Son Of Sparda
Member
Hah, it's good to know that I'm not the only one who likes to give Capcom shit over that logo.
I'll legit take a DMC logo this year, though 
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Devil May Cry 4 Special Edition |OT| Two girls, one motivated Vergil
- Thread starter Sigmaah
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Hah, it's good to know that I'm not the only one who likes to give Capcom shit over that logo.
So much discussion, but I'm too tired to contribute. So I'll just drop this old gem by our dear AgentLampshade-kun in anticipation of DMC5 in 3-4 hours (although I'm sticking by E3 2017). See you there, guys. Stop by the GAF twitch chat and we can share our hype or disappointment in real time.
So much discussion, but I'm too tired to contribute. So I'll just drop this old gem by our dear AgentLampshade-kun in anticipation of DMC5 in 3-4 hours (although I'm sticking by E3 2017). See you there, guys. Stop by the GAF twitch chat and we can share our hype or disappointment in real time.
No! It must not be disappointment!
It must not...
DantesLink
Member
So much discussion, but I'm too tired to contribute. So I'll just drop this old gem by our dear AgentLampshade-kun in anticipation of DMC5 in 3-4 hours (although I'm sticking by E3 2017). See you there, guys. Stop by the GAF twitch chat and we can share our hype or disappointment in real time.
Ryu Hayabusa has been lurking in the Musou swamp since 2011
It's too late to save him...
The L'arc en Ciel thing was dumb, but wasn't aimed at a worldwide audience. It wasn't meant for us.
Having nothing to show is weird, but then again nobody had anything to show. Only Tecmo Koei.
Sorry, I missed this. But chat was completely dead anyway.
Having nothing to show is weird, but then again nobody had anything to show. Only Tecmo Koei.
Sorry, I missed this. But chat was completely dead anyway.
Wolf Akela
Member
Son Of Sparda
Member
Capcom never ceases to amaze me.
Although this presser was just really bad. They didn't even show stuff that we were certain about like Tamsoft's new game or freaking Cold Steel 3. Didn't even had Nagoshi in it!
I don't know wtf Sony was doing with that conference.
Although this presser was just really bad. They didn't even show stuff that we were certain about like Tamsoft's new game or freaking Cold Steel 3. Didn't even had Nagoshi in it!
I don't know wtf Sony was doing with that conference.
I think this is a good summary and analysis of the press conference.
Kagari also commented that Japanese viewers seemed pleased with the conference.
This press conference just wasn't intended for GAF and the usual press conference stream viewer. And after how good last year's conference was, not including E3 this and last year, along with PSX, I can't be too salty about it. There's a bunch of huge titles coming out in the following months including FFXV and TLG. As well as ones like Deus Ex that already launched. Early next year we're getting Horizon, Persona 5, Nioh, Nier Automata, and RE7.
There'll be more new footage from the floor over the course of the week, including a big RE7 event on Saturday.
TLG (2009), Nioh (2004), Owlboy (2008?), and FFXV (2006), lol.
Kagari also commented that Japanese viewers seemed pleased with the conference.
This press conference just wasn't intended for GAF and the usual press conference stream viewer. And after how good last year's conference was, not including E3 this and last year, along with PSX, I can't be too salty about it. There's a bunch of huge titles coming out in the following months including FFXV and TLG. As well as ones like Deus Ex that already launched. Early next year we're getting Horizon, Persona 5, Nioh, Nier Automata, and RE7.
There'll be more new footage from the floor over the course of the week, including a big RE7 event on Saturday.
TLG (2009), Nioh (2004), Owlboy (2008?), and FFXV (2006), lol.
AgentLampshade
Member
Y'know, I've seen fan art of someone doing the letters as numerals for Resident Evil 6, so I can't even praise their creativity for the logo. In fact. Here it is.
You may scoff, but I actually think this is the LEAST that KT could be doing, for promoting their character action game star.
Another Musou appearance is definitely "beneath" Ninja Ryu, but at least he's still doing his best to stay relevant and making current appearances, showing that his company is still interested in marketing him. Musou Stars is just as much an effective marketing vehicle as it is a "celebration" of KT's brands. It likely also means that Ninja Ryu's proper return is likely next up on the docket, as soon as Team Ninja's action game squad is finished with Nioh, and they want to make damn sure people already know or remember who he is. Between keeping him out there and Nioh helping to further shed the "Ninja Dog" image and build up their cred, Team Ninja and Koei Tecmo seems to be already making the right moves to prepare for the immediate future.
Compare that with Capcom's treatment of DMC, at the moment. It's pretty much all quiet on the western front, unless you count 4SE last year, and Dante and Vergil's recent appearances in a 3DS strategy RPG that Capcom had no hand in besides loaning them out. Unless there's another Capcom crossover fighting game coming out soon, how else are they going to help prop up the return of their own star? They're not making this whole thing of "getting Classic Dante back into the public conscious, after nearly a ten year gap since his last game" any easier on themselves.
J_Macgrady
Member
Be honest though, are the majority of people who would buy DMC5 even care about all the little appearances Dante and Vergil make in these games?
DmC DE and DMC4SE came out last year. That's a lot. A lot more than what you can say about Ninja Gaiden. They'll focus on promoting the characters when they feel comfortable announcing the new game. It's that simple.
Dante and vergil statues
https://middleofnowheregaming.com/2...tues-so-epic-theyll-bring-a-tear-to-your-eye/
Looks really good.
Sorry i am on my phone, cant (too lazy) put the pictures here
https://middleofnowheregaming.com/2...tues-so-epic-theyll-bring-a-tear-to-your-eye/
Looks really good.
Sorry i am on my phone, cant (too lazy) put the pictures here
robotzombie
Member
So is there any chance left of a dmc5 reveal at tgs or has that ship sailed since the Sony press conference is over?
badcrumble
Member
TGS isn't over but I reeeeally wouldn't bank on it. It was a long shot anyway; most folks in this thread and elsewhere agree that Capcom's got to focus all of its PR efforts and dollars on RE7 right now, given that that franchise is kinda on the rocks. (Arguably DMC also is and has been, but it's not as important to Capcom's bottom line as RE is *and* it's less tricky to save since just bringing back classic Dante as protagonist and making Vergil core to the story would have fans cheering even if they also revealed that DMC5 will be turn-based or something*)
*I jest, but it's at least clear what fans want from DMC as far as gameplay is concerned and DmC
E/DMC4SE shows that Capcom knows it already, whereas RE has the unique problem of having multiple fanbases for multiple different tones and gameplay styles, making it exceptionally hard to know how to move forwardSon Of Sparda
Member
Nah. Don't believe in DMC5 until they outright confirm it. For all we know 4SE and DmC
E could have been quick cash grabs and Itsuno and co might be working on a smartphone game or some other shit like that.darkslayer101
Member
CrimsonCrescendo
Banned
Loaded up Devil May Cry 3 in to play the intro. Shit is still the fucking hypest. So much so I ended up playing through Mission 9 in one sitting. DMC 5 needs to find a way to be on par or top that.
Edit: Can I just say the pacing of the first seven missions is amazing? The first mission gives you the hype as fuck intro and then throws you right into the fray, Mission 2 puts you into a larger fray and sets you against a mini-boss, Mission 3 throws you against Cerberus to see if you learned anything and will kick your ass until you do, Mission 4 is a bit of a cool down from that as you explore the Teminagru a bit and face off against Gigapede, Mission 5 gives you more time to go through the tower and then ambushes you with Agni & Rudra, Mission 6 cools down and tests what you know about the style system, and just when you think you are getting the hang of things BAM here comes Vergil to teach you a lesson.
Edit: Can I just say the pacing of the first seven missions is amazing? The first mission gives you the hype as fuck intro and then throws you right into the fray, Mission 2 puts you into a larger fray and sets you against a mini-boss, Mission 3 throws you against Cerberus to see if you learned anything and will kick your ass until you do, Mission 4 is a bit of a cool down from that as you explore the Teminagru a bit and face off against Gigapede, Mission 5 gives you more time to go through the tower and then ambushes you with Agni & Rudra, Mission 6 cools down and tests what you know about the style system, and just when you think you are getting the hang of things BAM here comes Vergil to teach you a lesson.
Son Of Sparda
Member
After seeing how big of a leap Yakuza 6 has been from Yakuza 0 and Kiwami, I just can't stop thinking about how such a relatively smaller team like Team Yakuza manages to do a title every year (with considerable changes and new contents) and yet it has been 3 years since DmC and we still haven't heard a peep from Capcom about the next entry in the DMC series.
Granted, with Yakuza most of the times they kinda add and change from the fundamentals that are already in the previous entries. But then there comes stuff like Ishin and Yakuza 6 that are very very different from what they've done in the past and yet they still manage to release them in yearly basis.
Hell, the same team even managed to do a completely new TPS IP called Binary Domain between Yakuza Dead Souls and Yakuza 5!
So either Capcom is very slow with their production stuff or devs at Team Yakuza are wizards.
Granted, with Yakuza most of the times they kinda add and change from the fundamentals that are already in the previous entries. But then there comes stuff like Ishin and Yakuza 6 that are very very different from what they've done in the past and yet they still manage to release them in yearly basis.
Hell, the same team even managed to do a completely new TPS IP called Binary Domain between Yakuza Dead Souls and Yakuza 5!
So either Capcom is very slow with their production stuff or devs at Team Yakuza are wizards.
badcrumble
Member
It's kinda both, lol.
Yakuza has the added benefit of being a huge cult hit that they're not particularly trying to blow up into a big Western franchise.
Son Of Sparda
Member
Yeah, that's true. But still they really add a lot to these games with each new title.
Ishin had a completely new focus in combat, new environments, new mini-games, and pretty much new everything. The game even had a farmer simulator life style thingy going on which was really well made and deep.
The following year they introduced the style systems for the first time in the main series (which pretty much officially made the game a stylish action title) with a completely new playable character (with 4 new unique styles for him) and that's ignoring the changes that they brought to the environments due to the game being in a different time period. They also added TONS of new contents and side stuff to the game like a thorough Night Club management side activity and many new mini-games (that were relevant to the time period) such as dancing or phone calls with girls.
After that admittedly Kiwami was more like a refined and touched-up version of Yakuza 0, but I'm willing to give them a pass on this one since their main 2016 game will be Yakuza 6 and God that game looks sooooo amazingly good and content heavy that I don't eve know where to begin with. Biggest jump in the Yakuza series thus far, since they made a lot of things completely from ground up and the mind-blowing thing is that it seems to be one of the most content packed games in the franchise as well.
Add to the fact that all of the mentioned titles have very strong and lengthy stories in their main storyline and huge amount of interesting sides stories, and it's not hard to see why I'm so jaw dropped by Team Yakuza and what they've managed to accomplish in the past few years.
Just played DmC and replayed the entire Devil May Cry series. Phew!
Devil May Cry 1: 6.5/10
Devil May Cry 2: 4.0/10
Devil May Cry 3: 8.5/10
Devil May Cry 4: 7.5/10
DmC: 8.0/10
Definitely different than I remember in many ways. The camera and dodge mechanics of this franchise are a nightmare for sure, but Dante is a lot of fun to play as. Kinda frustrates me that the only thing Devil May Cry 2 did right with a single button dodge wasn't used in 3 or 4.
Devil May Cry 1: 6.5/10
Devil May Cry 2: 4.0/10
Devil May Cry 3: 8.5/10
Devil May Cry 4: 7.5/10
DmC: 8.0/10
Definitely different than I remember in many ways. The camera and dodge mechanics of this franchise are a nightmare for sure, but Dante is a lot of fun to play as. Kinda frustrates me that the only thing Devil May Cry 2 did right with a single button dodge wasn't used in 3 or 4.
darkslayer101
Member
imo dodging is perfectly fine in the DMC franchise. Having a single dodge button seems to make it too casual not to mention limiting options for key bindings.
AgentLampshade
Member
Dodging in DmCE often means pressing up to three buttons at once (Including both shoulder buttons for lock on) and it feels horrible to me.
E often means pressing up to three buttons at once (Including both shoulder buttons for lock on) and it feels horrible to me.Son Of Sparda
Member
Dodging in OG DMC always felt needlessly complicated to me, so I liked that they had a dedicated dodge button in DmC.
Dodging (talking about the R1+Left/Right+X version) was probably acceptable back in DMC1 with the slower, more methodical combat but it's completely unacceptable now.
It's so unacceptable now that the enemies still have to be designed with the old dodge in mind. Soulbourne games which have even slower, more methodical combat than DMC1 still have enemies/bosses who attack fast and that's balanced because you can dodge more easily. Hell it's more efficient, easier to just jump through attacks instead which just exposes how bad the dodge always has been.
Not to mention that it was never actually intuitive and restricted the 3D range of the dodge (can't dodge towards or away from attacks, only in two directions). This is one of those things that will not bother a long time DMC veteran but it's something that the current generation of players will not tolerate at all.
DmC's dodge system was imperfect but they at least tried to go down the right path. They made the mistake of having that stance system and then had the dodge button on the Shoulder buttons. So had to be holding down Lock On (R1), a stance modifier so let's say L2 for Angel and then L1 for Dodge. That's kinda stupid. The standard dodge button should just be Circle like Trickster (or like every other action game or ARPG out there right now).
Now people will bring up the issue of restricted design space because it limits the moves you can make to which I point to my control scheme of DMC5 that I have put up here numerous times. It's very easy to have all the styles be available at once while also having one button dodge... the only thing you have to change is how Devil Trigger works and that action is so limited in scope you can move it to something else easily (even the D Pad).
Sure.. they can retain the old dodge system. But then they have to design the enemies/boss encounters with that old dodge in mind which means dumb as hell enemies that get obliterated whenever you jump above them.
It's so unacceptable now that the enemies still have to be designed with the old dodge in mind. Soulbourne games which have even slower, more methodical combat than DMC1 still have enemies/bosses who attack fast and that's balanced because you can dodge more easily. Hell it's more efficient, easier to just jump through attacks instead which just exposes how bad the dodge always has been.
Not to mention that it was never actually intuitive and restricted the 3D range of the dodge (can't dodge towards or away from attacks, only in two directions). This is one of those things that will not bother a long time DMC veteran but it's something that the current generation of players will not tolerate at all.
DmC's dodge system was imperfect but they at least tried to go down the right path. They made the mistake of having that stance system and then had the dodge button on the Shoulder buttons. So had to be holding down Lock On (R1), a stance modifier so let's say L2 for Angel and then L1 for Dodge. That's kinda stupid. The standard dodge button should just be Circle like Trickster (or like every other action game or ARPG out there right now).
Now people will bring up the issue of restricted design space because it limits the moves you can make to which I point to my control scheme of DMC5 that I have put up here numerous times. It's very easy to have all the styles be available at once while also having one button dodge... the only thing you have to change is how Devil Trigger works and that action is so limited in scope you can move it to something else easily (even the D Pad).
Sure.. they can retain the old dodge system. But then they have to design the enemies/boss encounters with that old dodge in mind which means dumb as hell enemies that get obliterated whenever you jump above them.
Yeah, I always fail in my arguments when I say DMC is the shit, just because everyone would bring up the fact that the controls are weird and uncomfortable, compared to something like MGR or Bayonetta
I'm really interested to see how would Itsuno "modernize" the series
It's funny how Kamiya had to take some notes from DMC4 when making Bayonetta
and now it's time for Itsuno to do the exact same thing with Bayonetta & Revengeance
Glad to see Team Ninja correcting their stupid mistake by giving us back the low stance ki pulse recovery
I'm honestly extremely burnt out of souls at this point
and I couldn't stand playing past the first level in the beta when I found out that they removed this mechanic to make it more souls like
I'm honestly extremely burnt out of souls at this point
and I couldn't stand playing past the first level in the beta when I found out that they removed this mechanic to make it more souls like
Then why have a dodge at all?
The answer is that some attacks are designed to be better beaten by dodges while others are better dodged with a jump. Stuff like Griffon's vertical lightning or Vergil's Helm Breaker are better dodged with a roll than a jump because of their vertical active frames. It's possible to dodge any attack with any form of invincible ability but some are easier than others and that's the point of having of multiple defensive options.
I also think that dodges should recover faster when dodged properly to get back into the action faster, which would make them more appealing to use over just jumping. Kinda like Table Hopper but IMO a regular dodge should be the speed of Table Hopper and a properly timed dodge should be even faster.
And to be honest there really isn't much DMC can learn from Bayonetta. A lot of the relevant mechanics are already in DMC4 in some form. It's about putting it into one package and then having everything else support the combat which means level design and enemy/boss design. DMC4's combat (with some tweaks) with a full game that supports that combat would automatically be GOAT action game. For Itsuno to evolve DMC's combat, he has to look beyond any game... he has to go even further beyond *que Super Saiyan 3 music*.
I guess you're right
speaking of which, I think Nier Automata is going for that approach with its insane dodge system
I have a feeling that Nier Automata would be the game that an insanely op character like Vergil in DMC4:SE would fit right in
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what I meant was that Bayonetta & Revengeance are clearly much more accessible than DMC
Of course, we don't want something as horrendously accessible as DmC
But I wanna give the controller to my friends and be like "SEE! NOW YOU KNOW WHY I CAN'T SHUT UP ABOUT THIS THING!"
I can do that with Bayonetta & Revengeance, maybe even God Hand
but with DMC, that's impossible due to the extreme learning curve, with barely anything for the average player to mess around with
Man Nier and Nioh look so godlike. Hopefully they end up being good.
I am also hyped for Berserk even though I know the combat is going to be garbage.
Also DmC did take cues from PGs by allowing players to dodge and combo more freely while retaining the aspect of swapping "styles" and weapons from DMC. It was an inelegant solution but it was successful in the fact that new players got the gist of the combat quickly and figured out why people like DMC to begin with.
I am also hyped for Berserk even though I know the combat is going to be garbage.
Also DmC did take cues from PGs by allowing players to dodge and combo more freely while retaining the aspect of swapping "styles" and weapons from DMC. It was an inelegant solution but it was successful in the fact that new players got the gist of the combat quickly and figured out why people like DMC to begin with.
Nioh was pretty much dead to me when they removed Ki pulse recovery from low stance
but now I'm back on the hype train!
Nier is just, super impressive in so many ways. Sometimes I feel like it's too good to be true and I need to dial down my hype, BUT I CAN'T!
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see, execution is key
DmC would look so bland compared to other PG shit
I can sell a Wii U by just letting someone play "when the two meet" chapter in Bayonetta 2
The lumen sage was so fuckin' cool!
on the other hand, you can't really say that much about DmC's color coded enemies and the super forgettable bosses...
AgentLampshade
Member
Nier Automata sounds like my perfect game: a long RPG with DMC-like combat. The only thing holding me back is that I haven't played the original (original 2?) game(s). I don't want to google if I need to play it to understand this either, for fear of spoilers. So I guess I should just ask... Here? Dunno why I haven't before.
I was also trying to remember what they had mapped circle to in DmC, then I remembered its a launcher. DmCE did a lot of interesting things with the combat, but I really feel the basics weren't great, and that bogs it down.
I was also trying to remember what they had mapped circle to in DmC, then I remembered its a launcher. DmC
E did a lot of interesting things with the combat, but I really feel the basics weren't great, and that bogs it down.It really won't be necessary to play Nier before Automata - they've stated repeatedly that it's self-contained; and the setting and much of the cast are removed from each other. There are references and some cameos connecting the games, but the main stories themselves are completely separate. I'd still recommend Nier on its own merits if you have the means to play it, though. Drakengard, not so much.
Son Of Sparda
Member
In fact, I think Yoko Taro said that Automata would be more confusing to people who have played Nier.
The only thing that makes me worried about Automata is the Taro craziness. Like, in Drankengard 3 every time you would call for your dragon the game's framerate would tank completely, I'm talking about 10-15 frames here. Or the entire game is action and then there comes the true final boss and it's a fucking musical/rhythmic battle without any sort of tutorial (just look it up on google to see how awful it actually was).
Or in original Nier there was a text adventure/VN part. Now, I really liked the story that they told through those texts but still it was pretty boring to go from action to 20-30 minutes of straight text reading.
With Automata's recent showing and that awful completely zoomed out 2D section, I'm worried about how much of Taro's crazy stuff might be present in the final game.
PS: All in all, I did enjoy the genre switching in Nier though. Especially that one part when the game becomes a classic RE style horror game in a mansion.
The only thing that makes me worried about Automata is the Taro craziness. Like, in Drankengard 3 every time you would call for your dragon the game's framerate would tank completely, I'm talking about 10-15 frames here. Or the entire game is action and then there comes the true final boss and it's a fucking musical/rhythmic battle without any sort of tutorial (just look it up on google to see how awful it actually was).
Or in original Nier there was a text adventure/VN part. Now, I really liked the story that they told through those texts but still it was pretty boring to go from action to 20-30 minutes of straight text reading.
With Automata's recent showing and that awful completely zoomed out 2D section, I'm worried about how much of Taro's crazy stuff might be present in the final game.
PS: All in all, I did enjoy the genre switching in Nier though. Especially that one part when the game becomes a classic RE style horror game in a mansion.
Capcom has released its 2016 Integrated Report. Some might remember that the Integrated Report from last year contained this info among other things. Something it also revealed that no one really picked up on was that they were working on a VR engine, which turne out to be the RE Engine.
Time to dig through this in the hopes of finding juicy info, particularly about DMC.
Time to dig through this in the hopes of finding juicy info, particularly about DMC.
badcrumble
Member
Yeah, I think making dodge easier to execute would be a good thing for the combat in general. Jump works well most of the time but also exposes you to more vulnerability a lot of the time, and since it's easier to pull off, new players are trained by default to jump rather than to roll dodge. This encourages you to play the game wrong, basically.