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Destiny |OT40| Killed by the Architects

I agree. I do not like that the best looking stuff is locked behind timegate or you have to pay if you want it faster but at the end of the day, the same stuff can be free if you have patience. Which of course this being a loot game people don't have any, they want it all now.

Back to playing Division tonight. Come run some DZ with me, need to get to Rank 50

If they had the armor drop at a low drop rate, but let you run the content however many times you wanted, that would be great. Look at Diablo, you can get any type of gear at any point and there's no time gate or paywall.

No, the way Bungie is doing it is disgusting. Considering the only reason to continue doing PvE is for the different gear sets, them offering it for sale is just....sad.

This is what I said a few days ago. It seems like my fears have come to pass. I will do what I said I was going to do. Maybe I'll log in once a week to get the mystery box. Maybe not. See ya.

Damn. You nailed it then. You'll be sorely missed Deku. Still remember running VoG with you way back when, if only to get cool looking gear.
 
And then I max it out immediately with the armor I had from the previous update, 6 months ago.

Again-Selling loot in what is primarily a loot game. It doesn't matter what level it is.

The whole POINT of the INFUSION SYSTEM was so you could keep pieces of loot that you liked using.
I don't have time to find your other quote, but right here. The argument I "made up." How are you hitting 335 with level 3 and 320 gear?
 

Deku Tree

Member
I agree. I do not like that the best looking stuff is locked behind timegate or you have to pay if you want it faster but at the end of the day, the same stuff can be free if you have patience. Which of course this being a loot game people don't have any, they want it all now.

Back to playing Division tonight. Come run some DZ with me, need to get to Rank 50

I am salty as fuck about the fact the taken look is not a shader, I will not lie.

See you in the Division!

If they had the armor drop at a low drop rate, but let you run the content however many times you wanted, that would be great. Look at Diablo, you can get any type of gear at any point and there's no time gate or paywall.

No, the way Bungie is doing it is disgusting. Considering the only reason to continue doing PvE is for the different gear sets, them offering it for sale is just....sad.

Keep telling it like it is, Breezy. Never change.
 

ocean

Banned
For fuck's sake.

You're guaranteed 3 rolls a week for the hideous (PoE derived = garbage) armor. That's equivalent to the 3 Raid rolls you'd have gotten otherwise for a new raid armor set or whatever. Slow drip - like everything else.

Zero harm in offering a paid shortcut to those who feel it's worth it. It's the marvel of a free market with well informed and consenting economic agents - whether you spend your money or you don't, you're left with the satisfaction of having had a choice.

What do you value more, an extra US$20 in your pocket or a day 1 full set of Taken armor? Because you get to chose and that's what you'll have. What's the big deal?

Seriously it's like the gaming community lives in a parallel universe where selling things is a bad thing. The DLC/MT pitchfork crusade just strikes me as inherently irrational in feeling that it's somehow immoral to offer people w chance to buy something.
 
I don't have time to find your other quote, but right here. The argument I "made up." How are you hitting 335 with level 3 and 320 gear?

It looks like reading comprehension isn't a strong point.

A)I didn't say they 'sale max light level armor' like you claimed.
B)If you read the first sentence, it says this-
And then I max it out immediately with the armor I had from the previous update, 6 months ago.

No where does it say 'Max level gear I paid for'.

C)They are selling loot since you can earn this in game. Again, in a game where getting gear is the primary reason to play that game, selling the gear(Albeit at 3 LL) defeats the purpose of hunting for loot.
D)They introduced the Infusion system so people could keep old pieces of gear they wanted. And using this system, they're selling cool looking gear that unlocks an emote that can immediately be maxed by infusion.

For fuck's sake.

You're guaranteed 3 rolls a week for the hideous (PoE derived = garbage) armor. That's equivalent to the 3 Raid rolls you'd have gotten otherwise for a new raid armor set or whatever. Slow drip - like everything else.

Zero harm in offering a paid shortcut to those who feel it's worth it. It's the marvel of a free market with well informed and consenting economic agents - whether you spend your money or you don't, you're left with the satisfaction of having had a choice.

What do you value more, an extra US$20 in your pocket or a day 1 full set of Taken armor? Because you get to chose and that's what you'll have. What's the big deal?

Seriously it's like the gaming community lives in a parallel universe where selling things is a bad thing. The DLC/MT pitchfork crusade just strikes me as inherently irrational in feeling that it's somehow immoral to offer people w chance to buy something.

Then why have PvE at all if the whole reason of PvE is to get better and different gear when you can just, like you said, use a 'paid shortcut' to bypass that whole section of content?

I thought Destiny was a game about getting loot, and thus having content revolve around that. Not a game about buying loot, and then hamstringing content to fit that ethos of selling.
 

WipedOut

Member
For fuck's sake.

You're guaranteed 3 rolls a week for the hideous (PoE derived = garbage) armor. That's equivalent to the 3 Raid rolls you'd have gotten otherwise for a new raid armor set or whatever. Slow drip - like everything else.

Zero harm in offering a paid shortcut to those who feel it's worth it. It's the marvel of a free market with well informed and consenting economic agents - whether you spend your money or you don't, you're left with the satisfaction of having had a choice.

What do you value more, an extra US$20 in your pocket or a day 1 full set of Taken armor? Because you get to chose and that's what you'll have. What's the big deal?

Seriously it's like the gaming community lives in a parallel universe where selling things is a bad thing. The DLC/MT pitchfork crusade just strikes me as inherently irrational in feeling that it's somehow immoral to offer people w chance to buy something.

But it's not guaranteed, you buy a box and could get any piece of either the specktor or taken armor.

Yes it's optional and I will not buy it. There is no harm in them doing it but I agree that it's shitty to limit it to only 3 chances a week.
 
For fuck's sake.

You're guaranteed 3 rolls a week for the hideous (PoE derived = garbage) armor. That's equivalent to the 3 Raid rolls you'd have gotten otherwise for a new raid armor set or whatever. Slow drip - like everything else.

Zero harm in offering a paid shortcut to those who feel it's worth it. It's the marvel of a free market with well informed and consenting economic agents - whether you spend your money or you don't, you're left with the satisfaction of having had a choice.

What do you value more, an extra US$20 in your pocket or a day 1 full set of Taken armor? Because you get to chose and that's what you'll have. What's the big deal?

Seriously it's like the gaming community lives in a parallel universe where selling things is a bad thing. The DLC/MT pitchfork crusade just strikes me as inherently irrational in feeling that it's somehow immoral to offer people w chance to buy something.

I just don't want them to start selling weapons or full blown gear. They're heading down that slope, which is concerning, but not worthy of the backlash its getting. We haven't gone down that far.....yet. I can only hope we never do.
 

NeOak

Member
For fuck's sake.

You're guaranteed 3 rolls a week for the hideous (PoE derived = garbage) armor. That's equivalent to the 3 Raid rolls
But but... the spikes! So rad! I can be like Nilay Patel! I'm just missing the Apple Watch though.

blegh
 
This is not the kind of game that I fell in love with playing. I don't like the direction that Destiny is moving in. That is all.

I just don't want them to start selling weapons or full blown gear. They're heading down that slope, which is concerning, but not worthy of the backlash its getting. We haven't gone down that far.....yet. I can only hope we never do.

We're already into the abyss, weapons will be next

Nothing tonight hyped me, my hats still firmly on next weeks "reveal"and whether they actually release the new exotics
 
I thought Destiny was a game about getting loot, and thus having content revolve around that. Not a game about buying loot, and then hamstringing content to fit that ethos of selling.

Well it's not, and the sooner you accept it, the better.

Does anyone know if infusion for exotics is also 100%? We only saw 100% infusion for legendaries.

They didn't say, so no idea right now, but I would assume yes.
 

WipedOut

Member
We're already into the abyss, weapons will be next

Nothing tonight hyped me, my hats still firmly on next weeks "reveal"and whether they actually release the new exotics

Only thing I took away as a positive today was the 1:1 conversion. That is a huge step in the right direction that should have been there to begin with.

Let's reflect,
1. Emotes
2. Emotes, Halloween Masks
3. Emotes, Sparrows, Horns, $10 SRL Book with Gear, Sparrow and Emblem
4. (Soon) Emotes, infusable cosmetic gear, weapon skins (Miss anything)

It's obvious the next step is Boxes that could have weapons in it that could be infused to max LL

Slippery Slope indeed.
 
We're already into the abyss, weapons will be next

Nothing tonight hyped me, my hats still firmly on next weeks "reveal"and whether they actually release the new exotics

Well they aren't selling meaningful gear yet either. The 3 Defense gear had 0 int/disc/str. Not sure what perks it had, though...
 
Well it's not, and the sooner you accept it, the better it will be.

Then why did they remove the loot cave if it's not a game about loot

No harm in that. I mean, if Destiny isn't a loot game, so what if people get loot fast?

Oh wait...it's because it's a loot game.
 

ocean

Banned
But it's not guaranteed, you buy a box and could get any piece of either the specktor or taken armor.

Yes it's optional and I will not buy it. There is no harm in them doing it but I agree that it's shitty to limit it to only 3 chances a week.
Right but then you've never been guaranteed a weekly roll at a specific piece of armor except for HoW PoE.

If you wanted a full VoG or CE or KF set? Roll your dice each week and hope you get that piece. This time it is no different at all. The fact that there's a paid option has people feeling like it's ever been any different.

Bear with me for a moment. Let's assume they had swapped out Harrowed KF gear in Hard Mode for new Taken armor. You'd still be at the whim of a weekly roll except in that case you wouldn't even be able to pool all your chances to a single character (assuming you wanted to do Hunter first for instance). There would have been zero controversy because it's exactly the way everything in the game has always worked.

Instead it's a new wrapper - weekly boxes - but essentially the same concept for random weekly rolls at loot. Only fundamental difference is you're allowed to pay for a shortcut if so inclined, which doesn't make any material difference to how the game has always played except for those who wished they could pay and now can. Those of us who won't pay will just play and earn like we always have - no change.
 
Only thing I took away as a positive today was the 1:1 conversion. That is a huge step in the right direction that should have been there to begin with.

Yep thats great for me, as it means i won't have to do much PvE as i'll only want to get to around 325

Well they aren't selling meaningful gear yet either. The 3 Defense gear had 0 int/disc/str. Not sure what perks it had, though...

Its a taster for us and them if its successful they'll be all over selling meaningful gear
 
100% Infusion. Praise the Sun emote. Nice.

The rest is pure meh. I don't care about aesthetics. Stats are all that matter.

I'll be using any 335 gear to infuse my PVP Int/Disc setup. Which is a mishmash of pieces.

I do agree with Breezy in principle but Destiny isn't really a loot game anymore. So I won't waste any angst over it.
 

spyder_ur

Member
I don't really have a problem with the microtransactions in a silo; it's the fact that their prominence has come along at the exact moment that the makers of the game stopped putting out new, compelling experiences and gear that concerns me.
 
Right but then you've never been guaranteed a weekly roll at a specific piece of armor except for HoW PoE.

If you wanted a full VoG or CE or KF set? Roll your dice each week and hope you get that piece. This time it is no different at all. The fact that there's a paid option has people feeling like it's ever been any different.

Bear with me for a moment. Let's assume they had swapped out Harrowed KF gear in Hard Mode for new Taken armor. You'd still be at the whim of a weekly roll except in that case you wouldn't even be able to pool all your chances to a single character (assuming you wanted to do Hunter first for instance). There would have been zero controversy because it's exactly the way everything in the game has always worked.

Instead it's a new wrapper - weekly boxes - but essentially the same concept for random weekly rolls at loot. Only fundamental difference is you're allowed to pay for a shortcut if so inclined, which doesn't make any material difference to how the game has always played except for those who wished they could pay and now can. Those of us who won't pay will just play and earn like we always have - no change.

I personally can't wait for all future raid gear to be purchasable on the side. That's what we wanted, right? Oh you don't HAVE to pay for it, but you CAN pay for it. You know, a little shortcut ;)

The fact that it's even an option is disgusting. Options are good, yes, but not when they undermine players and the content.


Shit, better sit down and shut up then, I sure got told. I'm glad I have someone else to tell me how to think about a thing.

...wait, nah son. Come to your own conclusions. Don't read someones elses opinions on something, and take it as fact.
 

GhaleonEB

Member
The only reason I say that is because that is an odd thing to say from a games company. It's like Microsoft saying they're open to cross platform play, and the only reason they're saying that is not because they really want to be friendly, but because they're getting beat handedly by Sony and therefore they're trying to butter up people.

Urk saying 'go play other games' isn't because he has full confidence in Destiny. It's because he's lost confidence in Destiny, it's not a game that changes and evolves like they spouted before it came out. And if someone who has a hand in making Destiny falters in their own belief of the thing they are working on, then they shouldn't be working on it.

In essence, I don't want to buy bread from a breadmaker who is disillusioned with his own products, because then that bread will be worse off for it.
He must have lost confidence in Destiny before it came out, since this has been their message about Destiny from day 1. Urk, Luke and others have talked about how they want Destiny to be a game you play, set aside, and come back to periodically for new stuff. They said that before ship, after ship, when TTK was releasing, and now.
 

embalm

Member
Dude Breezy

If someone wants to buy a beautiful set of gear with real money, then why do I care? They can spend $50 bucks to look like a taken on April 12th, and I'll happily grind my treasure packs and have a full set eventually.

By allowing players to do that, we just got a free expansion. The April update is about as large as House of Wolves and it's completely free. They are tapping into the whales and letting me as a bottom feeder benefit.

Not only do I not give a shit that other players can buy bonus armor packs, I'm happy as hell that I haven't had to spend $20 on an expansion.

Destiny is fun to play and I am continuing to play it for fun. All of this extra stuff they are adding is making it even more fun.

Bring on the emotes; Bring on the Treasure Packs; Bring on the Sparrow Kits; and Bring on the whatever crazy eververse garbage is next! Because I love free updates.
 

Out 1

Member
What do you value more, an extra US$20 in your pocket or a day 1 full set of Taken armor? Because you get to chose and that's what you'll have. What's the big deal?

I agree. Even if time does not always equal money, it is the one commodity that we can never replace.

Though I have not played Diablo III after finishing the campaign shortly after launch, I understand that, in its current state, the game offers meaningful progression even for players who log in for 15-30 mins a day. With TTK, Destiny seemed to move towards that direction (the curve to 295, the 3oC, CoO), only to be derailed at KF with its double RNG system. Maybe Destiny should embrace its roots of a loot-based game and introduce a wider variety of gear with more ways to earn it.
 
ruthless knows that the true endgame it's to be fabulous


Ask on discord, they are having the good conversations there

I dont want to ask discord. I want to ask dgaf becuase i love you guys and you will be who i play with.

Its been awhile since i posted. When did it get so cold in here
 
Dude Breezy

If someone wants to buy a beautiful set of gear with real money, then why do I care? They can spend $50 bucks to look like a taken on April 12th, and I'll happily grind my treasure packs and have a full set eventually.

By allowing players to do that, we just got a free expansion. The April update is about as large as House of Wolves and it's completely free. They are tapping into the whales and letting me as a bottom feeder benefit.

Not only do I not give a shit that other players can buy bonus armor packs, I'm happy as hell that I haven't had to spend $20 on an expansion.

Destiny is fun to play and I am continuing to play it for fun. All of this extra stuff they are adding is making it even more fun.

Bring on the emotes; Bring on the Treasure Packs; Bring on the Sparrow Kits; and Bring on the whatever crazy eververse garbage is next! Because I love free updates.

"As large as HoW".

I disagree. HoW brought trials, and PoE. Along with new sets of armor, weapon, shaders, ships, etc.

What does this update bring? A recycled activity, reskinned gear, recycled weapons, and arguably the newest thing are the Chromas and the armor set. Not even close to what HoW brought. And instead of paying $20 for an expansion, you get to pay $40 come September. These free updates have and continue to be disappointing. I'd rather pay $20 twice a year because atleast then the content would have to be meaningful.

He must have lost confidence in Destiny before it came out, since this has been their message about Destiny from day 1. Urk, Luke and others have talked about how they want Destiny to be a game you play, set aside, and come back to periodically for new stuff. They said that before ship, after ship, when TTK was releasing, and now.

If the kotaku article was true about them having to restructure the game are true, then damn they must have known for a while.
 

ocean

Banned
Then why did they remove the loot cave if it's not a game about loot

No harm in that. I mean, if Destiny isn't a loot game, so what if people get loot fast?

Oh wait...it's because it's a loot game.
I mean it's a matter of opinion I guess?

But if it's a loot game it's the worst loot game ever made. There's very little of it worth using, getting all the best stuff is not only easy but actually inevitable if you play regularly (who here *doesn't* own every Exotic?), the looks and functionality are very poorly differentiated, the drop rate is egregiously bad, there is hardly a concept of distinct builds...

You're not the only one who thinks this is a loot game. But you are, like everybody else who thinks it is, always going to be disappointed with the game. You want it to be something it's not.

Destiny is a shooter. You play the campaign and then PvP it till you get bored, like every Halo/CoD/Battlefield/whatever. There's some cool stuff to do and get in PvE - twice a year a new activity that's fun the first 3-4 times you do it. But that's it.

I've said it a lot, but most of the people who are incessantly frustrated by the game feel that way because they want it to be something it's not and hasn't been and won't be.

Looking for a loot game? Infinite disappointment. Looking for a living, breathing, constantly upgraded MMO? Lol not here. Want a social experience where you can pair up in the wild and explore the world seeking adventures and complex challenges? Yeah, not here.

Want a game you can fire up with some buddies to talk shit and shoot monsters for a while in a trivially easy Raid? Bingo. You'd rather shoot other people online instead? A-OK. That's it.
 

NeOak

Member
I dont want to ask discord. I want to ask dgaf becuase i love you guys and you will be who i play with.

Its been awhile since i posted. When did it get so cold in here
The good discussion moved to discord today.

We were left with the whining in here. Why are they going to post here to get whining in response?
 

spyder_ur

Member
By allowing players to do that, we just got a free expansion. The April update is about as large as House of Wolves and it's completely free. They are tapping into the whales and letting me as a bottom feeder benefit.

I don't disagree with everything you say here, but this just isn't true, unless I am missing a whole bunch of stuff like two new activities, new exotics, new missions, new NPCs, etc.
 

WipedOut

Member
The loot cave was useful because it was free. Add $$ to get stuff? 99% wouldn't have bothered.
Meaning why give you all these free engrams when we can sell you $2 sterling boxes. Maybe I'm not explaining it right. They don't want us getting tons of free stuff.
 

Lnkn52

Member
All I care about is if Destiny 2 is being developed for PS4K, don't want another game not reaching potential cause of hardware.
 

NeOak

Member
Meaning why give you all these free engrams when we can sell you $2 sterling boxes. Maybe I'm not explaining it right. They don't want us getting tons of free stuff.
That was Y1, when there was no microtransactions at all. And you know why it was removed.

BS decision though. I didn't agree with the removal.

I don't disagree with everything you say here, but this just isn't true, unless I am missing a whole bunch of stuff like two new activities, new exotics, new missions, new NPCs, etc.

It's XBO HoW equivalent. They only got one new strike.

But no, it isn't full HoW even for XBO.
 
All I care about is if Destiny 2 is being developed for PS4K, don't want another game not reaching potential cause of hardware.

The only thing I wonder about PS4K.. is what Destiny will do with it, if any,
or what it'll do for Destiny. That's it!

I would like to meet the person that's excited for the return of Arachnid & Sunbreakers.

Hello LT, nice to meet you.

Jk, I'm not excited, but I do want Sunbreakers since it was my VERY FIRST exotic in Destiny.
 

embalm

Member
"As large as HoW".

I disagree. HoW brought trials, and PoE. Along with new sets of armor, weapon, shaders, ships, etc.

What does this update bring? A recycled activity, reskinned gear, recycled weapons, and arguably the newest thing are the Chromas and the armor set. Not even close to what HoW brought. And instead of paying $20 for an expansion, you get to pay $40 come September.
You're right this is smaller. So let's add in the other 3 free updates we've gotten. Now it's pretty comparable.

No idea what that payment comparison is about, all this stuff is $0. Give me my $0 content because it is pretty good.

Sorry this business model isn't for you, but it has proven to be more successful for both the Games that use it and for the players who play them.
 
You're right this is smaller. So let's add in the other 3 free updates we've gotten. Now it's pretty comparable.

No idea what that payment comparison is about, all this stuff is $0. Give me my $0 content because it is pretty good.

Sorry this business model isn't for you, but it has proven to be more successful for both the Games that use it and for the players who play them.

Oh you mean the halloween and SRL event or the crimson doubles I can't play right now

Payment comparison? You do know there's a $40 expansion coming out later this year? So much for free.
 
Yea, we can calm down now that it's settled. We still have 1 more reveal before we have all the information on the full April 12th update.

And remember, this is just the April update. We still have no idea what's in store for September. I doubt most will play this game from April to Sept as much as we have in the past.

And besides, earning these new armor/emotes/year1 guns, while cool, we don't know all the details yet AND we don't really have much to use them for outside PoE challenge, Trials and IB.
 
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