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Diablo III |OT5| Finally out of Beta
- Thread starter CarbonatedFalcon
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UnluckyKate
Member
decided to try my new barb pole and do a small run. figured out that In ever finished act one inferno in barb so I go from Wortham to butcher.
Got two legendaries. Two (shitty) weapons, one monk and one pole. Both dex and 20% MF.
And then , that's how my monk got up to 260 base MF. Also, 5k dps lol
Got two legendaries. Two (shitty) weapons, one monk and one pole. Both dex and 20% MF.
And then , that's how my monk got up to 260 base MF. Also, 5k dps lol
UnluckyKate
Member
Well, the Zombie Dog change is neat. I wonder what Gargantuan gets though. Then again, Zombie Dogs are the ones classified as a defensive summon...
As for Vision Quest, it's a lot easier to use. I'll say, at least. Probably would've been better off at +50% so a fully geared WD can still get to ~120/130 regen.
As for Vision Quest, it's a lot easier to use. I'll say, at least. Probably would've been better off at +50% so a fully geared WD can still get to ~120/130 regen.
UnluckyKate
Member
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Hm, that was underwhelming. Just saying "fuck it" and boosting WD's native mana regen is boring and uncreative, imo. I prefer the idea I suggested earlier of making VQ an innate attribute of all WDs and have the mana regen effect occur even when only 1 skill is on cooldown, and progressively scale it proportionately with the number of skills currently on cooldown. That way you still manage cooldowns, and it's in a different way than other classes manage cooldowns due to it being tied to your resource regeneration. Also, you can keep the fast cooldown spells in use for trash mobs, and still have the big cooldowns to use during boss fights.
Base Regen was increased by 25 (20 -> 45; +125% base regen, basically). Vision Quest will add another 30% (45 -> 58.5) whenever you cast a signature spell and lasts for 5 seconds. If you want to factor optimal gear, that should be ~80 base Mana Regen now and ~105 with Vision Quest.
Basically, they lowered the max Mana Regen you'll hit but increased your standard regen by a good amount. Hopefully this comes with some global Mana cost reductions, though...
Edit: Post-patch VQ will have ~60% the Mana Regen than pre-patch but without any cooldown juggling. It'll also basically be an always up regen, though I suppose old VQ was essentially always up.
sazzy
Member
I like that they admit some skills feel slow and are planning on fixing that. I use Leaping Spiders, and after the APS nerf, I've been hating playing my WD.
Can't wait to use pets again.
Poison Dogs+Stinky Garg+Bad Medicine+Leaping Spiders. Yep. This should be good.
From B.net:
I wish
Can't wait to use pets again.
Poison Dogs+Stinky Garg+Bad Medicine+Leaping Spiders. Yep. This should be good.
From B.net:
I wish
CarbonatedFalcon
Member
The only way they could get me to use Fan of Knives (and I do like the skill, it's just currently unusable) is by ditching the cooldown entirely, or making it something like only 2 seconds. I suppose if they made it do something like 1000% damage, that also might be acceptable.
DH changes are okay I suppose, but I doubt they'd get me to change my build which has been working in Inferno since I got there.
As mentioned, Sentry is still laughably bad, even with doubled damage. Smokescreen (and to a lesser extent Vault, if you're using that) are still way too good, and using any other skills that need discipline at a regular rate to use (i.e. anything but companion) is just a hit to survivability.
Also I don't know if Blizzard gets why people like Hungering Arrow so much. The guided ability on it means you are much likely to miss it than other shots and it also helps when you are hitting someone in a cornered position where normally a straight shot wouldn't hit.
Evasive Fire is great but the reason why people shy away from it is that if you get cornered or get walled in and you fire off against an enemy it will deplete your Disc almost instantly. They need to tweak that aspect of it some to make it more attractive as well as buffing some of its rune. Straight up damage buff isn't enough IMO.
And like mentioned, people shy away from Bola shots not because of damage but because of the delay.
Evasive Fire is great but the reason why people shy away from it is that if you get cornered or get walled in and you fire off against an enemy it will deplete your Disc almost instantly. They need to tweak that aspect of it some to make it more attractive as well as buffing some of its rune. Straight up damage buff isn't enough IMO.
And like mentioned, people shy away from Bola shots not because of damage but because of the delay.
Loving the changes to VQ. Essentially, yeah, you will get a bit less mana overall, but being able to use 4 of your skills when you actually need them instead of wishing you could just get rid of them putting them on perma-cooldown so that you wouldn't have to pop this annoying useless thing just to get your mana regen to make the other 2 skills viable is an overall buff, and a major one.
Your math is off because you are not including the mana draining from the usage of primary spells. Most WD primary spells have 10 mana per use associated with them. I guess if you just use darts once to proc the new VQ and then do nothing, you can see regen numbers described, but that leaves you vulnerable to massive damage spikes in inferno. While not as weak as DHs, WDs dont have enough abilities to stand around and take abuse to inferno mobs. WD CC abilities will help some, but that is another drain on mana.
Most WD secondary skills are over 120 mana per cast, so while an increase of 25 mana would seem nice to other classes, it barely puts a dent in the mana costs of secondary skills. The nerf to VQ also hurts tank doctors who use rain a lot to regain health. They didnt give hard numbers in how much they were increasing damage on the listed spells, so it is tough to gauge how much damage output the buffs increases. Unless they bumped the damage of most secondary skills by 75 percent, I dont see new WD build dps coming close to the builds now. I see that as a huge nerf, if the overall dps is decreased for builds with the new patch.
If they would have decreased the very high mana cost associated with secondary spells, I wouldnt be too upset with the VQ nerf. As it is now WD will still struggle with mana at all times since the VQ nerf wont allow WD to regain mana back quickly outside of Voodoo. Hopefully Im overreacting and the buffs will allow for more diversity, but I dont see how bats, bears, rain, locust swarm or even spirit barrage builds will be viable without a reduction in mana costs. 100 plus mana cost per cast will still limit many builds.
I guess WD can go glass cannon like other classes and just hope to kill everything in sight before they run out of mana or die. I will play around some with the changes, but I dont think they are going to help much except allow a bigger build diversity while sacrificing damage with current builds. I have a huge backlog and a lot of good games are due out soon, so a break from D3 until they work out more changes to the WD will probably be a good thing instead of getting upset over the nerfs. I guess the biggest head scratcher for me is the least played class in need of the most changes and improvements saw the biggest nerf while arguably the strongest class Barbarians saw the biggest buffs with next to zero nerfs.
I mean, I suppose I could factor them but that would require knowing your APS, what spells are we spamming (since persistent spells reset the duration while they're going), how properly are you timing things, etc. There's a lot of factors.
For instance, 2 APS Rain of Toads is 70 Mana/second which means you're still regening about 30 Mana per second. This isn't factoring any other passives, however (Blood Ritual, Pierce the Veil).
Like I said earlier, it should be +50%, not +30% unless there's some good mana cost reductions across the board. And even then, it'd be pushing it. Without more details, however, it's really just hard to say on anything except that the new VQ frees up a build and allows for easier uptime but at the cost of about 80 Mana regen vs old VQ. New VQ does have a consistent mana cost for the upkeep, however, which does hurt it as well ... though many builds spammed those spells anyway so it's not necessarily a change.
And, for the record, I do have a 60 WD and I used a VQ build.
Yes, I would like to use a skill for its intended purpose rather than to regen my mana with and curse 5 seconds later when I run into a mob and need it. Though some of them already have large mana costs with long cool downs and little up time.
I will play with pets as I ditched them so long ago but I really used the Garg. Overall I will have to play around and see the full release notes to see if the VQ nerf is softened by the fix in cool downs, mana costs and animation time.
Oh, update on what they did with the Garg:
The true irony will be that all builds will still almost always have four spells on cooldown anyway!
soxinthebox
Member
I'm liking the sound of the WD changes especially the VQ change - finally I can use the other 4 abilities when I need to.
Also with all the patch previews out now I'm optimistic about this dropping this Tuesday and I can't wait
Also with all the patch previews out now I'm optimistic about this dropping this Tuesday and I can't wait
I guess I just dont see the need to nerf VQ so badly. Leaving it alone wouldnt overpower any new builds and still allow older builds to remain viable, thus creating more build diversity as they want. People can choose to use VQ builds or try out the changes in new builds. The nerf kills many old builds. Maybe if they cut mana cost on secondary spells and cut mana costs associated with primary spells like darts as well as nerfing VQ some, I wouldnt feel as bad. Personally I have zero interests in pets and I am more interested in the dots, curses, poison side of WD instead of pets, so the pet changes dont get me excited much.
Sounds good, plagued and molten really destroy my pets... Don't see molten in there though but I hope it's also on the list...
Health changes to Zombie Dogs sound pretty good as well, they might just have made the pet/CC WD's pretty damn strong, we'll have to see how this turns out. It sounds like a huge buff to me, and I farmed act 1 inferno with a summoner/cc build for a very long time.
Mana regen buff is also pretty huge for LOH/tanking doctors using acid raid and not using VQ, it does sound like a huge nerf to the people running VQ/bears builds, having 4 skills on cooldown all the time never "felt" good for me though so I don't really care myself.
Firebomb and Acid Cloud are skills I use in both my summoner and LOH/tank build so again, straight up buff.
I never had a feeling we were so underpowered but if I read all this stuff it sounds like WD's have become a LOT more powerful, a couple builds anyway. Hope they created more viable builds for the later inferno acts. I'd love to see those act4 procdoctors use pets in act4
Hmm, might be some stealth nerfs in there as well, just read this on the WD forums;
If they are going to start messing with CC procs and LOH procs we might just get nerfed hard... Wonder how it will unfold. Salt tears on the WD forums all over, lmao. Guess they'll have to do something about those procs cause with the listed changes WDs would get way overpowered otherwise.
UnluckyKate
Member
So Zombie bears not viable anymore unless you land the dance rain voodoo ? That sucks hard.
BigJonsson
Member
Dinged 60 on my Barb
Any suggestions for how to attack inferno? I have about 6 million gold at the moment..............
I guess I can just do some farming runs with my WD to try and find gear
Is it pretty much essential that I have high LOH? Is it time to get a shield or a 2-hander? Or is sticking to dual wielding still the way to go?
As far as the WD changes go I like them, I don't use VQ and I don't really have mana issues with my splinters build
The pet buffs are exactly what I need to burn down elites faster and make kiting easier......
Any suggestions for how to attack inferno? I have about 6 million gold at the moment..............
I guess I can just do some farming runs with my WD to try and find gear
Is it pretty much essential that I have high LOH? Is it time to get a shield or a 2-hander? Or is sticking to dual wielding still the way to go?
As far as the WD changes go I like them, I don't use VQ and I don't really have mana issues with my splinters build
The pet buffs are exactly what I need to burn down elites faster and make kiting easier......
UnluckyKate
Member
Dinged 60 on my Barb
Any suggestions for how to attack inferno? I have about 6 million gold at the moment..............
I guess I can just do some farming runs with my WD to try and find gear
Is it pretty much essential that I have high LOH? Is it time to get a shield or a 2-hander? Or is sticking to dual wielding still the way to go?
As far as the WD changes go I like them, I don't use VQ and I don't really have mana issues with my splinters build
The pet buffs are exactly what I need to burn down elites faster and make kiting easier......
I have two 800+ dps slow weapons (mace and spear), 30k base dps, 50k life and yesterday I teared through act one solo. No LOH, but 5.70% dmg life leech. Also, 400-500 all res.
Edit: my barb stuff cost me about 500k. I looted beast pieces farming with it that would have cost me several millions. (main weapons, belt and amulet)
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Sven-2689/hero/6404807
BigJonsson
Member
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
I do. I want variety, I will not use Venom Hydra for a few months at least. And I was one who switched off of that build very early, compared to how it is still a popular build
Edit: I will experiment with a stun-heavy fast IAS build (not 2.2+ fast, but around 1.7-1.9, if possible) based on chain lighting, lighting hydra, and wave of force and duplicates.
UnluckyKate
Member
I'm trying to figure out his build, maybe this ? :
http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#ajSiVX!XeT!YYZbZb
Arcane hydra was already pretty close in usefulness for temporal flux specs. If they also upped the damage, I could see it being superior for kiting than even frost hydra.
I'd like to try a lightning-based spec too as V_Arnold suggested. I missed the boat back when Living Lightning was OP, and that spell reminds me a lot of DH's Ball Lightning.
Wonder if they ever thought to have the skills become more effective with character level, maybe have the skills start at their original level, and then scale until they reach the maximum at level 60.
They mentioned some skills (WD pets?) gaining more stuff when you hit level 60 so it's possible they've kept a lot of that stuff in m ind. Who knows. We'll need to see full patch notes first.
I think there are so many changes at once that this is probably not the last balance patch so I wouldn't be too worried if they don't get everything right this time.
There's a few skills that do scale with clvl, though it's mostly player health related ones.
Right, I was thinking of the "does x% of weapon damage" ones. I guess they were banking on the increase in weapon damage scaling well enough with level to get the desired effect. Instead it looks like it may have gone from "not enough at higher levels" to "insanely good at lower levels", even if weapon damage is necessarily lower in lower levels.
Well, still, it looks like an improvement overall. When are they implementing this again?
IlludiumQ36
Member
Because it's boring. And because Arcane and Lightning are very effective when using Temp. Flux and Paralysis respectively. I've employed builds based around both to great success in AI & II.
Impeccable
Member
August 28th.
I'm currently testing Demon Hunter and I have to say this and Monk were the most fun the play (up till level 9, of course!). I still need to test Witch Doctor.
Barbarian was just boring...
Any ways to reduce latency in the game? I'm mostly sitting at about 110-120.. It's perfectly playable but the lower the better. I do often get a... graphics lag? I don't know how to explain this
Barbarian was just boring...
Any ways to reduce latency in the game? I'm mostly sitting at about 110-120.. It's perfectly playable but the lower the better. I do often get a... graphics lag? I don't know how to explain this
Good news for me. Looking forward to doing another Spirit Barrage build.
BigJonsson
Member
Double tornado build is fun, can't wait until I get more resist gear and HP so I don't die as much
I have 1400 LOH at the moment though, 3% life steal
I have 1400 LOH at the moment though, 3% life steal
next week. bashoik confirm it on twitter.
Makes sense. WoW patch will take care of the GW2 launch, D3 will deal with the headstart.
Boot up Normal in coop.
Aggro the entire map. Stand in the middle.
Be the goblin king. Or maybe the goblins scale with the difficulty and not the item itself.
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