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[The Pleasure]

Time to bring back the Disney dollar

Each Bison dollar is worth ten disney dollars.

 

[darrylgorn]

Phil Spencer licking his lips he been wanting to buy Disney for years

 

[Maiden Voyage]

It’s not good to see major American corporations lose so much value. I hope they can turn it around in the coming years.

Yep. Netflix has similar results. It's been a rough year and a looming recession means we've got a difficult couple of years ahead of us.

 

[Ragnarok]

Everything they touch turns to shit. Their parks are infested with pedos and their boardroom is infested with the woke mind virus. I hope they lose everything.

 

[Interfectum]

No...it really fucking doesn't. You can't possibly extrapolate that kind of information from the information that is publicly known. You got some exit polling to support that claim? You're looking at the timing of this, and comparing it to media outlets driving certain stories at that time, but you seem completely blind to everything else going on in the world and economy at the same time. That and Disney has been releasing stuff that's objectively bad. Reboots to classics, that no one ever asked for, and this particular film is about a fictional film that a popular fictional toy was based on, who displays none of the goofy/charming characteristics that made the fictional toy popular. This is the most meta spinoff Disney's ever cobbled together, and it assumed that Buzz Lightyear's name was going to be enough to carry the film.

You're welcome to jump to wild conclusions though, because no one is going to take you to task for being wrong when Disney is minting money in 5 years, while copy-pasta-ing the same storylines they have been for the past forever years now. Why would Lightyear be the straw that broke the camel's back, when Disney has been banking heavy on inclusion for far, far longer than that? Who knows? Maybe this one will come true before Netflix eventually folds. That was another company that was doomed based on the opinions of an overconfident fringe.

This is the first homosexual kiss in a Disney cartoon AFAIK and it comes hot of the heals of the "don't say gay" controversy. I'm not connecting dots that don't exist, it's right in front of you. And regardless of how cobbled or meta Lightyear is, it should have done better than it did. Something stopped parents from taking their family to see this movie and it's not some internal market turmoil. It's quite obvious.

 

[BigDeadFreak]

Yes, because disney made films and shows about minorities or the lgbtq community, thats why the world has turned on them…grow up.

I don't think it's making films about these groups that annoys people, it's the lecturing that goes with it. It's the same with all other entertainment mediums.

Look at Street Fighter 2, for example. It's one of the most successful games of all time and almost half the characters in it are ethnic minorities. No one cared back then but if it was made today it would come with a load of political messaging attacking straight white men and virtue signalling about how progressive the game is. This kind of thing just annoys people and is counterproductive to the cause its trying to serve.

 

[V1LÆM]

lmao if Disney+ gets a price hike then i will never touch it again. it's currently £8/month here so much cheaper than netflix but i only ever sub to watch Star Wars shit. Mandalorian was good but that boba show was ass and Obi Wan is a bit better but not as good as i hoped. netflix might be more than double the price (if i want 4K lmfao) but it's actually got stuff i want to watch.

the marvel trash doesn't interest me and i'm tired of the live action remakes of their classics. even their new stuff is rubbish. the recent pixar stuff is shit. lightyear was awful. the last one i enjoyed was Soul and before that Toy Story 4 and even that wasn't necessary. Should've ended with TS3.

disney is boring now.

 

[Dreamin]

I don't think it's anything they've done, I think it's just because the markets tanking due to all the insane risks and abuse by wallstreet mauling peoples retirement funds, most stocks were also up way too much due to all the trillions printed for prime brokers

 

[Nvzman]

I think disney plus was a mistake in the long run, i dont know if they will ever make the box office money they were raking in again if people are content to wait until it hits the service

I think Disney's biggest problem is their complete oversaturation of shit. Constant Marvel shit thrown in your face, constant Star Wars shit thrown in your face, constant Pixar shit thrown in your face, and I think people are finally waking up to the fact that none of it is particularly good. Since Infinity War came out, theres been like one good MCU movie, and it wasn't even made by Disney.
This extends to their parks too, because I am so utterly sick of seeing every single new ride being some IP instead of something original. They are going to just burn people out at this rate.

 

[sol_bad]

Why are people trying to blame "wokeism" and oversaturated of product? Are people already forgetting that the world went through a 2+ year pandemic?

 

[reksveks]

I don't think it's making films about these groups that annoys people, it's the lecturing that goes with it. It's the same with all other entertainment mediums.

Look at Street Fighter 2, for example. It's one of the most successful games of all time and almost half the characters in it are ethnic minorities. No one cared back then but if it was made today it would come with a load of political messaging attacking straight white men and virtue signalling about how progressive the game is. This kind of thing just annoys people and is counterproductive to the cause its trying to serve.

The right would find a thing to complain because it gives them power and money in a much quicker way than historically.

 

[Dural]

This is the first homosexual kiss in a Disney cartoon AFAIK and it comes hot of the heals of the "don't say gay" controversy. I'm not connecting dots that don't exist, it's right in front of you. And regardless of how cobbled or meta Lightyear is, it should have done better than it did. Something stopped parents from taking their family to see this movie and it's not some internal market turmoil. It's quite obvious.

Disney specifically said they added it back because of the bill.

I've always been a huge Disney fan, lived a mile from Disneyland for part of my childhood and grew up on the classics (Cinderella, Peter Pan, Sleeping Beauty) and the renaissance films. As an adult with a family I've taken my family of 6 to both Disneyland and Disney World and spent ~$5000 at Disneyland and close to $10,000 on our trip last year to Disney World. I've always been there opening weekend with my kids for Disney animated movies, our living room is decorated in Disney and has multiple Thomas Kincade Disney prints mounted and hung on the wall. I even bought a timeshare so we could go to Florida or California every year to visit. With the recent BS they pulled with the Florida bill I cut off everything from Disney until they decide to cater to the families they always have and not activists. It's going to hurt as we love the parks, but I feel it needs to be done and I know I'm not the only one. They're not going to make up the lost revenue with single manchildren and activists.

 

[Zeroing]

Meh let them suffer... maybe people are finally realising that Disney is nowadays just producing trash. Nothing to do with being woke, it is the direction they choose 10 years ago. They moved away from hand drawing animations and focused on meaningless sequels after sequels with more CGI than story content.

 

[Umbasaborne]

Meh let them suffer... maybe people are finally realising that Disney is nowadays just producing trash. Nothing to do with being woke, it is the direction they choose 10 years ago. They moved away from hand drawing animations and focused on meaningless sequels after sequels with more CGI than story content.

I think this is the bigger issue. They are uncreative to a fault, for all their money, they are terrified of originality

 

[Zeroing]

I think this is the bigger issue. They are uncreative to a fault, for all their money, they are terrified of originality

Yeah that is Hollywood.

 

[West Texas CEO]

Is this the same company that put hidden penises in everything?!

 

[Von Hugh]

Must be frustrating for all the investors who thought Disney+ would skyrocket the value 10X in a couple years.

 

[Labolas]

Good. Fuck Disney.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Marvel phase 4 being a chain of flops might have played a part in the diminishing share value.

Out of 5 films, spiderman no way home was top but thats a sony film, so I don't know how much disney gets but: black window, shang xi and eternals have been certified flops. Doctor strange in the multiverse is the only succesful one and even then it's just 11 in the list of mcu movies (ranked by worldwide box office).

Meanwhile on the animation side, since 2019 they've done nothing but underperform and lose money. And of course star wars is and unknown commodity right now... the force awakens was massive, but the second and third movie had dwindling revenues, with the third one while breaking 1B dollars, that was just half of what TFA made., and that was 3 years ago. Since then star wars has just been a television IP.

So: marvel going down, star wars going down, animation going down.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Good.

 

[The Pleasure]

Is this the same company that put hidden penises in everything?!

 

[ikbalCO]

Damn.

Rabbi Shapiro keeps winning.

 

[DeaDPo0L84]

I'm almost 38 years old, grew up on Disney. Some of the classic movies are still till this day my favorites when it comes to animation cause they stood the test of time. As a conservative it'd be easy to say this is 100% due to decisions made surrounding certain societal decisions such as the Florida parental rights bill, or the videos that leaked showing woke employees having agendas outside of simply creating great products.

And while those issues probably had an impact in the grand scheme of things the other side of this is Disney just kinda...sucks now? I mean you have to really be viewing things through rose tinted glasses to think they're anywhere near their prime from back in the day. They're a shit factory at this point, profit before creation. Sure their are a few hidden gems along the way but honestly they're a shell of their former selves.

 

[Crayon]

Letter poster, neo member, low post count and drive-by pearl-clutching "I can't believe GAF is like this" tone policing comments. They've got nobody left to argue with becuse the mods stamp out wrongthink in seconds, they miss that dopamine hit of calling someone an istaphobe incel.

Nothing to worry about. Mods aren't scared of users here so it's not going to turn into anything like that. If drifters want someone to argue with this is a good spot because thinking both ways allowed and they can excercise their reason for a change. To a point, of course.

I'd like to think I'm as woke as you get without being insane and I like it here. Maybe me n you will end up arguing over something one of these days but neither of us gonna get banned unless we go apeshit. That's awesome considering the state of the internet these days.

 

[Konnor]

Are you telling me that a corporation that non-stop shits out woke generic trash is failing? This is shocking news, who would have thought that the public would eventually have enough with that shit.

 

[LaughingStock]

Getting woke is not exactly the issue. But woke and incompetence often walk together.

Involving the company in politics also doesn't help.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

phase 4 being a chain of flops might have played a part in the diminishing share value.

Flops flops?...Not really.

so I don't know how much disney gets but: black window, shang xi and eternals have been certified flops.

I don't think that's is right.

Black Widow:
Production Budget: 200M
World Wide Box Office: 379 M

Shang-chi:
P.B: 150-200M
W.W.B.O: 400M

Eternals:
P.B: 200M
W.W.B.O: 402

I mean, you can say that they underperformed; COVID/Disney+ is a factor and the two of those examples are brand new characters/IPs in the MCU.

I would agree that phase 4 feel disjointed so far. But the MCU just ended an unparalleled achievement in filmeaking (production/storytelling) with the infinity saga.

Spider-Man and Dr Strange 2 = Multiverse.

Doctor strange in the multiverse is the only succesful one and even then it's just 11 in the list of mcu movies (ranked by worldwide box office).

Meanwhile on the animation side, since 2019 they've done nothing but underperform and lose money

COVID/Disney + Big Factor that affected the numbers. Plus those movies are new IPs.

Buzz light year is a categoric failure tho.

. And of course star wars is and unknown commodity right now... the force awakens was massive, but the second and third movie had dwindling revenues, with the third one while breaking 1B dollars, that was just half of what TFA made., and that was 3 years ago. Since then star wars has just been a television IP.

I agree.

So: marvel going down

Not really.

, star wars going down,

Star wars has been down since the second movie.

animation going down.

I don't think we have enough data yet.


EDIT: Disneyland/Disneyworld and shit like that are far more important to Disney. In term of revenue/value.

 

[NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt]

I'm almost 38 years old, grew up on Disney. Some of the classic movies are still till this day my favorites when it comes to animation cause they stood the test of time. As a conservative it'd be easy to say this is 100% due to decisions made surrounding certain societal decisions such as the Florida parental rights bill, or the videos that leaked showing woke employees having agendas outside of simply creating great products.

And while those issues probably had an impact in the grand scheme of things the other side of this is Disney just kinda...sucks now? I mean you have to really be viewing things through rose tinted glasses to think they're anywhere near their prime from back in the day. They're a shit factory at this point, profit before creation. Sure their are a few hidden gems along the way but honestly they're a shell of their former selves.

Understandable btw I hated the first Deadpool movie due to a certain scene in the beginning that made me roll my eyes

 

[PaddyOCanager]

They've produced nothing of value in years and the parks are stupid expensive. Unfortunately, the average Disney employee is probably going to suffer for this.

 

[93xfan]

Glad to hear it. Time to fire all the woke people and get some real talent.

 

[Crayon]

I saw one of those Star wars movies on a plane flight. I watch very few movies, so maybe this isnt much, but it was the worst movie I've seen in years.

 

[RoboFu]

Yeah and they will gouge their fan base for years before doing any actual good changes in favor of the customer.

I have taken my family to Disney world every year for week long vacation for the past 5 years, we didn't go this year and probably wont again until they make some changes that benefit the customer. They got greedy after losing money to covid. You get less and a higher price.

 

[SafeOrAlone]

content-wise, I'd be very disappointed with modern Disney if it wasn't for the MCU.

Now, I have plenty of issues with the MCU, namely the factory-like feel to most of these films...but at the same time, there is an exceptional level of passion put into them. It's a strange mix, but overall I have to say I've really enjoyed it.

Other then that, I haven't enjoyed anything Disney in a while, aside from Disneyland itself. Still fun.

 

[Dural]

I'm almost 38 years old, grew up on Disney. Some of the classic movies are still till this day my favorites when it comes to animation cause they stood the test of time. As a conservative it'd be easy to say this is 100% due to decisions made surrounding certain societal decisions such as the Florida parental rights bill, or the videos that leaked showing woke employees having agendas outside of simply creating great products.

And while those issues probably had an impact in the grand scheme of things the other side of this is Disney just kinda...sucks now? I mean you have to really be viewing things through rose tinted glasses to think they're anywhere near their prime from back in the day. They're a shit factory at this point, profit before creation. Sure their are a few hidden gems along the way but honestly they're a shell of their former selves.

IDK, I've enjoyed everything Walt Disney Animation Studios has put out since Tangled; Wreck it Ralph, Frozen, Big Hero 6, Zootopia, Moana, and Encanto. I'd put Tangled and Moana up there with the classic princess movies. Pixar, on the other hand, has been more miss than hit lately for me.

 

[IntentionalPun]

Just a ton of factors all mixing together.. stock market crashing in general + uncertainty in the streaming space, COVID recovery being slow for film box office, and TV/cable ever shrinking.

Wall Street just isn't bullish on the media industry anymore after really going in hard on the Netflix stock price and anyone else doing well in streaming.

Stock prices are generally about growth potential above all else, w/ actual current financial health being secondary. Disney is in a tough spot on both things but the dust will settle after we can consider the "COVID recovery" over . If it ever is that is.. people's habits may have changed after being stuck at home so long, so things like the theater even if safe might be effected.

 

[Nester99]

Flops flops?...Not really.


I don't think that's is right.

Black Widow:
Production Budget: 200M
World Wide Box Office: 379 M

Shang-chi:
P.B: 150-200M
W.W.B.O: 400M

Eternals:
P.B: 200M
W.W.B.O: 402

I mean, you can say that they underperformed; COVID/Disney+ is a factor and the two of those examples are brand new characters/IPs in the MCU.

I would agree that phase 4 feel disjointed so far. But the MCU just ended an unparalleled achievement in filmeaking (production/storytelling) with the infinity saga.

That's only Production Budget. Marketing Budget can be a similar amount.

How Much Eternals Cost To Make (& How Much Box Office To Be A Success)

Eternals don't come cheap.

screenrant.com

The general rule of thumb is a film's breakeven point is its production budget doubled. This means Eternals would have to gross around $400 million globally in order to recoup its costs. Right now, it has a good chance of hitting that mark. A handful of Hollywood blockbusters have passed that threshold worldwide, including Shang-Chi ($423.6 million) and No Time to Die ($606.7 million). Black Widow earned $379.6 million, but its gross was affected by the hybrid Disney+ release where viewers paid to watch it via Premier Access. Given the popularity of the MCU and the gap between studio tentpoles since No Time to Die opened, there should be demand for Eternals. However, there are some factors working against it.

Eternals Has Made $400 Million, But It's Still In Loss

Eternals is one of the most mature movies to come out of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. It also had a budget of $200 million, which is the 10th highest of

www.quirkybyte.com

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Flops flops?...Not really.


I don't think that's is right.

Black Widow:
Production Budget: 200M
World Wide Box Office: 379 M

Shang-chi:
P.B: 150-200M
W.W.B.O: 400M

Eternals:
P.B: 200M
W.W.B.O: 402

I mean, you can say that they underperformed; COVID/Disney+ is a factor and the two of those examples are brand new characters/IPs in the MCU.

I would agree that phase 4 feel disjointed so far. But the MCU just ended an unparalleled achievement in filmeaking (production/storytelling) with the infinity saga.

Spider-Man and Dr Strange 2 = Multiverse.





COVID/Disney + Big Factor that affected the numbers. Plus those movies are new IPs.

Buzz light year is a categoric failure tho.


I agree.

Not really.


Star wars has been down since the second movie.


I don't think we have enough data yet.


EDIT: Disneyland/Disneyworld and shit like that are far more important to Disney. In term of revenue/value.

While generally I agree with your remarks, I'd like to point out that common wisdom is that movies need to do twice their budgets in box office returns, and black window, shang xi and eternals are barely there. Doctor Strange 2 is hovering close to 1B which is great (hopefully will lead to more sam reimi) but it's still 10-11 in the mcu ranklist. And the rest of phase 4 has a lot of unkowns:

Thor Love and Thunder: Taika Waititi had a solid run with thor 2 but replacing Chris is an unknown.
Black Panther 1 was very succesful but the face of the movie sadly passed away. Unkown expectations
The marvels is riding the coattails of brie larsons 1B+ captain marvel so expectations are there
Fantastic 4: previous fantastic 4 movies have been very mediocre in results, so it is an unknown

MCU had been a massive hit up until phase 3, but phase 4 is proving very different.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

That's only Production Budget. Marketing Budget can be a similar amount.

How Much Eternals Cost To Make (& How Much Box Office To Be A Success)

Eternals don't come cheap.

screenrant.com

The general rule of thumb is a film's breakeven point is its production budget doubled. This means Eternals would have to gross around $400 million globally in order to recoup its costs. Right now, it has a good chance of hitting that mark. A handful of Hollywood blockbusters have passed that threshold worldwide, including Shang-Chi ($423.6 million) and No Time to Die ($606.7 million). Black Widow earned $379.6 million, but its gross was affected by the hybrid Disney+ release where viewers paid to watch it via Premier Access. Given the popularity of the MCU and the gap between studio tentpoles since No Time to Die opened, there should be demand for Eternals. However, there are some factors working against it.

Eternals Has Made $400 Million, But It's Still In Loss

Eternals is one of the most mature movies to come out of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. It also had a budget of $200 million, which is the 10th highest of

www.quirkybyte.com

Thats what they said. There is also a saying in the Hollywood industry: 'No movie makes money', as a way of saying that there is a lot of shenanigans behind the scenes (accounting and stuff like the ancillary market, licensing and shit like that)

There is a channel that tracks the box office and the estimated marketing cost if you are interested:

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

While generally I agree with your remarks, I'd like to point out that common wisdom is that movies need to do twice their budgets in box office returns, and black window, shang xi and eternals are barely there.

Yes I have heard of that rule of thumb. But it is tricky.

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Shang-Chi-and-the-Legend-of-the-Ten-Rings-(2021)#tab=summary

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Eternals-(2021)#tab=summary

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Black-Widow-(2021)#tab=summary

As I replied to the other guy. There are a lot of weird shit these companies make to manipulate numbers. And there is also the ancillary market. So, in general terms, I don't think we can see these three examples as 'flops'. Maybe lackluster or underperforming, creatively disappointing.

Doctor Strange 2 is hovering close to 1B which is great (hopefully will lead to more sam reimi) but it's still 10-11 in the mcu ranklist. And the rest of phase 4 has a lot of unkowns:

Yep. I don't see an issue with 10-11 mcu ranklist at all.

Thor Love and Thunder: Taika Waititi had a solid run with thor 2 but replacing Chris is an unknown.
Black Panther 1 was very succesful but the face of the movie sadly passed away. Unkown expectations
The marvels is riding the coattails of brie larsons 1B+ captain marvel so expectations are there
Fantastic 4: previous fantastic 4 movies have been very mediocre in results, so it is an unknown

MCU had been a massive hit up until phase 3, but phase 4 is proving very different.

Quite understandable. As I said before; Kevin Feige made an unprecedented achievement in filmmaking production and storytelling with the infinity saga. Several studios tried to do the same and fail.

And yes, this phase 4 feels weird, disjointed or unappealing (I dunno) so far. The issue is: Everything is as set up for the future, and as you said: the future of the MCU is an unknown. Could be a massive letdown or surpass the infinity saga, because:

Now that Marvel has the rights for the X-men/Fantastic 4. Fans will go crazy when that shit happens =

I mean, Spider-man and Dr. Strange's 2 cameos prove that.

 

[Xenon]

Seeing all these companies chasing high Blackrock ESG scores lose significant amount of their value is amazingly satisfying.

 

[Unknown?]

Time to bring back the Disney dollar

The funny thing is real dollars are just as worthless. Rofl

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Yes I have heard of that rule of thumb. But it is tricky.

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Shang-Chi-and-the-Legend-of-the-Ten-Rings-(2021)#tab=summary

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Eternals-(2021)#tab=summary

https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Black-Widow-(2021)#tab=summary

As I replied to the other guy. There are a lot of weird shit these companies make to manipulate numbers. And there is also the ancillary market. So, in general terms, I don't think we can see these three examples as 'flops'. Maybe lackluster or underperforming, creatively disappointing.


Yep. I don't see an issue with 10-11 mcu ranklist at all.


Quite understandable. As I said before; Kevin Feige made an unprecedented achievement in filmmaking production and storytelling with the infinity saga. Several studios tried to do the same and fail.

And yes, this phase 4 feels weird, disjointed or unappealing (I dunno) so far. The issue is: Everything is as set up for the future, and as you said: the future of the MCU is an unknown. Could be a massive letdown or surpass the infinity saga, because:

Now that Marvel has the rights for the X-men/Fantastic 4. Fans will go crazy when that shit happens =

I mean, Spider-man and Dr. Strange's 2 cameos prove that.

You're right studios play with the numbers, so I'll concede that these 3 movies were not flops, but rather underperformers.

As for fantastic four I pray to god it's storyline is based on john byrne's run as writer, but I am hopeless of that actually happening.

 

[ManaByte]

As for fantastic four I pray to god it's storyline is based on john byrne's run as writer, but I am hopeless of that actually happening.

It’s probably going to be the Fraction or Hickman run.

 

[NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt]

It’s probably going to be the Fraction or Hickman run.

Hickman is great. I hope it is. I haven't read alot of his stuff but the ones I have read are great

 

[DeafTourette]

Who are the people in charge of Disney today? Why do they seem incompetent ?

They don't do Star Wars sequels well, they destroy movies with inclusions.

The series they do are boring with a high budget.

Seriously, if Disney were to come back to life and see everything they're doing and the Lightyear thing, I bet he be beyond furious and fire the people involved.

Bob Chapek.

Nuff said

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

It’s probably going to be the Fraction or Hickman run.

Well, there it is. Illusions shattered.

Thanks ManaByte for sharing your knowledge.

 

[ManaByte]

Hickman is great. I hope it is. I haven't read alot of his stuff but the ones I have read are great

Most of the MCU is based on Hickman, even this new saga is Hickman’s.

 

[Deleted member 1159]

“This confirms everything I already believed.” The thread

 

[jason10mm]

The "double your budget to break even" mantra is because theater's keep roughly half the box office, though these days with heavily front loaded BO and more of a 80/20 split the first weekend that is changing.

Marketing is an additional cost that's hard to really evaluate since Disney will pay itself crazy money to advertise movies on ABC and stuff like that.

 

[TTOOLL]

Well, they killed Star Wars so…