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[Crispy Gamer]

I personally thought it had the best uplift in IQ.

It's weird they showed more TLOU 2 instead of this an actual next-gen only game

 

[PaintTinJr]

I personally thought it had the best uplift in IQ.

The detail of the two pedestrians and car in the distance is a flat blur on the left, and like a super resolution clear on the right, even though it is like 200-300 metres from the camera. I've seen nothing at that relative distance using DLSS anywhere near as clean and clear.

 

[sachos]

One thing i dont think we have talked about is the huge potential uplift for GPU bound games like Elden Ring. Almost locked 60 in Quality equivalent settings when testing with the 6800. It would have been cool to see how it could run in the RT mode settings.

 

[ChiefDada]

Could be something to the fact that the two Sony games that arguably showed the best results with PSSR (TLOU Remastered; 2024 and SM2; late 2023) were released later than the titles that had more apparent deficiencies (Ratchet;2021/GT7; early 2022) or complete absence of PSSR (Horizon; early 2022). Could it be possible TLOU and SM2 devs obtained Pro devkits in time and were able to incorporate PSSR from inception as opposed to retrofitting?

 

[Anchovie123]

One thing i dont think we have talked about is the huge potential uplift for GPU bound games like Elden Ring. Almost locked 60 in Quality equivalent settings when testing with the 6800. It would have been cool to see how it could run in the RT mode settings.

Watch Fromsoft patch in Pro support, overshoot GPU bounds then fuck it up again.

 

[3liteDragon]

Reading up a lot on this Pro stuff, in terms of pure raster perf, my guess is that it's gonna be a bit above the 7700 XT. Now if we're bringing in the improved RT & AI feature set which isn't on any current AMD GPU yet, until the RDNA 4 cards are out the closest one will be the 4070. And I don't think PSSR (which is in a very good state for its first iteration) & the Pro's improved RT will compete with that card either. Its RT capabilities remain the big question mark. I also think there's a good chance PSSR will help the Pro (on a game-by-game basis) come close to 4070 in raster perf as well (RT excluded). Just my take, could be right or wrong, we'll know when the console's out.

 

[Zathalus]

I do wonder how often Sony will update PSSR and if future updates will get applied to previous game versions, so as to fix issues such as ghosting and shimmering.

In addition to PSSR I hope the add their own version of Ray Reconstruction to help as a denoiser for some of the artifacts you get from low resolution RT effects.

 

[Team Andromeda]

Aaaahhh, so you're a troll. Gotcha. Wish I'd known earlier before trying to engage. Lesson learned.

You seem not be able to accept or understand that the price is £700 and I don't think that it's only £300 more than what has gone before or looks like some here. to try and include trade-in value

The Price is £700 END OF. And SONY is doing a terrible job of selling a £700 system with poor demos some with just 3 seconds' worth of clips, what on earth is that about.

 

[PaintTinJr]

I do wonder how often Sony will update PSSR and if future updates will get applied to previous game versions, so as to fix issues such as ghosting and shimmering.

What ghosting? AFAIK there's none at normal game speed, and I'm yet to see an example of the shimmering that is unwanted or visible at normal zoom. The analysis by DF has been completely stacked with crops and zooms to try and imply that DLSS isn't inferior.

In addition to PSSR I hope they add their own version of Ray Reconstruction to help as a denoiser for some of the artefacts you get from low resolution RT effects.

Ray reconstruction is questionably useful to provide coherent results consistently.

UE5 since the beginning already does its own technique but at source scene data to guide it render less rays denoised, originally lumen did just 0.7 rays per pixel IIRC which I suspect they've improved on.

PlayStation 'Spectral' Super Resolution seemingly (by the leaked 864p) already seems like its solution is to save multifold by rendering less pixels natively, providing headroom to render more native RT in the groups that actually get rendered natively, and then upscale the whole lot to get proportionally more RT that is guaranteed to be coherent to the scene.

 

[Zathalus]

What ghosting? AFAIK there's none at normal game speed, and I'm yet to see an example of the shimmering that is unwanted or visible at normal zoom. The analysis by DF has been completely stacked with crops and zooms to try and imply that DLSS isn't inferior.

Ray reconstruction is questionably useful to provide coherent results consistently.

UE5 since the beginning already does its own technique but at source scene data to guide it render less rays denoised, originally lumen did just 0.7 rays per pixel IIRC which I suspect they've improved on.

PlayStation 'Spectral' Super Resolution seemingly (by the leaked 864p) already seems like its solution is to save multifold by rendering less pixels natively, providing headroom to render more native RT in the groups that actually get rendered natively, and then upscale the whole lot to get proportionally more RT that is guaranteed to be coherent to the scene.

 

[PaintTinJr]

What's the point of you replying at all if you aren't going to pour me another glass of your DF Kool-Aid ?

 

[Zathalus]

What's the point of you replying at all if you aren't going to pour me another glass of your DF Kool-Aid ?

Because your trolling is getting a bit tiresome at this point? You're clearly not interested in having a real conversation.

 

[PaintTinJr]

Because your trolling is getting a bit tiresome at this point? You're clearly not interested in having a real conversation.

There's nothing unreasonable about the points of discussion in context of you having actual technology knowledge to construct your own counter points - rather than just repeating populist DF 'analysis' - but sure, making one's own argument is the problem and trolling, right?

 

[Zathalus]

There's nothing unreasonable about the points of discussion in context of you having actual technology knowledge to construct your own counter points - rather than just repeating populist DF 'analysis' - but sure, making one's own argument is the problem and trolling, right?

You flat up admit you didn't watch the video and refuse to admit to the ghosting that multiple people have mentioned. If you can't agree on this basic fact then what else is there to discuss? You can throw as much technical jargon at the screen as you want, but none of that matters if you refuse to engage with the very basic premise of the observation.

 

[PaintTinJr]

You flat up admit you didn't watch the video and refuse to admit to the ghosting that multiple people have mentioned. If you can't agree on this basic fact then what else is there to discuss? You can throw as much technical jargon at the screen as you want, but none of that matters if you refuse to engage with the very basic premise of the observation.

The 'video' isn't a primary source of info. Why would I watch framed info that supports a false narrative from people that wouldn't survive any serious peer review process to validate what they do?

The issues aren't perceivable in any of the footage CNET randomly shot while trying out the Pro in Cerny's company are they? The issues aren't perceivable in real-time at normal viewing in any of the high quality footage from the reveal, completely invalidating the ghosting/shimmering narrative.

 

[Zathalus]

The 'video' isn't a primary source of info. Why would I watch framed info that supports a false narrative from people that wouldn't survive any serious peer review process to validate what they do?

The issues aren't perceivable in any of the footage CNET randomly shot while trying out the Pro in Cerny's company are they? The issues aren't perceivable in real-time at normal viewing in any of the high quality footage from the reveal, completely invalidating the ghosting/shimmering narrative.

So exactly what I just mentioned. You don't want to engage with the basic premise of this thread so further discussion on the topic is pointless.

 

[Gaiff]

The 'video' isn't a primary source of info. Why would I watch framed info that supports a false narrative from people that wouldn't survive any serious peer review process to validate what they do?

The issues aren't perceivable in any of the footage CNET randomly shot while trying out the Pro in Cerny's company are they? The issues aren't perceivable in real-time at normal viewing in any of the high quality footage from the reveal, completely invalidating the ghosting/shimmering narrative.

That's the case for a lot of the DLSS footage as well. For instance, the ghosting on the balloons in Rift Apart requires you to zoom in and be very very close to the display. I have a 34" monitor and initially thought there wasn't any until I leaned closer and managed to spot it. If you're sitting at a normal viewing distance from a TV, there's no way you'll see it.

 

[PaintTinJr]

So exactly what I just mentioned. You don't want to engage with the basic premise of this thread so further discussion on the topic is pointless.

The premise of the thread is their coverage findings, no? Or is Gaf now just an outlet to promote their content and whatever they say has assumed veracity?

 

[Zathalus]

The premise of the thread is their coverage findings, no? Or is Gaf now just an outlet to promote their content and whatever they say has assumed veracity?

Yes, so how would you discuss and/or debunk the findings in the video that the thread is about if you refuse to watch it?

 

[Crispy Gamer]

I found it hard to see ghosting in the PSSR footage but could easily spot it in DLSS these technologies are close but we need to see more software before saying anything definitive because we're evaluating final software vs in development footage.

 

[PaintTinJr]

That's the case for a lot of the DLSS footage as well. For instance, the ghosting on the balloons in Rift Apart requires you to zoom in and be very very close to the display. I have a 34" monitor and initially thought there wasn't any until I leaned closer and managed to spot it. If you're sitting at a normal viewing distance from a TV, there's no way you'll see it.

It isn't ghosting if you aren't seeing in normal viewing or....

are game developers and ML AI upscaler developers supposed to rework and compromise the benefits of their solutions on the off chance someone has their nose up against a high quality tiny screen and spot something that seems like ghosting? Or having people like DF combe every frame at slowmo and 500x zoom to false label a non-artefact?

 

[PaintTinJr]

Yes, so how would you discuss and/or debunk the findings in the video that the thread is about if you refuse to watch it?

There is plenty of people proxying their false claims of a source/s I have seen, and they are providing screen grabs like the one I critiqued by Bojji where he wrongly claimed the zoomed and cropped PSSR R&C shot a 60fps was inferior to PS5 fidelity for aliasing.

But, yeah I'm not going to be the one making the thread or beginning the discussions, doesn't mean I can't discuss the claims or analyse the screen grabs does it?

 

[Zathalus]

There is plenty of people proxying their false claims of a source/s I have seen, and they are providing screen grabs like the one I critiqued by Bojji where he wrongly claimed the zoomed and cropped PSSR R&C shot a 60fps was inferior to PS5 fidelity for aliasing.

But, yeah I'm not going to be the one making the thread or beginning the discussions, doesn't mean I can't discuss the claims or analyse the screen grabs does it?

You can of course critique screenshots the people contributing to the thread add, but it's pretty pointless to critique somebody talking about something they saw in the video without seeing it for yourself isn't it?

 

[PaintTinJr]

You can of course critique screenshots the people contributing to the thread add, but it's pretty pointless to critique somebody talking about something they saw in the video without seeing it for yourself isn't it?

Not if I don't wish to automatically give validation to their 'analysis', no.

 

[Mr Moose]

I see better lighting but I don't like the blurry waves in the foreground on the PSSR version.

I think they added DoF.

 

[Physiognomonics]

I found it hard to see ghosting in the PSSR footage but could easily spot it in DLSS these technologies are close but we need to see more software before saying anything definitive because we're evaluating final software vs in development footage.

Exactly. I am not expert of DLSS but can easily see plenty of ghosting in motion in most comparisons and without zooms. With PSSR you really need fast motion and big zooms to see some slight ghosting.

 

[SkyHighTrees]

Mfs is getting banned and shit. Its happening alright

 

[boris1979]

800€ for this, close to 1k if you want a disk drive

Guys seriously, it's time to switch to PC.

So you want to play big money for non gaming platform pc and dont want for gaming platform? Makes sence.

 

[boris1979]

Each second contains 60 frames to analyse and compare, no more is needed, but I guess many are now in denial.

Indeed they do, but that this is not what people expected is undoubtedly the case. It's just a slightly more powerful PS5 with better IQ thanks to AI upscaler.

Image quality at 60 comparable to 30 on ps5 is huge.

 

[boris1979]

Clear upgrade on Hogwarts props to them delivering that at 60FPS. Window looks massively better and the obvious raytracing reflection.

Ray tracing will be at 30 and 40 fps.

 

[welshrat]

Ray tracing will be at 30 and 40 fps.

40 is fine by me. I was wondering if the balanced mode was going to get a reasonable upgrade as was quite happy playing that mode but the visuals could really have done with a touch up

 

[Physiognomonics]

Ray tracing will be at 30 and 40 fps.

And likely 60fps with reduced resolution.

 

[boris1979]

Looks like PSSR is not doing ray reconstruction like DLSS can do. This needs to be a priority for future iterations of PSSR because the RT reflections are rendering at 1080p in Gran Turismo 7 and without ray reconstruction it's easier to see the low resolution.

1080p native is very high res for reflections. They look very good.

 

[boris1979]

Everything is running at 100+FPS so yeah I don't see the need for now. Maybe the next generation of CPU.


Lmao this really triggered you. I can't control what anyone is doing with their money. I'm just suggesting

If you are happy with sub 1080p in 2024, good for you (and everyone else!).

You play 4k dlss perf its 1080p native so stop this bs.

 

[boris1979]

So it s not even the Quality mode at 60fps.

Honestly this… does not look great

This footage of Hogwarts is at 30 though

It targets similar visual experience at 60 fps on pro with 30 on ps5. Of course native res is lower than 30 fps on pro and in my opinion at 60 fps more than 1080p upsampled to 4k is useless.

 

[boris1979]

Pro can use FSR3 frame gen just like 3070ti (and regular PS5). There is no info about PSSR FG so far.

Consoles dont have frame gen at their sdks.

 

[Bojji]

Consoles dont have frame gen at their sdks.

Xbox have probably?

It doesn't matter in the end, developers can use it

 

[boris1979]

They have the same frame gen option as of now as there's no Sony AI frame gen solution like DLSS3. It's FSR3.

Its difficult to implement because consoles dont have frame gen in libraries unlike pc.

 

[boris1979]

Xbox have probably?

It doesn't matter in the end, developers can use it

Absolutely different situation. On pc fsr frame gen is in dx 12 api. On consoles devs must port it from pc and integrate to console engine. Very hard work. And Immortals is only game that works with vrr on consoles. I think fiture fsr ai framegen will be implemented on pro and future xbox.

 

[Bojji]

Absolutely different situation. On pc fsr frame gen is in dx 12 api. On consoles devs must port it from pc and integrate to console engine. Very hard work. And Immortals is only game that works with vrr on consoles. I think fiture fsr ai framegen will be implemented on pro and future xbox.

Immortals is only game with reasonable use of technology, it's 45-60fps base and aims for 90-120 with frame gen. Not fucking 30 to 60...

We already have games with this tech on consoles so I don't know what we are talking about here.

 

[KyoZz]

You play 4k dlss perf its 1080p native so stop this bs.

Not really, I have a 1440p display and I play with DLAA and if possible I supersample to 4k.

 

[boris1979]

Immortals is only game with reasonable use of technology, it's 45-60fps base and aims for 90-120 with frame gen. Not fucking 30 to 60...

We already have games with this tech on consoles so I don't know what we are talking about here.

Unreal engine 5 is only engine now that supports frame generation on consoles. I think pro will be first console to support frame gen at sdk level. If it was so easy to implement on consoles all games on pc that have fsr framegen also had it on consoles.