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[HeadlessRoland]

I don't think anyone ever implied that Deus Ex is sandbox-like other than that you can freely choose from a variety of options to approach most situations.

Sadly those choices do not matter due to the horrible AI and level design and single cell energy regen (makes a majority of the augs worthless) and cover system (essentially teleport while transitioning between cover). You are never forced to adapt to anything because the AI is that bad. Choices are largely superfluous at best and illusionary at worst.

On the hardest difficulty I could kill any amount of enemies in any situation with any weapon. It feels unfinished, and while its certainly a fun game I do not believe it deserves the praise its getting. And the ending is very anticlimactic.

After awhile I started murdering everyone because I was getting bored and sneaking isnt any more difficult it is just way more tedious. Maybe someone can mod it into a good Shadowrun game or something.

Did I have the ability at some point during that mission to save them?

Yes.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Of course!

Ahhh DAMNIT!

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Sadly those choices do not matter due to the horrible AI and level design and single cell energy regen (makes a majority of the augs worthless) and cover system (essentially teleport while transitioning between cover).

What? The AI can easily see you and go to alarmed or hostile during cover transitions.

The single cell energy regen didn't make augs worthless, especially since "a majority of the augs" didn't actively use energy or were meant to be used in moderation.

 

[Snuggles]

What? The AI can easily see you and go to alarmed or hostile during cover transitions.

Correct. I was just playing earlier, and enemies were following me as I transitioned from cover to cover in a firefight. I was a good distance from them, so I figured it would fool them, but no go.

 

[HeadlessRoland]

What? The AI can easily see you and go to alarmed or hostile during cover transitions.

Yeah, if they are within 10 feet and looking DIRECTLY at you. And even then RARELY. Maybe I am just a insanely skilled (doubtful). And regardless you still "teleport" insane distances with a transition in a split second.

The single cell energy regen didn't make augs worthless, especially since "a majority of the augs" didn't actively use energy or were meant to be used in moderation.

Hahaha, ok. It makes all the augs that require activation worthless. Something else makes most of the others worthless, but they are likewise worthless.

Correct. I was just playing earlier, and enemies were following me as I transitioned from cover to cover in a firefight. I was a good distance from them, so I figured it would fool them, but no go.

After they are aggressed they will track you somewhat.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Sadly those choices do not matter due to the horrible AI and level design and single cell energy regen (makes a majority of the augs worthless) and cover system (essentially teleport while transitioning between cover). You are never forced to adapt to anything because the AI is that bad. Choices are largely superfluous at best and illusionary at worst.

On the hardest difficulty I could kill any amount of enemies in any situation with any weapon. It feels unfinished, and while its certainly a fun game I do not believe it deserves the praise its getting. And the ending is very anticlimactic.

After awhile I started murdering everyone because I was getting bored and sneaking isnt any more difficult it is just way more tedious. Maybe someone can mod it into a good Shadowrun game or something.

There are a ton of protein bars and powder in the game to replenish your other energy cells.

On the hardest difficulty, without armor upgrades, you die in like three or four gun shots. You must be pretty damn good to find no challenge in that. Perhaps you are, but please realize that most other people won't be gaming gods. Just look earlier in the thread and you see plenty of people complaining about the difficulty and lack of ammo.

For me, at least, a big part of the fun of Deus Ex is sneaking around and not being seen by anyone. I found this aspect of the game to be very satisfying.

 

[Alexios]

I thought the AI was pretty stupid, you could most often taze them one by one without issues (I mostly went stealth but this worked even when they were alert, it was only impossible on the

Spoiler

zombie

like dudes at the end, unless you "cheated" and climbed out of reach and did that) and EMP grenades made short work of anything else... I never even got the invisibility or see through walls or anything else, just the practical stuff, and stealth was still super easy most of the time. You barely needed the advanced weapons and gadgets at all. I think I only ever used one gas grenade. That said, I played on normal, but I didn't think the damage I got was the issue, just how they behaved. Getting more damage would likely make it annoying than feel like a good challenge, especially in some boss fights where the fully upgraded armor thing seemed to do little already... Do harder difficulties make the AI smarter or just up the damage they can take, and dish out? I'd try them if it's the former...

 

[33-Hit-Combo]

Wow... Some street punk headshotted me just now. One hit KO.

 

[Snuggles]

Yeah, if they are within 10 feet and looking DIRECTLY at you. And even then RARELY. Maybe I am just a insanely skilled (doubtful).

In my experience that I posted above, I was about three stories above the enemies, like 50 yards away, and they still kept on me as I moved from cover to cover. Maybe it depends on certain circumstances, but I certainly wasn't able to teleport away from them.

edit - just caught your edit after my post

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Yeah, if they are within 10 feet and looking DIRECTLY at you. And even then RARELY.

...No? It happened frequently. I had guards 50 feet away on a lower floor spotting me because the damn railing/walls became transparent for a few feet between cover.

Hahaha, ok. It makes all the augs that require activation worthless. Something else makes most of the others worthless, but they are likewise worthless.

I used Cloak extensively with 1 charge, it was insanely useful. Just those few seconds of invisibility can be huge in getting past a guard, camera, or passing through laser beams. You really only need like a second or two of Smart Vision to gauge where everything is nearby.

 

[Swifty]

Sadly those choices do not matter due to the horrible AI and level design and single cell energy regen (makes a majority of the augs worthless) and cover system (essentially teleport while transitioning between cover). You are never forced to adapt to anything because the AI is that bad. Choices are largely superfluous at best and illusionary at worst.

Just curious, have you ever played the original Deus Ex?

 

[HeadlessRoland]

In my experience that I posted above, I was about three stories above the enemies, like 50 yards away, and they still kept on me as I moved from cover to cover. Maybe it depends on certain circumstances, but I certainly wasn't able to teleport away from them.

Your experience is based on already having agressed them...

On the hardest difficulty, without armor upgrades, you die in like three or four gun shots. You must be pretty damn good to find no challenge in tha

I guess I am just a wizard and understand how to use cover to pop up-headshot rinse and repeat.

used Cloak extensively with 1 charge, it was insanely useful. Just those few seconds of invisibility can be huge in getting past a guard, camera, or passing through laser beams.

Negates the ability for take down...

...No? It happened frequently.

Must be sorcery.

Do harder difficulties make the AI smarter or just up the damage they can take, and dish out? I'd try them if it's the former...

Neg it does not, and the stupid AI makes difficulty setting largely irrelevant. Insta killing everything with headshots and taking no damage doesn't change on any setting.

 

[Hawkian]

rofl. Anybody else try to hack a really tough door 15 times, only to get fed up and blow it away with 4 shotgun shells, then find a pocket secretary with the code on the way out?

 

[Hot Coldman]

OH SHIT THAT FIRST BOSS WAS HARD oh wait i threw 2 frags, one gasser at him and then unloaded a machine pistol clip and 3 shotgun blasts to the face

huh

he stopped moving





Heng Sha is awesome.

 

[Card Boy]

Wow... Some street punk headshotted me just now. One hit KO.

Most of the enemies in Deus Ex 1 can headshot you with one bullet if your crouching.

 

[Zeth]

From reddit:

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Hahaha, ok. It makes all the augs that require activation worthless. Something else makes most of the others worthless, but they are likewise worthless.

Did we play the same game? There are only 4 manually activated abilities in the game. I only bought Typhoon, "see through walls", and "cloaking". I used the "see through walls" ability all the time and found it very useful. Cloaking was prohibitively expensive (and kind of cheapened the experience), so I only used it a couple of times after chomping down some protein bars. Typhoon is basically the same mechanic as your takedown move.

I never bought the silent running/landing stuff, so I can't comment, but I imagine it eats your energy similarly to the "see through walls" ability, and I could see it being very useful.

 

[Lostconfused]

I guess I am just a wizard and understand how to use cover to pop up-headshot rinse and repeat.

Or maybe you were just lucky. Since the AI can gun you down in a second on the hardest difficulty if you don't have dermal armor or more than 100 health.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Negates the ability for take down...

You don't need to constantly Cloak and Takedown at once, and if you really need to take out an opponent while cloaked, then the Tranq Rifle, Stun Gun, and silenced Pistol exist for those reasons.

I never bought the silent running/landing stuff, so I can't comment, but I imagine it eats your energy similarly to the "see through walls" ability, and I could see it being very useful.

Silent Running is about as worthless as in the first game, where you were silent crouched. In this game you certainly move fast enough while crouched most of the time. I can't tell if it's faster than the un-upgraded speed in the first, but it works fine in the game itself.

 

[Alexios]

I don't get it (the picture)?

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I guess I am just a wizard and understand how to use cover to pop up-headshot rinse and repeat.

Maybe, but regardless, you can only do that in some situations. In areas where more than 4 or so guards are alerted, at least one of them will attempt to rush you. Also, unless you have impeccable accuracy, you're going to run out of ammo pretty quickly if you're gunning everyone down.

 

[33-Hit-Combo]

From reddit:

http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg855/scaled.php?server=855&filename=img0880t.jpg&res=medium

 

[Deleted member 17706]

rofl. Anybody else try to hack a really tough door 15 times, only to get fed up and blow it away with 4 shotgun shells, then find a pocket secretary with the code on the way out?

Wait, you can shoot down doors? Most of them?

 

[HeadlessRoland]

Or maybe you were just lucky. Since the AI can gun you do in a second on the hardest difficulty if you don't have dermal armor or more than 100 health.

What does luck have to do with lining up your sights with a mobs head and then insta killing them over and over again? Worst case scenario is they lob a grenade at you which you then teleport/transition away from.

You don't need to constantly Cloak and Takedown at once, and if you really need to take out an opponent while cloaked, then the Tranq Rifle, Stun Gun, and silenced Pistol exist for those reasons.

Take down provides something you would otherwise not have. Cloaking beyond lasers does not. And yes the silenced pistol is the only weapon you need in any situation...because it can insta kill 90% of the game is 100% accurate and does not cause an alarm.

Also, unless you have impeccable accuracy, you're going to run out of ammo pretty quickly if you're gunning everyone down.

By the end I had used almost every round of pistol ammo in the game. But beyond heavy machine gunners you should be killing 90+% of the dudes in one shot. And some of those only require 1 (couldn't tell it seemed to vary).

 

[Varna]

I know they probably deliberately kept this kind of thing out of the game on purpose, but I really wish people would wake up after a while and other npcs reacted to people missing. There was even a NPC I heard radioing in that the area was all clear... but nothing ever happens once you knock him out.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Take down provides something you would otherwise not have. Cloaking beyond lasers does not.

What does this even mean?

Flashing cloak to get past lasers or cameras is super useful.

(Nonlethal) Takedowns are super useful.


They are not mutually exclusive, you can do both when you need to even with a single energy bar.

 

[Ken]

I don't get it (the picture)?

I guess it means that

Spoiler

after the cutscene where the augment dies Sarif says he'll have an investigation done on the corpse. When you get to the end of the first mission allowing SWAT to move in, the developers decided to place some SWAT NPCs in the room to investigate the augment and if you backtracked all the way back to the room you would see them compared to other games that either wouldn't let you go all the way back to the beginning or bother to add any changes.

 

[Lostconfused]

What does luck have to do with lining up your sights with a mobs head and then insta killing them over and over again? Worst case scenario is they lob a grenade at you which you then teleport/transition away from.

Nothing if you are doing that from stealth. If the enemy is alerted then there is a good chance that you will die before you even manage to get the cross hairs on one of them.

 

[GeoramA]

Took out everyone at DPD, except the last two fucks at the front door who killed me in less than a second.

Anyone else end their playing sessions with a quick murder spree?

 

[Alexios]

Yeah they really should wake up and some quests shouldn't end if you just knock them out, unless the game assumes that due to your awesome sedative capabilities they will stay unconcious long enough to die of dehydration or hunger if someone doesn't wake them up... Yet still gives you non lethal bonuses.

But if they woke up they could even let you taze normally invincible dudes and still have them show up in later cut scenes without issues within the game's logic. Though then they would have to mention the incident if they saw you do it...

 

[HeadlessRoland]

They are not mutually exclusive, you can do both when you need to even with a single energy bar.

In fact they are, take down requires one full bar of energy, correct?

If the enemy is alerted then there is a good chance that you will die before you even manage to get the cross hairs on one of them.

What? You line up the headshot in cover...you pop up and instantly kill one guy (at least) and then instantly go back into cover. You can kill a dozen guys in as many seconds one round per.

 

[Solo]

No beating the game for me until tomorrow night. I spoke to

Spoiler

Darrow and changed his mind

, found

Spoiler

Sarif

, and also got a message to help

Spoiler

Taggart

, and thats where I put it down for the night.

The big outdoor elevator is the point of no return I take it? Have I done everything needed (after I help

Spoiler

Taggart

) to see all the endings?

 

[Hot Coldman]

Yeah they really should wake up and some quests shouldn't end if you just knock them out, unless the game assumes that due to your awesome sedative capabilities they will stay unconcious long enough to die of dehydration or hunger if someone doesn't wake them up...

I normally Falcon Punch people as a way of saying goodbye after a conversation so this annoyed me too.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

In fact they are, take down requires one full bar of energy, correct?

Right, and the bar recharges.

I played a nonlethal run where a large part, if not majority, of people I took out were with takedowns, and I was hurting for energy a lot. I also used Cloak a lot when necessary. These scenarios never really overlapped. I was able to use both without one "negating" the other.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

In fact they are, take down requires one full bar of energy, correct?



What? You line up the headshot in cover...you pop up and instantly kill one guy (at least) and then instantly go back into cover. You can kill a dozen guys in as many seconds one round per.

How do you line up the headshot without exposing yourself?

 

[Zeliard]

How do you line up the headshot without exposing yourself?

By aiming when the person isn't looking in your direction?

 

[HeadlessRoland]

Right, and the bar recharges.

Yeah? What does this have to do with the skills being mutually exclusive because a take down requires a full bar. If you use one you cannot use the other at the same time...this is mutually exclusive.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

By aiming when the person isn't looking in your direction?

And how do you not get spotted by anyone else while doing this?

 

[Zeliard]

And how do you not get spotted by anyone else while doing this?

By making sure nobody is looking at you, and using a silencer? I'm not even sure what you're asking. Pretty puzzling.

I headshot people from cover constantly with my upgraded, silenced 10mm. One-hit kill.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Yeah? What does this have to do with the skills being mutually exclusive because a take down requires a full bar...

I already explained it. You never need to be cloaked to do most takedowns, so acting like Cloak is useless because it "negates" takedown is a complete falsehood. They are both useful.

 

[Coxswain]

How do you line up the headshot without exposing yourself?

You get a simplified blindfire reticle behind cover; as long as you have a laser sight so your bullets go where you aim them, you can eyeball it well enough that you can pretty consistently get a headshot by popping out for maybe half a second.

Like it's pretty easy to do it quickly enough that an enemy walking toward you will not go Hostile in the time between you poking your head out and the bullet going through his face.

 

[Recarpo]

The big outdoor elevator is the point of no return I take it? Have I done everything needed (after I help

Spoiler

Taggart

) to see all the endings?

Yes, the outdoor elevator is the point of no return and

Spoiler

finding and talking to Taggert and Sarif is all you need to get all endings.

 

[Solo]

Thanks man!

And how do you not get spotted by anyone else while doing this?

Wait for no one to be looking at you?

 

[Swifty]

Yeah? What does this have to do with the skills being mutually exclusive because a take down requires a full bar. If you use one you cannot use the other at the same time...this is mutually exclusive.

Sounds pretty balanced to me. If you want to use a take down while using an aug, you need to consume an energy bar. There's some resource management there. If you don't want to use an aug in order to take someone down, you've got to plan a bit more.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

By making sure nobody is looking at you, and using a silencer? I'm not even sure what you're asking. Pretty puzzling.

I headshot people from cover constantly with my upgraded, silenced 10mm. One-hit kill.

Sure, but a lot of the situations in the game aren't going to allow for you to headshot a guy without being spotted or quickly dragging the corpse away afterward.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Fellas. You might have seen this game coming but I am truly shocked over how good it is. The obvious love and care that went into developing this title is a rarity nowadays.

 

[Solo]

Darrow with dat

Spoiler

Daedelus

name drop!

 

[Zeliard]

Sure, but a lot of the situations in the game aren't going to allow for you to headshot a guy without being spotted or quickly dragging the corpse away afterward.

Not necessarily. I've done double headshots at times, killing a dude and his pal barely has a second to register before he goes down with a silenced headshot, and nobody else in the room is aware. Tremendously fun.

Snag the laser sight. Like in the first game, you essentially have 100% accuracy with it. The red dot is precisely where the bullet goes.

 

[oneils]

Ok everyone, call me a wuss.

I lowered the difficulty and I'm now having much more fun. Oh well. Back in Heng-sha. Having a blast.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Not necessarily. I've done double headshots at times, killing a dude and his pal barely has a second to register before he goes down with a silenced headshot, and nobody else in the room is aware. Tremendously fun.

Snag the laser sight. Like in the first game, you essentially have 100% accuracy with it. The red dot is precisely where the bullet goes.

Sure, I've done similar things with the laser-sighted pistol, but it seems a bit ridiculous, to me at least, to claim that such a feat is a simple thing throughout the game. Unless you know the patrol patterns and timings of every NPC in the game, there will be plenty of situations where you will set off an alarm after killing a guard.