts and decimation of the safety nets in British society.

As I said before the welfare cuts have nothing to do with money, it's all about ideology. And also the fact that IDS is a five star shithead.
 
So what exactly is America doing to help these refugees?

Not as much as I'd like for us to be doing. By October I believe we'll only have admitted roughly 2,000. Other than that the US has donated just over US$4 billion, but that's just money, when what these people need is a home. Typically the US accepts 70,000 refugees a year but there's apparently a fear in the government in allowing terror groups to slip in with these refugees. It's an unfounded fear in my opinion, requiring checks that can take years. In any case, I fail to see how America's actions (or inaction) should be relevant to the decision of other countries in regards to the refugees. These are people we're talking about. Those saying things like 'this country isn't doing what it can so why should we help them?' are childish and lacking in empathy.
 

Moreche

Member
People wonder why a certain % of population are against immigration but I wonder what what happen if I, a Christian white male turned up on Syrias border had the roles been reversed?
 
People wonder why a certain % of population are against immigration but I wonder what what happen if I, a Christian white male turned up on Syrias border had the roles been reversed?

I assume you're implying you'd be denied asylum by the Syrian government. Which may be true, I don't actually know. But how is that relevant? We're not talking about taking in the Syrian government that would deny you. We're talking about taking in downtrodden people.
 

TCRS

Banned
Aside from legal applications, how are you determining the difference between illegal immigrants and refugees when they're trying to hop on the back of trucks or sail their way across open water?

I would say let other countries in europe do the sorting (like germany for example) and then send them over here. I don't think there are any syrian refugees coming directly to the UK. so it's pretty easy to filter I would say.
 

KingSnake

The Birthday Skeleton
Some people keep throwing out the term "economic migrants" and that clearly shows what kind of media and parties are they following. Because in the real world the term refugee or asylum seeker is very clearly defined in the international treaties. You can use whatever word helps your conscience or bigotry, but you can't change the reality. Also, asylum is granted based on some clear criteria. And you can't obtain asylum in Europe unless you're already on European soil because the law is made purposely stupid. But don't let laws and common sense stop your hate.
 

Africanus

Member
People wonder why a certain % of population are against immigration but I wonder what what happen if I, a Christian white male turned up on Syrias border had the roles been reversed?



The government is a corrupt and flawed institution. However, the populace is a different matter.
I mean, 10% of the population is Christian, and many Syrians are white males.
 

KingSnake

The Birthday Skeleton
People wonder why a certain % of population are against immigration but I wonder what what happen if I, a Christian white male turned up on Syrias border had the roles been reversed?

Syrian recieved Christian Palestinian refugees in the past.
 

Moreche

Member
I assume you're implying you'd be denied asylum by the Syrian government. Which may be true, I don't actually know. But how is that relevant? We're not talking about taking in the Syrian government that would deny you. We're talking about taking in downtrodden people.
And what if I was downtrodden and would like to continue practising my religion while hoping that I will be rehoused and have my children join their education system and still retain their Christian beliefs?
Edit: do you seriously believe that this wouldn't be an issue?
Also would they be looking refuge here if we didn't have the welfare system that we currently have?
 
Some people keep throwing out the term "economic migrants" and that clearly shows what kind of media and parties are they following. Because in the real world the term refugee or asylum seeker is very clearly defined in the international treaties. You can use whatever word helps your conscience or bigotry, but you can't change the reality. Also, asylum is granted based on some clear criteria. And you can't obtain asylum in Europe unless you're already on European soil because the law is made purposely stupid. But don't let laws and common sense stop your hate.
Yeah, I'm so tired of seeing that expression. it's a pretty good indication of whether I can just completely disregard their opinion as trash and uninformed though.
 
Some people keep throwing out the term "economic migrants" and that clearly shows what kind of media and parties are they following. Because in the real world the term refugee or asylum seeker is very clearly defined in the international treaties. You can use whatever word helps your conscience or bigotry, but you can't change the reality. Also, asylum is granted based on some clear criteria. And you can't obtain asylum in Europe unless you're already on European soil because the law is made purposely stupid. But don't let laws and common sense stop your hate.

There is a difference though. There are people who want to leave for economic gain and are not at risk, and there are those that are genuinely at risk/in danger. Sure, the common goal is a better life, but there is a clear difference. People understandably want to help those who are most at risk and most in need. The figures that people are throwing around are near certainly heavily biased, but you can say with certainty that not all of the migrants are what should be considered refugees. Again, I'm not saying all or even many of them are economic migrants, just that some are.

I feel for both parties, but there is a difference - even if the label is somewhat unfair.

And for reference I am 100% in favour of helping these people.
 

Moreche

Member
There is a difference though. There are people who want to leave for economic gain and are not at risk, and there are those that are genuinely at risk/in danger. Sure, the common goal is a better life, but there is a clear difference. People understandably want to help those who are most at risk and most in need.

I feel for both parties, but there is a difference - even if the label is somewhat unfair.

And for reference I am 100% in favour of helping these people.
I agree, living in the UK I still hear and see British people who cost the govt. thousands every month through welfare, education and health through their four bedroom house with six kids and only work 3-4 hours a day all while claiming disability because of a crick in their fucking neck complain about these refugees.
It's a flawed system that'll never get fixed.
 
And what if I was downtrodden and would like to continue practising my religion while hoping that I will be rehoused and have my children join their education system and still retain their Christian beliefs?
Edit: do you seriously believe that this wouldn't be an issue?
Also would they be looking refuge here if we didn't have the welfare system that we currently have?

My question was how is any of that relevant? Just because you may be oppressed by another country's government means nothing about whether you should accept that country's refugees. Hell, the fact I may be oppressed by another government is more reason for me to want to accept their refugees. Because if I'd be oppressed by a country then there's a very good chance many of those refugees themselves were being oppressed. And I assume most are looking for a new home with a country that will grant them basic human rights and an opportunity to live peacefully. Many European countries are their best shot at that life. I don't understand why you're making this about religion. These people are suffering. Wouldn't the Christian thing to do be to help them regardless of their beliefs?
 

Go_Ly_Dow

Member
The Tories are evil.

Trickle down economics.

They actually believe that stimulating the top and the rich will make the wealth trickle down. Sure it will, but more of it will be retained and increase the inequality gap and worsen the distribution of wealth.

Human nature is greed. Businesses need to be regulated and the vunerable need to be protected. Jeremy Corbyn is the man to do this. Its a shame the tabloids will do everything in their power to demonize him so he will never get anywhere near no.10.
 
The Tories are evil.

Trickle down economics.

They actually believe that stimulating the top and the rich will make the wealth trickle down. Sure it will, more of it will be retained and increase the inequality gap and worsen the distribution of wealth.

Human nature is greed. Businesses need to be regulated and the vunerable need to be protected. Jeremy Corbyn is the man to do this. Its a shame the tabloids will do everything in their power to demonize him so he will never get anywhere near no.10.

His policies aren't all bad, some are good in fact. There are some fundamental flaws though: The Economist

I actually trust the Economist as they will fault either side dependant on the actual value of what they have to say. They were scathing about parts of Osborne's latest Budget, but also have words to say on Corbyn.
 
I would say let other countries in europe do the sorting (like germany for example) and then send them over here. I don't think there are any syrian refugees coming directly to the UK. so it's pretty easy to filter I would say.

How is that? They pay for fake documents and are the Germans going to wait for information confirming their identity with biometrics from the Syrian govt?
 
Some people keep throwing out the term "economic migrants" and that clearly shows what kind of media and parties are they following. Because in the real world the term refugee or asylum seeker is very clearly defined in the international treaties. You can use whatever word helps your conscience or bigotry, but you can't change the reality. Also, asylum is granted based on some clear criteria. And you can't obtain asylum in Europe unless you're already on European soil because the law is made purposely stupid. But don't let laws and common sense stop your hate.

What you say is true but you're assuming all the migrants are fleeing from humanitarian crisis such as war, genocide, religious persecution, etc which is not true. Yes, Syrians are refugees and are fleeing from that. They should be allowed in as asylum seekers obviously and I personally support that. They are not merely migrants/economic migrants. However they're not the only people trying to get into Europe, there are people from parts of Africa as an example that has no humanitarian crisis, no war, no genocide, no persecution, just bad economy.

How is it fair to everyone in economic hardships to give an easy pass to certain migrants just because it's easier for them to get to Europe? What makes them special that they needn't go through the same channels to migrate as others?

I'm in South Africa right now as a German, I have seen the poverty affecting some people. No one from South Africa is leaving to Europe because of the impossible journey, nor do they have a reason other than economics. It is relatively peaceful here. This is the same for many other African countries. You leave for economic opportunities. Guess what there are billions upon this Earth in countries across the planet that are can GREATLY benefit from European opportunities. Leaving a country for better economic conditions does not make you a refugee. The amount of Syrians for example are fleeing due to civil war, ISIS, etc, not because of the economy. They are refugees. I get your point though and I understand that racists would use economic migrants against refugees and I agree with you when people use it against them it's bigotry, but economic migrants do exist and they're not refugees and they do not have any right than any other person this planet to a country, they're not asylum seekers, they need to get into a country just like if an American is lookibg for European opportunities or anyone else - it doesn't matter. If a South African is looking for a better opportunity, they need to go through proper channels because there's no other way, they don't have the privilege (in a sense) to cross the ocean others can.

I feel you are confusing thinking everyone trying to get into Europe are refugees. That's not true, yes a lot of them are and right now there is a difference between economic migrants and refugees, especially when some economic migrants are using fake Syrian passports to get asylum status thus negatively affecting actual Syrian refugees... http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34150408

German customs officers have seized packages containing Syrian passports and police suspect they are being sold illegally to asylum seekers.

A finance ministry official said both genuine and forged passports were in the packets intercepted in the post. Germany is letting Syrians register for asylum regardless of where they entered the EU. As refugees from the Syrian civil war, most have a right to asylum.

The passports can help fraudulent claimants to get asylum, the EU says. The ministry official declined to say how many Syrian passports had been found in the customs checks. The German police are now investigating. The EU border agency Frontex says trafficking in fake Syrian passports has increased, notably in Turkey.

A Frontex official, Fabrice Leggeri, told French radio station Europe 1 that "people who use these fake passports mostly speak Arabic. "They may come from North Africa, the Middle East, but they have the profile of economic migrants," he said.

Germany has by far the highest number of asylum applicants in the EU, many of them Syrians and Afghans, but many also from the western Balkan countries. Turkey is a major transit country for refugees and other migrants heading for the EU, and is also housing more than two million Syrian refugees in camps.

So here we have people looking for economic opportunities, affecting Syrian refugees by using fake Syrian passports to get asylum status which is limited to Syrians only and limiting Syrians getting asylum status. Saying economic migrants is just another word for bigotry etc is a bit naive. I also blame the media for using migrants and refugees interchangeably. FWIW I support economic migrants but I believe refugees/asylum seekers should be given priority right now and if need be economic migrants turned away. I wish it was easier to get into many countries legally but unfortunately that's not the case for most of the world. Right now Europe can focus on refugees whom are more important. I've met multiple people in South Africa black, white and Indian that would like to leave the economy here for European opportunities but they can't because they can't do that journey and also must do it through proper means. How are their wants for better economic opportunities any different from more Northern Africans? Why should certain people looking for economic opportunities be given easier access? That's not right. There's a big difference between refugee and migrant.
 

KingSnake

The Birthday Skeleton
What you say is true but you're assuming all the migrants are fleeing from humanitarian crisis such as war, genocide, religious persecution, etc which is not true.

I'm not assuming anything. I said that there are clear criteria for granting asylum. Not everybody will get asylum. But that's up to the authorities to decide. The ones that are assuming are the ones deciding already that they are economic migrants and not refugees based on their own bias/bigotry. (observe how "economic migrants" is always used as a generalization and as a definitive statement).

Until a decision is made they are asylum seekers.

Or do you doubt that the German authorities can handle this process of identifying the true refugees?
 
Imo, their country has gone to shit and people want a better life. How terrible they decide to get out of their shithole country ravaged by war and bruality to do that. Only when Cameron's forced into it will he do it and then make himself look like a saint whilst he gives the okay. Prat.

The Tories are evil.

Trickle down economics.

They actually believe that stimulating the top and the rich will make the wealth trickle down. Sure it will, but more of it will be retained and increase the inequality gap and worsen the distribution of wealth.

Human nature is greed. Businesses need to be regulated and the vunerable need to be protected. Jeremy Corbyn is the man to do this. Its a shame the tabloids will do everything in their power to demonize him so he will never get anywhere near no.10.

That's because the British press likes it with Cameron in charge right now. To be honest, all of the political parties in this country piss me off, not just the Tories, who just happen to be the worst of the worst.
 

T-Dot

Banned
People wonder why a certain % of population are against immigration but I wonder what what happen if I, a Christian white male turned up on Syrias border had the roles been reversed?

This is the most ignorant post I have ever seen. 10% of Syrians are Christians, and they have helped Palestinian Christians.

Also, I'm of Syrian ancestry and also light-skinned.

Stop watching Fox News, and learn about the world.

lol

Yes lets celebrate the continued dumbing down of Neogaf with the banning of smokeydave. Peak stupidity and conformity is near.

He was more astute, witty, and articulate than a hundred of you snarky try-hards.

SmokeyDave brought it on himself
 

Maha Kali

Banned
Germany is importing 800,000 problems out of guilt for the holocaust, and it's going to come back to bite them in the ass. They got rid of Jews who build society and are now bringing in Muslims, who only tear down societies. LOL can stupid Germany ever be on the right side of history? I'm so glad I live in America where we're not taking on a bunch of future terrorists.
 
Germany is importing 800,000 problems out of guilt for the holocaust, and it's going to come back to bite them in the ass. They got rid of Jews who build society and are now bringing in Muslims, who only tear down societies. LOL can stupid Germany ever be on the right side of history? I'm so glad I live in America where we're not taking on a bunch of future terrorists.

Whoa.
 

T-Dot

Banned
Germany is importing 800,000 problems out of guilt for the holocaust, and it's going to come back to bite them in the ass. They got rid of Jews who build society and are now bringing in Muslims, who only tear down societies. LOL can stupid Germany ever be on the right side of history? I'm so glad I live in America where we're not taking on a bunch of future terrorists.

banhammer15gq9.jpg
 

KingSnake

The Birthday Skeleton
Germany is importing 800,000 problems out of guilt for the holocaust, and it's going to come back to bite them in the ass. They got rid of Jews who build society and are now bringing in Muslims, who only tear down societies. LOL can stupid Germany ever be on the right side of history? I'm so glad I live in America where we're not taking on a bunch of future terrorists.

Hate speech at its finest.
 

reckless

Member
Germany is importing 800,000 problems out of guilt for the holocaust, and it's going to come back to bite them in the ass. They got rid of Jews who build society and are now bringing in Muslims, who only tear down societies. LOL can stupid Germany ever be on the right side of history? I'm so glad I live in America where we're not taking on a bunch of future terrorists.

Couldn't even make it to 10 posts.
 

JDSN

Banned
lol

Yes lets celebrate the continued dumbing down of Neogaf with the banning of smokeydave. Peak stupidity and conformity is near.

He was more astute, witty, and articulate than a hundred of you snarky try-hards.
Pff, man Vita fans are really taking this ban bad.
 

SgtCobra

Member
Germany is importing 800,000 problems out of guilt for the holocaust, and it's going to come back to bite them in the ass. They got rid of Jews who build society and are now bringing in Muslims, who only tear down societies. LOL can stupid Germany ever be on the right side of history? I'm so glad I live in America where we're not taking on a bunch of future terrorists.
lol

Yes lets celebrate the continued dumbing down of Neogaf with the banning of smokeydave. Peak stupidity and conformity is near.

He was more astute, witty, and articulate than a hundred of you snarky try-hards.

I said damn.
 

Snake

Member
Germany is importing 800,000 problems out of guilt for the holocaust, and it's going to come back to bite them in the ass. They got rid of Jews who build society and are now bringing in Muslims, who only tear down societies. LOL can stupid Germany ever be on the right side of history? I'm so glad I live in America where we're not taking on a bunch of future terrorists.

Yours has been a long and distinguished career on this forum and you shall surely be missed.
 

Zaphod

Member
Germany is importing 800,000 problems out of guilt for the holocaust, and it's going to come back to bite them in the ass. They got rid of Jews who build society and are now bringing in Muslims, who only tear down societies. LOL can stupid Germany ever be on the right side of history? I'm so glad I live in America where we're not taking on a bunch of future terrorists.

Do you run scared when you see a Muslim attending one of our Universities as an international student?
 

Zaphod

Member
No, I just keep an eye on them for any guns/bombs though.

Ha! The thought of some civilian speciously leering at anyone potentially from the mid-east on campus is hilarious. Or do you just ask nicely, like "Hi Muhammad, I've got my part of the group work complete, bring any bombs in today?"
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom